boner confessor posted:

you're putting way too much thought into this

the person saying "i saw blacks welfare cheats buying things they shouldn't have! on my dime!" did not actually see any of these things. they probably saw a middle class black family and assumed they were using food stamps, or saw a poor black family and starting making up how expensive their clothing was, or whatever other stupid bullshit goes on in the mind of a racist. they said "I saw X thing happen" even though it didn't happen because the racist is unused to their bullshit being challenged versus collecting solemn nods from other racists. it's the same as saying you saw angels on the drive home from church yesterday, it's a message meant for a completely different audience than the speaker intended and they hosed up by being so blunt or clueless as to repeat their dumb made up didn't actually happen story which justifies a particular worldview to the wrong audience

remember that people who say these things are the same people who are convinced undocumented immigrants receive thousands of dollars in government benefits monthly despite that being literally impossible, so there's no reason to accept this "i saw welfare fraud at the grocery store! i see it all the time!" as a factual story

Dr. Arbitrary posted:

There is no secret hospital welfare program that's only for Mexicans.

J.A.B.C. posted:

It's an honored Right-Wing tradition since Reagan to talk about welfare queens buying lobster or getting fancy hotels, or drunks buying an orange with food stamps, getting change then buying vodka with the change.

It's fake. Whole-cloth falsehoods designed to denigrate those who are on hard times, because as another poster pointed out, a lot of our national morality is tied to our wealth. Prosperity Gospel has poisoned the well, and it will take decades to reverse the damage.

J.A.B.C. posted:

It's an honored Right-Wing tradition since Reagan to talk about welfare queens buying lobster or getting fancy hotels, or drunks buying an orange with food stamps, getting change then buying vodka with the change.

It's fake. Whole-cloth falsehoods designed to denigrate those who are on hard times, because as another poster pointed out, a lot of our national morality is tied to our wealth. Prosperity Gospel has poisoned the well, and it will take decades to reverse the damage.

BarbarianElephant posted:

The Reagan thing was actually about one real conwoman who did all the things Reagan said she did. One woman. It's not an indictment of the system anymore than one shoplifter proves that shops don't work.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linda_Taylor

Sometimes a thing can be both true and irrelevant.

Aeka 2.0 posted:

Aeka 2.0 posted:

Same guy, doubling down:


Isn't dumping the junk a good thing?

AnoHito posted:

This happens pretty much all the time. They is literally Economics 101. As in I actually learned about this in the class "Economics 101."

Shadin posted:

No you see, it's logical that they should get mad about quantitative easing, and then get mad about reversing it, because it means Jews Liberal bankers are trying to undermine Trump.

PerniciousKnid posted:

As someone said before, the Fed illegally made the economy look better to help Obama, now they're illegally hurting the economy to hurt Trump. It's consistent!

Iron Crowned posted:

The people who are jealous that they don't get food money. Who cares that they bought a drat bag of chips, or some soda (these are the two that people always bring up for some reason)

Having known people who have been on SNAP, it's a pittance, and only covers food. Need laundry detergent, shampoo, soap, or anything else to keep you acceptably humanlike? Tough poo poo.

Also, food banks are almost a joke. Yeah, you'll get food, but it'll mostly be green beans and corn.

ChristopherRobin posted:

It's great though because usually the conversation boils down to the other person realizing they're wrong but still saying some dumb poo poo like "I've personally seen people abuse the system!" like that's the trump card.

Panfilo posted:

How would these people respond if you pointed out that food stamps basically support the businesses poor people buy products from, and with limited/no food stamps it would unfairly burden those businesses since they would have less customers.

Shadin posted:

On that note, I'd love to listen to what these people think the Fed should actually do.

boner confessor posted:

"they should get JOBS"

boner confessor posted:

"they should get JOBS"

Panfilo posted:

Seriously, food stamps are win-win. It costs us pennies, helps feed needy people, and supports the stores they buy products from. You better bet little bodegas and convenience stores would love for all their inventory to qualify for SNAP/TANF/WIC purchases.

Ravenfood posted:

Food stamps literally have the highest rate-of-return as far as economic stimulus goes for just this reason. If you want to stimulate the economy, increase food stamps.

Ravenfood posted:

Food stamps literally have the highest rate-of-return as far as economic stimulus goes for just this reason. If you want to stimulate the economy, increase food stamps.

Iron Crowned posted:

BUt that means poors will stop working!

sweart gliwere posted:

The new American dream: living in a discount tent under the bridge, with a month's worth of shelf-stable food and a smartphone with your personal choice of R&B ringtone. Maybe upgrade to an old church van or some 1990s hatchback after a few years. #winning

Panfilo posted:

The cell phone thing really galls me because it is an example of something I hear in real life all the drat time. "That homeless guy has a nicer cell phone than me!".

Like they complain that homeless people are such an eyesore in downtown, and don't understand that an obamaphone can help that guy bootstrap himself into a job or afford a roof under his head eventually. Not to mention being able to keep in contact with his social worker/parole officer/AA sponsor instead of staggering around outside the post office in a fugue state.

VorpalBunny posted:

I am a stay-at-home-parent, and this morning with my minivan full of kids, my car battery died. I had to sit in my driveway, waiting for my car insurance-covered tow truck to come and give me a jump. I then drove my kids to their private preschool and public elementary schools, drove to the local car repair shop, waited patiently for my new car battery and didn't even bother to ask how much it all cost as I had a credit card in my wallet and I know I have funds in my bank account.

At every single step of the way, if I was poor I would have been hosed. Would my cut-rate car insurance cover a battery jump? I would have been hours late for work. Could I have afforded a new battery or would I have to cross my fingers that the jump would hold until I could scrape together enough for a new battery? Could I then afford to hire someone to install it for me?

The privilege we have as middle-class or higher Americans is so easy to forget. Sure, I bitched and complained but I got it fixed and have moved on with my day. These assholes who clutter my feed with veiled racist memes and sneers about "scammers" and "illegals" float through life and only seem to reflect on the bigger picture when it literally bumps into them. Then it's a religious quote or an "I don't see color" message and nothing changes.

gently caress these people. Open your eyes to other peoples' experiences, for America's sake!

Ashcans posted:

Actually, in the new economy you won't have to do anything as primitive as pitch your own tent. Instead, you can use our Squattr app to coordinate with other new-economy workers on different schedules to timeshare a single tent, cardboard box, or even a sufficiently sheltered outcropping or rock in the park. Just find your preferred rest spot using the map feature, book your time (up to 6 hours at a stretch) and you're set! We accept SNAP and TANF as payment, and if you don't have funds available you can also enroll in a work program with one of our preferred partners, who will credit your account at the end of the shift.

Please leave the hovel in the same condition that you found it. If you make any improvements, like taping grocery bags over holes, you can earn up to an hour of free Squattr bookings each week.

Panfilo posted:

Another factor you touched on is that when you have a layer of wiggle room for emergencies, it lets you coast on a level of potential incompetence that a poor person can't afford (I'm not insinuating you are incompetent Voroalbunny, just using an example).

When I was younger I used to accidentally leave the headlights on my car,lock my keys in my car, etc embarrassingly often. But my mom would pay for platinum AAA for many years and sorting it out cost nothing. I'd call them on a cell phone that was also given to me, which I would also misplace or break way too often, but it was in insured and cheap and quick to replace. Ditto for credit cards- lose your card? The credit card company will practically overnight you a replacement and you'll be no worse for wear.

But someone that is very poor doesn't have all these cusions, and needs to be much more vigilant, careful, and forward thinking because any of the above mentioned setbacks could lead to financial ruin. It was mentioned in the Negrotown thread in an article that black people, for example, can't afford to be clueless because there are so many things already working against them. Poverty is very similar.

Ashcans posted:

Actually, in the new economy you won't have to do anything as primitive as pitch your own tent. Instead, you can use our Squattr app to coordinate with other new-economy workers on different schedules to timeshare a single tent, cardboard box, or even a sufficiently sheltered outcropping or rock in the park.

Dr. Arbitrary posted:

This except it generates income by extorting business owners and HOAs to keep Squattr nodes away.

Scruff McGruff posted:

Yeah, I was gonna say that my understanding was that every dollar we put into food stamps generates like $1.70 in GDP. It pays for itself and then some. But no, cuts should be made there, not to poo poo like Defense (especially the acquisition process and cost-plus contracting) which loses billions of dollars a year because they can't even figure out how to audit themselves, that's the kind of government waste that's critical to maintain.

Prism posted:

Apparently it scales to an extent...upward. It's $1.73 at the current level per dollar, but increasing SNAP by $1 billion is expected to produce more like $1.79 billion in economic activity, or was the last time I looked it up. (For scale, $1 billion is about 0.16% of the Pentagon's budget.) That was a couple years ago, but somehow I doubt Trump is demanding new studies on the matter.

The return on boosting SNAP expenditures is incredibly high.

Scruff McGruff posted:

"He was a great man who served this country his entire life in some form or other."
Except for that one time when he literally rebelled against it.

I also love the leap at the end of "Arlington National Cemetery is also connected with Lee, do they want us to tear that up too?!"
Arlington was a giant middle finger to Lee's face after the war, to make him look at all the Union troops he killed every time he sat on his front porch. gently caress no I don't want to tear that up, that's exactly the kind of poo poo I want to keep.

Mo_Steel posted:

Oh boy, a Prager University video about how evidence points to creationism let me just start a thoughtful critique on-

Mo_Steel posted:

Oh boy, a Prager University video about how evidence points to creationism let me just start a thoughtful critique on-

Kit Walker posted:

Frankly it should just be a guaranteed thing for everyone. Everyone gets a free $200 a month to spend on food, tied to inflation. Then no one can complain that it only benefits the poor

DrNutt posted:

Medicare for All and SNAP for All would go a long way in making America work for everyone even without bringing minimum wage up to something reasonable. But the flip side is that right wing fuckers would probably use it as an excuse to gut the minimum wage or leave it stagnant for another thirty off years. Every tiny thing in this country has to be achieved by fighting off parasitic vultures sucking the last blood from every stone they can.

Panfilo posted:

Like they complain that homeless people are such an eyesore in downtown, and don't understand that an obamaphone can help that guy bootstrap himself into a job or afford a roof under his head eventually. Not to mention being able to keep in contact with his social worker/parole officer/AA sponsor instead of staggering around outside the post office in a fugue state.