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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:Do the democrats have programs like this in place in any states? WHy aren't there chartered bus services for all districts that need them paid for on the dime of DNC donors? Same goes for ID acquisition. There should be a fund the DNC can use to make these issues go away for their voters. Dunno, honestly. But I am not super keen on relying on the Dems to do anything. Prefer to use local orgs and work within communities, building ties with people. Basically use the concept of Dual Power yo get poo poo done that national bodies/orgs don't/won't do. Extends to more than just this, as it can also be used to deal with mire.mundane community issues like making sure people are fed and have basic necessities.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:44
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Majorian posted:It's a reference to the fact that the piece I cited was by a woman of color who is critical of Hillary Clinton and thinks that her record on race is spottier than is commonly assumed. And you ignored it, because it doesn't fit with your narrative. It's not erasing WoC to disagree with you, even if a WoC agrees with you. And you trying to set up a WoC to be your shield against criticism is super gross.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:44
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Koalas March posted:I hypothetically believe that we can reform the justice system and keep our current build in place, but in order to that the "right" people need to be in every single position of power. You have made my life slightly less worth living now that I am thinking about how this can't be reality. The Luke Cage bit that is. Taerkar fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Sep 22, 2017 |
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Sep 22, 2017 20:45
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Majorian posted:But that view of Clinton and the Democrats seems to only take part of the picture into account. There's a lot of other stuff on their record that's pretty awful. Shouldn't that also factor into it? stop
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Sep 22, 2017 20:46
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Majorian posted:It's a reference to the fact that the piece I cited was by a woman of color who is critical of Hillary Clinton and thinks that her record on race is spottier than is commonly assumed. And you ignored it, because it doesn't fit with your narrative. i don't have a narrative dumbass. i'm calling you out for awkwardly trying to bring up the white devil hillary clinton as much as you possibly can you quoted a black woman and used the words of another black woman to say the first black woman was missing the bigger picture, and now you're yelling at me for erasing black women when i am saying you, specifically, you, are making dumb posts
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Sep 22, 2017 20:46
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Koalas March posted:We need to drill "Protect & Serve" into actual protection and serving. But cops (according to the Supreme Court) aren't required to protect and serve.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:46
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Majorian posted:It's a reference to the fact that the piece I cited was by a woman of color who is critical of Hillary Clinton and thinks that her record on race is spottier than is commonly assumed. And you ignored it, because it doesn't fit with your narrative. I usually don't even disagree with you but come on. Because a WOC agrees with you doesn't mean that the WOC who don't are wrong for it.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:46
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:what about ism . t x loving t. Because I genuinely wanted to ask a woman of color (KM) why the negative parts of Clinton's record on race relations don't seem to change the narrative that she is good on those issues. I don't think Clinton's an evil person, I don't think she's more racist than most other politicians, and I don't think she's more corrupt than most politicians. But I also am very curious about why, as Michelle Alexander puts it in her piece, "Black voters have been remarkably loyal to the Clintons for more than 25 years." Casey Finnigan posted:I usually don't even disagree with you but come on. Because a WOC agrees with you doesn't mean that the WOC who don't are wrong for it. I didn't say they were wrong; I really want to know what I'm missing about why those parts of her record get expunged.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:47
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is bad B: democrats shouldn't be voted for or C: PoC don't vote the right way (IE why are they voting for democrats)
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LunarShadow posted:Dunno, honestly. But I am not super keen on relying on the Dems to do anything. Prefer to use local orgs and work within communities, building ties with people. Basically use the concept of Dual Power yo get poo poo done that national bodies/orgs don't/won't do. Extends to more than just this, as it can also be used to deal with mire.mundane community issues like making sure people are fed and have basic necessities. I understand wanting local orgs to do the work, but there is no reason why the DNC should not be funding those local orgs to get the job done.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:47
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On the crime bill that Majorian keeps bringing up - I seem to remember commentary from the primaries saying the crime bill was popular in the black community, supported by black thought leaders and leading sociologists at the time. Is there any truth to that?
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Sep 22, 2017 20:48
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:I understand wanting local orgs to do the work, but there is no reason why the DNC should not be funding those local orgs to get the job done.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:48
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Casey Finnigan posted:This is a pretty dumb post dude. Even if you think they should dislike Hillary, they don't. Not everyone thinks like you do, and community outreach (which I'm not informed about but I believe Koala's March when she says Hillary engaged in it well) counts for a lot Here's a quick article that outlines some basic stuff. ate poo poo on live tv posted:So what's changed now? Racism and hate crimes have spiked since Trump gained the office and the Dems haven't really addressed it. Even talking to dems, liberals and leftists online there was a big push (even on this forum!) to "drop identity politics". It was a push to ignore racism and try to court those racist yt voters.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:50
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Majorian posted:Because I genuinely wanted to ask a woman of color (KM) why the negative parts of Clinton's record on race relations don't seem to change the narrative that she is good on those issues. I don't think Clinton's an evil person, I don't think she's more racist than most other politicians, and I don't think she's more corrupt than most politicians. But I also am very curious about why, as Michelle Alexander puts it in her piece, "Black voters have been remarkably loyal to the Clintons for more than 25 years." KM have you the reason and you rejected it, and then decided to interject with "Hillary BAD, WHY NOT ALL PEOPLE THINK HILLARY BAD" Koalas March posted:Believe it or not there are democrats who have worked extensively with the black community. Hillary Clinton is one of them. It's pretty loving transparent that you are more interested in bashing hillary than you are hearing why someone would support her.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:50
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Hellblazer187 posted:On the crime bill that Majorian keeps bringing up - I seem to remember commentary from the primaries saying the crime bill was popular in the black community, supported by black thought leaders and leading sociologists at the time. Is there any truth to that? yes, but it wasn't just "let's be tough on crime" it was "let's be tough on crime and also address the systemic causes of crime via economic reform"
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Sep 22, 2017 20:51
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Koalas March posted:Racism and hate crimes have spiked since Trump gained the office and the Dems haven't really addressed it. Even talking to dems, liberals and leftists online there was a big push (even on this forum!) to "drop identity politics". It was a push to ignore racism and try to court those racist yt voters. This is often tied in to "well they're only racist because of economics, we just need to address class"
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Sep 22, 2017 20:52
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Koalas March posted:I hypothetically believe that we can reform the justice system and keep our current build in place, but in order to do that the "right" people need to be in every single position of power. I genuinley wish I had enough faith in the system to believe we /can/ get all the right people in place for long enough to get this poo poo done, Cause this absolutely would be a drat good solution.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:53
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Hellblazer187 posted:On the crime bill that Majorian keeps bringing up - I seem to remember commentary from the primaries saying the crime bill was popular in the black community, supported by black thought leaders and leading sociologists at the time. Is there any truth to that? it turns out to be nuanced and complicated, but that doesn't easily lend itself to bashing Hillary Clinton, http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/crime/2016/02/why_many_black_politicians_backed_the_1994_crime_bill_championed_by_the.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/13/opinion/did-blacks-really-endorse-the-1994-crime-bill.html?mcubz=3 Heck Yes! Loam! fucked around with this message at 20:56 on Sep 22, 2017 |
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Sep 22, 2017 20:53
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:KM have you the reason and you rejected it, and then decided to interject with "Hillary BAD, WHY NOT ALL PEOPLE THINK HILLARY BAD" That's not true. I really do want to know. I can see that I asked in a pretty dumb way, and I apologize for that. Koalas March posted:Here's a quick article that outlines some basic stuff. This is what I was asking for, in basically the dumbest way possible. I appreciate you posting it, and I'm sorry I came off as saying that black people should think more like me, because that was not at all my intention. e: I'm also going to hold off on criticizing Hillary Clinton for the near-to-medium future as well. Clearly I do it way more than I realized, and I apologize for that too. It doesn't reflect my genuine attitude towards her; I don't think she's particularly bad or corrupt, for a politician. Majorian fucked around with this message at 21:09 on Sep 22, 2017 |
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Sep 22, 2017 20:54
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LunarShadow posted:I get that. If they do, that is great. I just doubt they would. well they should 
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Sep 22, 2017 20:54
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Hellblazer187 posted:On the crime bill that Majorian keeps bringing up - I seem to remember commentary from the primaries saying the crime bill was popular in the black community, supported by black thought leaders and leading sociologists at the time. Is there any truth to that? There is a lot of truth to that and there were also those that disagreed. Either way I don't really see how that shields anyone from criticism because of the obvious consequences of what actually happened as a direct cause of the crime bill.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:55
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Heck Yes! Loam! posted:well they should I should probably add the context that I am a southern communist, if that helps explain where I am coming from re: the dems.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:56
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LunarShadow posted:I should probably add the context that I am a southern communist, if that helps explain where I am coming from re: the dems. Makes sense. context is always helpful for understanding someone's positions. Thank you.
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Sep 22, 2017 20:57
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a woke WoC walks
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Sep 22, 2017 21:08
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Koalas March posted:Believe it or not there are democrats who have worked extensively with the black community. Hillary Clinton is one of them. Yeah don't underestimate that angle. That they've been hemming and hawing over the party line on reproductive health lately is a disgrace.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:08
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Koalas March posted:I hypothetically believe that we can reform the justice system and keep our current build in place, but in order to do that the "right" people need to be in every single position of power. Hey KM, can you please step up your Idris Elba gif game? Lets spread his face from sea to shining sea until everyone agrees he'd be the best choice for the next James Bond.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:08
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ate poo poo on live tv posted:There is a lot of truth to that and there were also those that disagreed. Either way I don't really see how that shields anyone from criticism because of the obvious consequences of what actually happened as a direct cause of the crime bill. It shouldn't shield someone from criticism over the results, but she campaigned on reversing a lot of that. "My husband did what seemed right at the time, and we'll change what needs to be changed now" is a lot less bad than "well, we locked up blacks for sport because we are actually white supremacists ourselves" which is what it seems to get portrayed as on the internet.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:09
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If I had a dime for every time I heard 'Superpredators' during the last two years I wouldn't have to worry about my student loans anymore.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:12
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Der Waffle Mous posted:Yeah don't underestimate that angle. It's a good point that I tend to forget, myself. It's easy to identify with her once one realizes how much unfair poo poo got piled onto her by the Richard Mellon Scaifes of the world. quote:That they've been hemming and hawing over the party line on reproductive health lately is a disgrace. Yeah, well, luckily that seems to have been beaten into the ground for now. That was a thought for the Democratic future that didn't need to be seriously entertained, imo.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:12
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did mccain just save 32M American's healthcare plans....again?
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Sep 22, 2017 21:18
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someone help me, I'm starting to develop Stockholm syndrome
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Sep 22, 2017 21:18
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Hellblazer187 posted:On the crime bill that Majorian keeps bringing up - I seem to remember commentary from the primaries saying the crime bill was popular in the black community, supported by black thought leaders and leading sociologists at the time. Is there any truth to that? the extremely short version is that after twelve years of the government's official policy on black communities being "lol gently caress 'em" the Clintons' "WE WILL RETURN TO THE GHETTO TO BRING ORDER WITH FIRE AND FURY" policy met with great approval because gently caress, at least government was treating crime there as a bug instead of a feature now. part of the joy of incremental politics: the further you let the Right drag the overton window, the less you have to do to be better than the alternative
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Sep 22, 2017 21:19
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Potato Salad posted:someone help me, I'm starting to develop Stockholm syndrome 
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Sep 22, 2017 21:21
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Majorian posted:It's a good point that I tend to forget, myself. It's easy to identify with her once one realizes how much unfair poo poo got piled onto her by the Richard Mellon Scaifes of the world. This is another great point to remember. Black women are just that. We are black and we are women. So we have the compounded problems of racism and sexism and misogynoir. Black women are often unfairly attacked for being black, a woman, or both. It is easy to identify with another woman who has faced a ridiculous amount of (generally) unfair scrutiny.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:21
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Potato Salad posted:did mccain just save 32M American's healthcare plans....again? Is it October? No? Then the answer is 'not yet'.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:22
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Potato Salad posted:did mccain just save 32M American's healthcare plans....again? Even a stopped watch is marginally less of a shithead than he usually is twice a year. Or something.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:22
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Sep 22, 2017 21:22
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Koalas March posted:This is another great point to remember. Black women are just that. We are black and we are women. So we have the compounded problems of racism and sexism and misogynoir. Black women are often unfairly attacked for being black, a woman, or both. It is easy to identify with another woman who has faced a ridiculous amount of (generally) unfair scrutiny. Fair enough, I really mean it when I say I'll try to lay off. 
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Sep 22, 2017 21:23
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Majorian posted:Fair enough, I really mean it when I say I'll try to lay off. I appreciate the contributions you've made and I think you're doing great. Thank you for actually listening! It's all good in the hood.  but this.. If you wanna steal my gif game, we gon fight 
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Sep 22, 2017 21:25
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Koalas March posted:I appreciate the contributions you've made and I think you're doing great. Thank you for actually listening! It's all good in the hood. 
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Sep 22, 2017 21:28
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McCain is actually terrible, right? I'm not just hallucinating that he's terrible and sometimes just accidentally does things that are not terrible, right? Because I swear a distressing number of people seem to think he's some sort of principled hero of American politics and that he can never be criticized because he was a POW at one point.
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Sep 22, 2017 21:29
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