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Take away her powers and you still have someone who effortlessly killed a giant warrior when she was 5.
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Sep 24, 2017 17:19
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Remember that the arc is called Vs. Four Emperors - Zou and Totland are both smaller arcs in a greater whole, and as much as I initially thought they could beat Big Mom here, it's become pretty clear that they can't. Katakuri isn't much of an end boss, it's true, but that's because he's a mid boss like Magellan, likely with Luffy pulling out something we haven't seen yet or that he learns here like with Blueno. Most importantly, Totland didn't have a story in itself that gets resolved with Big Mom going down. There's no deposed leader to take over again, no revolutionary movement, no closure, just Big Mom getting back up again and pursuing the Straw Hats anyway, except taking her down here would make that far less terrifying a prospect since right now she is still unbeatable, so a difficult escape that sets up the next part of the arc and climaxes with a mini boss is the only way this plays out now, regardless of how it could have when we were young and full of dreams of Luffy clowning her with the help of Brook and Nami.
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Sep 24, 2017 17:32
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RealFoxy posted:Please tell me more about how someone in a fictional manga with magical abilities given from a fruit they eat is illogical, thanks. Yeah how silly of me, there is no internal system of rules
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Sep 24, 2017 17:52
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TriffTshngo posted:I get where you're coming from but there's a major flaw in all this: I think you're taking Big Mom too lightly. Dressrosa was won by the narrowest of margins. Doflamingo was a proper "take Luffy to the limit" final boss. Do you really think Big Mom is around the same level of power as Doflamingo? Because the way Oda's built her up says to me that no, she is not. I think she's a lot stronger yes, but I also don't think Doflamingo pushed Luffy to the limit. Luffy was only just losing when fighting him in Gear Second and was clearly trouncing him in Gear Fourth; to an almost comical degree. Which he only went in to in the first place because the Bird Cage made things much more urgent. Even when Doflamingo started using awakening to try and level the field all he did was slow Luffy down a little by doing something he didn't understand. The only thing that stopped it being a pure curbstomp was that Luffy wasn't used to Gear Fourth yet. Gear Fourth itself has yet to have it's limits pushed at all. I'm taking Big Mom lightly, but I'd argue it's because I think other people are taking her too heavily and acting like she's some kind of unbeatable God and I don't think the story has really pushed that at all. When Oda wants he can certainly present that, see Kuma in Saboady, Magellan in Impel Down or the Admirals in Marineford. Nothing Big Mom has done has presented even close to that kind of gap, and while I'm sure people will argue that the gap isn't that big, my point is that that Oda can sell a gap in strength when he wants and I just don't see one here between Luffy and Big Mom as presented. Doctor_Fruitbat posted:Remember that the arc is called Vs. Four Emperors - Zou and Totland are both smaller arcs in a greater whole Syrup Village, Baratie & Arlong Park could be summed up as the East Blue arc, Alabasta, Skypiea, Enies Lobby and Thriller Bark could be summed up as the Paradise arc. Just because something is part of one arc doesn't mean it can't be part of a greater arc. Even the biggest "big" arc has gone on for maybe 150 odd chapters, and we've already put down 77 chapters as of this week just on Big Mom alone. Unless you are proposing that Kaido, Shanks & Blackbeard will all be dealt with in maybe 123 chapters so as to extend this big arc to 200 chapters and make it the biggest one yet, which I highly doubt, then I imagine this is simply another case of naming a mega arc like "East Blue", "Paradise" and "New World".
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Sep 24, 2017 18:05
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U-DO Burger posted:Take away her powers and you still have someone who effortlessly killed a giant warrior when she was 5. she did punch the gear 4 straight out of luffy the one time they went head to head I would be surprised if luffy didn't get some kind of power up from the katakuri fight tho, even if it's not a new form
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Sep 24, 2017 18:37
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tsob posted:I think she's a lot stronger yes, but I also don't think Doflamingo pushed Luffy to the limit. Luffy was only just losing when fighting him in Gear Second and was clearly trouncing him in Gear Fourth; to an almost comical degree. Which he only went in to in the first place because the Bird Cage made things much more urgent. Even when Doflamingo started using awakening to try and level the field all he did was slow Luffy down a little by doing something he didn't understand. The only thing that stopped it being a pure curbstomp was that Luffy wasn't used to Gear Fourth yet. Gear Fourth itself has yet to have it's limits pushed at all. I'm taking Big Mom lightly, but I'd argue it's because I think other people are taking her too heavily and acting like she's some kind of unbeatable God and I don't think the story has really pushed that at all. When Oda wants he can certainly present that, see Kuma in Saboady, Magellan in Impel Down or the Admirals in Marineford. Nothing Big Mom has done has presented even close to that kind of gap, and while I'm sure people will argue that the gap isn't that big, my point is that that Oda can sell a gap in strength when he wants and I just don't see one here between Luffy and Big Mom as presented. Luffy kinda totally did hit his limit there though. Doflamingo was too fast for gear 3 attacks, shrugged off gear 2 attacks and Luffy had to burn through all his gear 4 time and then some to win, and probably would have still lost if sheer ego didn't demand mingo go head to head with Luffys strongest move. How exactly are you interpreting the part where Luffy was on his rear end being hidden by the tournament announcer and a couple hundred gladiators were out getting slaughtered to buy time while he tried to get enough juice up for one last shot?
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Sep 24, 2017 18:41
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luffy wasnt at his limit though because gear 4 proved to push doffys poo poo absolutely in and the only tension was when luffy depowered. gear 4 luffy is a good tier ahead of doffy and luffy wasnt using whatever else gear 4 forms he must be hiding up his sleeve most of the dressrosa fights were chumpdowns and the only stakes was from hostages or the whole island being blown up AND they did it with half the crew gone and while I've accepted luffy isnt taking down big mom here lets not play revision and make it seem like anywhere in the new world had any real challenge yet until now drjuggalo fucked around with this message at 23:33 on Sep 24, 2017 |
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Sep 24, 2017 23:27
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drjuggalo posted:luffy wasnt at his limit though drjuggalo posted:the only tension was when luffy depowered. 
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Sep 24, 2017 23:43
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drjuggalo posted:luffy wasnt at his limit though because gear 4 proved to push doffys poo poo absolutely in and the only tension was when luffy depowered. gear 4 luffy is a good tier ahead of doffy and luffy wasnt using whatever else gear 4 forms he must be hiding up his sleeve Luffy running out of Haki was being at his limit. The "unlimited Gear 4" some fanboys like to imagine would indeed be a good tier ahead of Doflamingo, but that's not what Luffy is capable of right now.
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Sep 24, 2017 23:45
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but if luffy cut all the playing around at the start and hit him with one kong gun like he did after he powered back up the arc would have ended right then and there, luffy didnt run out of gas from doffy but from just using it and doffy would not have handled half of what luffy threw out at cracker
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Sep 24, 2017 23:48
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Luffy depowered so Oda could pad chapters so he could put the sharing of the armada sake cups as chapter 800
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Sep 24, 2017 23:50
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EmmyOk posted:Luffy depowered so Oda could pad chapters so he could put the sharing of the armada sake cups as chapter 800 not worth it
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Sep 24, 2017 23:51
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EmmyOk posted:Luffy depowered so Oda could pad chapters so he could put the sharing of the armada sake cups as chapter 800 Manatee Cannon posted:not worth it
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Sep 24, 2017 23:53
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EmmyOk posted:Luffy depowered so Oda could pad chapters so he could put the sharing of the armada sake cups as chapter 800 everything about the climax of dressrosa sucked except luffy's ability to bend his limbs mid punch and the final blow on doffy
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Sep 25, 2017 00:04
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anime was right posted:dressrosa sucked yeah
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Sep 25, 2017 00:05
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JahRoo posted:yeah nah the arc was super good up until birdcage, and a couple of the fights were solid
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Sep 25, 2017 00:06
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one thing i really like about oda is he creates lots of subdivisions of characters. like, most of the characters in one piece fall into some sort of group so that you can remember them really easily. like, the supernovas, the yonko, the shichibukai, the marines, etc. i know some of these are like, just important organizations or factions. most key characters under characters who are in these groups fall into little subgroups (doffy's org was broken up by suit, for example). so like, you can remember characters by what groups he put them in. i always thought that was neat and something a lot of successful fiction with huge casts tends to do in some fashion so its easier to remember people...
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Sep 25, 2017 00:09
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normally i think the black limb haki stuff and haki in general is dumb but Bounceman's red + black limbs are so sick
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Sep 25, 2017 00:11
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yeah the kabuki aesthetic is cool
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Sep 25, 2017 00:13
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there were some great moments in dressrosa (god ussop, senor pink, king kong gun) that were balanced out by some awful ones (human umbrella robin, luffy
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Sep 25, 2017 00:15
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Saying the whole arc sucked was harsh. It was really long and rambling, and it felt like a lot of good moments were outweighed by dumb stuff like introducing 50 new characters in the colosseum. I understand the point was to introduce them for the sake of establishing the armada at the end of the arc, but it's really hard to care about them until that happens. In general I found it really hard to care about pretty much anything except taking out Sugar, and Luffy vs. Doffy. There were a lot of genuinely cool moments but there was so much else going on that detracted from them and it really soured me on the arc. I started reading after dressrosa had finished so I never had to deal with reading it week to week, but I don't know if I could have stayed interested the entire time. The only thing that got me to power through it was people saying that everything after was excellent (which it has been).
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Sep 25, 2017 00:29
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Dressrosa was a fun arc and had cool badguys but trying to introduce a literal armada of wacky characters in one arc strained the pacing. But now that it's over, the next big arc we have a full cast of side characters with powers and personality already introduced, so we can jump right into fighting Kaidou when they reappear. Look at Dressrosa as good investment for later chapters.
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Sep 25, 2017 01:25
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Conversely, the next arc could be even more bogged down with characters.
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Sep 25, 2017 01:47
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SatansBestBuddy posted:Conversely, the next arc could be even more bogged down with characters. it seems like we'll know most of the straw-hat side characters tho
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Sep 25, 2017 03:10
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SatansBestBuddy posted:Conversely, the next arc could be even more bogged down with characters. This is why I wonder if we even need a new crew member. Ever since the New World started it feels like the series is buckling under its own weight.
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Sep 25, 2017 09:01
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Blockhouse posted:This is why I wonder if we even need a new crew member. Ever since the New World started it feels like the series is buckling under its own weight. Would help if they didn't meet 50 assistant characters every single arc.
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Sep 25, 2017 09:01
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carrot joining the crew would be cool and good imo
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Sep 25, 2017 09:53
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ManSedan posted:What if there are Devil Vegetables. Closest thing is a tomato devil fruit.
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Sep 25, 2017 09:57
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Jose posted:carrot joining the crew would be cool and good imo Yeah, I could see her joining up but if she does I'm gonna assume she'll be the last regular member unless they decide to shove Law or Vivi onto the team later on (which is doubtful seeing as they both have their own commitments to worry about). I agree that we don't really need anymore crew members though, this series has become bloated enough as it is.
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Sep 25, 2017 11:56
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every one piece character is a precious gift
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Sep 25, 2017 12:02
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this might be a hot take but i think luffy is going to punch big mam
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Sep 25, 2017 13:03
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Countblanc posted:yeah the kabuki aesthetic is cool Gear 5 is gonna be Noh theatre. Gear 6 is just going to be luffy reciting terrible poetry.
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Sep 25, 2017 13:54
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Jose posted:carrot joining the crew would be cool and good imo Carrot and the other furries will probably join the armada along with the samurai.
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Sep 25, 2017 17:47
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Jose posted:this might be a hot take but i think luffy is going to punch big mam He tried but it didn't work.
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Sep 25, 2017 19:41
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The official translation of Napoleon's line is "this country" not my country.
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Sep 25, 2017 20:29
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Hey couple of questions, was there a reason given why Zoro can do Asura? Is he just bad as gently caress? And what's up with all the reused Baroque Works powers in Doflamingos crew?
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Sep 26, 2017 05:32
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Beef Jerky Robot posted:Hey couple of questions, was there a reason given why Zoro can do Asura? Is he just bad as gently caress? And what's up with all the reused Baroque Works powers in Doflamingos crew? A. It was just a new power up I think. B. I think a good deal of the 2nd arc features similar powers. Even in the Big Mom arc, we have Katakuri's fruit against Luffy's fruit, and Perospero's fruit against Galdino's (Mr. 3) fruit. Heck, not just powers but also storylines and characters, sorta. The Dressarosa arc has plenty of similarities with the Baroque Works arc, so I figure it's deliberate on Oda's part.
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Sep 26, 2017 05:43
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I got the impression Croc was trying to follow the Dressrosa playbook. Of course, the meta reason might be that Oda went back to the well. Lpzie fucked around with this message at 06:07 on Sep 26, 2017 |
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Sep 26, 2017 06:03
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Beef Jerky Robot posted:Hey couple of questions, was there a reason given why Zoro can do Asura? Is he just bad as gently caress? And what's up with all the reused Baroque Works powers in Doflamingos crew? Yeah, Zoro's just that cool. Also, Oda actually addressed this, a lot of fruits work off a hierarchy, so Plume Plume is strictly a worse Gas Gas, Chill Chill is a better Snow Snow, Weapon Weapon is straight up better than Dice Dice, etc
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Sep 26, 2017 08:18
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Zoro's relying just on pure strength and has a pretty high mastery on most Haki so I wouldn't be surprised if he's almost as strong as Luffy right now in the same way the people were terrified of Raleigh. Out of the 12 people in the "Worst Generation" the only two who have a relatively unknown strength right now are Drake (Who has a mythical Zoan fruit) and Killer (Who I assume is like Zoro and just really loving strong) I'm assuming Tier A+ is Luffy/Law/Kid Tier A- is Drake/Zoro/Killer and playing sub-captains/Admirals to the strongest pirates Blackbeard is an end-boss with some broken Fruit. Hawkins/Capone/Uroge/Apoo are B tier and aligning themselves with stronger people Bonney is probably not particularly strong, but plot related, perhaps to World Nobles, in the same way Robin is extremely important yet not overwhelmingly strong What I really want to know is how Crocodile and Bones stack up against these guys, and honestly maybe even Enel could hold his own in the New World too if he weren't so lazy/laid back. What I love about One Piece is that people aren't losing to imaginary power levels like Bleach, Naruto, or Dragon Ball Z, but legitimate counters
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Sep 26, 2017 08:21
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