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The whole idea of Company/Batallion/whatever-level assets just blows my mind. Look at the Soviet division in 1939: 18K men...54 AT guns.
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Oct 4, 2017 15:23
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aphid_licker posted:I feel like I've read more than a few stories of people trying a bit too hard to cleverly anticipate what the next war would be like and ending up with something completely stupid But I've been stockpiling all these sticks and stones for WW III
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Oct 4, 2017 15:25
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zoux posted:But I've been stockpiling all these sticks and stones for WW III You're the greater fool then, it's WW4 that is scheduled for sticks and stones. Your precious clubs and knapped spear heads won't save you from 50mt of canned sunshine.
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Oct 4, 2017 15:37
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JcDent posted:The whole idea of Company/Batallion/whatever-level assets just blows my mind. Look at the Soviet division in 1939: 18K men...54 AT guns. Isn't that "54 AT guns to reinforce AT guns already extant in regiment/brigade level formations"? And those regiments and brigades have their own AT guns to reinforce the ones already in companies and battalions?
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Oct 4, 2017 15:38
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Yeah, Russian assets are generally corresponding to level of hierarchy. So squad level artillery might be a single mortar, regimental could be some SPGs and towed mortars, while divisional artillery are more like batteries of 203mm or something.
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Oct 4, 2017 15:54
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Slim Jim Pickens posted:Even in propaganda, the A-H was the most A-H of all the great powers. All I can see  
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Oct 4, 2017 16:22
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Tias posted:Yeah, Russian assets are generally corresponding to level of hierarchy. So squad level artillery might be a single mortar, regimental could be some SPGs and towed mortars, while divisional artillery are more like batteries of 203mm or something. You're vastly overestimating the caliber of artillery offered. The smallest artillery piece would be at the company level, 50 mm mortars, designed to replace rifle grenades. At the battalion level, there were 82 mm mortars, and 120 mm at the regimental level. The regiment would also have access to low velocity 76 mm guns. Divisional artillery consisted of 76 mm guns and 122 mm howitzers. The big poo poo (122 mm guns, 152 mm gun-howitzers, 203 mm howitzers, etc) was at the corps level. JcDent posted:The whole idea of Company/Batallion/whatever-level assets just blows my mind. Look at the Soviet division in 1939: 18K men...54 AT guns. That's 54 anti-tank guns that are permanently tied to that division (at the division level, like Davin Valkri said). In the event of the division being deployed in a place where there are likely to be tanks, it would receive reinforcements in the form of a dedicated tank or anti-tank unit.
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Oct 4, 2017 16:37
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None of this is unique to the Russian army in WWII.
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Oct 4, 2017 17:20
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Slim Jim Pickens posted:Even in propaganda, the A-H was the most A-H of all the great powers. I'm the giant blond mustache
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Oct 4, 2017 17:23
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Slim Jim Pickens posted:the A-H was the most A-H of all the great powers.
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Oct 4, 2017 17:26
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I'm posting this so we can argue about Mr. Dent's spelling of "grognard" nothing else
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Oct 4, 2017 19:09
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Nebakenezzer posted:I'm posting this so we can argue about Mr. Dent's spelling of "grognard" nothing else finally, someone who remembers that british tanks have genders
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Oct 4, 2017 19:14
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Oct 4, 2017 19:35
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Oct 4, 2017 19:37
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Oct 4, 2017 19:40
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You have my attention
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Oct 4, 2017 19:43
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Oct 4, 2017 19:50
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Wouldn't the next step down be "slings", "spear throwers", or "a rock"?
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Oct 4, 2017 19:54
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Davin Valkri posted:Wouldn't the next step down be "slings", "spear throwers", or "a rock"? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ZnOsbD0wUw
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Oct 4, 2017 19:58
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Nebakenezzer posted:I'm posting this so we can argue about Mr. Dent's spelling of "grognard" nothing else Urgh if I had a million pounds I would buy the entire catalogue and wear a different one every day.
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Oct 4, 2017 22:26
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JaucheCharly posted:You have my attention PIKES
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Oct 4, 2017 22:27
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Nenonen posted:All I can see I'll call https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tt7xJdKfIMM
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Oct 4, 2017 22:36
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Oct 4, 2017 23:13
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Someone was posting a bunch of Byzantine empire memes in another thread here and I was dying
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Oct 4, 2017 23:15
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canyoneer posted:Someone was posting a bunch of Byzantine empire memes in another thread here and I was dying i love my dead gay empire
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Oct 4, 2017 23:34
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canyoneer posted:Someone was posting a bunch of Byzantine empire memes in another thread here and I was dying Well don't just say that without fuckin' sharing with the class.
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Oct 4, 2017 23:53
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Here's my current favorite military history meme
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Oct 5, 2017 00:19
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it loses something without the tweet complaining about how hard it is to draw meiji clothing on a cat
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Oct 5, 2017 00:26
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JcDent posted:The whole idea of Company/Batallion/whatever-level assets just blows my mind. Look at the Soviet division in 1939: 18K men...54 AT guns. In addition to the stuff mentioned above, 54 guns translates to a substantial amount of gun crew, drivers, quartermasters, caterers, signallers, ammo depots and clerks, especially if they are large guns. Multiply this by all the other support arms organic to the division and suddenly the level of support allocated to the riflemen looks much more appropriate.
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Oct 5, 2017 02:19
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The first panel of this one always makes me mad. "I'm punk so I must rebel". Uh... Yes? I guess it takes too much space to write out "my mode of dress is a commercialized derivative of punk fashion and I enjoy the musical stylings of Blink-182 and Avril Lavigne so I must rebel."
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Oct 5, 2017 04:31
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I've been in one too many (okay, far too many) conversations about how steampunk isn't real punk because it doesn't rebel against anything.
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Oct 5, 2017 05:31
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Ensign Expendable posted:I've been in one too many (okay, far too many) conversations about how steampunk isn't real punk because it doesn't rebel against anything. It rebels against the widely-held belief that steampunk is lame as all hell? Which is correct. Steampunk is in fact lame as all hell. vv: China Mieville managed to make steampunk rad, but the subculture around it?? less rad by a good deal Grand Prize Winner fucked around with this message at 05:42 on Oct 5, 2017 |
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Oct 5, 2017 05:39
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Ensign Expendable posted:I've been in one too many (okay, far too many) conversations about how steampunk isn't real punk because it doesn't rebel against anything. That seems more like a knock on the writers and less on the aesthetic though. You could very easily (or maybe readily) do a story thats got unspeakable acts of colonial cruelty going on abroad while little orphans are getting their hands mangled making clockwork war machines at home while organized labor gets its collective teeth kicked in by undercover autonomous police simulacra. Instead you get (cool) airships and idle rich adventurers.
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Oct 5, 2017 05:39
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Milo and POTUS posted:That seems more like a knock on the writers and less on the aesthetic though. You could very easily (or maybe readily) do a story thats got unspeakable acts of colonial cruelty going on abroad while little orphans are getting their hands mangled making clockwork war machines at home while organized labor gets its collective teeth kicked in by undercover autonomous police simulacra. Instead you get (cool) airships and idle rich adventurers. Me and some friends were talking about making steampunk costumes of the October revolution at one point, clockwork-Lenin ("the opressed workers of Russia needed a savior - so they built one!") and so on, just because of that. Too many great white hunter, colonial general and other very non-punk things around.
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Oct 5, 2017 06:30
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I think that at some point it was decided that "-punk" just means "visual styling" or something, so that's why you have dieselpunk and whatnot. For most of the society, anti establishment hackers are part of cyberpunk aesthetic rather than some ideological thing. It's one of those things where language evolves naturally to make stuff more lame. I'm still pissed over memes vs. macros thing.
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Oct 5, 2017 06:45
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Ataxerxes posted:Me and some friends were talking about making steampunk costumes of the October revolution at one point, clockwork-Lenin ("the opressed workers of Russia needed a savior - so they built one!") and so on, just because of that. Too many great white hunter, colonial general and other very non-punk things around. That's a good costume idea and you should do that. JcDent posted:I think that at some point it was decided that "-punk" just means "visual styling" or something, so that's why you have dieselpunk and whatnot. For most of the society, anti establishment hackers are part of cyberpunk aesthetic rather than some ideological thing. ¡Viva la Revolución! 
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Oct 5, 2017 06:52
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Picture of the day: Road with destroyed Soviet armor. Oinassalmi. 1940/03/20. SA-Kuva. Note the width of the road and the denseness of the forest. Operating armored vehicles outside of the roads would have been practically impossible. When the photo was taken (at the end of the war) the snow depth has already dropped significantly from its highest, but would have still been around 50 cm. This is my best guess on the same location in 2011: click. -- Part 7: "Order: A Soviet attack is anticipated..." This is a translation of the war diary of the Finnish 2nd Detached Sissi Company from 10.11.1939 to 26.4.1940, as it fought in the Winter War. Last time, the company spent 10 days in Ilomantsi proper resting and refitting. It was then subjected to a newly arrived 12th battalion of the Field Reinforcement Brigade (12/FR-Br). Together with the battalion, it moved closer to the front, where its now acting as the battalion reserve, some 4km from where I think the front line is. The most recent orders task the company with the creation of some counterattack ski trails and supply routes. -- 13.1.1940 Approx. 11.00 - 14.00: The detachment creates a four-wide ski trail from its camp area to lake Mölkönlampi (Loezi: The name is not a perfect match, but I've learned that the names in the diary are not to be fully trusted and this would make the most sense.) Detachment commander reconnoitring the area of lake Mölkönlampi. 15.15: I platoon to build fortifications in the area of Mölkönlampi. 16.30 - 18.30: Building fortifications in the front line. Light artillery fire. 14.1.1940 9.00 - 13.00: The detachment creates a four-wide ski trail from its camp area to cape Kekoniemi (Loezi: Unable to locate on map. Bound to be one of the small capes along the shore to the east or north.). 15.15.: II platoon to build fortifications in the area of lake Mölkönlampi. 16.30 - 18.30: Building fortifications in the front line. 15.1.1940 9.00 - 14.00: Reconnoitred and cleared a supply route in the direction of Western shore of lake Taivallampi -- cape Kekoniemi -- Kääntämä strait. Pfc. Räsänen acting as a guide. The route was tested using six horses. 15.15: I platoon to build fortifications in the area of Mölkönlampi. 16.30 - 18.30: Building fortifications in the front line. Approx. 23.00: Order of Capt.Laakso:: A Soviet attack is anticipated. Detachment Julkunen moves to reinforce the front line as follows: I platoon, under the command of res.lt. Julkunen, moves to the northern side of lake Mölkölampi. It will take control of a sector limiting on the right on the ridge at the place of the letter "v" in the word "Karpanjärvi" in the map (Loezi:  , like I had the original maps. But I did check the modern topographical maps and there's something resembling a ridge around here). The left limit of the sector is the mouth of Karpanoja ditch. II platoon, under the command of res.2nd.lt Piitulainen is to march to Kääntämä strait, where it reinforces the sector ranging from the strait itself to the mouth of Karpanoja ditch. Leave by 2.00, arrive by 4.00. (Loezi: That's during the night, in case you didn't catch we're using the 24h clock).16.1.1940 1.00: The platoon of res.2nd.lt Piitulainen departs towards Kääntämä strait. 2.00: II platoon, under command of res.lt. Julkunen, departs to lake Mölkönlampi. 3.00 - 4.00: Men are pointed their positions, the sector is prepared for defensive action. The sector is divided into bases "Rock", "Island" and "Cape". Trained manning the positions. Multiple cases of frostbite due to severe cold and lack of tents. Mild artillery fire. No attack. Order of Cpt. Laakso: Detachment J will take charge of the sector limiting on the right on Karpanoja ditch and on the left on Kääntämä strait. The detachment will occupy the strait area with a single platoon. Rest of the detachment will act as the reserve in the northern area of the battalion sector, around the area of Karpanoja ditch. Must stay prepared for immediate action and build counterattack ski trails to the directions of Kääntämä strait, Karpanoja ditch and lake Mölkönlampi Approx. 8.00: Ordered the company quartermaster to load vehicles and drive along the supply road from lake Taivallampi to Kääntämä strait, until a guide sent by the detachment commander is met. The guide will point the place for the new company camp. Approx. 9.00: Sgt. Lehti tasked with finding a new site for the company camp near the supply road, around the height of Karpanoja ditch (Loezi: at beginning the process to find the site one hour after telling the guys to start heading for it. Also, there's no clear indication of where the new site is, but I suspect it's around this area).9.00 - 11.00: After res.2nd.lt Houttu's platoon arrived, II platoon was allowed to leave the line on a squad-by-squad basis to follow Sgt. Lehti's ski trail to the west. After reaching a place where it was screened from the sight of the enemy, the men had to temporarily build fires (Loezi: Must have been pretty cold). 13.00: Baggage train arrives. Work to set up new camp is started. Close-in guard detail is set. Medium artillery fire. 17.1.1940 Heavy exchange of fire in the direction Jänissaari and "Birch" (Loezi: One of the code-named listening posts set up a few weeks earlier. Exact location unknown) during the early morning. No enemy at the Kääntämä strait. 8.00 - 17.00: Ensonite tents (Loezi: literally layered cardboard) are being built. Special difficulties due to deep ground frost and extremely rocky terrain. A field-stable is built. At the Kääntämä strait, field fortifications are improved. 18.1.1940 Quiet with the exception of light artillery fire. Reconnoitred the nearby area. Kääntämä strait field fortifications are improved. 19.1.1940 Kääntämä strait field fortifications are improved. Created a trip-obstacle on the ice, together with mines to raise an alarm. 11.00 - 14.00: Created a counterattack ski trail from the camp area to the area north of lake Mölkönlampi. Quiet overall. -- Next time: The priorities of a Finn are somewhat unique Loezi fucked around with this message at 23:21 on Oct 6, 2017 |
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Oct 5, 2017 07:13
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Counter Attack Ski Trails
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Oct 5, 2017 07:50
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JcDent posted:Counter As a curiosity, that's a single word in Finnish.
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Oct 5, 2017 07:55
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mllaneza posted:That's a good costume idea and you should do that. A friend of mine from college does Steampunk Workers of the World Unite. Historians are fun people.
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Oct 5, 2017 12:26
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