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Bongo Bill posted:According to my schedule, I'll have watched Attack of the Clones again no later than the 22nd. I will praise it to you at that time. Please look forward to it. We'll be waiting with bated breath
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Oct 11, 2017 03:54
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All the prequels had vociferously lovely scripts and miscasting. Hayden Christensen's performance and the Anakin actor from TPM were universally panned (because they were bad). I didn't know this was hyperbolic to say.
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Oct 11, 2017 04:16
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It's definitely got its flaws- nobody puts in an especially good performance, it's ugly as sin- but I would just as soon watch Attack of the Clones five times in a row than sit through the Hobbit Trilogy again.
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Oct 11, 2017 04:21
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I like Porg.
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Oct 11, 2017 04:27
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Yaws posted:It is most emphatically not better than TFA. Like just recently I can say that Jupiter Ascending and Valerian were both far worse than Attack of the Clones.
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Oct 11, 2017 04:27
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General Dog posted:It's definitely got its flaws- nobody puts in an especially good performance, it's ugly as sin- but I would just as soon watch Attack of the Clones five times in a row than sit through the Hobbit Trilogy again. Yeah, the Hobbit films and Star Wars prequels are both poo poo. No argument there.
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Oct 11, 2017 04:30
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I don't understand why the Hobbit movies have avoided the level of notoriety that the Star Wars prequels have. They're really, really bad. Maybe people just felt too beaten down to even want to think about them after watching them.
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Oct 11, 2017 04:35
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I can't shake the notion that my old frustrations with Clones stem from the fact that it's in some ways the absolute spine of the entire (at least six-part) Star War and it falls short of being good. Although I've come to appreciate it a lot more in recent years, especially due to thoughtful posts in these ere threads
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Oct 11, 2017 04:35
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General Dog posted:I don't understand why the Hobbit movies have avoided the level of notoriety that the Star Wars prequels have. They're really, really bad. Maybe people just felt too beaten down to even want to think about them after watching them. The back half of the third one is one of the few times I've considered leaving the theater just because it was going on and on. In retrospect I could've just not seen those movies and missed nothing.
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Oct 11, 2017 04:36
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Attack Of The Clones is hindered by being roughly seventeen hours long. Well that and that stupid droid factory scene.
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Oct 11, 2017 04:38
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It's mind boggling how much worse they look on every level than LoTR
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Oct 11, 2017 04:38
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I have fond memories of them sticking a GoPro camera on a buoy and using that to film a scene in the middle of the movie for seemingly no reason.
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Oct 11, 2017 04:41
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Not to get all  , but it's weird that the Hobbits would even have a go pro
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Oct 11, 2017 04:42
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When I found you...I saw raw, untamed power...
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Oct 11, 2017 05:04
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General Dog posted:I don't understand why the Hobbit movies have avoided the level of notoriety that the Star Wars prequels have. They're really, really bad. Maybe people just felt too beaten down to even want to think about them after watching them. No one has the slightest inclination to rewatch them because they're tedious as gently caress. The prequels are garbage, but they are not boring.
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Oct 11, 2017 05:05
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So the Porgs hang out on Luke's little island. Does he feast on them?
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Oct 11, 2017 05:12
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General Dog posted:I don't understand why the Hobbit movies have avoided the level of notoriety that the Star Wars prequels have. They're really, really bad. Maybe people just felt too beaten down to even want to think about them after watching them. It's because blowback against movies has nothing to do with their quality. The Hobbit trilogy is uncontroversially bad. Enjoyably bad, perhaps, even; they're stupid movies, and while stupidity often ruins movies, it can also elevate scenes. They're Generic Fantasy-Action Movie Product, a cynical parody of their predecessors. They look and sound like you'd expect them to, a trilogy made-to-order to chase an earlier success at the expense of any identity of its own. That's the kind of movie you can easily dislike, but it's not the kind of movie you can hate. It would be like hating plain cold oatmeal. Who gives a gently caress? There may be hate regarding undignified treatment of Prof. Tolkien's literature, but none for the film in the can. The Star Wars prequels, meanwhile, have a very strong identity, an identity that contradicted sixteen years of fan imaginings. They have a distinct and novel style and largely realized ambitions. They had integrity enough to give their audience something that differed from what they had previously shown they wanted. They also happen to be good, but that fact is immaterial: it's a betrayal of expectations. Star Wars turned out to be different than what so many people thought Star Wars was, and that's a disappointment you can really sink your teeth into. Fandom is the condition of feeling a sense of ownership over art on the basis of having invested attention into it.
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Oct 11, 2017 05:22
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Bongo Bill often retreats into this idea that the prequels are hated by fans solely because they simply failed to deliver what fans were expecting. This whole idea hinges on the fact that the Star Wars prequels offered some radical departure from the OT and fans just weren't ready for it. It's a loving pretentious, naive and easily dispelled notion. The prequels were amateur hour from the first film from top to loving bottom. From a writing, directing and acting standpoint. And this carries throughout the entire PT. But he'll never acknowledge this. It's because the Prequel didn't met EXPECTATIONS.
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Oct 11, 2017 05:34
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That would explain people disliking them (if it were true), but it wouldn't explain people hating them.
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Oct 11, 2017 05:35
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no no no, theres zero consideration that the prequels might be bad films! It's the fandom that's the problem! You see how I unloaded that!
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Oct 11, 2017 05:35
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Yaws posted:Bongo Bill often retreats into this idea that the prequels are hated by fans solely because they simply failed to deliver what fans were expecting. This whole idea hinges on the fact that the Star Wars prequels offered some radical departure from the OT and fans just weren't ready for it. It's a loving pretentious, naive and easily dispelled notion. The prequels were amateur hour from the first film from top to loving bottom. From a writing, directing and acting standpoint. And this carries throughout the entire PT. Unfortunately for you, Bongo Bill is 100% right. Well, 90%, the Prequels are also not as good as the OT. Still good, not as good, but somehow this is worse thanks to overhype and sky-high expectations leading to a completely irrational backlash that lasts to this day. As proof, people who discover the Star Wars prequels without baggage usually don't have the same weird hatred. They either liked them or didn't like them like normal movies.
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Oct 11, 2017 05:48
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Serf posted:Like just recently I can say that Jupiter Ascending and Valerian were both far worse than Attack of the Clones. I can quite confidently say those are both much better than Attack of the clones. I don't particular care if people claim to enjoy Attack of the clones. But when star wars fans put it above any other star wars film it actually affects me emotionally in a depressing and disappointing way like no other terrible film internet opinion MonsieurChoc posted:
The backlash may be irrational but more irrational is the bizarre reverse backlash where people say they are really good
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Oct 11, 2017 05:51
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MonsieurChoc posted:Unfortunately for you, Bongo Bill is 100% right. The only people who appreciate the PT are children who don't know any better.
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Oct 11, 2017 05:53
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MonsieurChoc posted:As proof, people who discover the Star Wars prequels without baggage usually don't have the same weird hatred. They either liked them or didn't like them like normal movies.
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Oct 11, 2017 05:56
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Here's another anecdote: A friend of mine had never seen any Star Wars movies at all. None of them. So we we showed him the OT and he liked them well enough. Then we showed him the Prequels I'll never forget his reaction. It was unhinged rage! A real and utterly loathing! He HATED these films! Just detested them! He wasn't a Star Wars fans to begin with and even HE could recognize the shortcomings of the prequels. In short, it's stupid to bring up some lame anecdote to buttress your argument.
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Oct 11, 2017 06:06
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Yaws posted:Here's another anecdote: A friend of mine had never seen any Star Wars movies at all. None of them. So we we showed him the OT and he liked them well enough. Which version of the OT.
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Oct 11, 2017 06:14
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General Dog posted:I don't understand why the Hobbit movies have avoided the level of notoriety that the Star Wars prequels have. They're really, really bad. Maybe people just felt too beaten down to even want to think about them after watching them. Pretty easy. Not really surprising. 1. Star Wars was bigger than Lord of the Rings and people had high hopes for the prequels. Bongo Bill is right. Just look around the Internet at people saying things like 'But Obi-Wan said-!' or 'Things like Yoda are different!' 2. Star Wars prequels were kind of weirdly interesting at points. The Hobbit films are so drat boring. 3. The Star Wars prequels primed people for disappointment, perhaps, when it came to big budget prequels.
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Oct 11, 2017 06:38
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The Hobbit trilogy and the Star Wars prequels are both poo poo, but if I had to choose, I definitely prefer the Hobbit films as the better set. At least their special effects look like PS4 games', whereas the Star Wars prequels look like PS1 stuff from the 90s.
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Oct 11, 2017 06:48
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They should have called the new walkers HR-MBs
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Oct 11, 2017 07:33
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I'm beginning to think that Star Wars fans do not actually like Star Wars. And this means Star Wars fans like Star Wars ads and then immediately forgetting the actual movie, putting its name on a ranked list, and then complaining incessantly about the incredibly traumatic prequel films. We're talking people who say, like, "The Force Awakens is the second-best film in the series" and yet can't even follow the basic narrative.
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Oct 11, 2017 08:03
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porfiria posted:I like Porg. Do you like them enough to drive two hours and buy one bigger than you? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTnEhlvb6jI
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Oct 11, 2017 09:04
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The only movie mentioned ITT that I don't want to defend is Valerian, and that's because I haven't seen it. Where's my four-hour cut of Jupiter Ascending, dammit. Always seems weird to me when people complain that the Hobbit movies are too long, given that we're in the era of binge-watching ten hours of dreck on Netflix.
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Oct 11, 2017 09:14
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To me, there's a big difference between watching 2-3 hours at home v. at the cinema.
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Oct 11, 2017 09:38
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The ranking: Empire A New Hope Revenge of the Sith Attack of the Clones The Force Awakens The Phantom Menace Return of the Jedi Clones is in some ways the most flawed entry but makes up for that by also being the most fascinating. It's the movie where the Jedi are saved by stormtroopers in Star Destroyers, Obi-Wan plays space detective and blunders right into the beginning of the Empire, and we see just how much Anakin got screwed up by being separated from his mom. The romance scenes aren't very fun to watch and the visuals are a little uneven due to this being the first all-digital outing, but it also has some of the purest genre homages in the series, including a shot where Anakin and Obi-Wan fly into the opening of Blade Runner. One of the worst big budget movies ever made? It's not even the worst franchise space opera movie to come out that year!
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Oct 11, 2017 09:42
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"The Lord of the Rings look good don't they? Okay, the Prequels look worse than them."Yaws posted:Here's another anecdote: A friend of mine had never seen any Star Wars movies at all. None of them. So we we showed him the OT and he liked them well enough. This merely proves that the reaction is symptomatic. Nobody reacts with "unhinged rage" to even the worst movie. Anybody can point out a legion of movies worse than the Prequels, so the only explanation is that this unhinged reaction is symptomatic to liking Star Wars uncritically ("he liked them well enough"). Liking Star Wars isn't actually proof of critical capability.
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Oct 11, 2017 09:54
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well why not posted:To me, there's a big difference between watching 2-3 hours at home v. at the cinema. Much like the prequels, the bulk of the bad rap has been acquired since they left the cinema - they all did well enough at the box office. There's the added angle though of there being no HFR home release, which is annoying as they look much worse without it.
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Oct 11, 2017 09:56
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Also I'm glad that people who hate the Star Wars Prequels have, once again, successfully and irreversibly turned the discussion back to the Star Wars Prequels.
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Oct 11, 2017 10:01
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:Also I'm glad that people who hate the Star Wars Prequels have, once again, successfully and irreversibly turned the discussion back to the Star Wars Prequels. I think it's pretty symptomatic that instead of discussing TFA or R1 people tend to talk about prequels. In all of their controversiality, they are much more interesting movies than TFA or R1.
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Oct 11, 2017 10:12
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Very red movie
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Oct 11, 2017 10:30
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Wandle Cax posted:I can quite confidently say those are both much better than Attack of the clones. I don't particular care if people claim to enjoy Attack of the clones. But when star wars fans put it above any other star wars film it actually affects me emotionally in a depressing and disappointing way like no other terrible film internet opinion I mean Attack of the Clones is better in every conceivable way (other than special effects but that's just a consequence of time) than the boring and empty movies I mentioned. It is also more entertaining and important than The Phantom Menace and miles ahead of the Disney Star Wars movies. It is obviously not my favorite Star Wars movie, but it is a fine part of the original saga.
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Oct 11, 2017 11:05
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