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He's a fun hero. IIRC on TT he knew the signature spell from each of the 8 lores.
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Oct 13, 2017 11:09
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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:On the campaign map, it would be nice if dwarfs had a way to reach their higher tier tech units a bit earlier, their growth is the lowest of anyone for thematic reasons but it means you got to go most of the campaign on just warriors/longbeards and quarrelers/grudge throwers with gunpowder sidegrades. Yeah, the Dwarfs can feel bland for a while because of it. They have some really interesting and fun units but you don't see them for so long. It doesn't help that their tier 1 units are absolute badasses on their own, but that's the Dawi. Also forgot to add Daemonslayer Heroes to the Dawi roster. A singular angry Dwarf with the bite of a Carnosaur who gets bonuses to assassination on the campaign map. More of a hero/Lord/monster assassin than the Thane who would be an army buffer.
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Oct 13, 2017 11:12
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What's the best way to use the warpfire thrower? it's a bit odd moving them around with the extra rat carrying the machine around for the guy spraying with the hose, they also seem to have a tendency not to fire without a perfectly clear shot which is pretty hard to get with how immobile they are.
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Oct 13, 2017 11:15
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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:What's the best way to use the warpfire thrower? it's a bit odd moving them around with the extra rat carrying the machine around for the guy spraying with the hose, they also seem to have a tendency not to fire without a perfectly clear shot which is pretty hard to get with how immobile they are. Either use them as clumsy flanking teams or leave gaps in the front line with the warpfire throwers behind them, and heroes/lords in front to distract enemies. They can really pour a lot of hate onto troops fighting your lord if nothing else is in the way, that kind of thing.
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Oct 13, 2017 11:24
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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:What's the best way to use the warpfire thrower? it's a bit odd moving them around with the extra rat carrying the machine around for the guy spraying with the hose, they also seem to have a tendency not to fire without a perfectly clear shot which is pretty hard to get with how immobile they are. I don't really like them. Irondrakes aren't amazing but they work okayish because your Dwarf front line units are sturdy and reliable enough for you to spend some time flanking or setting up weird static formations. Skaven? Not so much. Doesn't help that they don't pierce armor when the other WH2 races are generally quite well-armored. I see no reason to use these guys over death globes which perform the same sort of role 100x better.
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Oct 13, 2017 13:11
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After finishing a Skaven and Lizardman campaign I went back to TWW1 to play Wood Elves as I'd never given them a proper go and I'm too impatient to wait for ME. I never realised how much auto-incrementing saves had become integral to my life...
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Oct 13, 2017 13:17
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Vargs posted:I don't really like them. Irondrakes aren't amazing but they work okayish because your Dwarf front line units are sturdy and reliable enough for you to spend some time flanking or setting up weird static formations. Skaven? Not so much. Doesn't help that they don't pierce armor when the other WH2 races are generally quite well-armored. I see no reason to use these guys over death globes which perform the same sort of role 100x better. I can see why warpfire throwers struggle against factions with low-level units with decent armour and leadership, but man are they gonna have a field day with any WH1 race except Dwarves in Mortal Empires
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Oct 13, 2017 14:03
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Vargs posted:I don't really like them. Irondrakes aren't amazing but they work okayish because your Dwarf front line units are sturdy and reliable enough for you to spend some time flanking or setting up weird static formations. Skaven? Not so much. Doesn't help that they don't pierce armor when the other WH2 races are generally quite well-armored. I see no reason to use these guys over death globes which perform the same sort of role 100x better. Ditto. They've had a nasty tendency to march right up next to any given enemy when I give them a shoot order, and then get stuck in melee. The damage is fantastic when they work but they're just too much of a pain in the rear end to make work. Globadiers all the way.
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Oct 13, 2017 14:19
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the whole point of warpfire throwers is to charge some slave units into anything at all and just light that poo poo up like the 4th July. The most important factor is nothing walks away from it alive, nothing.
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Oct 13, 2017 14:21
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The problem is the warpfire throwers will stop firing because they might scorch some slaves and you need to constantly move them around and find a angle they will actually fire at and half the time they just walk into the melee. If they could shoot through friendlies they would be worth bringing, but yeah, just bring the mustard gas guys instead. Sure was nice to see the warpfire thrower light up a treeman though.
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Oct 13, 2017 14:32
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Dravs posted:the whole point of warpfire throwers is to charge some slave units into anything at all and just light that poo poo up like the 4th July. They'll refuse to fire on your skavenslaves unless they have a flanking shot though, and the damage isn't even that great. Death globadiers, on the other hand, are 100% fine with blowing up said slaves from behind your lines and will annihilate both the slaves and the phoenix guard they're engaged with in 5 seconds.
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Oct 13, 2017 14:33
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Dravs posted:the whole point of warpfire throwers is to charge some slave units into anything at all and just light that poo poo up like the 4th July. The warpfire thrower team AI is extremely reluctant to actually open fire on the backs of your own slaves even when ordered to do so due to their flat firing trajectory, which makes them kind of poo poo. Poison/Death Globadiers do the same job a whole lot better because they have an arc on their tosses so they'll gleefully lob globes over(and onto) the heads of your slaves and cause massive ridiculous casualties to everyone involved. On another Skaven-related topic, I'm having serious trouble thinking of any time where I'd want to use clanrats as Skrolk. Slaves are 1/6 the upkeep of shielded clanrats which means I can massively stack the backfield with artillery/death globes and the army is still cheap as dirt, and if I need some punchier infantry(for taking walls and breaches) plague monks do the job amazingly well for only a bit more than clanrats even without Skrolk's army bonus.
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Oct 13, 2017 14:35
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Well with Skolk you got the 50% discount so of course you want to use the discounted units more. But a argument against going full slave is that expendable units cause morale penalties to other expendables so if you load up the entire army with them they will route faster.
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Oct 13, 2017 14:38
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IMO if you're rolling with say, an 8 melee unit core as Skaven, it's best to adjust the ratio of Skavenslaves to actual melee units as your financial situation improves. Even just 2 units of Skavenslaves gives you a decent window of opportunity for your warcrime units to do some serious damage. Mind you, I'm not a fan of using melee to get kills outside of large unit charges or the insane damage of Saurus Warriors in general; I prefer my ranged units when it comes to killing.
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Oct 13, 2017 14:47
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I am excited for better banners to be created again
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Oct 13, 2017 14:49
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Kanos posted:The warpfire thrower team AI is extremely reluctant to actually open fire on the backs of your own slaves even when ordered to do so due to their flat firing trajectory, which makes them kind of poo poo. Poison/Death Globadiers do the same job a whole lot better because they have an arc on their tosses so they'll gleefully lob globes over(and onto) the heads of your slaves and cause massive ridiculous casualties to everyone involved. I skiped warpfire throwers entirely on Skrolk for this reason. They're so fiddly to use compared to globadiers. Multiple plagueclaws / lightning cannons give you enough warcrime options
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Oct 13, 2017 14:54
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Roll with very few melee units as skaven and take a second plague priest imo. Vermintide is so stupid cheap that the limited charges holds you back waaaay more than winds. That's 16 summoned clanrats/monks, plus menace below! All completely expendable!
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Oct 13, 2017 14:57
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Any word on a fix for the idle unit bug?
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Oct 13, 2017 15:02
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Why can't I build siege equipment or use vaul's tower destroyer spell when fighting at the phoenix gate? It's clearly got walls and towers.
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Oct 13, 2017 15:17
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It's because elves are better than you. (they're special gates so you don't get siege stuff for them and they take ages to move through even if you own them)
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Oct 13, 2017 15:27
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I'm a little disappointed they didn't just program Skaven ranged units to not even be affected by other units blocking LoS whatsoever. Most of their ranged units are pretty short ranged anyway and it is thematic that they will not care about a unit of slaves getting fried by warpfire.
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Oct 13, 2017 15:28
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Nephthys posted:It's because elves are better than you. I'm playing as Tyrion and attacking the dark elf shits from inside the special gate. This is dumb as hell. Can a non-Nazi modder sort this out, please.
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Oct 13, 2017 15:32
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Panfilo posted:I'm a little disappointed they didn't just program Skaven ranged units to not even be affected by other units blocking LoS whatsoever. Most of their ranged units are pretty short ranged anyway and it is thematic that they will not care about a unit of slaves getting fried by warpfire. It should at least be a thing that ranged units ignore having their LoS blocked by expendable units. I mean that's an actual unit trait now, so it shold be put to more use. Myself I've had decent use out of my warpfire throwers. Though I usually place them in front of my artillery-heavy army. When the enemy gets close I tie them down with menace below and fire away, when they get too close I charge in my melee units, and try to find a gap or a flank, or better an elevated position.
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Oct 13, 2017 15:35
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sassassin posted:I'm playing as Tyrion and attacking the dark elf shits from inside the special gate. Yeah, I also did Tyrion and those guys lasted until the final ritual for me because gently caress trying to take it without an endgame stack. The gate goes both ways unfortunately. They're made to be impregnable. I think they get a special summoning ability too btw. The HE's get Eagles I know. Not sure about DE's.
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Oct 13, 2017 15:42
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Re: mounts for lords and heroes, you can take them off the mounts in the campaign map. So I'll often take Tyrion off his horse for siege battles so that I can send him up on the walls.
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Oct 13, 2017 15:54
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Nephthys posted:Yeah, I also did Tyrion and those guys lasted until the final ritual for me because gently caress trying to take it without an endgame stack. The gate goes both ways unfortunately. They're made to be impregnable. Turns out encircling them for a turn was the solution. Their high-end garrison thought they could take Tyrion starter units and a bunch of militia spearmen. Their high leadership wasn't a blessing when it meant I wiped out units of black guard to the last elf. Walked right in next turn.
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Oct 13, 2017 16:08
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Nephthys posted:Yeah, I also did Tyrion and those guys lasted until the final ritual for me because gently caress trying to take it without an endgame stack. The gate goes both ways unfortunately. They're made to be impregnable. Dark Elf gate garrisons get no special summon. I haven't seen the others but I suspect only the High Elves get the eagle summon at gates.
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Oct 13, 2017 16:17
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sassassin posted:I retrospect it was unwise of me to become entrenched in a desert war I had no way of ever permanently resolving against a group of religious fundamentalists whose technological level I had vastly underestimated. The Necrarch Brotherhood and Strygos Empire were my personal Vietnam
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Oct 13, 2017 16:52
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JBP posted:My number one Mazda priority was to physically remove dark elves from the closest northern area and then obliterate anything that spent manpower on colonisation. No one moved back in after turn 60. I kept the New world Colonies as allies and let them take over the salted ruins after I wiped that Dark Elf faction off the map. I also actually let them have Skeggi (after I razed it), but rushed to block them from expanding south or west. The end result was they built a workable little empire of their own expanding northwards, and quickly became a great buffer state for me, and really hosed the Dark Elves. You go on making Maz proud, you little warmblood shits, and he might actually start to genuinely like you. 
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Oct 13, 2017 17:01
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Ra Ra Rasputin posted:Well with Skolk you got the 50% discount so of course you want to use the discounted units more. Skrolk only discounts plague monks in his own stack. I don't actually tend to mind when slaves rout. They rally super fast so as long as they don't all rout at the same time they kind of continually stream back in.
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Oct 13, 2017 17:01
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Randarkman posted:It should at least be a thing that ranged units ignore having their LoS blocked by expendable units. I mean that's an actual unit trait now, so it shold be put to more use. I get a lot of use out of queek's starting unit of warpfire throwers because they do *crazy* damage, especially in a flanking or rear attack, they're just hugely micro-heavy. I don't keep them in the primary stack -- i don't want them anywhere *near* actual good troops -- but I move them to one of my weaker armies as a stiffener for when auto-resolve fails me. Globadiers would probably be preferable if I were building new units though.
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Oct 13, 2017 17:41
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I'm a little worried that Ratling Gunners will function exactly like Warpfire Throwers, and will continue to be completely outclassed by Globadiers. Gas Rats were by far the most dangerous rats in Vermintide, too.
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Oct 13, 2017 17:50
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Vargs posted:I'm a little worried that Ratling Gunners will function exactly like Warpfire Throwers, and will continue to be completely outclassed by Globadiers. Gas Rats were by far the most dangerous rats in Vermintide, too. They could be useful if they had a longer range and were a bit quicker moving / more maneuverable. The biggest issue with the Warpfire Throwers is that you have to use them from the flanks, they're hard to maneuver into the flanks, and their range is so short that if you position them too close to the target they'll start running away again due to skirmish mode and aaah cycle repeats.
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Oct 13, 2017 17:59
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:They could be useful if they had a longer range and were a bit quicker moving / more maneuverable. The biggest issue with the Warpfire Throwers is that you have to use them from the flanks, they're hard to maneuver into the flanks, and their range is so short that if you position them too close to the target they'll start running away again due to skirmish mode and aaah cycle repeats. Every once in a while you line up this perfect flank into a gigantic mass of Saurus infantry and they win the battle all by themselves and suddenly you remember why they're worth the hassle.
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Oct 13, 2017 18:02
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Vargs posted:I'm a little worried that Ratling Gunners will function exactly like Warpfire Throwers, and will continue to be completely outclassed by Globadiers. Gas Rats were by far the most dangerous rats in Vermintide, too. They should give Ratling Guns flak ammo to completely murderfuck flying units. 
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Oct 13, 2017 18:02
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Skaven need to work like the pre-Warhammer games where your units will happily shoot each other in the back or put a volley of grapeshot straight through their commanding officer and turn him into salsa without even fuckin questioning the order. Cannons lost a lot of their personality now that they no longer have a dozen dead friendlies laying in front of them. New Butt Order fucked around with this message at 18:10 on Oct 13, 2017 |
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Oct 13, 2017 18:02
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I'm anticipating that the Skyre unit DLC will basically be weapon team alternatives to artillery pieces (Poison Wind Mortar v. Plagueclaw Catapult, Warplock Jezzail v. Warp Lightning Cannon), while the Ratling Gun will be a weaker but longer ranged alternative to Warpfire Throwers. I can see using them in that form for anti-ranged skirmisher work on the flanks and anti-light flyer duties, as well as still being a good threat against massed infantry.
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Oct 13, 2017 18:11
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New Butt Order posted:Skaven need to work like the pre-Warhammer games where your units will happily shoot each other in the back or put a volley of grapeshot straight through their commanding officer and turn him into salsa without even fuckin questioning the order. They are the only army in the tabletop game (at least back when I played, pre 7th edition) that were allowed to shoot into melee combat involving their own troops, they had a special rule for it called "Life is Cheap" so that would be thematically appropriate.
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Oct 13, 2017 18:12
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New Butt Order posted:Skaven need to work like the pre-Warhammer games where your units will happily shoot each other in the back or put a volley of grapeshot straight through their commanding officer and turn him into salsa without even fuckin questioning the order. I miss the Teuton catapults from M2TW Kingdoms that shot exploding barrels that could go off in mid flight, potentially destroying the unit's other siege engine if shooting sideways.
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Oct 13, 2017 18:28
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Magni posted:I kept the New world Colonies as allies and let them take over the salted ruins after I wiped that Dark Elf faction off the map. I also actually let them have Skeggi (after I razed it), but rushed to block them from expanding south or west. The end result was they built a workable little empire of their own expanding northwards, and quickly became a great buffer state for me, and really hosed the Dark Elves. They just invited me to go to war with the orcs then peaced out on the same turn. I think I might need to reevaluate their place in the great plan.
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Oct 13, 2017 18:48
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