PhazonLink posted:

butter emails.


non regressive media :

*has a vid feed of donnie's empty stage while a regressive talking head talks about the Clinton body double and the cyberspace matrix hacking of her emails*

Falstaff posted:

Outside the Russia can of worms, the fact that Trump received so much free (frequently negative) coverage was at least party Clinton's fault. And I'm not talking about the Pied Piper strategy here, I'm just referring to the way she distanced herself from her own campaign to such a degree.

For example, take the article posted a couple pages back about the relative scarcity of her press conferences. She only wanted to engage with the media in a very controlled environment, so of course they're going to talk more about the clown setting his own dick on fire every week than they are about the latest curated interview... in which she basically says nothing new compared to the last 299 interviews.

Thing is, she was supposed to be good at this.

steinrokkan posted:

She not only didn't have pressers, she also didn't have the usual press detachment to follow her around. Her most numerous events by far were closed fundraisers.

Boon posted:

Yeah okay, cite your sources because the press pool followed her just like Trump.

There's a million things to critique Clinton on without making poo poo up

Majorian posted:

It’s almost as if...her campaign messaging was...bland and not exciting?

No, it’s the children who are wrong.

JeffersonClay posted:

It is a journalist's job to mindlessly regurgitate campaign messaging, which is why they wrote 7 times as much about Clinton's emails than Trump's treatment of women.

Boon posted:

This is the stupidest form of post hoc analysis I've seen. Like, you really think that media was giving all that time to Trump, the big orange clown the media frequently used the word 'unprecedented' with because she didn't do a press conference? As if the lack of press conference kept the media from talking about her at all.

The entire media cycle for that campaign was:
1. Trump says/does something loving stupid (from day one)
2. Media covers stupid thing Trump says/does
3. Trump says more stupid poo poo
4. Media realizes a pattern, tunes in to entire rallies waiting to see what he says next
5. Rinse/repeat

WampaLord posted:

There really is no such thing as bad publicity.

steinrokkan posted:

"Clinton has also not yet set up a “protective pool,” a crew of reporters who travel with her on her campaign plane, which is typical. The Clinton team cited the fact that Trump didn’t have one either as a reason for the lag, but then Trump announced a pool. (It isn’t going totally smoothly: The designated pool reporter on Wednesday didn’t have a passport handy for Trump’s trip to Mexico, due to a last-minute announcement, and the campaign wouldn’t provide transportation for a fill-in.) Kaine said Thursday that a pool is coming as soon as next week."

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/09/whos-afraid-of-wolf-blitzer/498434/

From the same piece:

"As for the press conferences, let’s look at Clinton’s defenses. The first is that she talks to reporters all the time. Clinton does give interviews, though not as many as Trump; the Clinton campaign tallied 350 this year alone. But they tend to be carefully chosen sit-downs with a single journalist—Chuck Todd on Meet the Press, Andrea Mitchell; not with a journalist at all, as David Folkenflik noted; or extremely brief. Speaking to local media is a favorite strategy, turned into art by President Obama. It gives a politician valuable face time but guarantees a greater focus on topics of local interest, rather than the thorny, broader questions a national reporter might ask. (Of course, national reporters have been known to ask some boneheaded, baffling, or just boring questions when given their shot.)

The second is that she should get credit for town-hall meetings and for an appearance to the National Association of Black Journalists and National Association of Hispanic Journalists. She did take some questions from reporters there, but these settings are both somewhat more controlled than a press conference: It’s a formal setting, with rules of decorum and few chances for follow-ups and the like. One of the few reporters who did get a question in at the NABJ/NAHJ conference, The Washington Post’s Ed O’Keefe, took a moment to press her and was met with applause: “Thank you for being here. And I think on behalf of all of us, we encourage you to do this more often with reporters across the country. Especially those news organizations that travel the country with you everywhere you go.” The time for questions there was also reportedly halved."

quote:

Evidence suggests that negativity in advertising can have a backlash effect on the sponsor (Pinkleton 1997) and that personally-focused, trait-based negative messages (especially those that are uncivil) tend to be seen as less fair, less informative and less important than more substantive, policy-based messaging (Fridkin and Geer 1994; Brooks and Geer 2007).

In stark contrast to any prior presidential cycle for which we have Kantar Media/CMAG data, the Clinton campaign overwhelmingly chose to focus on Trump’s personality and fitness for office (in a sense, doubling down on the news media’s focus), leaving very little room for discussion in advertising of the reasons why Clinton herself was the better choice.

Shimrra Jamaane posted:

Is it Hillary's fault that when she was under the weather and passed out on 9/11 the media went loving wild about her health and questioning whether she was physically fit to hold office? Her polling numbers took a shark fall due to that whole mess. That was some bad loving publicity.

Shimrra Jamaane posted:

Is it Hillary's fault that when she was under the weather and passed out on 9/11 the media went loving wild about her health and questioning whether she was physically fit to hold office? Her polling numbers took a shark fall due to that whole mess. That was some bad loving publicity.

Condiv posted:

https://twitter.com/jimwaterson/status/919643034308042752

hillary clinton's obviously pretty upset that no-one wants to see her debate people to protect the ACA, or fight against republican tax plans

Mister Facetious posted:

Got a citation for that? Preferably from the POTUS himself.

President-elect Donald J. Trump posted:

So, it began with phony exit polls. And I got a call from my daughter at about 5:00 and she was called by people in their business and her husband Jared, great guy he was called. And they called me and they said, I'm sorry, dad, it looks really bad. It looks really, really bad. I said what's the problem? Tell me. Now, I was doing -- it's very interesting. Because I really assumed I lost. I believe that these things are supposed to be correct. So I sort of thought I lost. And I was OK with it. I wouldn't say great. In fact I called my vice president and I said, it's not looking good, right, Mike? I said, not looking good. You were getting the same numbers that I was getting. Of course you know a lot of it is phony stuff too. Because they will say Donald Trump is a bad person, do you agree or not? So people would say, yes. No, but it's easier than they have yes in a big box like that than they have no, you can't find it. So, you know, a lot of it is phony deals going on. But, I will tell you. So I got the call. And they said looks bad. Looks really bad. And they want to be nice to me. This is -- they're talking this way because they wanted to be nice. They actually thought we might lose. Strongly. So I said don't worry about it don't worry about it. Whatever happens happens. Now, for the last month I didn't do interviews. All I did was these rallies. I did three a day. I did three a day.

[...]

And I said, I said to Mike and I said to everybody, we're going to win Michigan. I'll tell you. It hadn't been won in like 38 years, but we are going to win Michigan and we ended up winning Michigan. But anyway, so I got the bad news from my daughter. And I said, that's too bad. So I go and see my wife. I said baby, I tell you what. We're not going to win tonight because the polls have come out and, you know, I always used to believe in those exit polls. I don't believe in them anymore. And it's just looking bad, but you know what, I'm OK with it because of the fact that I couldn't have worked any harder. You can't do any worse that than. I mean, I just, couldn't -- and if I lose, I lose. And, you know, what, if I lose I lose and I'm going to have a nice easier life. We can all relax together, right? But so, you know, I felt, you know, you don't feel good if you didn't put out and you lose, but if you put out every single ounce of energy in your blood, you feel like OK. There's nothing more you can do. So, I told her, and she looked at me and she has seen these rallies and she said, you're not going to lose. I said, no, I'm telling you the polls are looking very big. She goes you're not going to lose. My wife. So then I figured hey, look, it's just a nice wife that's trying to be nice. And guess what, she's a great person. So what happened, Melania, right? We love Melania. From the escalator. They love Melania. She's great. She said you're not going to lose. OK. So now the polls just closed and they start announcing numbers. And I said, oh, it is going to be embarrassing. I am trying to figure out what am I going to do. And I had this ballroom that's not that big because I didn't know if we were going to win or lose.

Potato Salad posted:

Real talk though, are they white

steinrokkan posted:

they are technically not elephants either

Boon posted:

This is the stupidest form of post hoc analysis I've seen. Like, you really think that media was giving all that time to Trump, the big orange clown the media frequently used the word 'unprecedented' with because she didn't do a press conference? As if the lack of press conference kept the media from talking about her at all.

The entire media cycle for that campaign was:
1. Trump says/does something loving stupid (from day one)
2. Media covers stupid thing Trump says/does
3. Trump says more stupid poo poo
4. Media realizes a pattern, tunes in to entire rallies waiting to see what he says next
5. Rinse/repeat

Condiv posted:

it didn't help that hillary gave trump free publicity by having a vast majority of her ads covering him instead of discussing her and her policies. sounds like even the hillary campaign didn't want to talk about hillary

JeffersonClay posted:

I'm glad we're at the bernouts defending the media's coverage of her emails portion of this conversation.

withak posted:

Isn't there an entire other thread for tediously rehashing the election of 2016?

OtherworldlyInvader posted:

Trump is probably a literal narcissist and I doubt he's truly capable of believing he can lose, but the Trump campaign internal polls were showing the same thing all the other polls were showing; a Clinton landslide.

Condiv posted:

it doesn't help that hillary is literally still trying to rehash the election to this day...

NewForumSoftware posted:

spoiler alert: they are both rich out of touch criminals who have zero qualifications to lead the country who in a desperate attempt to protect their rich friends wasted untold amounts of money attempting to lose an election by simply giving the other candidate more media coverage and it turns out the Democrats won (thank you centrist donors) which means the prize is we get a Republican president

but yes, the army of sycophant lanyards are incompetent and it's been painfully obvious for years. thats what happens when you build a career on being a yes man for senile war criminals

Condiv posted:

https://twitter.com/jimwaterson/status/919643034308042752

hillary clinton's obviously pretty upset that no-one wants to see her debate people to protect the ACA, or fight against republican tax plans

JeffersonClay posted:

So really, when you think about it, all the stories about her emails were an advantage

JeffersonClay posted:

It is a journalist's job to mindlessly regurgitate campaign messaging, which is why they wrote 7 times as much about Clinton's emails than Trump's treatment of women.

OtherworldlyInvader posted:

Trump is probably a literal narcissist and I doubt he's truly capable of believing he can lose, but the Trump campaign internal polls were showing the same thing all the other polls were showing; a Clinton landslide.

Radish posted:

What's sad is both candidates for 2016 keep trying to rehash it for different reasons regardless of this thread.

quote:

Here’s how the alleged scam worked. JPMorgan moved to forgive the mortgages of tens of thousands of homeowners; the feds, in turn, credited these canceled loans against the penalties due under the 2012 and 2013 settlements. But here’s the rub: In many instances, JPMorgan was forgiving loans it no longer owned.

The alleged fraud is described in internal JPMorgan documents, public records, testimony from homeowners and investors burned in the scam, and other evidence presented in a blockbuster lawsuit against JPMorgan, now being heard in US District Court in New York City.

Condiv posted:

it doesn't help that hillary is literally still trying to rehash the election to this day...

WampaLord posted:

She was urged to drink more water regularly by her staffers and ignored them, so yea it was kind of her fault.

I highly doubt that particular event cost her the election, though. Very few voters care about health concerns, we have VPs after all.

The Kingfish posted:

It's a journalist's job to mindlessly regurgitate interesting campaign messaging—which Clinton never provided.

NewForumSoftware posted:

spoiler alert: they are both ricblahblah

Neurolimal posted:

The Guliani Of Demoblahblah

steinrokkan posted:

"Clinton has also blahbl;ahblah

NBC posted:

Raging wildfires forced an elderly couple to jump into a pool to escape the superheated air as their rented house burned — with the husband cradling his dying wife in his arms.

Armando Berriz, 76, and his wife of 55 years, Carmen, 75, were on vacation in wine country with their daughter, their son-in-law and a grandchild and had three beautiful days together before the fire moved closer last Monday. "That evening, we were playing games and we were by the pool about 10:30 p.m. to 11 p.m.," said the Berrizes' daughter, Monica Berriz Ocon. "We were in the jacuzzi enjoying the evening. There was no trace of smoke or any haze. We couldn't smell anything."

A few hours later, Ocon's husband woke her, saying he smelled smoke. They looked out the windows of their rented home and saw a slight glow over a nearby ridge. "As soon as I got back to the bedroom, there was fire [that] had started on my side of the house and, embers were flying crazy," she said.

Ocon went to alert her parents, but the fire was moving swiftly and unimpeded right for their house. "It literally happened within a minute's time. It was violent and very aggressive," she said. "I proceeded to wake up my daughter, told her to get up. She had only enough time to grab a towel to cover herself, and we all got in our cars."

The family broke up into three cars and tried to roll down the street to safety, but the elder Berrizes got separated when the caravan tried to turn around — the couple, now alone, ended up back at the house where the only safe place was the pool. "He said, 'We need to get to the pool.' He says God gave him that Idea," Ocon said. "He and my mom grabbed each other's arms, hands and they ran to the pool. It was the only thing that was not aflame — it was the only path he had, and he went there with my mom, and they jumped in."

Ocon estimated that the pair spent five to six hours keeping themselves submerged, coming up only for air.

"My mother fought hard," she said. "She did not have the stamina that my father had, and they were together the whole time. She slowly lost strength, and it was a blessing. She passed away in my father's arms peacefully. [...] We can draw conclusions as to how she passed," Ocon said. "It could've been the smoke inhalation or the cold of the pool, hypothermia. We don't really know just yet, but what we do know is that it was a peaceful passing."

Armando Berriz clung to the edge of the pool to keep them both afloat, causing second-degree burns. The couple, who were childhood sweethearts, immigrated to the United States from Cuba to build a life and a family together.

C. Everett Koop posted:

Yes, drowning, the most peaceful of passings.

tentative8e8op posted: