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Interesting question: Will the Independence parties participate in the December 21st election? If they do they implicitly accept Madrid's/Rajoy's authority, if they don't they lose all their power.
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Oct 27, 2017 19:33
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The process of charging them with the Spanish equivalent of treason is already underway so no that's no longer an option for them. This is the hill they die on.
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Oct 27, 2017 19:35
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MiddleOne posted:The process of charging them with the Spanish equivalent of treason is already underway so no that's no longer an option for them. This is the hill they die on. It's treason then?
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Oct 27, 2017 19:41
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If Catalonia declared independence, why would they obey Spain's call for elections?
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Oct 27, 2017 19:41
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They have no reason anymore, that's what I'm telling GC.
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Oct 27, 2017 19:42
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GaussianCopula posted:Interesting question: Will the Independence parties participate in the December 21st election? They can still schedule the first official elections of the independent nation of Catalunya for December 21st. Genius!
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Oct 27, 2017 19:43
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Did they take any administrativ actions? It seems to me like they voted for independence and waited for Madrid to react, without any plans on what to do as "Catalan Republic".
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Oct 27, 2017 19:47
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Their best bet is passive resistance, rally the mob with human
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Oct 27, 2017 19:47
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BabyFur Denny posted:They can still schedule the first official elections of the independent nation of Catalunya for December 21st. Genius! That would nicely continue this state of Schrodinger's independence
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Oct 27, 2017 19:48
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Wait, I thought Rajoy was also stripping Catalonia of its sovereignty, so why is he scheduling new elections for their parliament? What's he actually changing in legal terms?
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Oct 27, 2017 19:50
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Rajoy just announced that he's replacing Catalonia's chief of police which uh, doesn't exactly inspire confidence for me.Spiritus Nox posted:Wait, I thought Rajoy was also stripping Catalonia of its sovereignty, so why is he scheduling new elections for their parliament? What's he actually changing in legal terms? The idea is that he's stripping Catalonia of sovereignty until new elections can be held.
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Oct 27, 2017 19:51
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MiddleOne posted:The idea is that he's stripping Catalonia of sovereignty until new elections can be held. Ah, I see.
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Oct 27, 2017 19:53
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BabyFur Denny posted:They can still schedule the first official elections of the independent nation of Catalunya for December 21st. Genius!  It's a pity La Vanguardia didn't use a picture of Rajoy looking to his right because it would have been the perfect image. Fat Samurai fucked around with this message at 19:59 on Oct 27, 2017 |
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Oct 27, 2017 19:57
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Elections on December 21st is kind of unexpected, since Rajoy was getting pressure from his own party to push the date back as far as possible, and could do so for 6 months per the agreement with PSOE.MiddleOne posted:Rajoy just announced that he's replacing Catalonia's chief of police which uh, doesn't exactly inspire confidence for me. Trapero is being investigated under sedition charges for not following orders, so no surprises there.
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Oct 27, 2017 20:03
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sertalman posted:Elections on December 21st is kind of unexpected, since Rajoy was getting pressure from his own party to push the date back as far as possible, and could do so for 6 months per the agreement with PSOE. I thought elections would be on february, at the very least, surprising. On the other hand, replacing the Mossos chief was a pretty obvious move, what I'm unsure is what it will really achieve. At least, the government has renounced to seize control of catalan public television.
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Oct 27, 2017 20:08
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MiddleOne posted:The process of charging them with the Spanish equivalent of treason is already underway so no that's no longer an option for them. This is the hill they die on. Does that prevent them from holding an elected office? It would be very hilarious to see government run from inside the prison.
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Oct 27, 2017 20:10
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adhuin posted:Does that prevent them from holding an elected office? Crushing the aspirations of a new nation is hilarious. As an Englishman I can appreciate this humour.
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Oct 27, 2017 21:27
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Boris Galerkin posted:I’m just an American outsider so I have no idea on the nuances and intricacies of this but this last bit is something I don’t really understand. Spain is a country, and Catalonia is an “autonomous region.” But like… Catalonia is a part of Spain, is it not? Why doesn’t it make sense that the top level of government come from Madrid, where I understand is where the seat of power of Spain the country is?
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Oct 27, 2017 21:46
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A better question for Americans to ask is "why isn't Spain just a Republic?"
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Oct 27, 2017 22:00
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A Buttery Pastry posted:You read "Everything is decided from the capital" and thought that was in any way equivalent to how government work in the US? What the officer corps wants is the equivalent of the abolition of all states in the US, with all authority ceded to the House of Representatives and the office of the president. Or did you think they meant only in terms of the military? The quote I quoted was talking about the military and I specifically mentioned the national guard(s) and how in times of war they’d be commanded by generals in Washington. So you tell me what you thought I meant it in terms of.
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Oct 27, 2017 22:07
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Boris Galerkin posted:The quote I quoted was talking about the military and I specifically mentioned the national guard(s) and how in times of war they’d be commanded by generals in Washington. So you tell me what you thought I meant it in terms of. edit: Most national guards seem to be limited in time, though some still exist https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Guard rgocs fucked around with this message at 22:21 on Oct 27, 2017 |
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Oct 27, 2017 22:19
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Pere Soler , director of Mossos , has stepped down from its position.Basically he obeyed spanish orders.Grapplejack posted:A better question for Americans to ask is "why isn't Spain just a Republic?" Because Franco said no.And when the army is filled with fascisst with tanks and you don't have an army you take what you can get.
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Oct 27, 2017 23:00
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Can anybody tell me what this is?
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Oct 27, 2017 23:35
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Pissflaps posted:Can anybody tell me what this is? Man, France really should conquer Llivia right now, that's some bullshit right there.
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Oct 28, 2017 00:05
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Pissflaps posted:Can anybody tell me what this is? A lovely triangle
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Oct 28, 2017 00:08
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Fat Samurai posted:It's a pity La Vanguardia didn't use a picture of Rajoy looking to his right because it would have been the perfect image.  
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Oct 28, 2017 00:22
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With all the huff huff some people are arguing the parlament didn't vote on the actual declaration of independence but an preamble that doesn't include the proper declaration. This is more a resolution to make the gov apply the transition law that didn't have any kind of normative effect.Basically this is all performative poo poo that is not legally binding by the catalonian legality, and done that way to avoid running afoul of the spanish legality. hump day bitches! fucked around with this message at 00:56 on Oct 28, 2017 |
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Oct 28, 2017 00:33
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hump day bitches! posted:With all the huff huff some people are arguing the parlament didn't vote on the actual declaration of independence but an preamble that doesn't include the proper declaration. A kind of diplomatic last ditch effort to salvage a peaceful resolution, but it just begs the question of why they voted in secret if this was in essence a resolution of protest?
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Oct 28, 2017 00:49
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I don't see how the EU isn't hosed now. No matter which way they side, unless they persuade everyone to reset back three months or something, they have to stand to one side either for separatism or anti-democracy.
Surprise Giraffe fucked around with this message at 01:05 on Oct 28, 2017 |
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Oct 28, 2017 00:54
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PhilippAchtel posted:A kind of diplomatic last ditch effort to salvage a peaceful resolution, but it just begs the question of why they voted in secret if this was in essence a resolution of protest? " you can't say i voted , and whatever the whole thing was fake" They declared the independence with a non binding resolution. hump day bitches! fucked around with this message at 01:10 on Oct 28, 2017 |
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Oct 28, 2017 01:00
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Surprise Giraffe posted:I don't see how the EU isn't hosed now. No matter which way they side, unless they persuade everyone to reset back three months or something, they have to stand to one side either for separatism or anti-democracy. Nobody's feeling as conflicted about this as you think they are. Everyone outside of Spain is on Spain's side.
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Oct 28, 2017 03:44
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Pissflaps posted:Can anybody tell me what this is? catalonia bro... I plan to foem the Donald Trump Brigade when we take the fight to spain in Catalonia.
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Oct 28, 2017 05:30
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Boris Galerkin posted:The quote I quoted was talking about the military and I specifically mentioned the national guard(s) and how in times of war they’d be commanded by generals in Washington. So you tell me what you thought I meant it in terms of.
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Oct 28, 2017 07:13
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Pissflaps posted:Can anybody tell me what this is? A mess
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Oct 28, 2017 07:53
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Surprise Giraffe posted:I don't see how the EU isn't hosed now. No matter which way they side, unless they persuade everyone to reset back three months or something, they have to stand to one side either for separatism or anti-democracy. Nope, they can entirely do the "this is an internal matter" thing because the EU isn't even competent for handling these kinds of matters domestically. (This is working as intended because the Member States are always afraid of giving the EU too much power, lest it do something actually impactful.) The other Member States will have to choose a side to sympathize with but I guess it's only natural that countries would support the country that doesn't want to be split up.
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Oct 28, 2017 09:34
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LeoMarr posted:catalonia bro... Ok, now I'm pro-independence
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Oct 28, 2017 10:23
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Surprise Giraffe posted:I don't see how the EU isn't hosed now. No matter which way they side, unless they persuade everyone to reset back three months or something, they have to stand to one side either for separatism or anti-democracy. Whoever told the Catalans that the EU or its members are willing, capable or even favorable to support their independence was a huge loving liar. It's delusional and gives me the worst Brexit flashbacks. The member states settled on this matter over a month ago when they wished Spain good luck dealing with this internal crisis. This is not going to change. Even if Rajoy starts smashing heads, the other states will just be criticizing the police brutality and urge both sides to moderation.
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Oct 28, 2017 10:27
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Catalonia's malaise is that it is too far away from Russia to become an Oblast. Otherwise, thousands of "volunteers" would have landed at Barcelona's beach-side night clubs overnight and helped establish the people's republic of Kataloniya
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Oct 28, 2017 10:36
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Apparently this tweet https://twitter.com/laSextaTV/status/923962711205171201 Is a part of Catalonia UDIing itself out of Catalonia.
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Oct 28, 2017 10:40
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Deltasquid posted:Catalonia's malaise is that it is too far away from Russia to become an Oblast. Otherwise, thousands of "volunteers" would have landed at Barcelona's beach-side night clubs overnight and helped establish the people's republic of Kataloniya I wonder whether this airline  offers direct flights to Spain.
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Oct 28, 2017 10:40
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