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I've been out of Modern for a while and was looking to update some of my decks. Did Opt not end up usurping Serum Visions? Looks like most decks are running the playset of Visions but only 2 Opt if any (for reference I'm on Grixis Shadow and UW Control). Follow up for Suicide Steve, I did see Opt in one build of U Tron recently, does it work there? Also, what's this UG fish build I see? Was it just one of Saffron Olive's decks of the week or does it have legs? On that, is there any consensus about Kopala vs Kira?
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Oct 25, 2017 22:04
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| # ? May 14, 2024 00:48 |
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Opt is bad. Pretty much the only decks that will want it are decks with Spell Snare that want to hold up turn 1 Snare and cantrip if they don't need it. Probably some combo decks too but it's worse than Sleight of Hand for finding your combo pieces and it's worse than Serum Visions unless you're trying to go off this turn. Blue Tron has enough filtering in cards like Remand, Condescend, and Thirst and is completely unplayable without Chalice imo (also unplayable with Chalice but less so.) You really don't want to play cards like Spell Snare or Pierce that support Opt in Blue Tron for a whole bunch of reasons.
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Oct 25, 2017 22:12
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Basically, Opt and Visions are in different decks.
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Oct 25, 2017 22:56
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I've been considering it in a Monastery Mentor deck that leans on hand disruption
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Oct 26, 2017 00:25
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I still think there's no deck that wants the first Opt before the 4th Serum Visions but there are decks that want it before Sleight of Hand.
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Oct 26, 2017 00:29
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suicidesteve posted:I still think there's no deck that wants the first Opt before the 4th Serum Visions but there are decks that want it before Sleight of Hand.
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Oct 26, 2017 00:32
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So EW went well. I placed 65th because I scooped my last opponent into T8 contention when I was dead  2 of my 3 losses went to people in T8, and the last loss was #12 on breakers.
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Oct 26, 2017 00:33
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standard.deviant posted:I assume that UW control might if it’s not a tap out deck. UWR flash feels like it wants Opt but I haven’t had a chance to play Modern to check. This exactly.
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Oct 26, 2017 00:51
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Oh and Steve--it looks like RUG Delver might be OK after all. Really weird to see it without Goyfs, though.
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Oct 26, 2017 02:57
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suicidesteve posted:I still think there's no deck that wants the first Opt before the 4th Serum Visions but there are decks that want it before Sleight of Hand. I don't play visions in midrangey RUG. I've been experimenting with Opt. It's not terrible.
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Oct 26, 2017 03:04
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Tim Raines IRL posted:I don't play visions in midrangey RUG. I've been experimenting with Opt. It's not terrible. With the caveat that it's a tier 3 deck, I moved from a 2:2 split of AV:SV to 2:2 AV:Opt in Faeries and it's been working out for me. Past turn 2 I want to do everything instant speed, and I am okay with giving up the extra digging power. But yeah, all the tap out decks want SV over it 100%.
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Oct 26, 2017 03:18
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standard.deviant posted:Oh and Steve--it looks like RUG Delver might be OK after all. Really weird to see it without Goyfs, though. It's very bad. Every now and then it runs hot and this happens but look at that top 8. It didn't have a single good matchup in it. Not even close. Also that build was really bad. Mongoose + Mandrills is ridiculous. Just play Pyro if you don't want to play Goyfs for some reason.
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Oct 26, 2017 03:53
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So madcap moon is pretty cheeky and fun when no one expects it.
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Oct 26, 2017 08:13
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Errant Gin Monks posted:So madcap moon is pretty cheeky and fun when no one expects it. I like the version with Emrakul and Through the Breach more. No idea if it's a better version, I just think Emrakul is rad.
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Oct 26, 2017 14:04
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Legacy is trash. I'm back to just playing 1v1 commander.
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Oct 26, 2017 14:34
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Tim Raines IRL posted:Legacy is trash. I'm back to just playing 1v1 commander. Which is also trash, let's be honest. Maybe not as much without the tutors at least.
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Oct 26, 2017 16:07
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suicidesteve posted:I still think there's no deck that wants the first Opt before the 4th Serum Visions but there are decks that want it before Sleight of Hand. A number of Faeries decks have moved to Opt from the Serum Visions, primarily because snapcaster-oriented decks because of how well Opt works with snapcaster. In particular, Yuta Takahashi's Faeries decks has moved from AV/Serum to AV/Opt, and the tempo deck that one of the Faeries Discord players writes about has switched as well (http://legitmtg.com/ub-faeries-at-it-again-pptq-win/). I've been trying it mine, too, and like it there, but not in the versions I was running before switching to snapcasters.
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Oct 27, 2017 13:19
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Is there a UB aggro/control deck that, instead of playing bad faeries, plays good cards? I'm thinking something in this vein: 4x Delver 4x Snapcaster 4x Gurmag Angler 2x Something? Clique? 4x Opt 3-4x Chart a Course 4x Thoughtscour 4x Fatal Push some remands some disrupting shoals maybe a deprive or two? maaaaybe some serum visions? Islands Fetches Watery Graves Mutavaults sideboard has a bunch of black cards like countersquall and your favorite discard spells, maybe some awful cards like vampiric link for burn?
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Oct 27, 2017 18:18
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Johnny Five-Jaces posted:Is there a UB aggro/control deck that, instead of playing bad faeries, plays good cards? I'm thinking something in this vein: I saw one build pop up on Decked Builder a few months back that was full on UB draw go. Was very similar to UW except that instead of path and verdict it ran push and damnation with a different set of planeswalkers. Only creatures were snaps and grave titans. I think all the hand hate was in the board too. Not sure if it was actually any good, seemed interesting though to see a UB control deck that wasn't fairies or an esper/grixis build. Edit: I think this was it. http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=15989&d=298389&f=MO Mef989 fucked around with this message at 18:37 on Oct 27, 2017 |
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Oct 27, 2017 18:33
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Johnny Five-Jaces posted:Is there a UB aggro/control deck that, instead of playing bad faeries, plays good cards? I'm thinking something in this vein: The strongest version of this archetype is probably grixis shadow. If you want to have fun, somebody at my shop plays a sweet UB thing in the ice deck with pretty reasonable success.
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Oct 27, 2017 19:16
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Johnny Five-Jaces posted:good cards?
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Oct 27, 2017 19:58
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I haven’t been paying much attention to magic recently but I assume based on the previous conversation Opt is no good in grixis death’s shadow? Ugh, I need to play more of that deck it’s my favorite grixis/izzet deck in modern since treasure cruise was legal I think.
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Oct 27, 2017 20:40
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I don't know about "good" but a guy at my old LGS was playing uB Zombies for a while to great success. Basically black beaters with some disruption, he did surprisingly well but that was a few years ago and I have no idea what that deck would look like now. Mef989 posted:I saw one build pop up on Decked Builder a few months back that was full on UB draw go. Was very similar to UW except that instead of path and verdict it ran push and damnation with a different set of planeswalkers. Only creatures were snaps and grave titans. I think all the hand hate was in the board too. Not sure if it was actually any good, seemed interesting though to see a UB control deck that wasn't fairies or an esper/grixis build. I've seen one or two decks like this lately, they look cool but I have too many decks already that I don't play.
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Oct 27, 2017 20:45
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Pontius Pilate posted:I haven’t been paying much attention to magic recently but I assume based on the previous conversation Opt is no good in grixis death’s shadow? Ugh, I need to play more of that deck it’s my favorite grixis/izzet deck in modern since treasure cruise was legal I think. Serum Visions is more efficient, but Opt can be good with your Ambush Vipers
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Oct 27, 2017 21:18
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C-Euro posted:I've seen one or two decks like this lately, they look cool but I have too many decks already that I don't play. This was my reaction to this deck as well. It looks fun but i already have Grixis DS and UW Control built (which I don't see this being better than either), as well as the comedy option of Mono U Tron, if I want to play a snapcaster deck.
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Oct 27, 2017 21:18
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How good/necessary are the two copies of JVP that keep showing up in infect lists lately? I have most of the rest of the money cards for that deck but I have a hard time justifying shelling out for those.
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Oct 27, 2017 21:22
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Johnny Five-Jaces posted:Is there a UB aggro/control deck that, instead of playing bad faeries, plays good cards? Most of the "Faeries" decks don't run many Faeries - most are basically UB good stuff in a shell that includes Bitterblossom, Spellstutter, and perhaps VClique, as those are actually good cards against things like Storm and Shadow.
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Oct 27, 2017 21:23
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Mef989 posted:This was my reaction to this deck as well. It looks fun but i already have Grixis DS and UW Control built (which I don't see this being better than either), as well as the comedy option of Mono U Tron, if I want to play a snapcaster deck. I just want to play big creatures, I wouldn't be nearly as interested in the deck if it wasn't running Grave Titan. See also: why I'm about to build Ponza 
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Oct 27, 2017 22:39
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Mef989 posted:I saw one build pop up on Decked Builder a few months back that was full on UB draw go. Was very similar to UW except that instead of path and verdict it ran push and damnation with a different set of planeswalkers. Only creatures were snaps and grave titans. I think all the hand hate was in the board too. Not sure if it was actually any good, seemed interesting though to see a UB control deck that wasn't fairies or an esper/grixis build. this deck is neat but is exactly the opposite of what I want. Basically I'd like to leverage 1 mana 3/2 fliers and 1 mana 5/5s to very quickly beat my opponent to death, and I'd rather do it without having to play stupid games with my life total. it's possible I just can't play that game in modern, and even my inclusion of snapcasters in my original list points to a grindier, midrangier sort of gameplan. chart a course is demonstrably good and disrupting shoal is force of will
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Oct 28, 2017 06:48
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Noted card which is good and not bad Force of Will.
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Oct 28, 2017 07:15
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Modern Update: Still playing spirits. Played poorly in a 2.5 k over the weekend and went 4-3, losing twice to my own misplays, and once to the guy who played in the finals. Updated my sideboard to be a bit more stock and now it holds 2x Eidolon of Rhetoric and 1x Worship. (cutting 2x Chris Pikula and 1x Runed halo) Went 4-0 at Modern Monday yesterday, and even played against some legitimate decks. R1 vs Elves Lose die roll Win 2-1 G1: Elves does its elves thing and empties the hand into Shaman of the pack for 7 and then 8. Side in: 2x Eidolon, 2x Rhox War Monk, 1x Worship G2: we both mull to 6, and I go T1 Hierarch into T2 Eidolon of Rhetoric. Which pretty much shuts down the elves gameplan. G3: Opponent mulls to 4 and I keep a 7 so it was mostly a non-game R2: vs Ad Naus Win Die Roll Win 2-1 G1: I get a T1 Hierarch, represent the T2 Queller, then flash in rattlechains on end step. Cast Mausoleum wanderer during my turn, swing 3 then pass still holding up queller. Opponent doesn't Phyrexian unlife so on end-step I flash in Geist and race him before he combo's Side in: 2x Kataki, 2x Qasali Pridemage, 1x Worship, 2x Eidolon of Rhetoric G2: I don't have enough interaction (even though I have 3 coco's starting T3) 2 of them eat a pact and the last one doesn't see any Mausoleum wanderers. G3: I hit an exceptionally Timely Eidolon of Rhetoric while representing a clock. Opponent lands a phyrexian unlife and I swing him to -3 life, and then attempt to cast a Qasali Pridemage (to destroy the unlife) Opponent has to pact it, and then has to angels grace in his upkeep to not lose, which is his spell for the turn. R3 vs 4 Color Scapeshift (Bring to light) Lose the Die Roll Win 2-0 G1: My opponent goes Shock -> suspend search for tomorrow, so I rightly put them on the valakut deck. I make a huge mistake and fetch basic island instead of Breeding Pool (because I was like "durr protect the life total") and go T1 Mausoleum Wanderer pass. opponent plays a tapped shock and passes. I fetch a basic plains and pass. On opponents upkeep I flash in a rattlechains and target rattlechains with the Hexproof trigger. Opponent takes the bait and bolts chains in response leaving one mana up. I sac Wanderer to counter the Search for Tomorrow that's coming off suspend. Opponent looks really upset, draws card for turn, plays no T3 land, and passes. At this point I end up drawing back to back hierarchs with no green source (see fetch mistake earlier) and a coco in hand. I also have 2x Mausoleum wanderers and a phantasmal image (copying Wanderer) all aboard the "low quality beats train" Eventually my opponent finds a third land and suspends another Search, while I continue to draw 3 drops. I also draw a rattlechains though and that's enough pump for the Wanderer team to get lethal. Side in: 2x Eidolon of Rhetoric, 1x Worship G2: I drop an Eidolon of Rhetoric once my opponents Search for Tomorrow is at 1 counter. A CoCo gets mana leaked, but the Second CoCo resolves. Opponent swings in repeatedly with Obstinate Baloth and I fetch->shock myself to 1 life but get a spell queller for the second baloth, and a lethal swing. R4 vs Grixis Deaths Shadow Lose Die Roll Win 2-1 G1: My opponent has T1 cycle street wraith -> inquisition, T2 Thoughtseize taking a spell queller and CoCo. I swing in with a hierarch T2 and cast a selfless spirit so my opponent is at 9 going into T3. 3 swings from the exalted selfless spirit wins the game as my opponent casts deaths shadows and Gurmag Angler, all creatures that cannot block flying. Side in: 1x Worship, 2x Eidolon of Rhetoric, 2x Rhox War Monk. G2: Opponent has more removal and a temur battle rage and I don't have wanderer or queller. G3: I go fetch-pass. Opponent T1 thoughtseizes and sees land, rattlechains, Rest in Peace, queller, drogskol captain, CoCo. Tanks on it for a second and just says "How do I beat this hand?" takes the captain or the queller (I can't remember). T2 I go land pass, Rattlechains on your upkeep, Opponent chooses not to push, but runs out more discard. And eventually just puts us both into topdeck mode. Once again moderate beats get there. What I'm trying to say is T2 rattlechains on opponents upkeep is a good play because it happens before draw step, and forces them to either let it resolve, or deal with it immediately and lose tempo.
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Oct 31, 2017 18:43
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I too went 4-0 on Modern Monday yesterday on the 8-rack train. R1 was dredge. I lost game 1 but they couldn't fight through the leylines game 2 and 3 R2 was affinity. Won the first game on the draw by having enough fatal pushes to clear his board of anything useful and Liliana to clean up and lock his hand. Game 2 he couldn't get through continual Ravens crimes with Bontus wiping his board and 3 shrieking afflictions out. R3 I should have lost to Eldrazi Tron. Game 1 was a quick IoK remove chalice, wrench mind, Lilly lock Game 2 he locked me out with 3 chalices out Game 3 he screwed up and let me cast thougtseize with a chalice on 1 stripping him down to 1 card on a Lilly activation with 3 shreiking afflictions and a rack out. R4 was abzan good stuff and I just had the removal and the mutavaults to make it to victory.
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Oct 31, 2017 22:04
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Mezzanon posted:Awesome Thanks for the write up Mezz, could you share the deck list with the updated SB please?
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Oct 31, 2017 22:12
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spirits write up
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Thisuck posted:Thanks for the write up Mezz, could you share the deck list with the updated SB please? Absolutely, halloween tribal. Creatures: 4x Noble Hierarch 4x Mausoleum Wanderer 4x Rattlechains 4x Selfless Spirit 2x Phantasmal Image 4x Spell Queller 4x Drogskol Captain 3x Geist of St Traft 1x Kira, Great Glass Spinner /30 Spells: 4x Path to Exile 4x Collected Company Land: 2x Botanical Sanctum 3x Windsweapt heath 4x Flooded Strand 3x Misty Rainforest 2x Breeding Pool 1x Cavern of Souls 1x Hallowed Fountain 1x Temple Garden 1x Raszorverge Thicket 1x Gavony Township 1x Forest 1x Island 1x plains /22 Board: 2x Rest in Peace 2x Stony Silence 2x Kataki, War's Wage 2x Rhox War Monk 2x Qasali Pridemage 2x Blessed Alliance 2x Eidolon of Rhetoric (was Meddling Mage) 1x Worship (Was a runed Halo) Edit: I'm taking this list to a 5k this weekend as well. Hope to have a better tournament report than the 2.5k I played last week. (hopefully I make fewer devastating misplays at least) Mezzanon fucked around with this message at 22:39 on Oct 31, 2017 |
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Oct 31, 2017 22:31
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Mezzanon posted:
Wow, thanks for the fast response!
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Oct 31, 2017 22:54
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Does anyone play old school? I'm planning on giving it a try with the American rules, since I live in Chicago and loads of people play it here. The european rules are just too spergy. Anyway, the tempo decks all seem good. Counterspell is a cool card, Argothian Pixies is a cool card. Can't go wrong.
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Nov 1, 2017 03:32
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Johnny Five-Jaces posted:Does anyone play old school? I'm planning on giving it a try with the American rules, since I live in Chicago and loads of people play it here. The european rules are just too spergy. I'm hoping my local Vintage venue runs events for it, at least until Workshop gets the axe.
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Nov 1, 2017 06:38
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Nothing like having to explain to people why Noble Hierarch is better than Birds of Paradise.
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Nov 6, 2017 08:59
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It's up there with DRS as far as one drops that steal games go. Who was this person?
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Nov 6, 2017 09:26
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People at my LGS. I got my first Noble Hierarch on store credit on Saturday. Despite a shitload of MM3 product being sold last spring, the majority of it was by people looking for Commander singles. We sometimes get Modern to fire once per month but it will just be four-player round robin. So they just never see something like Noble Hierarch's exalted ability make a game last a turn or two less. What's frustrating is poo poo like one of the Commander people bought 36 packs of Gatewatch (they were all loose), opened nine shocklands, and then traded nearly all of them in looking for even more Gatecrash packs. Just....loving sweet monkey jesus.
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Nov 6, 2017 15:27
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