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If SteamVR was the only player VR would be soooo sad... Subsidy is the answer.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:11
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Moonshine Rhyme posted:I'm getting a vive regardless because I'd rather not support a product owned by Facebook, unless that has changed? Enjoy having lesser controllers (Touch > Wands, Sorry but its true) for more money? Peoples whining about facebook and stuff is hilarious. Just dont link your facebook guys. How hard is this? Are you that worried about what you say on the mic being processed? I just dont get it. If you dont have a video card though, That Vive offer is pretty attractive. Also facebook money, means money for games, R&D, etc. Too much hate IMO. iceaim posted:I agree. Valve loving sucks now. Do they? As a stupid consumer I've not noticed. Is this mostly just because they arent doing HL3? Or what? I'm honestly curious what peoples beef with steam/valve in 2017 is. EbolaIvory fucked around with this message at 23:16 on Nov 2, 2017 |
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Nov 2, 2017 23:13
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Lemming posted:I dunno, man. The guy at Valve who figured out low persistence (http://blogs.valvesoftware.com/abrash/down-the-vr-rabbit-hole-fixing-judder/ ok it doesn't say he figured it out directly, but considering who he is and the way he's talking about it I'd be massively surprised if he wasn't at least crucial to the process) left Valve to work at Oculus. Chet Faliszek, their most prominent VR evangelist (and coincidentally one of the writers for HL and Portal and stuff) also left the company. I agree. Valve loving sucks now.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:13
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EbolaIvory posted:Do they? As a stupid consumer I've not noticed. Is this mostly just because they arent doing HL3? Or what? I'm honestly curious what peoples beef with steam/valve in 2017 is.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:20
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Steam is good, but Valve sucks because all they are is Steam and various well hated money grab schemes. They are microtransaction pioneers. Beyond that they dont really do software anymore hardly ever. The Lab is probably the best thing they have produced in years. They do occassionally do good stuff still but it generally seems unfocused and tends to remain indefinitely unfinished unless it makes fat stacks of cash.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:22
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Truga posted:just lol that there's still computer touchers in 2017 who can't type blind tho Sony solved this by making the superior PSVR, no keyboards needed. Double bonus is you get a free Daft Punk cosplay outfit
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Nov 2, 2017 23:23
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Oculus puts in millions upon millions of bucks into software development for the Oculus and haven't even made a demo as interesting as The Lab, which Valve did in their spare time. Looks to me like Oculus is fueled by money, and Valve by talent. Maybe if a few million people buy a budget Oculus set they can start to make something worth putting on their platform.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:26
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Anyway the point is, buy the pc-based VR headset that is cheapest instead of trying to attach morals to the company running them. Facebook has some dark stuff, Oculus was founded by an irl 4channer and Carmack literally does not understand human emotions. Valve hosed up video games I guess too but you know.
KakerMix fucked around with this message at 01:09 on Nov 3, 2017 |
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Nov 2, 2017 23:26
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EbolaIvory posted:Peoples whining about facebook and stuff is hilarious. Just dont link your facebook guys. How hard is this? Are you that worried about what you say on the mic being processed? I just dont get it. SIR you have offended me! Do not bring reasoning to an argument of passion about which multibillion dollar gaming company is backing/owning a VR company that totally desrives my undying NERD RAGE!
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Nov 2, 2017 23:27
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Sintax posted:Oculus puts in millions upon millions of bucks into software development for the Oculus and haven't even made a demo as interesting as The Lab, which Valve did in their spare time. Looks to me like Oculus is fueled by money, and Valve by talent. Maybe if a few million people buy a budget Oculus set they can start to make something worth putting on their platform. I mean Xortex was fun but....
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Nov 2, 2017 23:29
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Sintax posted:Oculus puts in millions upon millions of bucks into software development for the Oculus and haven't even made a demo as interesting as The Lab, which Valve did in their spare time. Looks to me like Oculus is fueled by money, and Valve by talent. Maybe if a few million people buy a budget Oculus set they can start to make something worth putting on their platform. ... buh?
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Nov 2, 2017 23:30
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I like my Rift, but I think I would like a Vive too. More competition is better and is going to be what leads to the most innovation- not the pros and cons of any one company.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:39
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Sintax posted:Oculus puts in millions upon millions of bucks into software development for the Oculus and haven't even made a demo as interesting as The Lab, which Valve did in their spare time. Looks to me like Oculus is fueled by money, and Valve by talent. Maybe if a few million people buy a budget Oculus set they can start to make something worth putting on their platform. Do the free games that come with it count? Because Robo Recall and the Rift Startup tutorial, Blow the Lab out of the water. Sorry, not sorry. rage-saq posted:SIR you have offended me! Do not bring reasoning to an argument of passion about which multibillion dollar gaming company is backing/owning a VR company that totally desrives my undying NERD RAGE! But Daaaaaad!
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Nov 2, 2017 23:43
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The Lab is good but then you do that bit where you open the draw and it's a little office inside (with sarcastic commentary throughout) then 'fix' the robots and it just becomes brilliant. Something about it on a technical level, I dunno, it seems so crisp and clear and very 'there' - and then the humour just pushes it all into genius territory. It is a credit to Valve that it's far far better than it should be purely by being made with great comedic sensibilities.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:48
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peter gabriel posted:The Lab is good but then you do that bit where you open the draw and it's a little office inside (with sarcastic commentary throughout) then 'fix' the robots and it just becomes brilliant. Ok I can agree that it’s crisp and clear. It just bored me to death after the starting things the rift give you to play with.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:50
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Ah yes, the recurring argument of Valve Vs Face. One, a shadow of a game-development company that invents cool poo poo and then gives up on it (Controller, Box, Link, Source2 engine) because there's no requirement for perseverance. If the concept fails to gain traction, they just move on while leaving a bunch of product owners in the dust. Or The other, a money hungry organization hellbent on controlling the market through a walled-garden and console-like exclusives because it's cool to be petty. They couldn't hack it in the smart-phone world, so now they're trying to brainwash the VR baby before it grows into a fully competitive market.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:54
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I like Echo Arena
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Nov 2, 2017 23:55
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Oculus gives you two demos, a platformer, two shooters, a Pokemon Snap like game, sculpting, painting, a multiplayer physics sandbox, a bunch of VR 3D movies, a collectible card game, and a zero-G sports game. But I guess The Lab more than makes up for everything. Oculus should invest more money in demos.
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Nov 2, 2017 23:56
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Exclusivity isn't petty, they're paying for the development of those games. The wall on the garden is easily traversed so whatever.
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Nov 3, 2017 00:00
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Sintax posted:Oculus puts in millions upon millions of bucks into software development for the Oculus and haven't even made a demo as interesting as The Lab, which Valve did in their spare time. Looks to me like Oculus is fueled by money, and Valve by talent. Maybe if a few million people buy a budget Oculus set they can start to make something worth putting on their platform. Sounds like you never played Lone Echo, Echo Arena, or even First Contact.
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Nov 3, 2017 00:02
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The lovely company is the one that nerds feel the need to defend. So pretty much both of them are garbage by association. Just admit you're consumers and the only thing either of these companies cares about, is your money. 90%+ of the VR games on PC are going to work with both headsets and in 3 years, you won't be using your current headset cause you'll have moved on to the next gen which could easily have a variety of other companies to dick ride.
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Nov 3, 2017 00:05
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homeless snail posted:Mostly just they have a super dysfunctional organizational structure where no one can tell anyone else what to do and people can wander from project to project according to their whims, so nothing gets done unless its something enough people are really passionate about (dota updates, VR) and everything else dies in the crib Also they either don't hire designers or their structure makes it so designers don't get any say. Steam has never been very well designed but they just keep tacking on more and more stuff without making any effort to keep things consistent or refine existing features. I think Valve's approach to development is probably fun for the devs but it's terrible at producing quality software.
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Nov 3, 2017 00:07
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Not to mention the B+ tier Edge of Nowhere, Witchblood, Mage's Tale, Wilson's Heart, Unspoken, The Climb, Cronos... It's not an absolutely unbeleivable knockout lineup but it's the lion's share of quality VR software. Plus ASW is the best software performance tool basically ever, plus Dash coming up. vvv Microsoft MR is a horrible idea and everyone involved is stupid. Fooz fucked around with this message at 00:32 on Nov 3, 2017 |
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Nov 3, 2017 00:07
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I don't have any hard numbers, but I have some strong spidey-sense that Microsoft's various Mixed Reality headsets are selling and will continue to sell like poo poo. Like, when the Rift CV1 was super hard to get, people were happily buying piles of them marked up to double or triple retail on eBay. Best Buy isn't moving any of the various brands at all for normal retail price on eBay, and I can't sell the extra headset I got for $30 under retail. All of the headsets plus controllers start at $400-450, same or more than a Rift bundle, so why would you get a Microsoft HMD? - Worse hand tracking than Rift/Vive, and the actual controllers don't look very durable for $100 - Doesn't have passthrough cameras so there's no actual mixed reality, hell the Vive has more actual mixed reality than the MS headsets as evidenced by that Logitech keyboard with your hands showing up - Every reviewer says the image quality is "the same" as Rift/Vive even though it can be around double the subpixel resolution on paper, not sure what's up with that - All the headsets except the Samsung lack physical IPD adjustment In other news my Dell headset still doesn't work... Microsoft is now requesting I screenshot the Device Manager to show the IMU and UVC sample counts... sounds like more fun for me!
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Nov 3, 2017 00:07
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Zero VGS posted:- Worse hand tracking than Rift/Vive, and the actual controllers don't look very durable for $100 First time I hit my door they would have been ruined. My touch controller survived just fine. Theres no way that outer ring isnt going to get busted quickly once you get playing.
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Nov 3, 2017 00:27
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GutBomb posted:Exclusivity isn't petty, they're paying for the development of those games. The wall on the garden is easily traversed so whatever. Sounds like they'd make more money if they sold it to everyone no matter what console, no? Exclusivity is bad and people should be ashamed to support it because all it does is propagate separation.
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Nov 3, 2017 00:33
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And most of the best video games ever
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Nov 3, 2017 00:34
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I'm sure if hollywood had a separate video standard for each film studio that amazing content would still be made, that doesn't mean it wouldn't still be massively anti-consumer. There is no practical reason for
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Nov 3, 2017 00:51
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Thor-Stryker posted:Sounds like they'd make more money if they sold it to everyone no matter what console, no? Oculus isn't trying to make money from hardware/software sales, they're trying to position their store as the place to go for quality stuff in the future once VR actually takes off There is a legitimate argument to be made for their current position; they don't have access to the code for OpenVR (I believe they asked for it and were specifically denied), so they can't actually implement their stuff (like ATW and ASW) for the Vive. If they opened the store legit, then you'd have people running stuff on worse hardware and having a not smooth experience, which is bad for their brand identity This argument is severely undercut by the fact that they implemented a hardware check at one point, which they removed and said it was an accident (  )I think the real test of how legit this is will be OpenXR, if they implement that and become hardware agnostic then I think they'll be justifying their current approach. Otherwise yeah it's just hosed and stupid. Edit: I mean Steam has a reputation as a dumping ground for unfinished garbage, which is uh, not inaccurate. So I can believe them when they say they don't want people to think of their store like that
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Nov 3, 2017 00:53
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It's to the detriment of developers, because it's dividing an already tiny market.
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Nov 3, 2017 00:54
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Pro dev content should be subsidised at a massive loss in a way that's more pro-consumer? SteamVR is 98% a place for indies to lose money, which they're also free to do on Oculus home. Getting Oculus (or some venture capitalist) to subsidise you is the only winning dev move there is, unless you made one of the first titles or released one of the first 2002-level FPS's.
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Nov 3, 2017 01:01
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I haven't posted anything about photogrammetry stuff in a while, but I came upon the holy grail for what I've been trying to do to speed things up and fix geometry: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBIA4oitZ0o A pretty amazing workflow for using medium to incredibly quickly fix holes, smooth bumpy areas, etc etc. This is what I have been waiting for, and it works sublimely. Well... partially. The problem I'm having is that while I can import to medium, edit, and export, I'm not having a single bit of luck aligning the model medium spits out and the original OBJ files. I could try to painstakingly align it by hand, but even being off by the slightest amount is going to screw up the retexturing, I need to align it directly on top. Minor geometry changes won't make a difference to the retexturing as long as its all in the same place. Does anyone have a single clue how I could go about doing this? Any way at all to auto align 2 meshes that are the same on the macro scale but have small variations in the topology on the micro scale? If I can solve this problem, and get it to align, this is the jackpot. This is it right here for quick and easy photogrammetry scene capture cleanup.
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Nov 3, 2017 01:03
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There's a lot of garbage on Steam and they could do a better job at filtering it out, but on the other hand one of my favourite VR games is rough enough that it's probably not Oculus Store material. Giving indie/solo developers room to experiment holds merit when applying a technology still in it's infancy. (itch.io handles this niche better than Steam does, though)
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Nov 3, 2017 01:07
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SwissCM posted:There's a lot of garbage on Steam and they could do a better job at filtering it out, but on the other hand one of my favourite VR games is rough enough that it's probably not Oculus Store material. Giving indie/solo developers room to experiment holds merit when applying a technology still in it's infancy. I absolutely agree. I don't think either approach is objectively good or bad, but they clearly have different goals
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Nov 3, 2017 01:14
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Tom Guycot posted:I haven't posted anything about photogrammetry stuff in a while, but I came upon the holy grail for what I've been trying to do to speed things up and fix geometry: I assume that is one reason they have you put it in a box first? If you could use a "snap to" feature to change the axis of each geometry to a corner of the envelope box then you could just snap the position of one over the positon of the other. Or I guess the axis of each should already be in the same position relative to the geometry so you could just snap one axis to the other and they should align perfectly. jubjub64 fucked around with this message at 01:18 on Nov 3, 2017 |
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Nov 3, 2017 01:15
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Sorry i think i was just trolling
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Nov 3, 2017 01:16
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Sintax posted:Sorry i think i was just trolling This is most easily trolled thread I know of so you picked the right one
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Nov 3, 2017 01:19
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Tom Guycot posted:I haven't posted anything about photogrammetry stuff in a while, but I came upon the holy grail for what I've been trying to do to speed things up and fix geometry: Without going and looking up papers, trying to answer like an interview question or something, I'd say to generate volumes for each of the meshes of increasing size (but the size here indicates fidelity to the original mesh since each generated volume is representing the full mesh, just aggregated) until you reach a point where there does not exist a rotation for the second volume that matches the first volume. The last size where a matching rotation existed, take that rotation and apply it to the original meshes. So eg. you start off creating a1x1 volume for each mesh, find matching rotation, then 2x2, etc. until you get to two volumes that cannot be rotated to match and then, my argument goes, you have reached the point where the differences in the original meshes is discernable from the level of fidelity of the volumes and you take the last rotation as your approximation. Seashell Salesman fucked around with this message at 01:52 on Nov 3, 2017 |
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Nov 3, 2017 01:30
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Seems like the narrative about Skyrim being a big pile of rear end has changed a lot in the last few days and the various sites that have played the current version seem to be really digging it. I am still pumped personally.
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Nov 3, 2017 01:51
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The videos look pretty impressive. I feel like interactions with the world could be a lot better though, there's too much UI as well. I'm happy to wait for the PC version, which I hope arrives at some point next year. I'd prefer Skyrim VR over Fallout 4 VR, though I'd be happy to play both.
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Nov 3, 2017 02:38
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