TG As An Industry - Past, Present, Future - The Something Awful Forums

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > TG As An Industry - Past, Present, Future

«‹›364 »

Liquid Communism: Mar 9, 2004; Out here, everything hurts.

The Deleter posted:

Marking the days until it turns out Duncan did something bad. Please no.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 09:10

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# ? May 9, 2024 12:00

Bedlamdan: Apr 25, 2008

Kurieg posted:

Now I remember that Bedlamdan was the person who was defending Bellum Maga because while it was a terribly lovely fetish game that was written with one hand and edited by nobody, the main villain was "PATRIARCHY" and thus the book was good.

I remember saying "it had everything I wanted in a game I never wanted to touch," or something along those lines. It was definitely terrible, yet I was also incredibly glad for its existence. A complicated feeling.

Goa Tse-tung posted:

and they do that because they are broke, not because of some insane conspiracy you believe

I just assumed they were gullible or easily taken in, more than anything else.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 15:04

dwarf74: Sep 2, 2012; Buglord

Bedlamdan posted:

My very first ban here was... less than a year go, actually, according to my rap sheet.

I do remember that Halloween Jack and FactsAreUseless had accounts there though, mostly for the sake of laughs and trolling. Also ThatOldTree under Plague of Hats.

I have one of the very first accounts there, from before RPGPundit took it over and turned it into the abyss that gazes back. Back when it was briefly the new incarnation of Nutkinland. Ah, those were the days.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 15:39

Plutonis: Mar 25, 2011

Nuns with Guns posted:

Tbh 3e isn't terrible. At least it has enough heft to soundly beat the two of them with.

It's more their loving massive delay due to scrapping and remaking mechanics over and over and shithattery on the forums whenever someone asked when that loving thing would be done.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 15:42

Goa Tse-tung: Feb 11, 2008; ;3; Yams Fan

Bedlamdan posted:

I just assumed they were gullible or easily taken in, more than anything else.

yeah one follows the other, if you dont have the time and money to verify/research

# ? Nov 10, 2017 15:45

Plutonis: Mar 25, 2011

Jesus christ loving STFU about mods Dan

# ? Nov 10, 2017 15:47

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

Bedlamdan posted:

I do remember that Halloween Jack and FactsAreUseless had accounts there though, mostly for the sake of laughs and trolling. Also ThatOldTree under Plague of Hats.

No, I was stupid enough to actually try to talk to people on RPGsite, until it became clear that it was infested with what we now call the alt-right.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 16:02

FMguru: Sep 10, 2003; peed on;
sexually

RPGnet forum moderator Zeea drops an arclight strike on that CA Sulieman thread

quote:

I'm sorry Nicole Lindroos is having a bad birthday weekend. I've been waking up suddenly in a panic each night for the last several nights, and I ended up sobbing for a good five minutes yesterday over some of this stuff. I've already decided I'm probably completely leaving this industry and I'm going to need to pull back from the hobby that was a defining element of my life for two-thirds of the time I've been alive.

So, I can't honestly say I give even a tenth of a gently caress about how this is stressing Nicole, Jaym, or any of the other people who decided to attack me, my wife, and dozens of other people. I called out John Morke in the thread where those two posted, and they still tried to claim that I was talking about Suleiman to protect him. gently caress that. They didn't care what happened to me or anyone else, or especially not the victims.

Nicole just wanted to throw her hissy fit and be right, and she threw her entire reputation in to protect some guy that I already knew from direct information had been harassing people, and later went to get a bunch of industry folks together to tell them how much I suck. And then she went after all of rpgnet's moderators due to my mod status, even though that was irrelevant to the thread (and she'd have known that if she'd bothered to read our site rules and regulations before coming here to harass people.) And after a thread got closed to cool off instead of her getting banned for all the personal attacks and other rules violations, she said the modstaff were conspiring to protect Holden, which is loving ridiculous.

Nicole doesn't have any excuse for this behavior. It's stressful having a friend or colleague accused of being a predator? loving tell me about it. I've been there at least twice in the past few weeks, and I didn't take the easy route and start attacking the accusers and making up conspiracy theories. Nobody else did this stuff. Just her and some of her friends.

And it wasn't just one bad day. This was a pattern of behavior that went on for weeks, even after so many accusers came forward that Green Ronin reluctantly had to release a misleading statement claiming they were no longer going to hire them while continuing to attack everyone they'd been attacking. And they're still going on about Nicole's feelings while other people are getting hit with cease & desist letters, directly insulted by Green Ronin, having their reputations dragged through the mud, having their friends turned against them?

Nicole preemptively said that she'd cleared Colin of all wrongdoing with the magical powers of police investigation that her position as an elfgames person gave her. Why the hell would anyone who'd been sexually harassed by him, or socially harassed by her, try to talk to her after that?

Jaym was harassed by John Morke? That's horrible. And that's one of the reasons that I told everyone about him. And also, he hurt very close friends of mine as well. How DARE anyone claim or insinuate that I was believing the victims in a different situation (with Colin) in order to protect John Morke?

(And I want to be clear. I knew specific, detailed, recent accusations against Colin Suleiman from trustworthy sources this entire time. None of them came from Holden Shearer, and in fact, one example came from someone who had been harassed by John Morke.)

So Nicole and friends made a mistake, and wrongly thought this was part of a smear campaign to protect Morke? Okay, then why did they stay on the attack and keep talking about how everyone was being mean to Nicole instead of loving apologizing to everyone they've hurt? Starting with the victims, then the other direct witnesses, then the authors that helped the victims, and then my wife and my friends and me and everyone else they disparaged?

Green Ronin was my absolute favorite company and Nicole Lindroos was one of my favorite industry figures. And then this happens. I didn't want to believe they'd do all this stuff, I've been bending over backwards to give them time to say something right, and they just kept digging themselves deeper. I'm out of fucks to give about their feelings and their reputations at this point.

And even though I shouldn't have to say this, I'm posting this in all black and it has nothing to do with me being a moderator here and I'm saying all this without any prior approval from anyone backstage. In fact, I've been strongly considering stepping down from moderating just so the people who have gone after me online will stop also going after rpgnet in the process. I probably won't, because I don't want to let other people's attacks get to me that deeply, but this is absolutely disgusting and I am sick and tired of seeing these defenses of Lindroos and excuses for why everybody who came forward deserved to be attacked because Holden Shearer exists and apparently that somehow is related in ways that I can't understand.

Naturally, the person who responds by (correctly) observing "Zeea is braver than any of you mealy-mouthed motherfuckers who let women down when they called on you" picks up a one-week ban for expressing such dreadfully uncouth sentiments.

Apparently, "mealy-mouthed motherfuckers" are a protected group at RPGnet, and they really don't want to do anything to make mealy-mouthed motherfuckers unwelcome there.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 17:44

Evil Mastermind: Apr 28, 2008

Watching the RPGNet mods trying to institute a policy that lets people call out the terrible people in the hobby/industry while hewing to "don't make personal attacks" is aggravatingly depressing.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 17:56

Comrade Gorbash: Jul 12, 2011; My paper soldiers form a wall, five paces thick and twice as tall.

Evil Mastermind posted:

Watching the RPGNet mods trying to institute a policy that lets people call out the terrible people in the hobby/industry while hewing to "don't make personal attacks" is aggravatingly depressing.

It's an impossible lift. They'll have to change their rules and restructure the mod team to get there - and I do mean have to, otherwise they're just going to compound harm with dumb poo poo.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 17:59

Evil Mastermind: Apr 28, 2008

Well, they did just redo the rules, but it's still the same basic idea that a direct insult is the Worst Crime, regardless of what the person being insulted has done.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:01

Serf: May 5, 2011

Evil Mastermind posted:

Watching the RPGNet mods trying to institute a policy that lets people call out the terrible people in the hobby/industry while hewing to "don't make personal attacks" is aggravatingly depressing.

this is the product of the most brokebrained people i have seen on the internet so far. i'm trying to understand the torturous logical puzzles you would have to solve in order to determine whether a post broke one of the seventeen-point byzantine laws that you have created to ensure that no one can have any sort of catharsis but gently caress that

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:02

Impermanent: Apr 1, 2010

rpgnet moderation is an amazing example of the worst of civility discourse norms combined with a complete lack of accountability.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:05

unseenlibrarian: Jun 4, 2012; There's only one thing in the mountains that leaves a track like this. The creature of legend that roams the Timberline. My people named him Sasquatch. You call him... Bigfoot.

Someone should probably email the Cubicle 7 response to the CA Suleiman thing to Green Ronin with "Like this guys" on it as a note.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:13

FMguru: Sep 10, 2003; peed on;
sexually

Evil Mastermind posted:

Watching the RPGNet mods trying to institute a policy that lets people call out the terrible people in the hobby/industry while hewing to "don't make personal attacks" is aggravatingly depressing.

Expecially since RPG designers and industry people actually are a special protected class on RPGnet, and even the slightest whiff of personal criticism of them brings the banhammer down like thunder.

Again, we just saw someone pick up a week's vacation because they criticized unspecified mealy-mouthed motherfuckers.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:13

Evil Mastermind: Apr 28, 2008

FMguru posted:

Expecially since RPG designers and industry people actually are a special protected class on RPGnet, and even the slightest whiff of personal criticism of them brings the banhammer down like thunder.

Again, we just saw someone pick up a week's vacation because they criticized unspecified mealy-mouthed motherfuckers.

Hell, even industry people who've been banned years ago are protected.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:14

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

RPGnet feels like the the natural end point of the hobbyist dominated RPG game industry. It's a great thing that so many places from little indies to big names are full of people who were big fans before joining, and those people tend to bring great insight. The problem is there's almost no 'division' any more between consumers and the people making the stuff, there's very little 'business presence' that we get. So, now we have places like this where the writers and all are just part of the community, but they're a part of the community with cool special access and knowledge and that makes the community more valuable because it's a place you can interact with them directly. Video games and all are such sprawling things except for small indie things mostly you just have community reps and all, and those people are suuuuper trained/restricted to avoid problems.

RPGnet genuinely feels like it values having the cool cred of 'we have all these writers who come here' more than anything else, so yea discussions like this become almost impossible because the mods are required to take this really sad handwringing 'guys let's not be MEAN about this systematic abusive behavior that was protected by company heads and had the accusers attacked by company reps' stance. I don't think they're bad guys and I certainly don't think any of them are somehow PRO sexual assault or whatever, but I think they do have their values kinda askew.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:22

Comrade Gorbash: Jul 12, 2011; My paper soldiers form a wall, five paces thick and twice as tall.

Let's keep in mind it's a site built around pretending to be loving elves, and that for the most part the worst posters have been people who truly believe liking the wrong edition of a game is worth making death threats over.

RPG.net has and is taking too long to recognize that's not the only kind of discussion happening and that you can't moderate all those discussions the same way, but they're a niche hobbyist site run primarily by unpaid volunteers in their spare time. Twitter is supposedly multi-million dollar operation with full-time paid admins and they're not only far worse with double-secret probation bullshit and tone policing, they actively promote loving Nazis. The difference doesn't excuse or shield RPG.net from critique but have some loving perspective at least.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:26

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Comrade Gorbash posted:

Let's keep in mind it's a site built around pretending to be loving elves, and that for the most part the worst posters have been people who truly believe liking the wrong edition of a game is worth making death threats over.

RPG.net has and is taking too long to recognize that's not the only kind of discussion happening and that you can't moderate all those discussions the same way, but they're a niche hobbyist site run primarily by unpaid volunteers in their spare time. Twitter is supposedly multi-million dollar operation with full-time paid admins and they're not only far worse with double-secret probation bullshit and tone policing, they actively promote loving Nazis. The difference doesn't excuse or shield RPG.net from critique but have some loving perspective at least.

Oh yea, 100% like I said I don't think this is the result of some moral failing or evil plot or whatever. For most of the history of the site there's nothing bad about maybe leaning a bit to favoring creators because hey it's nice to say they enjoy posting here and all because most of the conflicts were nerd on nerd arguments and the worst that would happen where that bias could be a problem is maybe sometimes a dev got a bit too passionate defending their work and someone gets called an elf-tard or whatever the cool insults were at that time.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:30

Comrade Gorbash: Jul 12, 2011; My paper soldiers form a wall, five paces thick and twice as tall.

sexpig by night posted:

Oh yea, 100% like I said I don't think this is the result of some moral failing or evil plot or whatever. For most of the history of the site there's nothing bad about maybe leaning a bit to favoring creators because hey it's nice to say they enjoy posting here and all because most of the conflicts were nerd on nerd arguments and the worst that would happen where that bias could be a problem is maybe sometimes a dev got a bit too passionate defending their work and someone gets called an elf-tard or whatever the cool insults were at that time.

Yeah we're cool. The fact RPG.net isn't prepared to handle this is a really big problem and is something they need to fix, but "these people are the most broke brain I've ever seen" stuff is just - again, some perspective please.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:34

FMguru: Sep 10, 2003; peed on;
sexually

sexpig by night posted:

RPGnet feels like the the natural end point of the hobbyist dominated RPG game industry. It's a great thing that so many places from little indies to big names are full of people who were big fans before joining, and those people tend to bring great insight. The problem is there's almost no 'division' any more between consumers and the people making the stuff, there's very little 'business presence' that we get. So, now we have places like this where the writers and all are just part of the community, but they're a part of the community with cool special access and knowledge and that makes the community more valuable because it's a place you can interact with them directly. Video games and all are such sprawling things except for small indie things mostly you just have community reps and all, and those people are suuuuper trained/restricted to avoid problems.

RPGnet genuinely feels like it values having the cool cred of 'we have all these writers who come here' more than anything else, so yea discussions like this become almost impossible because the mods are required to take this really sad handwringing 'guys let's not be MEAN about this systematic abusive behavior that was protected by company heads and had the accusers attacked by company reps' stance. I don't think they're bad guys and I certainly don't think any of them are somehow PRO sexual assault or whatever, but I think they do have their values kinda askew.

I think it's an artifact of the very early internet, where places like usenet groups were occupied entirely with computer nerds who just happened to have an interest in RPGs (or Star Trek, or macrame, or whatever) would talk about their hobby and there was almost no contact with the actual producers of their hobby interest. And when someone actually from Marvel comics or White Wolf games would join up, people would be over-the-moon ecstatic, because here was a source of actual inside information instead of just some nerds slapping each others dicks around, and there quickly developed a culture of deference to these sorts of people because you didn't want to chase away the one person who actually had some real insight into what was going on.

Fast-forward 25 years, and now everyone is online and you can follow the instagram accounts and twitter feeds of literally anyone who is anyone and companies are pouring promotional material onto the internet and are thoroughly happy to engage their fans in a thousand and one channels. People "in-the-know" are no longer these rare and precious things that need to be protected, but these old-line communities like RPGnet still treat them as if they were, and that's the arrow that leads to the current situation.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:35

unseenlibrarian: Jun 4, 2012; There's only one thing in the mountains that leaves a track like this. The creature of legend that roams the Timberline. My people named him Sasquatch. You call him... Bigfoot.

rpg.net's pro-creator policy actually came around from the opposite- early on they were more wild west and people were openly insulting game designers for their game design decisions and it had a rep as being extremely unfriendly. So the current policy came from a "We can't keep doing this guys, come on" place.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:43

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

I remember in particular an incident where someone said half-jokingly that he wanted to find Bruce Baugh at GenCon to take him to task for leaving talking plants out of Gamma World D20. What's worse, Baugh had some health problems that afford him few opportunities enjoy such public events. The guy came to his senses and apologized, but that's an example of how people could lose their poo poo at creators.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 18:57

dwarf74: Sep 2, 2012; Buglord

Hoooooly cow. I normally stay far, far away from cross-forum drama, but I have no idea what even all of this means, and how anyone could be expected to navigate this.

https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?819225-New-Rules-For-Personal-Attacks-Accusations-and-Points-Related

quote:

1. You can't make personal attacks on people. No calling them insulting things, telling them to go gently caress themselves, attributing malicious tendencies or motives to them. Don't say bad things about people here. This applies to all posters present and past, even those that have been permanently banned, and everyone presently or previously involved in the tabletop gaming industry.

2. As an exception to the previous rule, it is permissible to talk about specific things that gaming industry figures have done. If Bob Wizardpants started a kickstarter for Advanced Warplanes and Weasels, took eighty thousand dollars, and then released only a napkin with a coffee stain and the words 'gently caress you', then you can talk about this when someone starts a thread asking about what happened to AW&W.

3. This is a narrow exception, one that exists for the purposes of allowing people to talk about major issues in the gaming community and for the purposes of not silencing victims of misdeeds. It isn't free rein to attack gaming industry figures - there are limits.

4. First, you have to stick to discussing the specific things that happened, rather than the character of the people involved. You can't say "Bob Wizardpants is a thief." You can say what the kickstarter brought in, what the goals were, what Bob Wizardpants posted to talk about when things were to be delivered, and all that. If you saw Bob grope a fan at Weaselcon 2015, you can say that you saw it. But (whether we're dealing with kickstarter, harassment, or anything else) you can't take the leap from what Bob did to what kind of person Bob is or what Bob intends.

5. Second, any accusations have to be based on personal knowledge. For the kickstarter example, you have to see the posts you're talking about. For the groping example, you have to have seen it happen, or had it happen to you. You can link to others' words, but only if they're posting in public about what happened to them. Rumors or friend-of-a-friend stories aren't good enough - what's being said has to come directly from someone who knows what happened. When pointing to other's words, please bear in mind that the focus should be on them. Don't use things that happened to other people as a way to further your own personal grudge.

6. This is a fine line to draw, and seems a little arbitrary. The purpose is to keep our usual policy of not letting users attack and smear other posters, while making sure that we don't silence victims of harassment or abuse within the gaming community. This is why people who have personally been affected by or witnessed things are being given extra leeway beyond what posters normally have.

7. When specific accusations about people on this board are made, the forum staff may take action based on it. We aren't going to give specific rules and procedures for this, because these situations tend to extremely unique and fact-specific. But in general, please bear in mind that the forum is not a court. We have neither the position nor the resources to be determining whether someone did or did not do something, unless they did it here. Moderation decisions here are not supposed to punish the guilty or exonerate the innocent. We're also not equipped in any way to try to rehabilitate offenders, and that is not a matter an elfgame forum has any business getting involved in. Instead, all moderator action related to accusations of harassment or abuse will be in furtherance of this forum's mission statement: "To keep the forums friendly and welcoming to as wide a range of gamers as possible."

8. Also, please don't use rpg.net as a springboard to launch off-board attacks on people, companies, or conventions. If you want to organize a boycott of the new edition of Katanas and Kittensnakes, or to file a lawsuit or criminal charges against Bob Wizardpants, this forum is not the place to organize that. There are many places on the internet that are open to organizing direct action, but this is just a web forum where we talk about role playing games and everything else is secondary to that.

9. Relatedly, don't use acts by one person as a basis for attacking everyone associated with them. Don't impute the bad acts of one person to everyone who's ever hired them or worked on a book with them. If those others have themselves made statements or taken actions that would fall under the exception discussed here, posters can of course free to address it as a problem and feel free to discuss any responses they've made. But doing so still needs to stay within the bounds of what's being allowed here. Don't impugn the honesty or character of publishers or other designers who are working with someone who has been accused of some wrongdoing. Don't publically speculate about malign secret motives for every act or omission of everyone associated with someone accused of something. The gaming industry is a small one, and this issue is one that many designers and companies have no policies or procedures for dealing with harassment or abuse by people they've done business with. If they've made public statements or taken public actions, talk about that, not guilt-by-association.

10. Finally, please bear in mind that we're doing the best we can. These are very difficult times. The gaming industry and culture are going through major shakeups and we're trying to find a way to keep this a good place to talk about gaming. We're probably not always going to get it 100% right, but we're trying to get it right. These specific policies may change over time with the benefit of hindsight and experience, as we try to find out how to fulfill our mission of being a friendly and welcoming place under new and difficult circumstances.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 19:18

gourdcaptain: Nov 16, 2012

dwarf74 posted:

Hoooooly cow. I normally stay far, far away from cross-forum drama, but I have no idea what even all of this means, and how anyone could be expected to navigate this.

https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?819225-New-Rules-For-Personal-Attacks-Accusations-and-Points-Related

Also, they picked the absolute worst time to as a joke rename their infraction reporting system "Show Trials and Purges".

# ? Nov 10, 2017 19:31

Desiden: Mar 13, 2016; Mindless self indulgence is SRS BIZNS

Eh, RPGnet's policies evolved during a period in which more progressive types were largely complacent could content themselves with meaningful social progress even while doing little more than internet activism and shouting at people to check their privilege. Problem is, the poo poo going down is a lot more serious and requires more complicated responses than ones meant to keep outrage posturing within acceptable bounds.

I've seen similar problems in a lot of sites. There's a lot of wailing and hand wringing about "what can we do?????" whether its about sexual harassment, Trump, shootings, or whatever else. And the answer is "quite a bit", but its all stuff that requires unpleasantness: doing boring poo poo like lit drops, confrontational things like protests but also ballot initiatives where dipshits try to start poo poo with you, sacrifices like donating money, time, and energy, and otherwise getting out of your comfort zone. It can mean cutting out people who you liked, because it turns out deep down they held some pretty ugly beliefs, and sometimes it means policing your own side, and telling jackasses that are only there for their own egos to gently caress off so some real work can get done.

tl;dr - its been a bad year for everyone, including clicktivists. Places are having to move from talking a lot of poo poo to actually dealing with it, and that tends to involve a lot more confrontation and a lot less managing outrage dogpiles.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 19:37

Nihilarian: Oct 2, 2013

dwarf74 posted:

Hoooooly cow. I normally stay far, far away from cross-forum drama, but I have no idea what even all of this means, and how anyone could be expected to navigate this.

https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?819225-New-Rules-For-Personal-Attacks-Accusations-and-Points-Related

lmao are they still blaming the people who helped the victims for how this all went down

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:01

sexpig by night: Sep 8, 2011; by Azathoth

Nihilarian posted:

lmao are they still blaming the people who helped the victims for how this all went down

Considering it feels like rules 5 and 9 were specifically written to appease the three people angry that a victim of someone vented to a friend about how people who defended her attacker were now getting good guy points by going after someone else yea pretty much

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:13

Kurieg: Jul 19, 2012; RIP Lutri: 5/19/20-4/2/20

Rule #5 isn't going to do anything except protect predators unless victims are brave enough to directly confront them.

Which is bullshit.

RIP RPG.net

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:15

Comrade Gorbash: Jul 12, 2011; My paper soldiers form a wall, five paces thick and twice as tall.

It's really dumb. If you catch someone ratfucking, just deal with it on an exception base then. Don't make a general rule about it because it's just going to create a chilling effect.

EDIT: Really trying to create specific but generalized rules for situations like this is just doomed to failure.

There does need to be cognizance of people weaponizing accusations - I mentioned Alison Rapp earlier. The same happened to Sarah Nyberg. But these generalized rules about who can or can't come forward does nothing to prevent or deter that, it just makes it harder on people who have been victimized.

Comrade Gorbash fucked around with this message at 20:22 on Nov 10, 2017

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:18

ravenkult: Feb 3, 2011

I touched the poop, it was about time to get banned from that shithole of a forum.

e: Like holy poo poo, aren't they basically saying ''anonymous accusations are not allowed, you have to to 100% out yourself as a victim and have proof?''

ravenkult fucked around with this message at 20:31 on Nov 10, 2017

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:29

Mors Rattus: Oct 25, 2007; FATAL & Friends
Walls of Text
#1 Builder
2014-2018

have you considered maybe telling them your interpretation of their rules and why they're bad, instead of just declaring you touched the poop

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:34

ravenkult: Feb 3, 2011

who the gently caress are you, the thread police

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:36

Mors Rattus: Oct 25, 2007; FATAL & Friends
Walls of Text
#1 Builder
2014-2018

no, i'm just a guy saying your posts are lovely and you're being an idiot

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:36

ravenkult: Feb 3, 2011

The previous five posts above mine are a pretty good tl;dr why the new rules are terrible.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:40

Stephenls: Feb 21, 2013; [REDACTED]

ravenkult posted:

I touched the poop, it was about time to get banned from that shithole of a forum.

e: Like holy poo poo, aren't they basically saying ''anonymous accusations are not allowed, you have to to 100% out yourself as a victim and have proof?''

You have to present yourself as a victim or witness, or be linking to the words of someone presenting themselves as such, but you or whoever you're linking to don't have to do it under your own name. What Irlymvhir said about Matt is completely allowed, for example -- "I have firsthand knowledge of what he did." Fine. Links to Facebook conversation screenshots? Fine.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:47

Comrade Gorbash: Jul 12, 2011; My paper soldiers form a wall, five paces thick and twice as tall.

These rules are bad, and most of all seem to point to RPG.net trying to just solve this in one step by legislating new rules, and that's just a wrongheaded approach.

Frankly the model of exhaustive rules just doesn't work for properly moderating forums, especially with the way things are going. They really need to break away from the legalistic approach and have proper community guidelines, and made clear distinctions in regards to different categories of discussion. They're trying to avoid arbitrary moderation because that's just as chilling and lovely, but they've made the rules so labyrinthine they can't be enforced except arbitrarily.

ravenkult posted:

The previous five posts above mine are a pretty good tl;dr why the new rules are terrible.

Maybe you should try to follow their example.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:48

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

No, no. They GSF'd their way into this mess, and they'll GSF their way out.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:53

Comrade Gorbash: Jul 12, 2011; My paper soldiers form a wall, five paces thick and twice as tall.

Halloween Jack posted:

No, no. They GSF'd their way into this mess, and they'll GSF their way out.

GSF? Honestly asking, haven't seen that one before and haven't been able to figure it out from context.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:55

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# ? May 9, 2024 12:00

Cannibal Smiley: Feb 20, 2013

Halloween Jack posted:

No, no. They GSF'd their way into this mess, and they'll GSF their way out.

I confess confusion as to what GSF means.

# ? Nov 10, 2017 20:55

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > TG As An Industry - Past, Present, Future

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