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HMS Beagle posted:The Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles are the final DLC characters in Injustice 2. Oh gently caress they totally are. https://twitter.com/HiFightTH/status/929212966452346880
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Nov 11, 2017 06:20
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CJacobs posted:So what you're saying is, I should play
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Nov 11, 2017 06:21
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HMS Beagle posted:The Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles are the final DLC characters in Injustice 2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rXE2RjinkU
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Nov 11, 2017 06:23
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why is spamming combos seen as "more skillful" than literally any other way of playing in games like MKX? i like to play all the kharacters and don't have time to learn a million button combos, i go online and just can't do anything because aggressive kombo players just wail on you until you're dead. otoh it feels good when i do beat them. like i actually have a decent w/l record but against the people who just do one combo over and over and over i stand almost no chance. is Injustice 2 better about that or should i just give up online fighting games unless i want to turn it into a full time job learning i-frames and all that bullshit? man i miss MK2
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Nov 11, 2017 06:23
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Ciaphas posted:I feel like I now know less than I did 20 minutes ago
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Nov 11, 2017 06:25
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Remember TMNT Tournament Fighters?
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Nov 11, 2017 06:26
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precision posted:why is spamming combos seen as "more skillful" than literally any other way of playing in games like MKX? i like to play all the kharacters and don't have time to learn a million button combos, i go online and just can't do anything because aggressive kombo players just wail on you until you're dead. the real answer though is that those games aren't good enough to take seriously so just have fun with it, and if you want to get good at a fg play something else
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Nov 11, 2017 06:31
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yZ7Y1X8KlBg
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Nov 11, 2017 06:32
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Injustice 2 is good, actually
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Nov 11, 2017 06:34
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:Remember TMNT Tournament Fighters? THat game had a fighter who got bullied so hard her skin turned to armor E: I think? Wait no it was a different 90s SNES fighting game But Rocks Hurt Head fucked around with this message at 06:40 on Nov 11, 2017 |
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Nov 11, 2017 06:34
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Nov 11, 2017 06:36
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homeless snail posted:I feel like your question is kinda all over the place, but yeah someone that knows one move and can execute it consistently is usually going to beat someone that doesn't know poo poo especially how to counter that one move the guy knows, and someone with an actual understanding of the game is gonna kick both of their asses, that's just how fgs work i guess it just feels like there isn't really any attempt to make a fighting game where you don't have to remember a whole lot of poo poo to be good; older games relied more on tempo and playing smart rather than being able to rush in and knock off huge chunks of health bar by just pressing buttons in a certain order. like yeah, older games had that to a much more limited extent (scorpion in MK2) but at the same time it was a LOT easier to counter people who tried it. it feels like they're catering to a crowd that goes for complexity over everything. ideally it would be very possible to be a good player without ever using long 40% health combo strings, in fact ideally those would not exist or would actually be super hard to do. i guess i'm just old. like even soul calibur was more about positional awareness and smart attacking, it feels like. MK9/10 feel like they're all about getting your one good combo to go off
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Nov 11, 2017 06:44
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ive never played la noire so im going to do that
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Nov 11, 2017 06:46
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OTOH older fighting games included killer instinct which was one of the most combo stringy games
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Nov 11, 2017 06:47
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Zerilan posted:OTOH older fighting games included killer instinct which was one of the most combo stringy games that's definitely true, and same with MK3, but at the same time it was possible to be good without using those, or that is to say, it was a lot easier to counter those. it doesn't feel like good design for me to have to look up how to counter certain things online, in those games it was natural/self-evident how to counter them. i mean like i used to be able to play MK2 and kick anybody's rear end with Reptile, who objectively sucked really hard, just by using basic moves.
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Nov 11, 2017 06:51
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CJacobs posted:Elex looks interesting from what little I've seen but I have absolutely no idea what it's about or what kind of game it is. Is there a thread on it? Here's the thread: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3838160 I'd like to play it someday but I'm gonna wait on a sale because backlog.
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Nov 11, 2017 06:53
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and to be fair MK9/10 actually do seem like they tried to go back to "a well placed uppercut or jump kick is all you need" but didn't really commit to it
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Nov 11, 2017 06:54
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corn in the bible posted:ive never played la noire so im going to do that A good thematic thing to try is to buy some scotch and a tumbler like an old-timey detective, and then get so drunk that it makes the game seem better.
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Nov 11, 2017 06:58
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precision posted:i guess it just feels like there isn't really any attempt to make a fighting game where you don't have to remember a whole lot of poo poo to be good; older games relied more on tempo and playing smart rather than being able to rush in and knock off huge chunks of health bar by just pressing buttons in a certain order. like yeah, older games had that to a much more limited extent (scorpion in MK2) but at the same time it was a LOT easier to counter people who tried it. it feels like they're catering to a crowd that goes for complexity over everything. ideally it would be very possible to be a good player without ever using long 40% health combo strings, in fact ideally those would not exist or would actually be super hard to do. To get that combo is about tempo and playing smart, usually in order to do that much damage the opponent usually needs to significantly mess up by whiffing an unsafe attack or something. Usually if your opponent is just trying the same thing over and over it should be easy to counter or punish, like I don't know how that differs from the "smart attacking" you praise older games for. The dynamics haven't changed that much
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Nov 11, 2017 07:06
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Cursed by Finger Puzzles
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Nov 11, 2017 07:07
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CharlieFoxtrot posted:To get that combo is about tempo and playing smart, usually in order to do that much damage the opponent usually needs to significantly mess up by whiffing an unsafe attack or something it sure doesn't feel that way. i'm not getting punished by whiffs, i'm just getting wailed on and desperately trying to block or do anything at all and being denied the chance to actually do a single drat thing sometimes. like yeah i'm aware i could look up the combo they're doing and how specifically to counter it, or when to counter it, but that's kind of the point of my complaint - it feels lame to "have" to do that. it doesn't feel like it's possible to just be good at the game anymore, you have to take into account so much esoteric knowledge, which i totally understand is the point of more serious fighting games, but like... games like MK are supposed to have a lower barrier of entry than that. i thought.
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Nov 11, 2017 07:10
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its a pretty common trap to fall into, thinking "I'd be good at these games if it wasn't for the dang finger puzzles". the reality is that the mechanics of a fighting game form a language and combos are an expression of that language, like the reason combos are combos is because the individual moves have properties that mean they can be safely chained together, games aren't looking out for a 20 input long secret code to say "oh he hit the buttons do The Good Move" (there have been some games that do do that and they're objectively garbage). If you can't see the forest for the trees and think there's just too much nerd poo poo for you to learn then you've already lost and you should just be satisfied with what you've got, but if you want to get good you start small and start practicing. Even if you don't know or don't have the dexterity yet to do a hugeass combo, you'll probably still beat that guy because they never actually learned the language of the game they just memorized some sequence of buttons they saw on the internet. Then your next challenge will be someone that both understands the game and can execute
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Nov 11, 2017 07:12
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precision posted:that's definitely true, and same with MK3, but at the same time it was possible to be good without using those, or that is to say, it was a lot easier to counter those. it doesn't feel like good design for me to have to look up how to counter certain things online, in those games it was natural/self-evident how to counter them. The people you played at your arcade probably sucked and the general availability on how to actually play smart in FGs has risen the skill floor. You can probably still ruin people's strategies because they're probably not doing safe blockstrings 100% of the time but learning when they're not is a huge part of playing FGs
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Nov 11, 2017 07:17
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Speaking of fighting games, I just got pokken and blaziken is fun but so far the "campaign" is piss easy whereas going online I immediately get my rear end kicked to the point that I have like a 20 percent winrate 
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Nov 11, 2017 07:18
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I like the metaphor of fighting games as a language because I've always been poo poo at learning new languages and I'm really bad at/confused by fighting games  Getting high and bullshitting my way through Tekken with my brother and friends is always fun though
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Nov 11, 2017 07:19
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homeless snail posted:its a pretty common trap to fall into, thinking "I'd be good at these games if it wasn't for the dang finger puzzles". the reality is that the mechanics of a fighting game form a language and combos are an expression of that language, like the reason combos are combos is because the individual moves have properties that mean they can be safely chained together, games aren't looking out for a 20 input long secret code to say "oh he hit the buttons do The Good Move" (there have been some games that do do that and they're objectively garbage). Well in the case of injustice it's literally how the games work because they kinda suck rear end. I don't like the nether realm feel of just punching in buttons to do unique strings, it requires way more knowledge than most games. Coupled with their roster emphasis on bonkers zoning characters they make some of the most instructsble and ugly FGs but also sell them to the biggest market somehow
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Nov 11, 2017 07:19
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Also I rebound the controls and I can't shake the feeling that maybe I've made a grave and terrible mistake. But on the other hand I do like the new controls more, if I can get used to it after a few hours of the default controls.
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Nov 11, 2017 07:19
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In Training posted:Well in the case of injustice it's literally how the games work because they kinda suck rear end. I don't like the nether realm feel of just punching in buttons to do unique strings, it requires way more knowledge than most games. Coupled with their roster emphasis on bonkers zoning characters they make some of the most instructsble and ugly FGs but also sell them to the biggest market somehow
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Nov 11, 2017 07:21
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I would like a fighting game where it's less about stringing combos and more about setting up a few good, hard, pivotal hits and maybe some small chains. Like, you don't have very much health at all and so you have to be careful, but playing defensively means the other guy can take advantage because a few good hits is all you need. But he doesn't have much health either so it works the same the other way around. A slower pace less about the reaction time and more about the calculated moves that make comp fighting games fun. I'm sure they're out there, but I don't play many fighting games so I don't know any examples.
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Nov 11, 2017 07:23
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CJacobs posted:I would like a fighting game where it's less about stringing combos and more about setting up a few good, hard, pivotal hits and maybe some small chains. Like, you don't have very much health at all and so you have to be careful, but playing defensively means the other guy can take advantage because a few good hits is all you need. But he doesn't have much health either so it works the same the other way around. A slower pace less about the reaction time and more about the calculated moves that make comp fighting games fun. I'm sure they're out there, but I don't play many fighting games so I don't know any examples. Super Street Fighter II Turbo is the game you're looking for. Or Tekken 7 for the 3D version
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Nov 11, 2017 07:26
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CJacobs posted:I would like a fighting game where it's less about stringing combos and more about setting up a few good, hard, pivotal hits and maybe some small chains. Like, you don't have very much health at all and so you have to be careful, but playing defensively means the other guy can take advantage because a few good hits is all you need. But he doesn't have much health either so it works the same the other way around. A slower pace less about the reaction time and more about the calculated moves that make comp fighting games fun. I'm sure they're out there, but I don't play many fighting games so I don't know any examples. This is totally Tekken
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Nov 11, 2017 07:27
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I was thinking of saying "yeah that sounds like Tekken" but as previously said I'm no fighter aficionado
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Nov 11, 2017 07:29
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homeless snail posted:not racist but I don't think westerners can make fighting games I agree except for the major dramatic example of Super Turbo existing because Capcom USA kept increasing the speed of the game while Capcom Japan kept slowing it down, a fight that continues to this day. the switch version of SFII reverts the speed to the slow Japanese arcade levels lol, it's insane how they won't let it go
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Nov 11, 2017 07:30
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Bushido Blade would be the extreme case of that. One good blow to the head or chest? You're dead.
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Nov 11, 2017 07:31
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Just play against any little kids you have in your family, you can sit back and throw fireballs and uppercut them all day and they can't do poo poo about it.
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Nov 11, 2017 07:31
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CJacobs posted:I would like a fighting game where it's less about stringing combos and more about setting up a few good, hard, pivotal hits and maybe some small chains. Like, you don't have very much health at all and so you have to be careful, but playing defensively means the other guy can take advantage because a few good hits is all you need. But he doesn't have much health either so it works the same the other way around. A slower pace less about the reaction time and more about the calculated moves that make comp fighting games fun. I'm sure they're out there, but I don't play many fighting games so I don't know any examples.
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Nov 11, 2017 07:31
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Ive been playing a lot of samurai shodown V Special recently and it's design is anti-combo, nothing really links into anything and most characters have a move that will just do 50% damage no questions asked off a whiff punish. But I also wouldn't recommend it as a newbie game bc there's a lot of funky mechanics and 3 meters and ways to do instant kills or reversals or disarms or alpha counters etc. it's a strange game
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Nov 11, 2017 07:33
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Those all sound like good suggestions so I will go look at them, thanks.
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Nov 11, 2017 07:34
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Complaining on the Internet works again, I just won 5 ranked matches in a row I think all it is is that the fast pace makes me stress out. Basically what CJacobs said
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Nov 11, 2017 07:35
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For all the poo poo MvC:I rightfully gets, I got stupid excited when I watched somebody fight the last boss of story mode.
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Nov 11, 2017 07:37
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