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KaptainKrunk posted:so what will governments do when the next big crash hits? just assume all the bad debt again and more QE? well the problem is, a bailout isn't going to work a second time because at that point it becomes obvious to even the dimmest world leader that the US is effectively running a pyramid scheme. since the 1980s, the west -- and the US in particular -- has been operating an amazing scam. by floating their currencies, and offshoring almost all their manufacturing and productive capital to third world countries where labour is easier to exploit, the west has been able to run some truly astonishing trade deficits. the US alone consumes at least 2 billion dollars in goods and services every day day and provides nothing in exchange except for more dollars.  liberated from that terrible burden of having to actually produce anything of value, the US has been free to focus on what's really important; gambling. during the same time period debt outraced GDP as manufacturing was replaced by financial services as the main driver of the economy. essentially that real economy was replaced by a fake "service economy" that can only really sustain itself by going into exponentially deeper levels of debt. In other words, it's a pyramid scheme, and like all pyramid schemes its going to eventually have to collapse. All of the data indicates we're in the closing stages of that pyramid scheme. The obscene levels of debt and inequality is literally crushing the system under its own weight. The economy has been lurching through a series of increasingly spectacular and volatile bubbles since the late 90s, beginning with the dotcom bubble and then the housing bubble and now culminating in the everything bubble, where we're witnessing simultaneous bubbles in stocks, bonds, real estate, health care, cryptocurrency, student loans, financial derivatives, etc. its slowly beginning to dawn on the baby boomers that if all of them are cashing out their 401k around the same time, then it would be mathematically impossible for them to all get a payout. similarly, a generation of millennial bagholders who have been parasitized by student debt are beginning to recognise that an economy composed of nothing but stock brokers, graphic designers, lawyers and computer programmers is not only not possible, but doesen't actually make any sense. they'd been promised they would get promoted to double black diamond, but it turns out the only way to get ahead in america is to scam someone else into your downline. in other words, a bailout isn't going to work this time because western economies are fundamentally, structurally broken. they can only function as long as you have a much larger peripheral of exploited workers manufacturing the goods you need elsewhere and exporting it to you for free. that's fine if you hold the reserve currency status, but the world has changed and there's little reason china would want US dollars anymore. it's about to be plunged in its own debt related economic depression as well as an energy crisis, so if the US tries to bail out their own failing economy by printing even more money, I can't imagine China being impressed with the news that its citizens will have to work harder and export more goods and resources for free, so that westerners can continue to live the lifestyle they're accustomed to. more likely, it will just tell the US that their money is no longer any good here, at which point things start to really break down.
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Nov 16, 2017 16:13
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Ahhh, that's the stuff really feelin' the DOOM today
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Nov 16, 2017 16:33
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Nov 16, 2017 16:37
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Anyone who thinks they can predict the future of the economy is full of it.
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Nov 16, 2017 16:44
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stop making predictions, close your eyes, dehumanize yourself and face to bloodshed
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Nov 16, 2017 16:59
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silentsnack posted:Eh, the Cold War 'narrative' I get from history and media produced during that era is basically ignoring capitalism altogether and pretending we are superior as a people because we have some kind of mythical freedom; and casting communism/socialism as wrong and evil and intrinsically opposed to freedom. It was all "us vs them" running mainly on fear of the USSR as something strange and incomprehensible. (Then came that whole "threat of nuclear death" thing, which just escalated the issue.) it's not remembered so much nowadays, but there was often a factor of technological competition and standard-of-living competition for example, the Kitchen Debate between Nixon and Khrushchev, which took place in a model home that was loaded with then-newfangled appliances and was supposedly affordable for the average middle-class American. it was meant to show the superiority of capitalism by showing what a wonderful and prosperous lifestyle the average American worker could (supposedly) afford, unlike those poor backward Soviets
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Nov 16, 2017 17:33
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https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/nov/16/oil-and-gas-shares-dip-as-norways-central-bank-advises-oslo-to-divestquote:The bank that runs the world’s biggest sovereign wealth fund has told the Norwegian government it should dump its shares in oil and gas companies, in a move that could have significant consequences for the sector. 
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Nov 16, 2017 18:24
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Manic Technophile posted:poo poo Life Syndrome. The medical community has at last articulated an appropriate name for life under capitalism. Sebastian Junger talked about this a few times. the rates of obesity, alcoholism, depression and suicide are astronomically high in affluent neighborhoods because the brass ring of a huge secluded mansion full of expensive stuff actually makes people loving miserable. once everything goes to poo poo and the .01% helicopter off to their isolated walled compounds in New Zealand they'll end up eating the barrel of a shotgun from their own zombie apocalypse armories within a year. e: hmm thought that article was going to be about miserable depressed rich assholes, it's actually about people crushed under their heels. my mistake! oh well at least there are lots of rich people who hate life and themselves too vv basically this Rhesus Pieces fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Nov 16, 2017 |
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Nov 16, 2017 18:36
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Nov 16, 2017 18:42
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Jose posted:https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/nov/16/oil-and-gas-shares-dip-as-norways-central-bank-advises-oslo-to-divest oh no I've seen Occupied, I know where this is going
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Nov 16, 2017 18:46
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https://twitter.com/KateBennett_DC/status/931201050446630918
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Nov 16, 2017 19:06
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click through and check out how bad that bitch toasted her face lol
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Nov 16, 2017 19:16
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when youre a billionaire $1000 is effectively $0
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Nov 16, 2017 19:21
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tbh im just surprised its not actually fetish gear
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Nov 16, 2017 20:39
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it is dumb to pretend the US isn’t still a huge manufacturing economy, that’s a denial of reality
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Nov 16, 2017 22:16
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Manufacturing has fallen in relative terms and is no longer driving employment. Consumers have too much debt and no well paying jobs to pay it off. Services is going to go bust and so is tech, and those are the only 2 things that picked up the slack. Even a fall in the dollar weight return manufacturing to the us, because when the factories left, so did their associated supply chains. They're all in china, and in china they will stay.
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Nov 16, 2017 22:51
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Digiwizzard posted:the US alone consumes at least 2 billion dollars in goods and services every day day and provides nothing in exchange except for more dollars. we actually produce more than we did previously, there's just no additional employment because of it. fallen in relative terms, sure, but that's demand limited
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Nov 16, 2017 23:47
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austerity and welfare punishment https://twitter.com/imajsaclaimant/...agenumber%3D130
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Nov 16, 2017 23:51
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Is today the day?
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Nov 17, 2017 19:03
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Animal-Mother posted:Is today the day? What's today?
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Nov 17, 2017 19:28
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yes commence looting
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Nov 17, 2017 19:29
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Looking forward to the black friday trampling deaths this year.
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Nov 17, 2017 20:18
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Manic Technophile posted:Looking forward to the black friday trampling deaths this year. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZXYGxrNWbo
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Nov 17, 2017 23:24
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https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/11/17/business/venezuelas-state-oil-company-pdvsa-declared-default/ PDVSA, Venezuela's state oil company, was ruled to be in default today. Venezuela's oil exports have been falling year over year, but a sudden halt to it's production would send oil prices higher. Even if only temporarily.
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Nov 17, 2017 23:57
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Animal-Mother posted:Is today the day? hasnt hit the senate floor. doomsday is now a post-thanksgiving affair.
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Nov 18, 2017 04:11
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anime was right posted:hasnt hit the senate floor. doomsday is now a post-thanksgiving affair. 
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Nov 18, 2017 05:18
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it's almost like the GOP sees everyone under 30 running towards socialism and they think this will piss them off about taxes enough to create a generation of young republicans
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Nov 18, 2017 05:25
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Rhesus Pieces posted:it's almost like the GOP sees everyone under 30 running towards socialism and they think this will piss them off about taxes enough to create a generation of young republicans no, it's because for the first time in a long time they have absolute control and they're going to use this opportunity to Get poo poo Done for their donors / themselves
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Nov 18, 2017 05:50
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logikv9 posted:no, it's because for the first time in a long time they have absolute control and they're going to use this opportunity to Get poo poo Done for their donors / themselves p much this. if you figure some mostly disenfranchised pleb even registers on their radar, lol
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Nov 18, 2017 06:09
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Rhesus Pieces posted:it's almost like the GOP sees everyone under 30 running towards socialism and they think this will piss them off about taxes enough to create a generation of young republicans i wonder if they're just being such spiteful fucks because they didn't expect to have to actually govern, hillary was supposed to win and they were going to be there to oppose her and keep the gravy train rolling
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Nov 18, 2017 06:46
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i think 'if china has an economic crisis they will refuse to trade in dollars' is my favourite doomsday thread take yet
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Nov 18, 2017 15:17
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silentsnack posted:Isn't it going to be hilarious when "I had to take out student loans to pay taxes on my need-based tuition waivers because grants didn't even pay for half my books" becomes a common statement? v important for as many people as possible to be forced into an eternity of debt slavery, lest the system collapse
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Nov 18, 2017 19:06
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nvm
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Nov 19, 2017 08:47
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https://twitter.com/JordanUhl/status/931954701096058886
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Nov 19, 2017 09:34
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logikv9 posted:no, it's because for the first time in a long time they have absolute control and they're going to use this opportunity to Get poo poo Done for their donors / themselves yea this is the last opportunity to actually do things Under Hillary they could have kept the gravy train rolling, made her a lame duck mired in pseudo-scandals, and laughed as the financial crisis hit on her watch before sweeping into absolute power. If they can't get taxes passed they are absolutely hosed because they'll have pissed off the big money donors, will be hated by the increasingly Trumpist base, and by associating with Trump will have alienated middle-aged white women and hispanics for a good while
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Nov 19, 2017 09:36
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https://twitter.com/JordanUhl/status/931956395137740801?s=17 lol
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Nov 19, 2017 09:37
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KaptainKrunk posted:yea this is the last opportunity to actually do things middle aged white women voted for trump lmao
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Nov 19, 2017 09:39
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not sure, can student debt fly when it's raining?
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Nov 19, 2017 10:34
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I will bite the bullet and accept an f35 in place of my student loan debt, as the former can only kill me if I'm in it.
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Nov 19, 2017 10:52
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Mort posted:not sure, can student debt fly when it's raining? Only for a certain distance, the glide ratio is real bad and tends to end in a fatal crash upon landing at the base of the bridge it launched from
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Nov 19, 2017 13:21
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