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That loving sweater vest. I can never get over it. It's like he went to a tailor and said "I want to look like the nineteen fifties idea of a boy detective, but stupider somehow."
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Nov 20, 2017 07:13
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Well, everybody exists in Mementos, so it's no surprise that a name gets a hit. Or do you only exist in Mementos if you stand out from the rank and file, just not enough to make your own palace?
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Nov 20, 2017 07:25
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Glazius posted:Well, everybody exists in Mementos, so it's no surprise that a name gets a hit. She has a palace. The name had a hit in the nav.
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Nov 20, 2017 07:58
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Futaba probably hacked somebody's phone and told them to deliver a message at Leblanc that said such or so for 5000 yen.
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Nov 20, 2017 10:03
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This stretch of the game made me respect the hell out of Sojiro, the man is great. This is easily in the top 5 best parts of writing in terms of execution. Kinda related to all this, I'm somewhat curious as to where we were in the plots for 3 and 4 around this date, but not enough to really check for myself unless I get bored later.
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Nov 20, 2017 10:08
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Stroth posted:That loving sweater vest. I can never get over it. It's like he went to a tailor and said "I want to look like the nineteen fifties idea of a boy detective, but stupider somehow." "I'm looking for something that says 'is probably a narc' and 'has lots of lunch money'."
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Nov 20, 2017 10:11
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Futaba just leaned out her window and yelled "HEY I NEED A PHANTOM THIEF TO DELIVER THIS CARD TO ALL HIS PHANTOM THIEF FRIENDS AT THEIR SECRET PHANTOM THIEF HIDEOUT" and Ryuji took it from thereFunky Valentine posted:"I'm looking for something that says 'is probably a narc' and 'has lots of lunch money'." oh no please don't stuff me in that locker, I'll do anything :bigtran: Hwurmp fucked around with this message at 12:26 on Nov 20, 2017 |
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Nov 20, 2017 12:17
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at least Makoto was quick to assume what i was assuming ever since this arc started (though it helped that we saw Futaba's room beforehand)
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Nov 20, 2017 12:33
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A Bystander posted:This stretch of the game made me respect the hell out of Sojiro, the man is great. This is easily in the top 5 best parts of writing in terms of execution. Going by memory in Persona 4 it was dealing with the creepy kid who pretended to be the murder. Not so sure what was going in Persona 3 but I think it was leading up to the holiday retreat with the rest of the team. Anyway in regards to Akechi I had very little time for him after his reaction to the phantom thieves proving to actually be a force for good.
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Nov 20, 2017 13:30
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GeneX posted:Also, the game is kinda blatant about Makoto being into you. Again. I'm cool with that - I don't know much about the game, but I feel pretty secure in saying she's the best choice for the MC. Always date someone way smarter and cooler than you!
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Nov 20, 2017 14:03
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Really Pants posted:Futaba just leaned out her window and yelled "HEY I NEED A PHANTOM THIEF TO DELIVER THIS CARD TO ALL HIS PHANTOM THIEF FRIENDS AT THEIR SECRET PHANTOM THIEF HIDEOUT" and Ryuji took it from there I could believe this.
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Nov 20, 2017 18:33
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GeneX posted:The entire setup for this arc is kinda iffy, though I think it's probably the best one in the game. Like, the basic idea of "we're gonna wreck the economy if you don't do a thing" is liable to provoke a government investigation, not a bad-psychonauts intervention. I'm willing to bet that if we don't do the thing and the economy is turbofucked that #Millenials is going to take the blame even with the ~*mysterious hackers*~ having done poo poo like this before apparently. That seems like a thing this game would do.
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Nov 20, 2017 19:20
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Having the economy of Japan collapse is pretty bad even if it's clearly not your fault.
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Nov 20, 2017 20:23
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A Bystander posted:Kinda related to all this, I'm somewhat curious as to where we were in the plots for 3 and 4 around this date, but not enough to really check for myself unless I get bored later. There are a couple twists, sudden-but-inevitable betrayals, etc. to mix things up but the core mission runs through the gameplay in an unbroken line. While I prefer the overall gameplay experience of Persona 4/5, I think P3 was onto something with that. Presenting a mystery or a puzzle in this fashion yet nailing it to the rails until you reach a certain point makes for awkward flow.
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Nov 20, 2017 22:43
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On the other hand, Persona 3's pacing and story structure are kind of a garbage fire. Like, I don't hate the game by any means, but there's no getting around how awkwardly the game draws everything out and the fact that the turns of the plot just reinforce the actions you were already taking creates the impression that you're being railroaded and that the characters have no agency within the fiction. It also really doesn't help that you're literally waiting around for the plot to happen on full moon days. 4 and 5 shift away from purely reactionary protagonists and are much better for it, honestly.
Arist fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Nov 20, 2017 |
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Nov 20, 2017 22:55
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Blademaster_Aio posted:I don't like Akechi. We already know that evil gubmint man has an agent of their own, with our powers, that has been heavily hinted to be behind all the poo poo happening. So he's not wrong in the cause, just the culprits~
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Nov 20, 2017 22:58
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I think 4 hits the sweet spot between guiding motivations and protagonist agency, personally. 3 just kinda plops you into the situation and takes forever to explain what the gently caress you’re doing, while this game doesn’t really connect its arcs in a very satisfying manner (like, it’s logical when you look at the exact circumstances, but in the abstract, things are just kinda...iffy). In 4, your goal is pretty much always “jump in the TV to save or aprehend some person”, but the specifics change constantly, and you’re always trying to make some progress in figuring out who or what is responsible for everything. Here in 5, there’s too little integration of the overarching narrative; in 3, there’s far too much.
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Nov 20, 2017 23:08
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Arist posted:On the other hand, Persona 3's pacing and story structure are kind of a garbage fire. Like, I don't hate the game by any means, but there's no getting around how awkwardly the game draws everything out and the fact that the turns of the plot just reinforce the actions you were already taking creates the impression that you're being railroaded and that the characters have no agency within the fiction. It also really doesn't help that you're literally waiting around for the plot to happen on full moon days. 4 and 5 shift away from purely reactionary protagonists and are much better for it, honestly. 5 is the first Persona I've played. I recently went back to try 3 and while I like it, I'm like into mid July without there really be any urgency to the plot beyond explore Tartarus and wait until a full moon, which feels so much different than how 5 throws you pretty quickly into needing to deal with kamoshida's poo poo.
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Nov 21, 2017 01:05
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Jesus Christ, Ryuji https://twitter.com/grandmarth/status/868663753646014464
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Nov 21, 2017 03:05
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One thing I do like about P3 is that the characters actually have lives; sometimes characters just can't go to Tartarus for whatever reason. Contrast that to P4/P5, where most of the group have no lives and are ready to jump into the TV/Metaverse whenever. Kinda weird when they go 'yeah I can't SL today for some reason but I'm down to jump into Mementos for a few hours'.
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Nov 21, 2017 03:17
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ApplesandOranges posted:One thing I do like about P3 is that the characters actually have lives; sometimes characters just can't go to Tartarus for whatever reason. Contrast that to P4/P5, where most of the group have no lives and are ready to jump into the TV/Metaverse whenever. Kinda weird when they go 'yeah I can't SL today for some reason but I'm down to jump into Mementos for a few hours'. I mean, yeah it makes more sense from a story point of view, but on the mechanics side that's kinda a giant bag of dicks.
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Nov 21, 2017 05:05
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Actually it makes more sense from a story point of view here too. The phantom thieves have a lot more at stake than the P3 cast did. Remember when the stakes were raised for the P3 cast, all of them were available too. Right from the start, they have to steal hearts otherwise there will be undesirable consequences. The P4 cast also has this same sense of urgency.
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Nov 21, 2017 08:41
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Blademaster_Aio posted:Actually it makes more sense from a story point of view here too. Put simply, whatever they had to do isn't so important that they can't drop what they were doing to do Other Side stuff. It's just more important than larking with you. Compare with P3, where the utter lack of urgency to exploring Tartarus and the full moon gating on the plot meant that no one really had to do anything if they didn't feel like it.
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Nov 21, 2017 09:28
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I mean, except Yosuke and Yukiko had actual professional jobs where they'd be in semi-managerial positions. Or Ann who'd have to reschedule photo shoots. It's less aggravating from a mechanical standpoint to have everyone available whenever, it's just funny that they'll drop everything the moment the MC says they're going TV diving but can't take the time to talk about their deep-seated emotional problems.
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Nov 21, 2017 10:11
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ApplesandOranges posted:I mean, except Yosuke and Yukiko had actual professional jobs where they'd be in semi-managerial positions. Or Ann who'd have to reschedule photo shoots. Peoples lives are on the line in P4, and in P5 there is the whole deadline thing. They have more sense of urgency.
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Nov 21, 2017 10:16
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I mean, it really comes down to cutting down on tedium for the player. Stuff like work schedules can be planned around since you get them well in advance, but that's just putting unnecessary busywork on the player. Hell, if you really want to break it down than all 3 of them have bonding events that happen during their work - something that would normally be a no-go for bonding events (represented by days they're unavailable), except in this instance. Are you going to force the player to figure this out, without knowing it's required?
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Nov 21, 2017 18:45
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To be clear, I'm not advocating P3's approach as inherently superior to the discrete missions 4 & 5 throw at you. Mostly what I'd like is a way to put solving these non-dungeon obstacles on a countdown as well, so that you could gain extra time by actually figuring out solution early instead of running from point A to point B pretending to do something useful. Wouldn't even have to be a binary pass/fail thing either--the penalty for not bothering would just be fewer opportunities to hang out with your party members (because they're too busy doing the legwork), and fewer days to clear the actual Palace itself.
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Nov 21, 2017 21:35
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Part 73: 7/25: Perverts In The Desert Music: Beneath the Mask (Instrumental Version)   I guess they need to set some rules when the world’s eyes are on us because of the Phantom Thieves. Stuff like, “Don’t do anything that will hurt the school’s reputation; spend your summer break quietly.” I can’t stay quiet with all this excitement going on. Medjed’s statement was insane! “People of Japan, you must not worship the Phantom Thieves,” they said… It could just be a joke. There’s talk that this could lead to the biggest leak of private data to date. I wonder if they’re gonna target another site… I’m curious to see how the Phantom Thieves react. It’s what I’m looking forward to most this summer. It’ll be the perfect escape from exam studies. But the Phantom Thieves need to take action. They’re the ones Medjed is after. This is bigger than I thought. We can’t leave this be... Let’s get this assembly out of the way. We have our own business to attend to!  Our school’s done for… I don’t care what the principal has to say. They’re so stupid! I wish I could change their hearts. Why not make a post? Our request might be taken...Anon: both are crossing the line Anon: medjed is dangerous…… Anon: Fight for justice! Music: Wicked Plan  Wait, we don’t even see the assembly!?  Huh? Did you have school too, Yusuke? I’m doing laundry, so these are the only clothes I had to wear.That sounds contrived! You really should buy a couple more outfits... Come now, we didn’t gather here to make small talk, now did we? Let’s get to Alibaba’s case. Well then, I’ll start. It looks like Futaba was listening in on Leblanc. But why would she want to listen in on the cafe? I have no idea. It’s just like Boss said… She’s a tough nut to crack. In any case, her hacking skills will be absolutely necessary if we wish to stand up to Medjed. Going by what she has told us, we may even be able to identify who they are. We’ll have to trust in her skills for now then. Anyway, we found out that Futaba has a Palace… but can someone who isn’t evil have one? That doesn’t matter. A Palace is the materialization of distorted cognitions brought about by strong desires… That’s all. It just so happens that a lot of warped people turn out evil.Music: Suspicion  Maybe that has something to do with why she calls herself Alibaba. According to the chief’s story, Futaba has auditory and visual hallucinations, right? There’s a chance those are related to some important memories she’s holding. It’s hard to explain… but those memories may have been warped by the distortions. Basically we just gotta steal her Treasure, right? Well, yeah. So do we all agree about taking on Futaba’s Palace? She’s asked us to do so. I don’t think that part is an issue. If we heal Futaba’s heart, it will not only help Boss, but she can then assist us with Medjed. I agree. I’ve been wonderin’ about how Boss said “a lot happened” after Futaba’s mom died too. Hold on a second. Our investigation of her Palace may not go like anything we’ve done up to this point. Why’s that? Having an individual ask you to steal their heart is an extremely irregular case. There’s no telling what the Palace ruler’s disposition will be like, or the distortion that’ll be there. We may run into some unforeseen situations. Do you still want to go in? All right. Let’s just make sure we’re cautious. Well, let’s get crackin’ on those keywords, huh? The ones we have at the moment are “Futaba Sakura” and “Sojiro Sakura’s house.” We got the “who” and the “where,” so all that’s left is the “what,” right? Let us try going to their house first. Boss is busy running the cafe, isn’t he? We should make sure he doesn’t suspect anything. I’ll be able to remember everything if I turn back into a human, right? Music: Break it Down (Elp Version) That has to be the case. I… definitely want this mission to succeed. If we can retrieve Futaba’s memories, then I’d bet we can get mine back too… In any case, it’s not every day you stumble upon a hacker like her around. You really do have a gift, don’t you? You sure live up to my expectations. I can sense a firm resolve from Morgana... There are a few new infiltration tools available to craft, but we won’t be seeing them for a bit.  Music: Wicked Plan  She’s a shut-in, so we just gotta figure out “what” she thinks her house is. If she can’t get out, maybe a prison? Conditions have not been met. Perhaps a labyrinth with an unknown exit? Conditions have not been met. Hmm… Maybe an oasis? Conditions have not been met. Nothing so far. In that case, how about hell? Conditions have not been met. We don’t have nearly enough clues... If only we could ask her directly... We can. C’mon, let’s go see Futaba. But what will we say to get in? Whaddya mean? We’re sneakin’ in. You have to be joking. Won’t the door be locked for sure this time? I’ll take care of that. Oh, and I figured out where Futaba’s room was when I snuck in last night. What if we run into Boss though? There’s no way we’ll be able to avoid his questions this time. He’s at work now, so I think we should be fine. Gettin’ cold feet, Makoto? Don’t worry, it’ll be nothing. We’ve gone through loads of poo poo like this already.Dude, Yusuke’s right there. ...This is our only choice, right? I suppose Futaba did get in contact with Maaku-kun… Perhaps she’ll at least be willing to speak with him… ...Very well. Let’s do this.Music: Suspicion   There’s no answer... Futaba-chan. Are you there? I’m sorry for being startled and screaming yesterday. It was so dark that I got scared.*pause* No reaction whatsoever. This is gonna be hard...    Why’s she only reacting to that name…? You’re Futaba Sakura, aren’t you?*pause* She’s not responding again. Does she not like us saying her name? We don’t have time to dally around. We need her keyword before dealing with Alibaba’s identity. We want to learn more about you. If we don’t do so, we can’t steal your heart. The reason why we came here is because we need the keyword to enter your Palace. That’s why we want to talk with Futaba Sakura herself, and not Alibaba. You don’t have to show yourself. Just answer some questions for us. Chat messages are fine. OK. All right then… Our leader, the guy who lives in Leblanc’s attic, wants to speak with you. We’re counting on you, Maaku-kun. Try and get a keyword out of her. What do you want to hear? A house is a house. It looks like you should ask something different.The answers will loop back if you choose incorrectly.  Hm?    I can’t leave this place. I’m going to die here. Wha-- Die…? Is this going to continue? Why? This place is my tomb. You think that’s it? Try entering “tomb.”Music: Disquiet  We got it…! Was that enough? Yes. It was plenty. You haven’t forgotten your promise of helping us if we complete your request, right? I haven’t. We made a deal.  You idiot, don’t activate it here!   Yeah, we see that. Wait, what the—Our clothes are still the same? Futaba herself is asking us to steal her heart. It’d be odd if she saw us as a threat. If she doesn’t see us as an enemy, then your clothes don’t change. That’s how it works. But more importantly, I told you to be cautious! Why’d you activate it like that!? Is that why we ended up in a desert? Where’s the tomb? It’s so drat hot here. Even though we entered right in front of her room, we didn’t end up inside it.Ann, stop pointing out weird inconsistencies. That’s my job, and I’m terrible at it. She must really want to keep people away from her. I see… What a bleak feeling this place has… It’s the complete opposite of Kaneshiro’s bank.I get what you mean, but that place was also pretty bleak in its own way. Let’s hurry up and get goin’. Where’s the Palace? Is it that way? A tomb in the desert… I see. Anyway, let’s make our way there. Isn’t that kinda far? Are we gonna walk!? Of course not! My paws will get burned! I’ll make sure to put the AC on full blast! You’re so considerate! Hehe, r-right… All right! Let’s roll!Through the Desert Music: Treading On Scorched Sand     Here’s something dumb I figured out a while back: the entire reason for the pointless assembly and Yusuke’s laundry beats is because they’d already made this cutscene with the characters in their school clothes. It’s real stupid.   But it’s [sic] still beats opening the windows to the hot desert air. Hey, Ann. Can I have a drink? Didn’t you have mineral water? I drank it already… *sigh* How’re the guys…? Huh…? Welp  Ann pulls on the emergency brake.  Morons.  Look at Yusuke’s face here.  There we go.     I like that the game feels the need to bend over backwards to justify the clothes thing but the characters all pulled their shoes out of hyperspace offscreen. The AC ain’t workin’ at all! The hell was that lukewarm air about!? That was the best I could do, so quit your yapping! For real, you are so half-assed! What was that!? You wanna fight, punk!? Geez, shut up! It’s hot, so don’t make me more irritated! To think her Palace would be a pyramid...Music: The Days When My Mother Was There (Another Version)  Hey, a pyramid’s a tomb, right? Yes. It’s a pharaoh’s tomb. That’s how it’s mostly known. There are a variety of theories on it. For instance, it’s even said to be a device for reviving the dead.I understand the symbolism you’re going for, but I’m still gonna call bullshit. I was a huge ancient Egypt freak as a kid and never heard that once, and it doesn’t really jive with their view of the afterlife anyhow. Plus, that “reviving the dead” thing hasn’t come up in a cursory Google, which I’ve come to trust far more than my own memory. I’m sure one of you is already gearing up to correct me on how it’s totally a thing though. Reviving the dead, hm…? It’s beautiful nonetheless… It’s perfectly conformed to the golden ratio…I know what that is from class! Hey, guys, can we go in already? I’m gonna melt...
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Nov 24, 2017 18:32
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Reviving the dead makes me think of Stargate.
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Nov 24, 2017 18:39
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It was sort of a thing in a Terry Pratchett novel, only not really!
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Nov 24, 2017 18:39
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Arist posted:
http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/pyramidreligion.htm for example. The resurrection they're referring to is more of the "in some kind of mystical way" thing, though. They didn't think the body was going to get back up again and walk out of its tomb healed as far as I know.
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Nov 24, 2017 19:12
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I'll take that as a win for me, because it seems like the game is absolutely implying the latter.
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Nov 24, 2017 19:21
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It's just bad translation. It's not like the game has any shortage of that.
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Nov 24, 2017 19:26
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Between cutscenes like this and certain excerpts from the artbook interviews, it's probably a super good thing that the P3/4/5 director is finally going to gently caress off.
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Nov 24, 2017 19:56
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Arist posted:
Well, that is a theory. But it's usually one held by the same kind of people that theorize the pyramids were built by aliens.
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Nov 24, 2017 19:58
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Oxxidation posted:Between cutscenes like this and certain excerpts from the artbook interviews, it's probably a super good thing that the P3/4/5 director is finally going to gently caress off. On the one hand, yeah, on the other I'm still a little worried. If we could get a guy who nails the weird mix of JoJo's Bizarre Adventure and Paranoia Agent that this series has become while getting rid of the parts with all the pointless sexualization of teenagers and homophobia that'd be perfect.
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Nov 24, 2017 20:05
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at least Yusuke's face made me laugh
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Nov 24, 2017 20:21
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Tarezax posted:Reviving the dead makes me think of Stargate. Well, Goa'uld DO have glowing golden eyes and reverberating voices like all the Shadows we've seen so far. Are we gonna see some Jaffa fighting the Phantom Thieves?
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Nov 24, 2017 20:45
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Stroth posted:Well, that is a theory. But it's usually one held by the same kind of people that theorize the pyramids were built by aliens. That is stupid. Why build them yourself when you have usually gullible Tau'ri to do your bidding?
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Nov 24, 2017 20:47
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I Ilways liked that cutscene- not THAT part, mind you, but the sheer scale of the desert is pretty cool. As the screenshots show, you can see the city on the far horizon... it's just got this vast gulf of desert between it and this persons palace, because there is that much of a remove of this person from the world. It's a striking image... and also, more than a little depressing, like a lot of things about this character. I've always kinda liked this dungeon, even though I freely admit that it probably looks the way it does to accommodate the personae you start getting around this level. But I can't really say why yet.
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Nov 24, 2017 20:58
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