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Holy gently caress that thing was huge.
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Nov 19, 2017 21:37
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Barudak posted:Not interested in an Incredibles 2 unless we get them back in the booth to do audio commentary for an in universe cartoon with 1970s Super Friends style animation and production values. I don't remember it exactly but there was a whole bit where Frozone was complaining about them using a white guy for his parts or something like that. It was pretty funny and not the kind of joke you would've ever expected to see in a kid's cartoon anyway
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Nov 19, 2017 21:38
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2 cents on Ratatouille. Sure, a message of the film is 'Some people can't cook', referring specifically to Linguini. And yes, some are shown to be innately more talented, such as Remy. A rat from a home that tries to keep down his talents. A rat that overcomes overwhelming adversity to do what he wants to do, and what he does better than anyone, which is cook. A simplified take on the Randian narrative. But that ignores not only plenty of detail of Remy's journey, but also Linguini's. A man who comes out of nowhere not knowing anything. Who comes across a talent in need, and uses his platform and power within his world to give Remy a space to perform his talent. He relies on an authority, being the chefs that know what they are doing, to give him direction. He does not give any attribution to Remy, but does so to the understanding of mutual benefit of everyone. He and Remy both understand the talent and power they distinctly have, and collaborate so not only they benefit but the patrons they serve. It's not so much "gently caress you, got mine" as it is "Got mine, here's some for you too". And I just want to point out that, at least under my understanding, Libritiarianism operates under the assumption that those with the talents are the best metaphorical captains for their metaphorical ship. But even within the world of the movie, it is shown that restaurants are at the mercy of their audience, critics most of all. And presumably, a true Randian story would be about this shackle that weighs the chefs down, and overthrowing this authority (the critics) so that the chef is free to cook what they like. But the resolution of the film comes from working with this authority, who acknowledges his power and authority to benefit the heroes, against his own prejudice. It's another brick in the thematic message that people need to look beyond one's self and to help other people to find personal happiness.
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Nov 19, 2017 22:11
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Macaluso posted:I don't remember it exactly but there was a whole bit where Frozone was complaining about them using a white guy for his parts or something like that. It was pretty funny and not the kind of joke you would've ever expected to see in a kid's cartoon anyway "A BEATNIK! I SOUND LIKE A BEATNIK!" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1R44MvXeEQw
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Nov 19, 2017 22:25
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GrandpaPants posted:Holy gently caress that thing was huge. Yeah, it's worth noting the size of the actual people in that frame.
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Nov 19, 2017 22:28
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This movie is awesome and criminally underrated.
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Nov 19, 2017 22:31
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Guy Mann posted:"A BEATNIK! I SOUND LIKE A BEATNIK!"
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Nov 19, 2017 23:31
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Well just saw a Trailer for Ferdinand and I really don't have high hopes of it being good.
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Nov 19, 2017 23:48
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Pick posted:This movie is awesome and criminally underrated. Everything about Bowler Hat Guy is fantastic. He's both Yzma and Kronk in the same character.
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Nov 19, 2017 23:55
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achillesforever6 posted:I wonder how many takes it took to do this without Sam Jackson not swearing An improbably high number. A story I always remember is that on the set of Black Snake Moan he stopped a scene saying "I have to take a loving piss" walked like 20 feet, unzipped his pants infront of the entire crew and pissed in the creek, walked back and said "i'm loving sorry about that" and was right back to filming.
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Nov 20, 2017 05:00
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Does anyone have opinions on the sequels to The Land Before Time? It was my favorite growing up, but I never saw any of the direct to video sequels. I have a 2 year old nephew who also loves dinosaurs and singing and am wondering if I should go for the whole enchilada.
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Nov 20, 2017 07:45
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Beachcomber posted:Does anyone have opinions on the sequels to The Land Before Time? the first couple are okay, for DTV sequels that go considerably lighter in tone, but the majority of them aren't worth the money even in a thrift store bin.
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Nov 20, 2017 08:10
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I really have to wonder who saw the original and thought, "We should market this to children under five!"
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Nov 20, 2017 08:40
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Das Boo posted:I really have to wonder who saw the original and thought, "We should market this to children under five!" You might be right. Maybe I'll see if I can dig up "Daffy Duck and the Dinosaur"
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Nov 20, 2017 08:49
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Beachcomber posted:Does anyone have opinions on the sequels to The Land Before Time? Do the Rite of Spring segment of Fantasia over and over again. I absolutely loved that
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Nov 20, 2017 09:27
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Das Boo posted:I really have to wonder who saw the original and thought, "We should market this to children under five!" The same marketing division that handled The Secret of NIMH and All Dogs Go to Heaven, probably.
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Nov 20, 2017 15:28
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The moral of Ratatouille is that an incompetent and unsanitary man, or a literal gutter rat, can become a celebrated chef more easily than a skilled woman.
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Nov 20, 2017 15:57
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Pick posted:This movie is awesome and criminally underrated. I've never even heard of it. It's streaming on Netflix though! Added it to my list.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:04
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Beachcomber posted:You might be right. Maybe I'll see if I can dig up "Daffy Duck and the Dinosaur" Oh, no, I think an under five can watch it if they're that sort of kid! I was under five when I first saw it.  It just seems like a really weird mass marketing strategy. E: And I should add all the sequels are REALLY aged down. Das Boo fucked around with this message at 16:23 on Nov 20, 2017 |
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Nov 20, 2017 16:17
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Beachcomber posted:Does anyone have opinions on the sequels to The Land Before Time? The first 2 aren't good but fall in the range of what direct to video sequels are. Then the next couple are like 90s saturday morning tie in cartoon level but they eventually fall into being really weird garbage. Like by the end they are fighting aliens and mini dinosaurs and yetis and stuff.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:19
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Das Boo posted:Lotta people upset at the idea of talent ITT. TBF “talent” alongside its inbred cousin “qualifications” are the main justifications you’ll hear in political discussions to justify a system where 10% do well and everyone else gets to die in a ditch.
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Nov 20, 2017 19:57
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readingatwork posted:TBF “talent” alongside its inbred cousin “qualifications” are the main justifications you’ll hear in political discussions to justify a system where 10% do well and everyone else gets to die in a ditch. Does that stop it from existing, though? Some people have knacks, that's life. It's not realistic to believe everyone is or can be equally good at everything. It's also possible to encourage someone's talent without kicking someone else to the curb. Does that alone make it Randian?
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Nov 20, 2017 20:46
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Das Boo posted:Does that stop it from existing, though? Some people have knacks, that's life. It's not realistic to believe everyone is or can be equally good at everything. It's also possible to encourage someone's talent without kicking someone else to the curb. It's specifically that the government is stopping these talented individuals in every one of his movies that shines the rand influence through.
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Nov 20, 2017 21:02
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Das Boo posted:Does that stop it from existing, though? Some people have knacks, that's life. It's not realistic to believe everyone is or can be equally good at everything. It's also possible to encourage someone's talent without kicking someone else to the curb. I don’t disagree. Just pointing out where all the hostility is coming from. People really don’t want to hear stories about how it’s unfair that the special people of the world aren’t allowed to express their talents at a time when the real live “special people” are using said talents to rape and pillage the world for personal gain.
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Nov 20, 2017 21:30
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I don't see how any of that is the movie's fault though. I mean this is basically the other side of the coin of Fox News saying that Mr Rogers was evil for telling kids that they're special.
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Nov 20, 2017 21:52
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Guy Mann posted:I don't see how any of that is the movie's fault though. It's some very impressive leap of logic - Evel Knievel would wish he could jump that far.
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Nov 20, 2017 22:45
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it's not the talented people who are raping and pillaging. rich people are not talented.
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Nov 20, 2017 23:25
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Hemingway To Go! posted:it's not the talented people who are raping and pillaging. rich people are not talented. Bullshit. If they’re not talented then why do they have so much money? Checkmate, nerd. 
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Nov 20, 2017 23:35
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I think you can argue about if it's specifically rand or something else but brad bird absolutely loves telling and retelling a single specific story about government oppression of superior people.
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Nov 21, 2017 00:05
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"Is Brad Bird An Objectivist" - the greatest thread in the history of forums, locked by a moderator after 12,239 pages of heated debate,
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Nov 21, 2017 00:22
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Gonna quote Mark Mayerson again, this time on The Incredibles and Brad Bird: "The criticism of Bird is that his films contain characters who are innately superior to the majority. This strikes many as elitist, though common sense tells us that we all know people who have an aptitude for something, whether it's music, math, sports, languages, drawing, etc. It's interesting that the idea of talent has become so controversial. Many claim that Bird expects his characters to be treated differently than those without their talents, and there's some truth in this, but not in a way that Ayn Rand would endorse. I am no Rand expert, but what I know of her writing is that it is elitist; those who are superior should not be dragged down by the inferior and should it happen, then the superior are justified in withdrawing their talents from society. As the Slate article points out, the idea of the elite going on strike is nowhere present in Bird's work. Rather than springing from elitism, I think Bird's work springs from artistic frustration and I think his career should make that obvious. In The Incredibles and in Ratatouille, the characters are trying to exercise their talents in ways that are beneficial. A key scene in The Incredibles is when Bob witnesses a mugging while being dressed down by his boss. His frustration doesn't stem from his inability to exercise his powers, but from the altruistic need to help someone who is being victimized. In Ratatouille, Remy risks his life repeatedly to get closer to cooking, something that would benefit people if only they didn't let their prejudices get in the way. Both are frustrated by a world which stops them from being who they are, even though the world would benefit. Forget Ayn Rand and look at the animation business. It's filled with artists who would say that they're not doing their best work or are stuck labouring on projects that they have no great love for. It's true across the industry, which is why so many artists are involved in side projects that are an escape from the frustration of their day jobs. Bird has been more successful than most, but he still can't get his chosen projects onto the screen. The Incredibles and Ratatouille are fantasies where characters overcome obstacles to fully realize their talents. Unfortunately for Bird and the rest of us, it rarely happens in life."
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Nov 21, 2017 02:18
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Hey remember when artists got almost totally free rein on Kingdom of the Sun and it was obviously going to completely suck and then got retooled into a movie everyone likes?
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Nov 21, 2017 02:43
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"Let artists create whatever they want" sounds good until you open Tezuka's desk and see all the porn of mouse women.
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Nov 21, 2017 02:45
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Pick posted:"Let artists create whatever they want" sounds good until you open Tezuka's desk and see all the porn of mouse women. "Let artists create whatever they want" gets you a lot of garbage but idiosyncratic garbage is better than something that's formulaic and just okay. It also produces much better peak quality than rigid oversight.
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Nov 21, 2017 02:48
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:"Let artists create whatever they want" gets you a lot of garbage but idiosyncratic garbage is better than something that's formulaic and just okay. It also produces much better peak quality than rigid oversight. The alternative isn't "rigid oversight", it's acknowledging that input and constructive guidance actually helps an artist produce his or her best work.
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Nov 21, 2017 02:54
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Pick posted:The alternative isn't "rigid oversight", it's acknowledging that input and constructive guidance actually helps an artist produce his or her best work. That's not what we're talking about in the context of Brad Bird's favorite theme, though. We're talking about gatekeeping and management putting their foot down and saying "no." Obviously that's a sensible thing to do from a variety of perspectives -- financial and "minimize the amount of mouse porn in the world" among them -- but it's not unreasonable to say that yeah, that can also be pretty stifling.
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Nov 21, 2017 02:56
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Depends on what it is he wished he were making and if it's any good.
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Nov 21, 2017 03:05
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This discussion just reminded me that Tomorrowland was crap after the first act :-(
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Nov 21, 2017 03:10
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Well even then, in both cases the protagonists eventually learn to compromise a little and work with others instead of doing whatever they want on their own. So, checks out.
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Nov 21, 2017 03:11
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GrandpaPants posted:This discussion just reminded me that Tomorrowland was crap after the first act :-( I would say the film's pretty alright until they actually reach Tomorrowland (and that includes the kid George Clooney scenes). And the scene with Keegan Michael-Key is kinda weird conceptually.
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Nov 21, 2017 03:31
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