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Cowcaster posted:the only distinction i’m seeing is under the old system you’d say “i’m paying tokens to try and get an adaptive hand cannon with explosive payload” and under the new system you say “i’m paying tokens to try and get a better devils”, what am i missing here Autism
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Nov 21, 2017 22:24
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the reason you want random rolls is because d2 is a loot game that has a functionally (pretty limited) pool of loot. variance in the rolls (preferably something between d1 and d2) provides you with rewards worth chasing more or less regardless of how much you play. right now, despite not really playing a whole lot of d2 on pc, the only thing i want that i don’t have is an antiope. with fixed rolls, literally anything i get that is not an antiope is worthless to me. people have these doomsday-cult paranoid delusions of some adderal-tweaked 13 year old with godrolls crushing their 800-elo lobbies are missing the twin points that 1; the commonly-farmed godroll guns from d1 were still some of the best guns in the game even if your version had a poo poo-tier roll and 2; the people who were actually sitting down and farming for these guns were almost wholly insulated from the ‘casuals’ or whoever’s lobby integrity we’re supposed to care about. you’re pretty much arguing ‘someone who plays the game ten times as much as me should get the same stuff I do’, which is an admirable goal but doesn’t really mesh with the gameplay loop of a loot game and misses the point that some guy who plays 200 hours a week has a nearly 0 percent chance of winding up playing against someone who plays for five in a scenario where their farming for great weapons really matters
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Nov 21, 2017 22:25
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Norns posted:Autism no i’m pretty sure i’ve got that
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Nov 21, 2017 22:25
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Cowcaster posted:the only distinction i’m seeing is under the old system you’d say “i’m paying tokens to try and get an adaptive hand cannon with explosive payload” and under the new system you say “i’m paying tokens to try and get a better devils”, what am i missing here You'd have a Better Devils, it may not have explosive payload it may have quick reload or faster ADS but for the most part it would feel and hit as hard as any other Better Devils inside its optimal range. So you could play with this gun you liked while you kept an eye out for a slightly better version. Right now if you don't have one you don't have one. I've had 4 or 5 Better Devils drop, my friend who has played probably twice as much Crucible as me has never had one.
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Nov 21, 2017 22:27
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I don't see how changing to the other system would help that case at all.
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Nov 21, 2017 22:30
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big nipples big life posted:You'd have a Better Devils, it may not have explosive payload it may have quick reload or faster ADS but for the most part it would feel and hit as hard as any other Better Devils inside it's optimal range. So you could play with this gun you liked while you kept an eye out for a slightly better version. except the game has other legendary handcannons with different stats than better devils, they’re called “other legendary handcannons that aren’t better devils”. if the handcannon you get is called better devils but it doesn’t have the traits that make better devils so desireable, then it’s not really better devils, right?
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Nov 21, 2017 22:31
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Worse Devils
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Nov 21, 2017 22:31
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Cowcaster posted:the only distinction i’m seeing is under the old system you’d say “i’m paying tokens to try and get an adaptive hand cannon with explosive payload” and under the new system you say “i’m paying tokens to try and get a better devils”, what am i missing here The new guns in D2 are unfun and in D1 even within the existing meta you could customize your guns a bit. For example: in D1 I could get a bullet hose AR with quicker moving while ADS and more range at the expense of some stability, but also with Counterbalance for pure vertical recoil so I could balance out the lack of stability with manual stick control. The meta was extreme stability bullet hoses so with a bit more thumbskill I could outrange these guys and be a pain in the rear end to hit during gunfights, which made me a loving god. In D2 everyone uses Uriel’s. Example 2: at the end of its life everyone used mid impact HCs, but just from the rotating vendor rolls you could pick a great one with a big in air accuracy boost or insane reload speed, or refunding missed shots depending on your playstyle. D1 had some MuSt HAvE perks but by the end of its life you could get rolls with those perks very easily and you had tons of freedom with the rest. They redid everything to balance things for pvp but whoops they also made pvp suck rear end regardless, so now you have less fun in pve with no fun guns and no cool powers, and most of the loot experience is sharding dupes and praying to god you get the 1/35 chance to get the one gun you don’t have from the gunsmith, then not getting it and sharding more dupes. Really fun stuff, can’t wait to turn this game on again never. Pozload Escobar fucked around with this message at 22:35 on Nov 21, 2017 |
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Nov 21, 2017 22:32
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TheRagamuffin posted:I don't see how changing to the other system would help that case at all. You walk up to the vendor and buy a Better Devils with your crucible tokens, he stands there 24/7 and he always sells a Better Devils. Every week the rolls change but the gun is always there. So the case I posted wouldn't happen, my friend would have a better Devils and all he'd have to do is check the vendor for a better one.
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Nov 21, 2017 22:32
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Got the IB titan helm in one package, fuckin a
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Nov 21, 2017 22:32
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A Buff Gay Dude posted:The new guns in D2 are unfun and in D1 even within the existing meta you could customize your guns a bit. that sounds to me like “destiny 1 had more types of perks” than anything to do with how those perks are assigned to guns
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Nov 21, 2017 22:34
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big nipples big life posted:You walk up to the vendor and buy a Better Devils with your crucible tokens, he stands there 24/7 and he always sells a Better Devils. Every week the rolls change but the gun is always there. So the case I posted wouldn't happen, my friend would have a better Devils and all he'd have to do is check the vendor for a better one. The best system would be he sells the Better Devils 24/7 but it always has the same rolls. If there's a shortage of poo poo to do, add more fun stuff like Raids and make the PvP better. Adding dumb RNG to make it so people "play more than a few hours a week" or whatever is moronic.
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Nov 21, 2017 22:35
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A big problem with destiny is that it's a loot game where the loot for the most part doesn't loving matter. The way the scaling with power level works is kind of really stupid
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Nov 21, 2017 22:37
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Cowcaster posted:that sounds to me like “destiny 1 had more types of perks” than anything to do with how those perks are assigned to guns Not really but I think D2 does have fewer perks. In D2 if I want a better devils that does something a bit differently, I literally can’t get one. In D1’s system I could try and get a better devils that still had explosive rounds but also let me have more in air accuracy at the expense of quicker reload or whatever. D2 just gives you a few set perk combos whereas D1 let you do whatever. They looked at high end pvp in D1 where rolls eventually ossified to a degree and said “welp might as well make the whole game this boring”
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Nov 21, 2017 22:38
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They should make mods better
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Nov 21, 2017 22:38
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the only worthwhile mods are stat sticks so yeah they really should
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Nov 21, 2017 22:42
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henkman posted:A big problem with destiny 2 is that it's a loot game where the loot for the most part doesn't loving matter.
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Nov 21, 2017 22:43
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Fundamentally, D2 is a game that asks you to replay content over and over again, whether the same 3 public events, 5 strikes, or 6 pvp types in 2 playlists. You do this instead of playing other fun games because........ In D1 you did it because you could actually incrementally improve your poo poo both vertically and horizontally. In D2 there’s absolutely no horizontal progression beyond a point and vertical progression is a joke. You have to replay the content because you enjoy the actual content. D2 has good content and classic Bungie amazing shootfeel, but loving hell if I wanna keep replaying it instead of playing other more interesting stuff. That’s fine if that’s what Bungie wants to do but coming from D1 it sucks and I’ll scratch my itch elsewhere.
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Nov 21, 2017 22:44
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A Buff Gay Dude posted:Not really but I think D2 does have fewer perks. this sounds like a problem that there’s not enough guns. there could be a handcannon with explosive rounds but air accuracy instead of reload speed, just under the new system it would be called “the high colonic” or something.
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Nov 21, 2017 22:51
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you’re pretty much making the argument for random rolls, but every gun having its own name, which is such a dumb argument i don’t know why it would even occur to you
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Nov 21, 2017 22:54
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A 50S RAYGUN posted:you’re pretty much making the argument for random rolls, but every gun having its own name, which is such a dumb argument i don’t know why it would even occur to you That's basically how every other MMO does it.
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Nov 21, 2017 22:59
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Spicy Ramen emote is for sale in the eververse store for 3250 dust fyi
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Nov 21, 2017 23:00
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A 50S RAYGUN posted:you’re pretty much making the argument for random rolls, but every gun having its own name, which is such a dumb argument i don’t know why it would even occur to you for christ’s sake i don’t want random rolls in any loving thing if i’m arguing anything it’s destiny 2 is random enough as it is. i’m trying to understand how having 15 variants of a gun called better devils is somehow better than 15 different guns that cover that same range just with different names Cowcaster fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Nov 21, 2017 |
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Nov 21, 2017 23:01
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Cowcaster posted:for christ’s sake i don’t want random rolls in any loving thing your version of diablo would be really really bad
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Nov 21, 2017 23:02
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This isn't Diablo tho
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Nov 21, 2017 23:03
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More poopsocking! *Crowd boos* Okay, less poopsocking! *Crowd also boos* Poopsocking for some, microtransaction lootboxes for others?
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Nov 21, 2017 23:05
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Cowcaster posted:for christ’s sake i don’t want random rolls in any loving thing if i’m arguing anything it’s destiny 2 is random enough as it is. i’m trying to understand how having 15 variants of a gun called better devils is somehow better than 15 different guns that cover that same range just with different names you’re circumventing the entire point of the argument with nonsense, though. yes, if destiny 2 had a unique name for every conceivable weapon roll, that would be fine, but we have nowhere near that. you’re arguing for the same thing we are and acting like you’re not. Norns posted:This isn't Diablo tho destiny 1’s gameplay loop pretty much was and age of triumph d1 is a much better game than d2 currently is
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Nov 21, 2017 23:07
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TheRagamuffin posted:More poopsocking! D1 solves this by RoI by making the perk layout for all guns extremely good and dropping poo poo perks You’re basically guaranteed a good and competitive version of the gun with your first drop and then you can spend whatever time you want getting that perfect roll for the way you play. Seriously look up the way y3 iron banner and vendor guns rolled, it was glorious.
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Nov 21, 2017 23:09
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A 50S RAYGUN posted:you’re circumventing the entire point of the argument with nonsense, though. yes, if destiny 2 had a unique name for every conceivable weapon roll, that would be fine, but we have nowhere near that. you’re arguing for the same thing we are and acting like you’re not. i don't want that! i've never wanted that! i'm trying to understand if that's what you want, because it seems so gruesomely masochistic to me that apparently people exist out there that could possibly want more grind in their videogame!
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Nov 21, 2017 23:10
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henkman posted:A big problem with destiny is that it's a loot game where the loot for the most part doesn't loving matter. The way the scaling with power level works is kind of really stupid
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Nov 21, 2017 23:11
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Cowcaster posted:i don't want that! i've never wanted that! i'm trying to understand if that's what you want, because it seems so gruesomely masochistic to me that apparently people exist out there that could possibly want more grind in their videogame! i don’t want ‘more grind’, i want literally any reward i get to be more valuable than it’s constituent weapon parts (or legendary shards that i can spend on weapon parts)
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Nov 21, 2017 23:13
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"yeah, it's a boring loot treadmill, but at least it never ends!"
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Nov 21, 2017 23:13
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as opposed to a boring loot treadmill that does end???
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Nov 21, 2017 23:16
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I assume what's going to happen eventually is when we move onto a new "season" of cosmetics, the previous season's stuff will cycle in and out Xur-vendor style and the new stuff will remain random pull. Which still sucks but is slightly better.
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Nov 21, 2017 23:17
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A 50S RAYGUN posted:as opposed to a boring loot treadmill that does end??? yes!
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Nov 21, 2017 23:18
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All you need to do is look at Rise of Iron era Iron Banner relative to D2 iron Banner to see how hosed up D2 is. D1 iron banner was when all the boys came to the yard because the rewards were all good and plentiful, there was an end point with guaranteed rewards but you could keep grinding if you were tismed and most of all it was fun. D2 Banner is loving token garbage.
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Nov 21, 2017 23:20
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Maybe give us 500 Vault space minimum first, before wanting to bring back variants to gamble rolls on? Even with such a "Limited weapons pool", trying to have a cool collection of weapons and outfits it already fairly cramped. More so when you want to keep your garage full of cool space ships, space bikes, and Space Balls action figures (Be the first kid on your block to own a skin that finds resources on every planet!). Adding an extra dose of roulette wheel with the emphasis that "It's a loot game! The goal is to collect more loot!" rings hollow without a Scrooge McDuck vault so you can actually accumulate loot rather than throw them in the shredder with one hand and hold your spreadsheet in the other. Even if the genre does love trying to give you limited storage space and pitch such engine and/or dev effort limitations as a feature. "It's a loot game! Look at all these cool things you can grind for-holy poo poo, you want to keep the things we keep bragging are all amazing? What did you think this was, a loot game?"
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Nov 21, 2017 23:22
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Section Z posted:Maybe give us 500 Vault space minimum first, before wanting to bring back variants to gamble rolls on? D2 having fixed loot and not having kiosks is unforgivable.
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Nov 21, 2017 23:23
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A Buff Gay Dude posted:D2 having fixed loot and not having kiosks is unforgivable. Hell, even just some way to specify "Give me something from this planet's specialty pool" would be a big step. Section Z fucked around with this message at 23:29 on Nov 21, 2017 |
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Nov 21, 2017 23:26
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For people that have put a pvp group together what is the elo / Kd / kda cutoff you look for?
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Nov 21, 2017 23:26
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