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jivjov posted:I don't think anyone is saying Han is a violent sexual assualter. The scene just lacks vocalized specific affirmative consent; something we're trying very hard to drill the importance of into society today. Han being a sexual assaulter actually seemed to be what UmOk was getting from the scene. Like I said, the movie makes it clear that the encounter is consensual.
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Nov 26, 2017 20:13
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fridge corn posted:Lol of course a goon would require a woman to spell it out for them Goons don't require that. They just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. They don’t even wait. And when you’re a scoundrel, they let you do it. You can do anything.
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Nov 26, 2017 20:46
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In a modern context it is considered irresponsible to romanticize relationships which progress in that manner. Still a lot better about it than Blade Runner, though.
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Nov 26, 2017 20:52
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fridge corn posted:Lol of course a goon would require a woman to spell it out for them My dude, explicit consent is incredibly important. Don't even joke about not needing consent.
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Nov 26, 2017 21:19
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Even Bobby Peru cornering Lula in Wild at Heart seems somehow better than Deckard cornering Rachel in Blade Runner because Bobby actually leaves after Lula says what he wants her to say.
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Nov 26, 2017 21:20
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Captain Jesus posted:Han being a sexual assaulter actually seemed to be what UmOk was getting from the scene. Like I said, the movie makes it clear that the encounter is consensual. I wasn't saying he sexually assaulted Leelu. Although that could be the case as there is a national discussion going on right now about what constitutes sexual assault. I was just trying to say that it was messed up. And if you think clear consent involves a women saying "stop" then I don't know what to say.
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Nov 26, 2017 21:32
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Nov 26, 2017 21:32
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jivjov posted:My dude, explicit consent is incredibly important. Don't even joke about not needing consent. Uhh im not joking? Consent can come in any number of forms. If you needed a formal contract everytime you wanted to kiss someone none of us would even be here
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Nov 26, 2017 21:36
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You don’t have a contract?
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Nov 26, 2017 21:40
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fridge corn posted:Uhh im not joking? Consent can come in any number of forms. If you needed a formal contract everytime you wanted to kiss someone none of us would even be here Her lips said no, but her eyes said yes.
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Nov 26, 2017 21:43
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it was a blockbuster from the '80s, we're lucky it didn't involve han secretly pretending to be luke to get into her pants
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Nov 26, 2017 21:44
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She don't say a word And she won't say a word Until you kiss that girl, kiss the girl
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Nov 26, 2017 21:51
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Luke never got consent when he penetrated the exhaust shaft with his laser sperm
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Nov 26, 2017 22:08
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banned from Starbucks posted:Luke never got consent when he penetrated the exhaust shaft with his laser sperm rey's parentage is more complicated than i thought
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Nov 26, 2017 22:09
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Come to think of it, Leia never got consent when she kissed an injured Luke.
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Nov 26, 2017 22:27
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That loving Luke and Leia kiss. God drat it Lucas. Making those two related was wholly unnecessary. Yet another strike against RotJ.
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Nov 26, 2017 23:36
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Yaws posted:That loving Luke and Leia kiss. God drat it Lucas. Making those two related was wholly unnecessary. Yet another strike against RotJ. When you take this plot ‘element’, the already uncomfortable nature behind the relationship between Indy and Marion in Raiders of the Lost Ark (not to mention the original age Marion was supposed to be), plus Howard the Duck; really makes you think about Lucas’ kink.
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Nov 27, 2017 00:48
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Yaws posted:That loving Luke and Leia kiss. God drat it Lucas. Making those two related was wholly unnecessary. Yet another strike against RotJ. Who cares? Luke unknowingly having the hots for his sister is funny. Especially since she looks just like his mom. Dude wants to gently caress his mother and kill his father. What kind of filth is this? I certainly don't want it infecting my cultural touchstones. fridge corn posted:Uhh im not joking? Consent can come in any number of forms. If you needed a formal contract everytime you wanted to kiss someone none of us would even be here Dude I want to defend the Han/Leia romance on the grounds of it being inherently a fantasy and not necessarily something intended to be emulated in real life, but people like you make it awfully hard. You don't need a formal contract to kiss someone but you also probably shouldn't corner a woman and then start putting your hands all over despite her physically pushing you away and telling you no. If you just assume you can tell she's secretly into it because that's how it works in the movies, you're going to get into some bad territory. I don't see why we can't point stuff like this out without automatically having people respond like we're telling them the Han/Leia romance is suddenly Bad and they're Bad People for enjoying it. Some people might be saying that but I'm not. I just think it's good to draw a line between fantasy and reality. Cnut the Great fucked around with this message at 00:57 on Nov 27, 2017 |
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Nov 27, 2017 00:50
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Cnut the Great posted:Who cares? Luke unknowingly having the hots for his sister is funny. Especially since she looks just like his mom. Because this isn't a loving John Waters movie. I have no doubt Cnut has never seen a John Waters film but someone will get me here.
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Nov 27, 2017 01:24
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Yaws posted:Because this isn't a loving John Waters movie. You think George Lucas, film geek and avid reader of Joseph Campbell, wouldn't have dared to steal from Sophocles?
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Nov 27, 2017 02:28
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Yaws posted:Because this isn't a loving John Waters movie. You're a loving dick.
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Nov 27, 2017 02:31
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Cnut the Great posted:You're a loving dick. What is your deal? I'm not trying to be a dick at all. You just don't seem like the type that has seen 'outsider cinema'. I was in now way attacking you as a person. No need to be a jerk about it. Sheesh. Yaws fucked around with this message at 03:09 on Nov 27, 2017 |
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Nov 27, 2017 03:06
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Cnut the Great posted:Dude I want to defend the Han/Leia romance on the grounds of it being inherently a fantasy and not necessarily something intended to be emulated in real life, but people like you make it awfully hard. We can’t empty quote, so I’ll just say that this is the point.
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Nov 27, 2017 03:28
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Cnut the Great posted:Dude I want to defend the Han/Leia romance on the grounds of it being inherently a fantasy and not necessarily something intended to be emulated in real life, but people like you make it awfully hard. Err yeah that's fine and exactly my point too just don't get all self righteous about it okay?
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Nov 27, 2017 07:42
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Nov 27, 2017 10:44
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Cnut the Great posted:Dude I want to defend the Han/Leia romance on the grounds of it being inherently a fantasy and not necessarily something intended to be emulated in real life, but people like you make it awfully hard. fridge corn posted:Err yeah that's fine and exactly my point too just don't get all self righteous about it okay? If that was your point... fridge corn posted:Uhh im not joking? Consent can come in any number of forms. If you needed a formal contract everytime you wanted to kiss someone none of us would even be here ...this was a really weird way of saying that.
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Nov 27, 2017 12:37
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Nov 27, 2017 12:43
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Captain Jesus posted:Han is no Deckard. Get off my plane.
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Nov 27, 2017 12:45
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jivjov posted:Whenever anyone says that TFA was a remake of ANH (or that TLJ is looking like a remake of ESB), I start to question if that person has ever actually watched a Star Wars film. TFA is a blow by blow remake of the entire OT. Act 1 strongly resembles ANH's Act 1. Act 2 strongly resembles ESB's Act 2 and Act 3 Strongly resembles Act 3 from RotJ. That was something that felt immediately obvious to me. It's most striking with Act 3 though where the team in the air is dependent on an attack from the ground to blow up a shield generator.
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Nov 27, 2017 15:09
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Yorkshire Tea posted:Act 1 strongly resembles ANH's Act 1. Act 2 strongly resembles ESB's Act 2 and Act 3 Strongly resembles Act 3 from RotJ.
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Nov 27, 2017 15:13
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thrawn527 posted:If that was your point... The problem is a bunch of ppl itt trying to score feminism points by pointing out that Han's advances are a bit forceful and creepy (obvious) yet completely ignoring Leias agency in all this. It's she not allowed to want Han's advances? The whole series up until this point she's been a supreme all business badass, is she not allowed to let some of her deeper feelings bubble to the surface? Like it's a pretty significant character moment for Leia but let's completely misinterpret the scene and focus on Han being a dickhead because we're retards (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST) (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Nov 27, 2017 15:27
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Cat Machine posted:I don't see the similarities between ESB act 2 and TFA act 2 - could you elaborate? That's the weakest part of what I'm saying and I'll freely admit it. Further, the opinion on Luke's decision in ESB that this thread takes is very different to my own so also bear that in mind. I also think that's actually a reflection of how the second act is probably TFA's weakest area. So ignoring hilarious alien interlude, Rey spends much of the second Act of TFA learning about who exactly she is. It's similar to both ANH's second and ESB's second acts where Luke spends time learning about the force. The reason I feel it most strikingly resembles ESB is because of the choices made. So in ESB Luke gets a vision near the end of the act and basically goes "gently caress that noise," and runs off based on his impulses which is absolutely disastrous for everyone involved. Similarly Rey at the end of the act gets a similar vision that makes her run the hell off and is again, disastrous for those involved. In addition, we also have Finn basically giving up on the idea of the resistance and trying to run off as well, which means that he's unable to prevent Rey from being captured. Thematically both acts are about the rejection of one's responsibilities in favour of doing something quick and easy and the negative consequences after. But again, I'll freely admit that it's contingent on my own understanding of ESB and is also undercut by hilarious alien interlude.
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Nov 27, 2017 15:50
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Maybe they don't have consent laws in that galaxy Also it's based on being a long time ago Like when chasing girls meant literally chasing them
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Nov 27, 2017 15:52
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the poo poo that goes down between han and leia in ESB is pretty hosed up and yet it manages to seem almost pleasant compared to that scene in blade runner
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Nov 27, 2017 15:59
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fridge corn posted:The problem is a bunch of ppl itt trying to score feminism points by pointing out that Han's advances are a bit forceful and creepy (obvious) yet completely ignoring Leias agency in all this. It's she not allowed to want Han's advances? The whole series up until this point she's been a supreme all business badass, is she not allowed to let some of her deeper feelings bubble to the surface? Like it's a pretty significant character moment for Leia but let's completely misinterpret the scene and focus on Han being a dickhead because we're retards I had a post ready about who is actually removing Leia’s agency in that scene (Han), but reading back again, “score feminism points” is such a dumbass thing to say that, nah, I’m out.
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Nov 27, 2017 16:20
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fridge corn posted:The problem is a bunch of ppl itt trying to score feminism points by pointing out that Han's advances are a bit forceful and creepy (obvious) yet completely ignoring Leias agency in all this. It's she not allowed to want Han's advances? The whole series up until this point she's been a supreme all business badass, is she not allowed to let some of her deeper feelings bubble to the surface? Like it's a pretty significant character moment for Leia but let's completely misinterpret the scene and focus on Han being a dickhead because we're retards 1) ableist slurs aren't necessary; we're talking about some films here. 2) Han deliberately ignores Leia's agency. She literally tells him to stop and let go of her, and the moment C-3PO shows up, she bolts.
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Nov 27, 2017 16:33
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are feminism points what you use to unlock rey in battlefront 2 now?
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Nov 27, 2017 16:35
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I wish I could just stay in that other Star Wars thread, but holy poo poo it's even worse.
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Nov 27, 2017 18:03
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thrawn527 posted:I had a post ready about who is actually removing Leia’s agency in that scene (Han), but reading back again, “score feminism points” is such a dumbass thing to say that, nah, I’m out. Smart move. Pretty sure some of these guys are going to start complaining about "little white cuck-balls" soon
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Nov 27, 2017 18:11
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jivjov posted:1) ableist slurs aren't necessary; we're talking about some films here. Knowing what we do of Leia, a woman who is completely fearless in front of darth vader, do you not think she would be able to handle someone like Han? You don't think she wouldn't crack him one round the jaw if she really didn't want him going there? You give her too little credit. I know you mean well but your reading of the scene is unfortunate. I suggest maybe educating yourself a bit on the matter and having another look at it.
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Nov 27, 2017 18:15
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