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Reiterpallasch posted:you probably shouldn't click your staples if only to avoid massive wrist fatigue, but the gcd in this game is slow enough that plenty of highly skilled players click their ogcds with zero impact on their play It blows my mind that people are able to do that because I could certainly never but hey, if it works for you, stick with it imo 
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Nov 29, 2017 14:50
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Truga posted:No, but some crazy people like to pull fairy skills to their hotbars rather than just use the pet bar. it's because SCH doesn't have enough buttons already and needs more
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Nov 29, 2017 14:52
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I don't seem to have that issue. My main modifier keys are caps and alt, and well, between 123456 and aqwrgbv that's 39 possible hotkeys, and shift+keys I use for out of combat crap since it's kinda awkward hitting shift + movement + some of my hotkeys. I have the pet bar things on caps+zxcvb, you just need place, return and the 3 skills anyway.
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Nov 29, 2017 14:58
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Ainsley McTree posted:It blows my mind that people are able to do that because I could certainly never but hey, if it works for you, stick with it imo I don't find myself doing it on PLD near as much because it isn't really necessary, but when I was cranking out top DPS as dragoon in HW I streamed for a friend and he said I clicked like a starcraft player trying to keep his APM up. At the time I didn't notice it but I was really flying all over the place constantly tweaking camera while clicking buttons. But yeah I couldn't play this game at all with just hotkeys. I don't think I could get going near as fast as I personally do with the mouse. I'm also just using a lovely insignia mouse/kb combo from best buy that costs like $15 and playing on an imac from 2012 booted into win7, so I'm definitely not the norm. But the point is, you don't need anything fancy at all to play at top level this game. It is stupid easy to play on old and garbage equipment. I wouldn't know what to do with an MMO mouse or keyboard.
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Nov 29, 2017 15:13
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Truga posted:No, but some crazy people like to pull fairy skills to their hotbars rather than just use the pet bar. I know you all are talking about KB+M, but for the record the pet crossbar sucks in every possible way.
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Nov 29, 2017 15:18
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Darth Walrus posted:What’s that track with the chorus that blares away at the end of level 60 dungeons? I never knew throwing down with the Oxford Literacy Oel could be quite so epic. It was supposed to be Nidhogg's boss theme, but it got replaced at the last second and moved to 3.4+ boss themes. The result is a track that is a little too epic to be playing on fights with things like "Lava Scorpion"
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Nov 29, 2017 15:40
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I initially played with controller but even with all the expanded cross bars, I was running out of space for skills on MNK and SAM (and forget trying to heal). I moved to keyboard and mouse a month ago, and I use 1-5 and ERF and ALT+ those keys for my main skills (eg my normal SAM attacks are 1-4, Alt 1-3 for Keiten and 3rd step moves, ERF for AOE, and DPS on 1-3 for A, 4 for Essential Dignity, ST, Alt+1-4 for Cards, ERF and alt for various heals and Esuna) and tend to mouse target over targeting with the F keys. Anything else I tend to click as it's normally a special need (eg self heals, aggro drop, limit break, stance change, etc). I'm pretty happy with it. I wish I could use CTRL and SHIFT for more space, but my tiny hands make those harder to reach reliabily and still be able to use WSAD to move about. Though for heals I may look into mouse-over macros since I use mouse to target half the time.
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Nov 29, 2017 15:51
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80 buttons wasn't enough for you to play MNK with a controller?
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Nov 29, 2017 15:54
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Reiterpallasch posted:you probably shouldn't click your staples if only to avoid massive wrist fatigue, but the gcd in this game is slow enough that plenty of highly skilled players click their ogcds with zero impact on their play as a tank player at some point I got into the habit of clicking my defensive CDs and unless i need to pop a bunch at once it still just feels better cause i can keep my left hand running the combo/oGCD motions
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Nov 29, 2017 15:55
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On the subject of finding room for keybinds: I'd be really interested to see what could be done to reduce the number of keybinds required for each job without reducing the (meaningful) complexity of playing it. One of my least favorite things about traditional MMOs with a lot of skills per class is finding comfortable keybinds for everything I need. I have a really hard time for that because I'm pretty picky, and if I have to use more than two modifier keys I get very annoyed. Obviously jobs like RDM are really easy targets (have Impact replace Jolt II when it procs, put the melee combo on one button, that kind of thing--doesn't really change how you play at all, just saves you keybinds), just like any job with a lot of procs, but I wonder about healers and tanks especially. A lot of their complexity comes from situational actions and probably couldn't be consolidated without removing some of the interest of playing them.
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Nov 29, 2017 15:55
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Honestly since the skill consolidation I haven't had much trouble fitting any of my jobs even on crossbars, I barely use double-tap bars and only for stuff that's like "once a fight if that" like Protect, Rescue, Sustain, Summon, Aetherial Manip, Between the Lines, Potions or Apocata. So long as they don't shy away from making new max level rotations invalidate parts of older ones we should be alright. I don't play any melee DPS though, maybe it's harder there.
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Nov 29, 2017 16:09
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MechaX posted:It was supposed to be Nidhogg's boss theme, but it got replaced at the last second and moved to 3.4+ boss themes. That said, that fight has enough raw material for the music to really elevate it. With standard boss music, you’d be fighting a big burny arachnid with persistent AOEs. With Revenge Twofold, you’re doing battle with a vast, hideous spirit of fire as it tries to wake the mighty, ancient volcano it’s nested in and drown you beneath the searing blood of the earth. Entering your Dreadwyrm Trance as the chorus ramps up, the lava creeps towards you, and you prepare to land the finishing blow before your tank burns to death (again) is quite an experience.
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Nov 29, 2017 16:13
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Phone posted:80 buttons wasn't enough for you to play MNK with a controller? Not without messing up and getting on the wrong bar. I didn't want to do hot bar switching cause speed, so I used the main cross bar and the L2-R2 and R2-L2 cross bars for various combat stuff, and the double tap L2/R2 for out of combat stuff like teleport, mount, etc.
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Nov 29, 2017 16:21
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Phone posted:80 buttons wasn't enough for you to play MNK with a controller? How do you controller users use the left part of the crossbar anyway? That thumb is pretty much reserved for movement, no?
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Nov 29, 2017 16:25
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MechaX posted:It was supposed to be Nidhogg's boss theme, but it got replaced at the last second and moved to 3.4+ boss themes. Lava Scorpion's cooler than Nidhogg imo
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Nov 29, 2017 16:25
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MechaX posted:The result is a track that is a little too epic to be playing on fights with things like "Lava Scorpion" Revenge Twofold improves any battle. 
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Nov 29, 2017 16:26
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Truga posted:How do you controller users use the left part of the crossbar anyway? That thumb is pretty much reserved for movement, no? I put skills that required less movement over there (cool down skills, heals, situational stuff, AOEs). All my positional/active stuff was on the buttons.
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Nov 29, 2017 16:27
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I think I was off in my math... 48 buttons? 32 that don't require a double tap. Math.
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Nov 29, 2017 16:28
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Truga posted:How do you controller users use the left part of the crossbar anyway? That thumb is pretty much reserved for movement, no? The way crossbar works is holding a modifier (usually a trigger) and then using the 8 face buttons (d pad on the left, shapes on the right). I think most controller players put main rotation GCDs on the right side of the pad, off cycle GCDs and AOEs on the left side, and then oGCDs and stances behind their favorite extended crossbar trigger. I don't like the way that the controller target selects, but then again I don't like the way it tab selects either with kb+m.
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Nov 29, 2017 16:33
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Phone posted:I think I was off in my math... 48 buttons? 32 that don't require a double tap. 40 with double tap. Those only bring up a half bar, not a full 8. It's a good number, but then you need to take in to account accurately putting in the activation trigger to the other crossbars during a battle (I put less important skills on L2->R2 as I normally used the R2 crossbar so pulling up that bar was more natural than the other). It's doable, but depends on what skills you have and need during a fight. Also, take my words with a grain of salt cause I'm not a super awesome MMO player, just good enough to generally not die once I know content.
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Nov 29, 2017 16:36
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I wish I could get used to playing with a controller. It honestly seems easier to me than my usual keybind setup (1-6, shift+1-6, ctrl+1-6, and a smattering of keys like Q, E, R, F, C, Z, X, V, and a few others), but for some reason I just can't make it work for me. I think I'm so used to buttons on a controller being for specific actions in an action game or something that using modifiers to change them just feels completely foreign to me. And I really can't seem to figure out targeting on a controller, either.
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Nov 29, 2017 16:39
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I guess I just play differently since there's zero skills I want to use/queue while not moving, despite mostly playing casters. Like, even just normal broil spam is often interrupted by small amounts of movement in between, due to how you can move around a bit while still casting in this game.
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Nov 29, 2017 16:39
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I'm glad they didn't stick with the pre-launch plans of locus being bismark and metal for ravana. I'm sure the lyrics were different at that point for them. The HW soundtrack is pretty good all around. Also nidhogg's music owns.
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Nov 29, 2017 16:42
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Bremma posted:40 with double tap. Those only bring up a half bar, not a full 8. It's a good number, but then you need to take in to account accurately putting in the activation trigger to the other crossbars during a battle (I put less important skills on L2->R2 as I normally used the R2 crossbar so pulling up that bar was more natural than the other). It's doable, but depends on what skills you have and need during a fight. Also, take my words with a grain of salt cause I'm not a super awesome MMO player, just good enough to generally not die once I know content. My math using a DS4, I think all of the possible cross bar combos are L2, R2, L2+L2, R2+R2, L2+R2, R2+L2; 8 buttons per modifier = 48.
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Nov 29, 2017 16:45
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Truga posted:How do you controller users use the left part of the crossbar anyway? That thumb is pretty much reserved for movement, no? Steam Controller.
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Nov 29, 2017 17:25
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I think the only reservations I have toward clicking in FF with its glacial GCD is that I double weave regularly and I can't click things if I'm constantly rotating my camera around like a crazy person as I do.
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Nov 29, 2017 17:49
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nuru posted:I think the only reservations I have toward clicking in FF with its glacial GCD is that I double weave regularly and I can't click things if I'm constantly rotating my camera around like a crazy person as I do. I double weave and still flip my camera around a lot. It's very easy to do. Also use legacy controls if you're not already.
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Nov 29, 2017 18:46
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I used to click a few things until a certain someone in my static made fun of me for it. Now I only click rez. I'd really like to see some button bloat looked at with regards to AST and cards. We have Draw, Undraw, Royal Road, Undraw Royal Road, Spread, Undraw Spread, Redraw, Minor Arcana, and Sleeve Draw. Nine buttons (or six, if you just right click off buffs) all bent around trying to get Balance. Like how PvE melee could lose a lot of buttons by following their PvP counterparts, I think PvE AST could probably do with borrowing some ideas from its PvP counterpart. Really, how some bloat was looked at and some was not has been a bit of a lopsided affair.
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Nov 29, 2017 19:41
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Hobgoblin2099 posted:Revenge Twofold improves any battle. I'm still mad that it cuts out after the beam battle in DS and is replaced with the boring Diabolos song.
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Nov 29, 2017 19:50
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BrightWing posted:I'm still mad that it cuts out after the beam battle in DS and is replaced with the boring Diabolos song. A lovely fight deserves a lovely song.
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Nov 29, 2017 20:04
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ruta posted:I used to click a few things until a certain someone in my static made fun of me for it. Now I only click rez. DRG, WAR, SAM, MNK maybe?, all could do with those PvP style changing abilities to cut down on button bloat. Also I'm almost 60 on my MCH and I want to know who the hell decided that the 3 shot rotation should be a goddamn coin toss as to whether it even bothers to proc the next shot beyond an excuse to keep ammunition relevant.
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Nov 29, 2017 20:07
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:A lovely fight deserves a lovely song. Is that the fight where everyone who isn't a healer can just stand around picking their noses and you'll still win, because he loses like 20,000 health a second? I had a Diabolos Hollow where every single living person had -50% damage and everyone just gave up and stopped raising people in one of the alliances, and we still cleared after like 10 minutes of him very slowly wilting away. Also, I found the rarest item in the game, the mythical Skallic Bottoms of Healing. Just a hundred more runs and the matching shoes might drop!  re: AST button bloat, the only Undrawn I usually keep on my bars is Empty Road, the rest seem redundant at 50, and especially at 66 when you have Minor Arcana. Solo Wing Pixy fucked around with this message at 20:14 on Nov 29, 2017 |
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Nov 29, 2017 20:12
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Solo Wing Pixy posted:Is that the fight where everyone who isn't a healer can just stand around picking their noses and you'll still win, because he loses like 20,000 health a second? I had a Diabolos Hollow where every single living person had -50% damage and everyone just gave up and stopped raising people in one of the alliances, and we still cleared after like 10 minutes of him very slowly wilting away. Yeah, it's the fight where he's invincible for the first quarter of the fight, and then either wipes the alliance or kills himself.
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Nov 29, 2017 20:19
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I would have thought the most relevant undraw was for Spread. Maybe you only use Sleeve Draw when you've got something in Spread, but you should be using it if you have over ~15 seconds left on Draw's cooldown. I'm going to remove a held Spire before a Royal Road effect of any kind.
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Nov 29, 2017 20:21
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:Yeah, it's the fight where he's invincible for the first quarter of the fight, and then either wipes the alliance or kills himself. He's not invincible. It's a big stoneskin. If people would actually dps it makes it go so much faster.
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Nov 29, 2017 20:25
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Mr. Nice! posted:He's not invincible. It's a big stoneskin. If people would actually dps it makes it go so much faster. It's a big stoneskin that makes him autocrit every attack. Please DPS it down.
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Nov 29, 2017 20:28
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ruta posted:I would have thought the most relevant undraw was for Spread. Maybe you only use Sleeve Draw when you've got something in Spread, but you should be using it if you have over ~15 seconds left on Draw's cooldown. I'm going to remove a held Spire before a Royal Road effect of any kind. I've said for years that if you hit Royal Road with nothing drawn and a card in Spread, it should move the card from Spread to Royal Road.
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Nov 29, 2017 20:33
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Orcs and Ostriches posted:Yeah, it's the fight where he's invincible for the first quarter of the fight, and then either wipes the alliance or kills himself. Invincible enemies don't usually display damage numbers. Please attack the boss.
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Nov 29, 2017 20:39
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It's loving eight, nine, ten weeks into 3.1, and there are still people standing in the middle of the room when Rofocale does his phase transition attack, and complaining when they get hosed by it. Do you *really* think anyone who doesn't already DPS down the stoneskin is going to start now?
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Nov 29, 2017 20:40
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SwissArmyDruid posted:I've said for years that if you hit Royal Road with nothing drawn and a card in Spread, it should move the card from Spread to Royal Road. I would like this for Minor Arcana as well.
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Nov 29, 2017 20:41
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