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Shageletic posted:Whatcha talkin about, V is a good movie. Haven't read the comic tho. V is good, somewhat misses the point of the source material, had some unnecessary changes. Watchmen is good, somewhat misses the point or actually gets it depending on who you ask, makes some unwanted but probably necessary and understandable changes. I'd say it's a better film than V even though I like V.
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Nov 30, 2017 21:50
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Al Borland Corp. posted:Personally I doubt it's actually even piss in the jar, But only lex knows. I like to think that Lex was watching it on the TV waiting for her notice then pushing a large red detonate button
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Nov 30, 2017 21:51
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Monaghan posted:Have to agree with this. The fight between batman and superman in bvs felt so contrived. It always felt like there was a hundred different ways it could have gone differently and batman and superman wouldn't have fought each other. However, they managed to end up fighting each other because they both seem to be morons who are incapable of using simple reasoning or talking things out. Steve vs. Tony is so loving good, especially because you can empathize with the motivation for both guys. Tony wants revenge because he just saw a video of his parents being murdered, and Steve wants to save his best friend who was used. I'm sure more people would fall on Cap's side because of knowing that Bucky was brainwashed, but at the same time you totally understand why Tony doesn't care. There's emotion driving them in their fight here.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:11
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Codependent Poster posted:Steve vs. Tony is so loving good, especially because you can empathize with the motivation for both guys. Tony wants revenge because he just saw a video of his parents being murdered, and Steve wants to save his best friend who was used. I'm sure more people would fall on Cap's side because of knowing that Bucky was brainwashed, but at the same time you totally understand why Tony doesn't care. There's emotion driving them in their fight here. I love Civil War the more I think about it. A lot of people complain about how it sets the casualty numbers so low for all of the Avengers' various outings while missing that that's kind of the whole point of the movie. It rubs in your face that getting caught up on how many people died is stupid and pointless. You know who's the most concerned with sheer numbers? Ross, and he's obviously using the whole thing as political capital. Every single act in the film is motivated by the death of a single person (or family, in Zemo's case). The whole point of Civil War is that every single death is important, and can have huge ramification. Why does Tony go whole hog on the accords? To absolve himself of the guilt he feels over that one death the lady confronted him with. Why is T'Challa hell bent on murdering Bucky? Because of the death of his father. What first cements Steve's decision to stand against the accords? Peggy dying. Why does Tony want to kill Bucky? Because his mom died. It's great.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:33
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Nov 30, 2017 22:41
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I give them a lot of credit for that last part where instead of a superhero vs. super powered experiments fight we get Cap vs. Tony and then T’Challa spares Zemo after so badly wanting revenge the whole film. It’s very effective in its message.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:42
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Phylodox posted:I love Civil War the more I think about it. A lot of people complain about how it sets the casualty numbers so low for all of the Avengers' various outings while missing that that's kind of the whole point of the movie. It rubs in your face that getting caught up on how many people died is stupid and pointless. You know who's the most concerned with sheer numbers? Ross, and he's obviously using the whole thing as political capital. Every single act in the film is motivated by the death of a single person (or family, in Zemo's case). The whole point of Civil War is that every single death is important, and can have huge ramification. Why does Tony go whole hog on the accords? To absolve himself of the guilt he feels over that one death the lady confronted him with. Why is T'Challa hell bent on murdering Bucky? Because of the death of his father. What first cements Steve's decision to stand against the accords? Peggy dying. Why does Tony want to kill Bucky? Because his mom died. It's great. I think Civil War succeeded where BvS arguably didn't is also that you can understand and potentially support anyone in Civil War - Tony, Steve, T'Challa, even Ross. They all have valid points they're trying to make, even Ross seems like a guy struggling with the implications of being the Secretary of Defense in an age of superheroes who generally do not hold themselves to any higher authority and tend to leave behind messes for governments to wrestle with. No side is blameless or without redeeming virtues, and the actors sold how conflicted every character was about what was going on - Tony's immense guilt and sense of responsibility, Steve's selfless dedication to a man he knows is innocent, T'Challa's drive for vengeance, Ross the frustrated bureaucrat who wants someone to step up and say they were responsible for what happened and will take care of the negative consequences and aftermath.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:42
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The other thing that it really sells to me is how by the end of the movie both sides understand the other and regret what it came to, but that still doesn’t just magically fix things and you can’t just unring all those bells. Hopefully IW doesn’t just reset that in 10 minutes.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:43
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And btw what a massive step up from comic incarnation.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:44
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I mean, even Zemo comes across as sympathetic, and that's saying something Daniel Bruhls disaffected delivery of "my father still clutching my wife and son in his arms" is heartbreaking
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Nov 30, 2017 22:51
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fruit on the bottom posted:And btw what a massive step up from comic incarnation. Pretty much. I hated the civil war comic but love the movie. The movie resulted in a way more believable conflict.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:51
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One of the big problems tha BvS has is that Superman doesn't really have much of a character in that film. All we know about him is that he is in a sexual relationship with Lois, that he loves him mother and that he is terrible at his job.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:52
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FlamingLiberal posted:I give them a lot of credit for that last part where instead of a superhero vs. super powered experiments fight we get Cap vs. Tony and then T’Challa spares Zemo after so badly wanting revenge the whole film. It’s very effective in its message. It's such a great fake out. You think this will be the grand cop out and let the heroes remain friends as they unite to fight a team of 5 Winter Soldiers or whatever. Instead, this is Civil War, so it's gonna end with Cap beating up Iron Man.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:52
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fruit on the bottom posted:The other thing that it really sells to me is how by the end of the movie both sides understand the other and regret what it came to, but that still doesn’t just magically fix things and you can’t just unring all those bells. Both Tony and Steve seem like the kind of guy who are willing to put that aside when Thanos shows up. Age of Ultron established that Tony knows about Thanos, and is trying to prepare Earth for it - that's the big reason why he wanted to make Ultron. I suspect it's going to be "I still don't forgive you, but let's leave that for after we've saved the drat planet."
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Nov 30, 2017 22:53
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fruit on the bottom posted:The other thing that it really sells to me is how by the end of the movie both sides understand the other and regret what it came to, but that still doesn’t just magically fix things and you can’t just unring all those bells. Just going by the trailer, it seems they're still broke up. Team Tony(Plus Strange) are all on New York and Team Cap are all in Wakanda. Although War Machine is in the big running scene and Banner shows up as a human with Stark and as the Hulk in the end so I could be wrong.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:55
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Yeah that was established back in the first Avengers movie. When Hawkeye showed up to the Helicarrier and took out one of the engines they were pretty quick to come together to fix the problem.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:56
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Al Borland Corp. posted:V is good, somewhat misses the point of the source material, had some unnecessary changes. On a scene by scene level I find V to be more interesting, Stephen Fry, that amazing rear end in a top hat British propaganda guy, John Hurt, flashing knives making waves, its a very easy movie to watch a bit and end up watching the whole thing. Watchmen is a bit of a slog tonal wise, without the imaginative use of its medium that was found in the comics but not found (maybe cuz its impossible? though inventive meta takes isn't exactly new to films) in the movie. Its just kinda dark and gray and a little wearying. Still good stuff in it tho, but def not something that I can easily just rewatch.
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Nov 30, 2017 22:57
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Watchmen tried to do with superhero movies what the comic did with superhero comics, and it's really too bad it came out before the advent of the current paradigm of multiple films a year shared universe superhero movies.
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Nov 30, 2017 23:05
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" I don't care, he killed my mom." Is such a powerful line that even if you hate Tony you can't help but sympathize with him.
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Nov 30, 2017 23:14
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SleepCousinDeath posted:It's the only example. I'd say Peyton Reed fits as an interesting choice for Ant-Man / Ant-Man and the Wasp.
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Nov 30, 2017 23:17
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Samuringa posted:Just going by the trailer, it seems they're still broke up. Team Tony(Plus Strange) are all on New York and Team Cap are all in Wakanda. Although War Machine is in the big running scene and Banner shows up as a human with Stark and as the Hulk in the end so I could be wrong. Oooh - You just gave me a great and terrible idea. "How does that work? How do you have Banner in NY and Hulk in Wakanda?" Well, if you have a magical gee-gaw that can alter reality, maybe Bruce and hulk are on a trial separation?
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Nov 30, 2017 23:21
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I thought it was implied that Banner had been transported somewhere, via trickery.
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Nov 30, 2017 23:24
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WillyTheNewGuy posted:I'd say Peyton Reed fits as an interesting choice for Ant-Man / Ant-Man and the Wasp. Like, have we also already forgotten about James Gunn and Guardians because so many things have tried to rip it off already?
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Nov 30, 2017 23:26
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purple death ray posted:I thought it was implied that Banner had been transported somewhere, via trickery. If strange can send Thor and Loki to Norway I'm sure he wouldn't have trouble getting banner to wakanda
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Nov 30, 2017 23:28
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SleepCousinDeath posted:It's the only example. Yeah it's not like a 70s space opera was made, let alone two, or a weird escher-inspired visual spectacle, or a 80s conspiracy thriller Definitely not as visually varied as Bad Boring Grey Movie, or Bad Boring Grey Movie with Lots of Rain, or Wonder Woman which, while good, is a Pretty Grey Movie All Told, or whatever Justice League looks like (gonna guess it's Bad, Boring, and Grey) or SS, which is admittedly actually super varied with its aesthetic, too bad it loving sucks NieR Occomata fucked around with this message at 23:33 on Nov 30, 2017 |
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Nov 30, 2017 23:29
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purple death ray posted:I thought it was implied that Banner had been transported somewhere, via trickery. Hulk is probably gonna be tossed to the Sanctum Sanctorum via the tesseract before Thanos gets it. I bet Loki sends him there. Then it looks like Banner goes to Wakanda via the Hulkbuster armor. This is probably after or during the NY fight where Thanos beats Strange, Iron Man, and Spidey.
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Nov 30, 2017 23:32
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Hulk will just jump super hard Banner can make the perfect calculations so he lands in Wakanda safely 
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Nov 30, 2017 23:43
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It looks to me like Tony is going to be in Wakanda as well. Well, either it’s him, or a remote-controlled Hulkbuster suit. For all the talk of things Snyder hosed up, I don’t think enough attention is given to just how much he hosed up Lois Lane as well.
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Dec 1, 2017 00:01
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Lois Lane has no reason to be in BvS or Justice League, and the movies suffer trying to give her things to do. gently caress, even Man of Steel feels the need to constantly put her in situations she has no reason to be present for.
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Dec 1, 2017 00:02
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Although I did like how a basic application of journalism led her right to Clark Kent. That was neat.
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Dec 1, 2017 00:07
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Arist posted:
Hey, Zod really needed to take her aboard his ship otherwise.... Umm....
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Dec 1, 2017 00:12
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JT Smiley posted:Hey, Zod really needed to take her aboard his ship otherwise.... Umm.... Well the hologram of Russell Crowe only had two hands, come on
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Dec 1, 2017 00:16
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Arist posted:Lois Lane has no reason to be in BvS or Justice League, and the movies suffer trying to give her things to do. And then render that thing completely moot in the case of Batman v Superman. 
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Dec 1, 2017 00:18
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Man, Jor-el is kind of a dick. He goes through all the time and effort to create a perfect one to one holographic version of himself so it can impart all his knowledge to Clark and didn't even bother making one of his wife.
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Dec 1, 2017 00:21
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You'll think Tony went to Wakanda in the hulkbuster armor, until it gets badly damaged, and the Hulk bursts out of it
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Dec 1, 2017 00:22
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Kelp Plankton posted:You'll think Tony went to Wakanda in the hulkbuster armor, until it gets badly damaged, and the Hulk bursts out of it They did this in the comics and it was awesome.
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Dec 1, 2017 00:23
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Shageletic posted:Watchmen is a bit of a slog tonal wise, without the imaginative use of its medium that was found in the comics but not found (maybe cuz its impossible? though inventive meta takes isn't exactly new to films) in the movie. Its just kinda dark and gray and a little wearying. Still good stuff in it tho, but def not something that I can easily just rewatch. t's been years since I watched Watchmen (heh), but I remember at the time thinking that they really hosed up the tonal throughputs and payoffs for the Dr. Manhattan and Rorschach storylines. The major beats were all there, but they didn't connect together in a satisfying way. Snyder also miffed the ultimate payoff line of the film, which is inexcusable. It's "Do it? ...I did it 35 minutes ago," not "Do it? ...I triggered it 35 minutes ago." It's a tiny thing, but the repetition of "do" makes a big difference to the line's punch. Matthew Goode's delivery didn't do it any favors either.
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Dec 1, 2017 00:31
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Lick! The! Whisk! posted:Yeah it's not like a 70s space opera was made, let alone two, or a weird escher-inspired visual spectacle, or a 80s conspiracy thriller They didn't, those are just regular Marvel movies.
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Dec 1, 2017 00:32
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Arist posted:Lois Lane has no reason to be in BvS or Justice League, and the movies suffer trying to give her things to do. In BvS Lex uses Lois as bait to frame Superman in the Africa sequence, which eventually leads to Lex "framing" Superman again for the bombing. Lois is the one who uncovers this, so I'd argue she was pretty essential for one of the major plot points of the film. I'll agree about her role in Justice League though, but Whedon butchered her part anyways so  At the very least, her investigative prowess and fearlessness in BvS and MoS is a cut above most love interests in these types of films, which is always nice to see. JT Smiley posted:Hey, Zod really needed to take her aboard his ship otherwise.... Umm.... She potentially had information regarding the location of the codex since the film explained she was the only person who knew Superman's identity and that information was made public by that one blogger dude. It makes sense that Zod would want to detain her for questioning if Clark wouldn't give up the information or join him.
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Dec 1, 2017 00:35
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Old Kentucky Shark posted:Snyder also miffed the ultimate payoff line of the film, which is inexcusable. It's "Do it? ...I did it 35 minutes ago," not "Do it? ...I triggered it 35 minutes ago." It's a tiny thing, but the repetition of "do" makes a big difference to the line's punch. Matthew Goode's delivery didn't do it any favors either. I think he's the weakest member of the main cast relative to the importance of his part.
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Dec 1, 2017 00:36
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