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Alright here's some random thoughts I have about everything now that I finished reading it. First, I really like most of the recurring characters, and the fact that they end up not only showing up as a supporting cast, but also end up getting their own fights in the story and advance their characters was something I wasn't expecting when I started watching. I thought it would focus just on Ippo, his gym mates, and the opponent of the week. Like when Vorg left japan I thought "welp we'll never see him again lol" but I was wrong and he turned out to be a really cool character. I hope that the manga continues just a bit longer to tie up some loose ends with all these guys. Except Barfmichi. I'm glad he disappears forever after he lost to Ippo. This probably goes without saying but Takamura vs Hawk is definitely the best fight, easily one of the best shonen arcs I've ever seen, and I basically agree with everything tbp posted about it that I read. One of my favorite recurring themes of the story was the contrast between effort and "talent". Itagaki could be a pretty dumb and obnoxious character, and I would say most of his fights were bad and I rarely cheered for him, but I think the idea of exploring a "gifted" boxer was a good one, to oppose Ippo who is (supposed to be) all about hard work. Then again, Ippo has some natural gifts too, and it's not like any of his hard work includes boxing smarts and skills. Hell, I'd say Ippo has an uncanny talent for training, if that makes sense. But that's fine, because there's a balance to it. Almost every major character has some kind of struggle between their natural talents or skills and the amount of effort they have to put in to get results, and that's a theme I love seeing in a story like this. However, I think this well-intentioned thematic conflict is what led to Wally. Putting aside a lot of the baggage behind his character, he is supposed to be pure instinct, skill, and talent. But there's no subtlety to that, and even though the author probably wanted Wally to represent this idea of a boxer who runs on pure talent, it just ended up being really dumb. At the time when I was reading it, I was able to look past it and try and go along with what I thought Morikawa intended with the character, but in hindsight it's absolutely stupid and indefensible. Now he's out there in the world, and I don't know if it would be more stupid for him to just be forgotten about, or actually come back as the finely tuned boxing machine he was promised to eventually become. When it comes to Ippo's character, and Kamogawa, I can totally understand people's frustrations with them, but it feels slightly less deserved than I think it should be. I dunno, it's hard for me to say what the balance should be between Ippo's straightforward character and boxing style, and making him look like a big idiot running into punches. I don't think there's anything wrong with the idea that Ippo has simple strategies that basically amount to stepping into danger all the time because he's an inboxer. I remember at one point they say that his style goes against modern boxing for the most part, and if it were written better, I think that would be a lot more fun to root for. Also I really liked Kamogawa's backstory and that gave him a lot of leeway for me. The problem is definitely the really high number of pointless matches that Ippo has in the second half of the series. What ought to be something exciting, with Ippo using his fighting spirit and toughness to take a few bad hits, and step in and pressure his opponents up close, ends up looking extremely reckless after you keep seeing it against these assholes that aren't Sendo or Miyata or someone we care about. Worse yet, it makes the coach and Ippo look dumber than they should be. You cut out the number of those same strategy fights, and suddenly they don't seem that bad. All that said, we're on to Ippo now being punch drunk and that seems like it could go a couple ways. Personally, I'd like Ippo to retire at this point, and then cope with the fact that he can't box anymore. It's been said a million times that his character has barely changed, but there's no way he doesn't grow a little bit as a person after this. I don't think this is a bad direction for the story to take per se, but the timing is definitely kind of frustrating, considering how much was built up as this last run being Ippo's last hurrah shot at the world and finally starting to perfect this ULTIMATE DEMPSY ROLL that the story has been teasing for a million chapters. I get that it makes it shocking and tragic, but it also makes it all feel pointless to the reader. Most of it all goes back to "well what was the point of all those stupid gimmick fights". Also stuff like Date's baton pass seem like why bother if this was always going to be the end result? I could go on about more stuff but I'm rambling about things that have already been said. tl;dr i like this manga but it could have been better with most of the Ippo fights in the middle taken out, or at least had more thought put in to them. I think this post made me sound like I disliked it more than I did
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Nov 30, 2017 06:58
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| # ? May 13, 2024 23:18 |
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Ippo will transition to MMA. What year is it in this series again? Maybe Pride can wheel him out to fight a pro wrestler or something.
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Nov 30, 2017 08:50
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[Here lies Ippo. He never scored]
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Nov 30, 2017 09:15
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Plutonis posted:According to /a/ morikawa wrote a haiku threatening the editors on the authors comments lol
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Nov 30, 2017 09:27
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I guess it's just time to place our bets: Is this series going to end badly? Was jungle punch man really the kiss of death for the series? Will Ippo's elephant never again roam free in the light of day???
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Nov 30, 2017 09:49
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Nov 30, 2017 14:38
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that kamogawa didn't stop ippo is basically what will seal that old man's fate
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Nov 30, 2017 14:48
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Nov 30, 2017 14:54
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I genuinely wonder if Takamura won't be angry with the coach to an extent. I get why he was giving Ippo poo poo, since he's known Kamogawa longer and they've a similar bond, but I do wonder if Takamura isn't irritated that the towel wasn't thrown.
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Nov 30, 2017 16:17
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Imagining a parallel universe where the author never started this whole Dempsey Roll bullshit "Uhh Dempshe Rolll"
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Nov 30, 2017 17:50
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Dec 1, 2017 00:35
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 is he a better coach than Kamogawa? 
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Dec 1, 2017 01:54
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I hope the One Piece ending is The Sunny sinking with Raftel in view.
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Dec 1, 2017 03:13
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Blaise330 posted:I hope the One Piece ending is The Sunny sinking with Raftel in view. this actually hurt me to think about
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Dec 1, 2017 03:14
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Patware posted:this actually hurt me to think about its fine half of the crew can carry the other half
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Dec 1, 2017 03:22
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Luffy: Shanks... I just wanted to show you.... *luffy sinks to bottom of ocean, straw hat burns with the ship. Shanks looks on helplessly from a distance.* Hope Oda's health is good. Still better than Bleach ending.
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Dec 1, 2017 03:38
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It's a decently executed piece of drama on the single-fight level, it just clashes badly with the manga as a whole. That's if it's actually the end, but it not being the end would itself be tricky to work at this point. Woli was the worst individual fight, but the manga was structurally in a trough between Ippo taking the national title and the Gonzalez fight, which is most of it and more than an IRL decade. Some good individual parts in that can't salvage so much wasted time.
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Dec 1, 2017 04:00
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the existence of woli meant ippos efforts were always going to be in vain.
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Dec 1, 2017 04:03
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Looking back, it's really downright insane how long this series spent basically going nowhere plot-wise with title defenses.
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Dec 1, 2017 04:06
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Ytlaya posted:Looking back, it's really downright insane how long this series spent basically going nowhere plot-wise with title defenses. I feel like Takamura was actually yelling at Morikawa now in that "WHERE'S MY SUPER-MIDDLEWEIGHT TITLE MATCH?!?!" panel. 
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Dec 1, 2017 04:19
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My real question is: How in the world did Takamura become such an incredible boxer? No one at his gym knows how to properly train a fighter (besides possibly himself) and aside from his own silliness he's incredibly skilled. I am assuming that relatively speaking the major difference between him and Ippo as boxers is technique since everyone at their level are genetic freaks anyway. The fact that almost every other trainer shown from opposing fighters gyms seemed competent makes Takamura's success against boxers of similar strength even more baffling. Are we to assume he's mostly a self taught prodigy that just humors/gets emotional support from Kamogawa?
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Dec 1, 2017 10:38
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Drink Top posted:My real question is: How in the world did Takamura become such an incredible boxer? Are we to assume he's mostly a self taught prodigy that just humors/gets emotional support from Kamogawa? Well...yes. Kamogawa even admits this during the Battle of Hawk. All Takamura has ever really gotten for training was left jabs and footwork.
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Dec 1, 2017 10:55
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Kamogawa can teach good foundational boxing but nothing else, Takamura is a genius for whom those foundations are all he needs to work from himself.
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Dec 1, 2017 11:53
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So......Ippo is dead right? Or brain dead? Man this manga got dark real fuckin fast. I wonder if all that training will have him transition into being discovered to run Sasuke-like obstacle courses, Ninja Warrior. Or he's just dead and dreams die a slow painful death when you block punches with your face. Odds of having coach hang himself in the ring?
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Dec 2, 2017 09:08
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It turns out the past 500+ chapters were all just a nightmare Ippo had the night after beating Sawamura, making Ippo realize he can't block punches with his face anymore and taking steps to become a better boxer
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Dec 2, 2017 21:05
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Jiro posted:So......Ippo is dead right? Or brain dead? At this point its worth keeping in mind there are many, many boxers who have continued boxing even with brain damage and many of them do win matches. What this means is Ippo will be forced to take a tough decision, either give up boxing, or go back in the ring both risking his life in the process and also knowing his chances of winning has been taken a poo poo on. He would have to grow a pair of balls to do that and it would be an extremely questionable decision. OTOH if he gets back in the ring it will be a loving tense match knowing both that he is at a huge disadvantage and also that loss could equal death.
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Dec 2, 2017 21:44
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Like if you look at most boxing stories that aren't Rocky, they deal with boxing being a sport about getting your brain splattered repeatedly in one way or another. Its a large part of what makes it a narratively interesting sport.
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Dec 2, 2017 21:48
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Didn't Ippo promise Kumi that after his next loss he would retire?
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Dec 2, 2017 23:01
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Oh god dammit, I can already see her falling into the same trap as Ippo's mom. Kumi might actually relent on that, and that suckssssss.
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Dec 2, 2017 23:13
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Kamogawa's boxing, or so we're informed by opposing coaches, is orthodox and laser focused on hitting vital points as fast and hard as possible. This works fine for Takamura, who is smarter than Ippo; possesses the pride and killer instinct Ippo lacks; is not obsessed with a super move.
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Dec 2, 2017 23:45
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takamura's super move is punching the other guy really hard until they go down.
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Dec 3, 2017 00:50
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:takamura's super move is punching the other guy really hard until they go down. the pompadour is his super move.
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Dec 3, 2017 01:04
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Huzzah! posted:Didn't Ippo promise Kumi that after his next loss he would retire? I can imagine Ippo quitting, then after some time realizing the only thing he'll ever be any good at is boxing, and coming back to it at that point will require him to change as a character, start putting himself above others, and just in general man the gently caress up and take hard decisions.
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Dec 3, 2017 01:45
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Takamura should get a new coach
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Dec 3, 2017 02:35
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Stairmaster posted:Takamura should get a new coach Takamura doesn't need a coach, he can conquer the world alone.
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Dec 3, 2017 06:17
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takamura can dodge a punch, jab, and isn't a midget
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Dec 3, 2017 06:34
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takamura's punch is dynamite
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Dec 3, 2017 09:05
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Ippo is the natural end result of Kamogawa's training, Takamura was purely an accident
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Dec 3, 2017 17:20
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takamura has a coach rather than a father figure he dedicated his life to pleasing
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Dec 3, 2017 22:13
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I'm gonna start reading some old fights again, started with Ippo vs Mashiba, back when Ippo had some spine on back, Kamogawa wasn't retarded and no Dempsey Roll bullshit  What other fights were the high points of the series, its been such a long time since I read Ippo...
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Dec 4, 2017 04:45
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