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Phanatic posted:Yeah, but "better regulation" is a really facile solution. It's like saying "Just cheer up!" is a solution to clinical depression. The capture occurs because the people who are in charge of creating the regulations are human and thus assholes. If you posit a solution that relies on non-rear end in a top hat human beings being in charge, that's not all that realistic. Don't have to worry about regulatory capture if you just legalize white collar crime thinkymeme.jpg
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Dec 8, 2017 17:35
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My phone knows the truth about bitcoins and auto corrects to buttcoins
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Dec 8, 2017 17:42
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Icemakor posted:[Bitcoin]'s not that hard. Just a bunch of buthurt fomo in this thread. Courtesy of Canadian debt bubble thread, where one normally finds levelheaded financial discussion plus CI's semi-lucid racism when he's not banned lol.
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Dec 8, 2017 19:08
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The current crypto frenzy has me somehow amazed at how many people don't realize you can also make a ton of money without speculative bubbles. The amount of comments from people saying essentially, "You're just jealous you're not rich because of all these crypto gains!" seem completely dumb to the concept that you can be rich without, "all these crypto gains." It's almost like people who do wild speculation aren't aware of the high value of stable investing principles!
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Dec 8, 2017 19:29
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Hoodwinker posted:The current crypto frenzy has me somehow amazed at how many people don't realize you can also make a ton of money without speculative bubbles. The amount of comments from people saying essentially, "You're just jealous you're not rich because of all these crypto gains!" seem completely dumb to the concept that you can be rich without, "all these crypto gains." It's almost like people who do wild speculation aren't aware of the high value of stable investing principles! That's the punchline for most of this. It's a bunch of people with no basis in finance/investing who are "now first day experts" in everything.
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Dec 8, 2017 19:32
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Motronic posted:That's the punchline for most of this. It's a bunch of people with no basis in finance/investing who are "now first day experts" in everything.
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Dec 8, 2017 19:44
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I can't help but think back to all those Reddit threads where someone loses all their family's money on Buttcoins and I sincerely hope they didn't cash out. Like that one guy who was responsible for his disabled sister's inheritance and blew through it all and then balked at the idea he should give her all the money that was left.
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Dec 8, 2017 19:48
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Motronic posted:That's the punchline for most of this. It's a bunch of people with no basis in finance/investing who are "now first day experts" in everything. This happens all the time with engineers and doctors. They automatically know everything about anything they touch because they spent a lot of time getting know something else once. Trying to explain something to an engineer is fun because, from my own personal experience, they keep trying to jump ahead explaining it me even though I'm the one trying to tell them what it is. Sometimes I miss being an FA, but then I remember trying to explain how a LIRP works to an engineer and don't regret changing direction.
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Dec 8, 2017 19:51
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Yeah I admit I really wish I had bought $100 worth of BTC back in 2013 as a laugh, that'd be a nice windfall. But just  at buying in now
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Dec 8, 2017 20:07
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Solice Kirsk posted:This happens all the time with engineers and doctors. They automatically know everything about anything they touch because they spent a lot of time getting know something else once. Trying to explain something to an engineer is fun because, from my own personal experience, they keep trying to jump ahead explaining it me even though I'm the one trying to tell them what it is. Sometimes I miss being an FA, but then I remember trying to explain how a LIRP works to an engineer and don't regret changing direction.
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Dec 8, 2017 20:08
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Nail Rat posted:Yeah I admit I really wish I had bought $100 worth of BTC back in 2013 as a laugh, that'd be a nice windfall. But just I actually disagree, to be honest. If you're willing to lose the money and think the bubble is a bit off then why not jump in now? You don't have to buy a full share or anything.
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Dec 8, 2017 20:10
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Solice Kirsk posted:I actually disagree, to be honest. If you're willing to lose the money and think the bubble is a bit off then why not jump in now? You don't have to buy a full share or anything. I'm waiting for a way to short it. 
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Dec 8, 2017 20:14
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Phanatic posted:I'm waiting for a way to short it.
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Dec 8, 2017 20:21
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Solice Kirsk posted:I actually disagree, to be honest. If you're willing to lose the money and think the bubble is a bit off then why not jump in now? You don't have to buy a full share or anything. I would say that the reasons not to jump in are 1) major trading sites have frequently turned into scams or collapsed, and 2) the whole thing could go to zero at pretty much any time. That said, the extreme volatility is a day trader's paradise. Could still be a fun way to make a windfall, but anything you put in should be assumed lost until you have it in cash again. Also, the bubble is definitely happening right now, it's just a matter of how big it gets. It could go up 100x or collapse to zero and I don't think either would be terribly shocking.
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Dec 8, 2017 20:34
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Hoodwinker posted:Good luck. The big financial institutions for the most part have been very vocal that they aren't going to touch it with a 10 blockchain pole. http://www.businessinsider.com/nasdaq-set-to-launch-bitcoin-futures-2017-11 quote:Nasdaq is hopping on the bitcoin bandwagon.
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Dec 8, 2017 20:48
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What happens when/if the price shits a brick in the meantime? Are they still going to release futures do you think? They do stand to make money off of the volatility even if the price isn't enormous I suppose.
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Dec 8, 2017 20:53
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Phanatic posted:I'm waiting for a way to short it. Good thing you didn't, because it's up 20% in a day, apparently. At least they don't die and decay like tulips? But with its value being propped up entirely by speculation, the fall is going to be spectacular. Probably when a few of the major holders decide to cash out, it will be an amazing spiral that's going to ruin more than a few lives.
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Dec 8, 2017 21:01
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It's a NASDAQ side exchange thing trading in futures priced on a derivative or something. Basically gently poking at it with someone else's 10' pole.
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Dec 8, 2017 21:02
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Hoodwinker posted:What happens when/if the price shits a brick in the meantime? Are they still going to release futures do you think? They do stand to make money off of the volatility even if the price isn't enormous I suppose. The exchanges DGAF about the price of the underlying. If there's enough interest to support enough volume for the derivatives, they can make money. I think the weak point with BTC-F is can they keep calculating a reference rate when one or more of the BTC exchanges blows up.
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Dec 8, 2017 21:27
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Vox Nihili posted:Also, the bubble is definitely happening right now, it's just a matter of how big it gets. It could go up 100x or collapse to zero and I don't think either would be terribly shocking. Nevermind that a lot of bitcoin's price is questionable thanks to exchanges doing fake buy/sells to prop up the price, and exchanges tending to have "technical problems" when a crash is happening, and a million other things.
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Dec 8, 2017 23:12
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Also it's comically slow transaction rate, which means that not only are you trying to time the market, you are trying to do it when you're going to have to give enough time for your orders to actually process. Hope no one else is trying to dump at the same time!
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Dec 8, 2017 23:28
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Somebody post that Etherium crash where a ton of people had sell orders and it completely wrecked Etherium for a night (and probably the person who organized the crash bought up as much as possible at 10% or whatever it was).
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Dec 8, 2017 23:37
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22 Eargesplitten posted:Somebody post that Etherium crash where a ton of people had sell orders and it completely wrecked Etherium for a night (and probably the person who organized the crash bought up as much as possible at 10% or whatever it was). That really was a thing of beauty, and a permanent drop like that is probably gonna be what the bubble burst is actually going to look like. The really funny part is going to be when people think it isn't permanent and dump the money they didn't lose back in and lose that as well.
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Dec 8, 2017 23:43
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I'm sure people buying bitcoin on credit cards is gonna work out swell for subprime sector.
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Dec 9, 2017 00:10
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The more I read y'all's hot takes, the more I'm convinced you guys don't actually know what you're talking about either. Goons have been speculating smugly for years and their predictions seem to have no more basis in reality than the dummies who are investing via borrowed money and waiting for good ol fiat to implode on itself or something At any rate (heh), Bitcoin chat suuuuux KingSlime fucked around with this message at 00:28 on Dec 9, 2017 |
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Dec 9, 2017 00:25
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KingSlime posted:The more I read y'all's hot takes, the more I'm convinced you guys don't actually know what you're talking about either. Goons have been speculating smugly for years and their predictions seem to have no more basis in reality than the dummies who are investing via borrowed money and waiting for good ol fiat to implode on itself or something we had a drat implosion from mtgox and a lot of comedy gold it seems that we'll have another solid implosion from bitfinex
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Dec 9, 2017 00:31
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KingSlime posted:The more I read y'all's hot takes, the more I'm convinced you guys don't actually know what you're talking about either. Goons have been speculating smugly for years and their predictions seem to have no more basis in reality than the dummies who are investing via borrowed money and waiting for good ol fiat to implode on itself or something Yeah, you're right, no one here can predict the future. But go ahead and tell me +2000% in a year is absolutely fine.
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Dec 9, 2017 00:45
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KingSlime posted:The more I read y'all's hot takes, the more I'm convinced you guys don't actually know what you're talking about either. Goons have been speculating smugly for years and their predictions seem to have no more basis in reality than the dummies who are investing via borrowed money and waiting for good ol fiat to implode on itself or something But yes, tell us more about how goons hate bitcoin for no good reason.
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Dec 9, 2017 01:08
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KingSlime posted:The more I read y'all's hot takes, the more I'm convinced you guys don't actually know what you're talking about either. Goons have been speculating smugly for years and their predictions seem to have no more basis in reality than the dummies who are investing via borrowed money and waiting for good ol fiat to implode on itself or something That's cause goons have been laughing at the notion that buttcoin will imminently destroy evil fiat by becoming a stable store of value and other things and stuff that you know, a currency, actually does. No one is surprised that the lolbertarian dumbass version of the 17th century Dutch tulip is gyrating wildly in value while generating constant scams and hilarious drama.
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Dec 9, 2017 01:10
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Dogcow posted:That's cause goons have been laughing at the notion that buttcoin will imminently destroy evil fiat by becoming a stable store of value and other things and stuff that you know, a currency, actually does. No one is surprised that the lolbertarian dumbass version of the 17th century Dutch tulip is gyrating wildly in value while generating constant scams and hilarious drama. I don’t think that reflects the historical record. There was a long history of making fun of r/bitcoin denizens who were holding out for BITCOIN 1000. I’m not current on the threads, but I don’t recall anyone saying “sure, it might make it to $15K, but it’ll be volatile”. Indeed the predictions were that every dip was the end of the line. I participated in both those pastimes, I’ll freely admit; I looked for a way to short BTC in 2015. I remain a cryptocurrency skeptic, and I think that BTC has structural issues (some of which, like proof-of-work confirmation, have promising research in other token systems), but the SA/YOSPOS reasoning hasn’t proved to be a good predictor of the value of speculating on BTC (or, less so, ETH). The bears don’t seem to have a better predictive model than the bulls do, from what I’ve seen.
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Dec 9, 2017 01:21
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YOSPOS was also predicting (still is predicting?) a dot com bubble bursting for years that hasn't come around. There does appear to have been a slight deflation though.
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Dec 9, 2017 01:39
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I hope quantum computers come along suddenly and without warning. Then a bad actor could, theoretically, derive secrets from public information and make bitcoin (et al) very sad.
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Dec 9, 2017 02:02
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H110Hawk posted:I hope quantum computers come along suddenly and without warning. Then a bad actor could, theoretically, derive secrets from public information and make bitcoin (et al) very sad. Does quantum pose a risk to current blockchain architectures? I can’t keep track of which algorithms suit which quantum strategies these days.
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Dec 9, 2017 02:36
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Everyone loves to try to call the bear. At some point, they’ll be right, but will never acknowledge the value lost in the years they were calling it while the market was still bull.
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Dec 9, 2017 03:33
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Cicero posted:YOSPOS was also predicting (still is predicting?) a dot com bubble bursting for years that hasn't come around. There does appear to have been a slight deflation though. It's coming. Not as hard hitting as the 2000's, but VC funding is starting to dry up. You can only fund so many $500 DRM-locked squeeze bag juicers before investors become skeptical. That and Silicon Valley is starting to feed on itself. 'Our new app is like BuzzFeed, but for Twitter!'
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Dec 9, 2017 04:07
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Subjunctive posted:Does quantum pose a risk to current blockchain architectures? I can’t keep track of which algorithms suit which quantum strategies these days. According to the internet bitcoin wallets are ecdsa key pairs. Those are 100% vulnerable to quantum attacks using Shor's algorithm allowing you to factor the private key from the public key. This is not feasible until general purpose quantum computing is available. Signature algorithms (in this case hashes from sha-256 and scrypt) are another question which I do not know the answer. The first allows you to generate a transaction request, which the network will then blindly approve because that's what bitcoin (etc) do for transactions. It does not allow you to forge (replace, change, whatever) entries in the blockchain itself.
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Dec 9, 2017 05:04
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largest factored number is 56153, on a quantum dealio that's gonna need to get to something more like 2^20 before we can start talking about shor poo poo
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Dec 9, 2017 05:13
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replied to wrong post
The Butcher fucked around with this message at 23:33 on Dec 11, 2017 |
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Dec 9, 2017 06:29
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Jake Mustache posted:Nicehash.com, something to do with crypto , just got hacked and lost $66m worth of users bitcoins. Whoops. But they will work on regaining customer trust in the upcoming days. I lost roughly $60 in coins and $10 in power  Please do not buy bitcoin directly, when the downswing comes it will be hot and heavy.
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Dec 9, 2017 07:34
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BigDave posted:It's coming. Not as hard hitting as the 2000's, but VC funding is starting to dry up. You can only fund so many $500 DRM-locked squeeze bag juicers before investors become skeptical.
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Dec 9, 2017 14:14
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