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A collection of headlines from a single day: Danish People's Party's demand for budget: No school for refugee children and abolish their Danish lessons Danish People's Party want to deny special refugee group (Syrians) family reunification Løkke announces significant revisions of immigration policy Støjberg open to sending rejected asylum seekers to deserted islands (Note that Syrians already have to wait three years to get reunification, at their own expense, and that we literally rob them at gunpoint when they request asylum. The rejected include violently persecuted Afghan minorities and nationals of countries with active civil wars, torture states, war zones that we're actively bombing, etc.)
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Dec 8, 2017 18:15
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I just moved here to København in August from Toronto and my gradual acquisition of Danish is leading to a growing awareness and horror of the political situation here. Look, Canada is a racist society, but we have a layer of shame and self-delusion that seems to require a degree of at least pretending that were not actual poo poo. We don't jump up and down and gleefully admit it in speeches...
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Dec 8, 2017 22:56
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Rust Martialis posted:I just moved here to København in August from Toronto and my gradual acquisition of Danish is leading to a growing awareness and horror of the political situation here. B... b... but our bikes and our city spires and our "hygge"...
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Dec 9, 2017 08:39
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SplitSoul posted:A collection of headlines from a single day: The desserted island part especially stuck out to me. I wonder from what country she got that walking human rights abuse policy idea from. 
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Dec 9, 2017 08:43
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Whenever I feel bad about current Swedish politics, I just need to look over Kattegat and suddenly I realize things could always get so much worse. Sometime ago a Swedish politician made a point of calling Muslims “not complete humans”, in front of his party leadership (they’re all racists so they didn’t care in the moment it seems). At least that caused such a poo poo storm that he was ousted from SD (while Åkesson in his usual puppy-eye-stance feigned ignorance of this thing called racism in his nationalist-isolationist party). But sending people to a deserted island? That’s like absurdly horrific. I feel we should stop that sort of thing I’m general (looking at you, Australia) and maybe not encourage it further. It’s only a matter of time before people will seriously argue that Hitler was mistreated when his Madagascar thing fell apart...
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Dec 9, 2017 13:57
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At that same SD conference front-runner Paula Bieler was confronted about an actual policy suggestion that immigrants should be forced to renounce their other citizenship's in order to be eligible for Swedish citizenships. When asked how this would work in conjunction with SD's policy proposals to expel immigrants who commit any crime she casually suggested that the law should allow for revoking Swedish citizenships (even if that renders the individual stateless) and that under those circumstances the state should be able to lock up the individual indefinitely under conditions which she described as: "A bare minimum standard which guarantees the most basic human rights, no ones should suffer torture or death, but basically nothing else." There was no consequence for this. In summary, I don't think you guys are that far ahead of us in our never-ending plunge to the abyss. 
MiddleOne fucked around with this message at 14:18 on Dec 9, 2017 |
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Dec 9, 2017 14:16
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Well SD has no real place of power just yet, and the latest polls don’t look too good for them. On the other hand, Moderaterna seems to embrace the whole “Syrians aren’t real people” mentality on their own, so who knows what happens in 2018.
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Dec 9, 2017 14:28
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SD would be in government right now if C & V didn't make forming a majority coalition with them impossible.
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Dec 9, 2017 14:36
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MiddleOne posted:At that same SD conference front-runner Paula Bieler was confronted about an actual policy suggestion that immigrants should be forced to renounce their other citizenship's in order to be eligible for Swedish citizenships. When asked how this would work in conjunction with SD's policy proposals to expel immigrants who commit any crime she casually suggested that the law should allow for revoking Swedish citizenships (even if that renders the individual stateless) and that under those circumstances the state should be able to lock up the individual indefinitely under conditions which she described as: I wonder how that is going to affect all native Swedes with dual citizenships, which basically is half my family. Her point is basically that people who come here under false pretenses like lying about age ( see “underage” afghans), origin ( see Iranian Afghans) or lost passports ( because better chance of asylum) should have to face the consequences of lying. Having a society where it is ok to lie is not the way we should go.
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Dec 9, 2017 14:45
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Internment camp until death is uh, quite the punishment. 
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Dec 9, 2017 14:47
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Cardiac posted:I wonder how that is going to affect all native Swedes with dual citizenships, which basically is half my family. Her point is that she don't want no swarthy people around, hth. Also when you're tryng to whiteknight the fash, you should try to invent an excuse that isn't also completely monstrous.
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Dec 9, 2017 15:45
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MiddleOne posted:Internment camp until death is uh, quite the punishment. It's for the most heinous of all crimes: lying while being non-white.
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Dec 9, 2017 17:06
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Konec Hry posted:It's for the most heinous of all crimes: being non-white.
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Dec 9, 2017 20:41
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On the topic of Afghans, the "deal" that S made with the greens is a total joke, won't change a thing really. Not that it would stop the greens from kicking up a mess and blow all of their political capital on a complete non issue a year before the election, with no chances of getting anything close to what they want through parliament. I wouldn't even throw a welfare vote on the greens at this point even if it cost us (S) a government. I cannot state how much I loving hate those guys. Göran Persson summed them up perfectly: "they are focused on scoring cheap points through pubescent throphy politics" And on a related topic, I've yet to see a single person critizising the way medicinal age exams are conducted by the board of forensic medecine propose an alternative method that is also medicinal. Besides it ain't news that SD's care for Sweden stops right at the border, it won't go further inland. They'd sell their whole base out for a cabinet position from M at this point. Postorder Trollet89 fucked around with this message at 21:10 on Dec 9, 2017 |
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Dec 9, 2017 20:46
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There is no alternative method suggested for two reasons: 1. No matter how much you wish it there currently is no such thing as an empirically sound method to determine age, of any kind 2. Most of us on the pro "don't send afghans off to a failed state in veritable civil war" don't see government agencies min-maxing who gets to enjoy youth privileges on differences that sometimes in actual MigV decisions are measured in weeks as ethically or morally justifiable These decisions are always going to be arbitrary under current technological restrictions. Some 20-somethings simply look young just as teenagers can look like adults. What we are arguing is that the government is over-reaching by pretending that just because there is a 'method' (garbage as it is) the state no longer has to rule in the favor of the asylum seeker who happen to reside in these edge cases.
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Dec 9, 2017 22:04
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MiddleOne posted:The desserted island part especially stuck out to me. I wonder from what country she got that walking human rights abuse policy idea from. Støjberg probably got the idea from the former Social Democratic Social Affairs Minister turned Liberal Welfare Minister turned state-funded neo-fascist hate blogger, Karen Jespersen. Evidently she reads her blog. Also, Karen Jespersen was still Social Affairs Minister when she proposed the deserted islands in 2001. The other thing she's known for is ensuring that homeless foreigners freeze to death.
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Dec 9, 2017 23:21
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How many deserted islands are even available? Are they planning on dumping them on Greenland and then claim it was their own fault for choosing to starve and freeze to death?
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Dec 10, 2017 00:16
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Poil posted:How many deserted islands are even available? Are they planning on dumping them on Greenland and then claim it was their own fault for choosing to starve and freeze to death? Just use Bornholm.
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Dec 10, 2017 00:31
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No don't it's the home of the only intelligible Danes
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Dec 10, 2017 00:36
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Apparently a synagogue was torched in Gothenburg?
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Dec 10, 2017 06:19
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Samovar posted:Apparently a synagogue was torched in Gothenburg? https://www.expressen.se/gt/brinnande-foremal-har-kastats-mot-synagoga-polisen-pa-plats-med-flera-patruller/ Ungdomar fast i lokalen På lördagskvällen hade en grupp judiska ungdomar en fest i synagogan. GT har talat med en mamma vars dotter befann sig i byggnaden. – Jag fick ett sms av henne för 20-30 minuter sedan. Hon skrev att ”mamma jag börjar bli rädd”, och att det är 20 maskerade män som kastar brinnande föremål. Its about time that Sweden deal with their Nazi problem. When Nazi scum throw molotov cocktails at children, you stop having a dialogue with them and lock them up behind bars. "Vi vill ha vår frihet tillbaka, och vi ska skjuta judarna", sades det bland annat, rapporterade Sveriges Radio Malmöhus." Shame!
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Dec 10, 2017 06:37
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Dec 10, 2017 08:24
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Poil posted:How many deserted islands are even available? Are they planning on dumping them on Greenland and then claim it was their own fault for choosing to starve and freeze to death?
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Dec 10, 2017 08:43
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So the plot of Johnny English....?
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Dec 10, 2017 08:45
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We could leverage the famous Nordic cooperation and convert Ahvenanmaa into a foreigner containment zone.
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Dec 10, 2017 11:15
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Beeswax posted:No don't it's the home of the only intelligible Danes GF quote: "Stupid Swedes."
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Dec 10, 2017 11:33
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Rust Martialis posted:GF quote: "Stupid Swedes." Good call to translate it to English so we could understand
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Dec 10, 2017 11:48
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throw to first drat IT posted:We could leverage the famous Nordic cooperation and convert Ahvenanmaa into a foreigner containment zone. What do you mean convert?
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Dec 10, 2017 14:05
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MiddleOne posted:
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Dec 11, 2017 16:22
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SplitSoul posted:Støjberg probably got the idea from the former Social Democratic Social Affairs Minister turned Liberal Welfare Minister turned state-funded neo-fascist hate blogger, Karen Jespersen. Evidently she reads her blog. Also, Karen Jespersen was still Social Affairs Minister when she proposed the deserted islands in 2001. The other thing she's known for is ensuring that homeless foreigners freeze to death. And to think that both Jespersen and hubby were venstresocialister in their youth.
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Dec 11, 2017 16:40
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widunder posted:The latest hilarious development in this saga are the law firms who have sent the results from Rättsmedicinalverket off for second opinions from independent medical experts, who have deemed RMV:s results to be incorrect. The big twist being that the independent medical experts are the authors of the papers that RMW based their testing methods on It's not like this was unknown. These methods stopped being used over a decade ago because they suck but apparently that was less important than Social Democratic ministers being able to self-rationalize sleeping soundly at night as they sold tens of thousands of young refugees down the river.
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Dec 12, 2017 00:22
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MiddleOne posted:It's not like this was unknown. These methods stopped being used over a decade ago because they suck but apparently that was less important than Social Democratic ministers being able to self-rationalize sleeping soundly at night as they sold tens of thousands of young refugees down the river. "Sorry, but they have to go "home" because science!" is a very convenient message compared to "we fear that you voters will leave us for SD because there are too many browns here". I doubt it will help and it's cowardly and disingenuous and disgusting, but he we are. Soon it's election year, dehumanize and face to bloodshed.
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Dec 12, 2017 07:21
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Lima posted:And to think that both Jespersen and hubby were venstresocialister in their youth. So was Søren Espersen. Although, to be fair, he was also on the DNSB mailing list, and now he's married to a Jew and IIRC has a son living in an Israeli settlement. Life's strange that way.
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Dec 12, 2017 07:23
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MiddleOne posted:It's not like this was unknown. These methods stopped being used over a decade ago because they suck but apparently that was less important than Social Democratic ministers being able to self-rationalize sleeping soundly at night as they sold tens of thousands of young refugees down the river. And yet UEFA does age-testing to determine whether football players are of the correct age. Why it was sent to RMW has to do with some obvious bias among doctors, see Henry Asher as the go-to example. Young economic immigrants (there is no war in Iran), as in a group that (for very good reasons) was sent towards Sweden as a place for seeking asylum. If you look at the distribution of underage asylum seekers to the EU, a majority of the total went to Sweden. Both Norway and Denmark have done age testing for far longer than we and the statistics from those are similar to what we see in Sweden now. There is also the issue that in the age 17-20 the ratio of female/males have been heavily skewed towards males, since something like 90-95% of the Afghans/Iranian asylum seekers are men. Where are all the females? The current cost for the asylum process for the Afghanians are on the order of Aghanistans budget, for a fraction of the people. Or to put it like this, I don't mind immigration but it should be for the right reasons otherwise you undermine the system. People in actual need should be offered asylum and brought here. Immigrants who come here to work should be welcomed with open arms. But that is not what we do. We offer asylum to those people who gets smuggled through Europe and who passes something like 10-15 safe countries on their way here because due to Dublin convention. These are predominantly young men who throw away their passports, lie about their age and who were sent here by their families in hope of a better economic future, where the families have in many cases borrowed money to do this. And then they get their hopes up about the recent S-MP deal (which btw punished all those who were honest about their age and were deported), but this deal will probably die after next election. Especially since MP are likely hosed in next election (see last weeks SCB and especially the numbers for Stockholm), which kills the current coalition. Well, it was dead anyway (the MP-S deal was just the last gasp to get the budget across) since there will be a vote in Riksdagen for whom will be sitting statsminister and since there will be no red-green majority, S are hosed. A middle coalition is hosed, since all the political commentators (except VBK) fail to realise how far S and Lib/C are from each other in actual politics. The likely outcome of next years election is a weak Alliansen coalition with support from SD (comedy option S + SD), where Lib&C will swallow their ideals for actual power. M have recovered enough by changing party leader without changing AKBs politics and by showing that one can recover votes from SD. This was one thing apparent from last weeks SCB, where the only actual voters in play for S&M were the SD voters, all other shifts were within each political faction. Which just shows that next years election will be a race to the bottom for SDs voters (and where S hilariously shot themselves in the foot with the S-MP deal).
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Dec 12, 2017 08:39
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Cardiac posted:These are predominantly young men who throw away their passports, lie about their age and who were sent here by their families in hope of a better economic future, where the families have in many cases borrowed money to do this. As far as age goes, assuming the asylum seekers systematically lie about their age assumes that you believe in the testing methods employed by the RMV which, in light of the last six months, appears to be a pretty goddamn untenable position. Moreover, it always strikes me as peculiar to assume that the brunt of unattended underage asylum seekers that came from Afghanistan in late 2015 all had some sort of sixth sense enabling them to correctly guess that it would take Migrationsverket two years to process their application for asylum and falsely stating their age to be 15 so that they would be as old as possible at the time of the decision yet still underage. As far as legal precedent goes, the highest court of migration stated in March that underage persons without local knowledge of Afghanistan and most importantly, without a social network there run such risks that they are considered to be in the need of alternative protection. The court just last week gave a review permit to a case where the first tier court had considered a young-yet-of-adult-age person to be in the same protection. If (and it's admittedly a pretty big if) that court upholds the decision that it would essentially render the medical examinations pretty much useless for most Afghan youths applying for asylum, or who have had their applications denied awaiting deportation.
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Dec 12, 2017 15:25
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Cardiac posted:And yet UEFA does age-testing to determine whether football players are of the correct age.
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Dec 12, 2017 15:35
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widunder posted:Bla bla and so on This is supposed to be a fun website so here is a fun picture of the midget Swedish prime minster with a bunch of immigrant children; https://ibb.co/kijxLG Edit; imgur kinda hosed up so I had to get another host. Still funny though. Heinz Hynkel fucked around with this message at 16:14 on Dec 12, 2017 |
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Dec 12, 2017 16:03
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It seems odd to me that S is supporting raising the retirement age, or is this just more shifting to the right that I lived through with Democrats in America.
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Dec 14, 2017 11:44
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Dirk Pitt posted:It seems odd to me that S is supporting raising the retirement age, or is this just more shifting to the right that I lived through with Democrats in America. The Democrats are basically the party that the S elite wished it could be.
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Dec 14, 2017 11:50
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Are you honestly going to sit here and pretend that Afghan refugees do not have legitimate reasons to claim asylum under the European Convention on Human Rights? I mean I'm sure you could get away with that argument on a family dinner but most of us here have google and are acutely aware of just how much the security situation in Afghanistan has deteriorated over the last few years. sensy v2.0 posted:Sounds like a reasonable scientific standard. If only we could rise all government institutions to the perfection of the UEFA. We can only dream to one day reach the impeccable judicial standards set by the UEFA MiddleOne fucked around with this message at 11:58 on Dec 14, 2017 |
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Dec 14, 2017 11:55
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