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jng2058 posted:I don't see that you have to retcon them, per say. If Caul can give us new Primaris marines, why can't he also give us new female Space Marines? If your problem is that you don't have enough Marines, wouldn't it make sense to make available the other 50% of the human race as candidates? dis
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Dec 15, 2017 01:46
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Artum posted:I still vote for lady custodes in the hope that the technicality of ladies stronger than marines causes a bunch of people to literally explode with anger. They're super secretive and better than Marines in every way so I love it.
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Dec 15, 2017 01:50
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jng2058 posted:I don't see that you have to retcon them, per say. If Caul can give us new Primaris marines, why can't he also give us new female Space Marines? If your problem is that you don't have enough Marines, wouldn't it make sense to make available the other 50% of the human race as candidates? I'm fine with new fluff. The female Stormcast Eternal model is a perfect example of them doing things really well. I think it would be cooler to have Primaris Sisters personally (imagine the rage of Primaris Sisters of Silence annihilating psyker spam).
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Dec 15, 2017 01:57
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Shockeh posted:It never ceases to amaze me (especially with the outsider perspective) that one of the best places to read 40k and not encounter alt-reich horrible fuckwittery is Something Awful Dot Com. All the way back to the original What is Ultramarine? thread one of the best things about this community is that, almost exclusively through self-policing, we have never put up with that poo poo for a second. Racist or sexist ham nonsense always gets stepped on. Beer4TheBeerGod posted:I would rather not see GW retcon Space Marines to include women. Maybe that puts me on the wrong side of things, but I feel like there are plenty of ways to incorporate women in the hobby without resorting to changing the fluff. For example adding female models to other ranges like Astra Militarum, Adeptus Mechanicus, and Psykers would be great (especially if they were part of the core Guard sprue). Eliminating some of the more sexualized elements like bullet catcher boob plates and high heel power armor boots would also be viable, although given how stylized and extreme the rest of 40K is I can understand keeping it. And finally revitalizing the Sisters of Battle so that the line is much more accessible would be great. I entirely agree. Equality doesn't require uniformity. I've said before, as you have, that making SoB viable and cool is the best way to deal with the power armour sausagefest. I think that retconning in female marines/Custodes would be tokenism, and a disservice to the SoB faction. The Eclesiarchy trying to make their own knock-off post-human army would be a goldmine for intrigue and drama. To be honest I find the most ardent supporters of female marines to be just as unsettling as the other unsavoury stereotype hams. Maybe I'm being unfair by not really trusting their motives, but once you look into the abyss of Doc thunder you can't go back. Lovely Joe Stalin fucked around with this message at 02:00 on Dec 15, 2017 |
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Dec 15, 2017 01:58
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:They're super secretive and better than Marines in every way so I love it. I wanna try this and I have a bunch of custodians bits on my workbench- what's a good place for 28mm heroic female heads? The Victoria miniatures offerings are a little small. E; I'm thinking I want to go with an older, more matriarchal look. Judi Dench or Carrie Fisher maybe? The statuesque offerings are a little too pulp. Immanentized fucked around with this message at 02:01 on Dec 15, 2017 |
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Dec 15, 2017 01:59
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I really can't comprehend why fat nerds are opposed to games companies trying to make their products more attractive to a wider audience, especially women. Can they really not make the connection that this is ultimately going to lead them to interacting with women on a more frequent basis? e: also on female space marine discussion, I don't see why they couldn't just introduce them in to existing armies through through experimental developments in "genetics" or some kind of deus ex machina to do with the warp or some poo poo idk Entropy238 fucked around with this message at 02:13 on Dec 15, 2017 |
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Dec 15, 2017 02:08
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Entropy238 posted:I really can't comprehend why fat nerds are opposed to games companies trying to make their products more attractive to a wider audience, especially women. Can they really not make the connection that this is ultimately going to lead them to interacting with women on a more frequent basis? They seem to actively loathe that prospect since that lovely mspaint thing about how a hobby becomes mainstream always gets passed about and sad wankers come out of the woodwork saying it's true.
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Dec 15, 2017 02:11
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Immanentized posted:I wanna try this and I have a bunch of custodians bits on my workbench- what's a good place for 28mm heroic female heads? The Victoria miniatures offerings are a little small. Try the bionic Statuesque heads, they're generally a little bit more gnarly.
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Dec 15, 2017 02:12
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Tldr being girls only get into thing to get attention from guys instead of because they like the loving game. They're everywhere, lurking in the shadows, these females who took up magic the gathering solely to get hit on.
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Dec 15, 2017 02:14
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Lovely Joe Stalin posted:To be honest I find the most ardent supporters of female marines to be just as unsettling as the other unsavoury stereotype hams. Maybe I'm being unfair by not really trusting their motives, but once you look into the abyss of Doc thunder you can't go back. forums user rapey joe stalin is doesnt trust the motives of men who really want more women in their game? thats some hella projection right there.
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Dec 15, 2017 02:17
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MasterSlowPoke posted:The dude who got banned ran a Facebook Magic the Gathering hate speech page, which where they would run drafts of which female MTG players they'd want to gently caress. Right before this, a guy who made a YouTube career out of harassing Magic personalities (especially women) got banned when a cosplayer quit the scene because of him and a bunch of other victims decided to speak out. Predictably, he decided to play the victim for having his "free speech" violated. Wizards of the Coast is extremely on the inclusivity train and it's not going over well with the alt-right dirtbags.
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Dec 15, 2017 02:18
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Immanentized posted:I wanna try this and I have a bunch of custodians bits on my workbench- what's a good place for 28mm heroic female heads? The Victoria miniatures offerings are a little small. Neave Blacktalon has an alternative head and is a female Stormcast Eternal; that might be an option. Only problem is that you'd have to buy the whole model, although if you have the bits I suspect the model itself would make for an interesting Custodian base. Not sure how Statuesque Miniatures stacks up.
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Dec 15, 2017 02:23
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I will forever cherish the tears from Alesha, Who Smiles At Death. I won't be truly complete until GW pulls something like that.
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Dec 15, 2017 02:23
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I never played Magic and I have no idea what that is
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Dec 15, 2017 02:24
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BIG MEATY SHITS posted:forums user rapey joe stalin is doesnt trust the motives of men who really want more women in their game? thats some hella projection right there. 
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Dec 15, 2017 02:25
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goose willis posted:I never played Magic and I have no idea what that is Alesha, Who Smiles at Death, is the first trans character in MTG.
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Dec 15, 2017 02:30
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SteelMentor posted:I will forever cherish the tears from Alesha, Who Smiles At Death. I won't be truly complete until GW pulls something like that. I could go for a lady taking up creeds job now that he's a museum exhibit. Watchers of the throne was pretty good for that with the high Lords for the Imperial navy and the arbites among others being women and not in a token way.
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Dec 15, 2017 02:33
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Yeah, nobody here has put up with racism or advocated prosecuting child trafficking victims for prostitution God indeed made my political enemies ridiculous, but this motherfucker was an animal the vet should have put down. I don't buy that female space marines would be a disservice to Sisters--the Sisters themselves have this sort of Bayonetta-style ownership of sexuality, having aggressively weaponized it. They literally began as a fascist dictator's harem and were converted to Murder Nuns Who Hunt and Euthanize Superhuman Warrior Monks, the ultimate expression of human guardianship. There could be a brilliant counterplay between Adepta Sororitas and the (new?) female Marines whom they always view with suspicion--like, why couldn't that lady Space Wolf have kept her perfect human form? Why serve the Emperor as a mutant? Artum posted:Tldr being girls only get into thing to get attention from guys instead of because they like the loving game. JFC, this was always the weirdest manifestation of grognard butthurt.  "THEY'RE DOING IT FOR ATTENTION! THEY JUST CAN'T GET ENOUGH NERD DICK! TEMPTING ME WITH THEIR SEXY, SEXY...EXISTENCE!" It's every bit as cringey as loving Islamist and pseudoMormon cult misogyny, expecting women in a public space to apologize for not being male, I guess? I had just enough chemical imbalance to have thought like this when I was an edgy teenager, but after both weeks of that phase, immediately questioned why anyone else couldn't pull themselves out of such a deep hole of retardation. It'd be way less scummy of them to just admit "I'm scared of women in my hobby for no good reason."
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Dec 15, 2017 02:33
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BJPaskoff posted:Right before this, a guy who made a YouTube career out of harassing Magic personalities (especially women) got banned when a cosplayer quit the scene because of him and a bunch of other victims decided to speak out. Predictably, he decided to play the victim for having his "free speech" violated. Isn't this the same MTG guy
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Dec 15, 2017 02:38
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It’s like an old friend really
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Dec 15, 2017 02:41
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muggins posted:Isn't this the same MTG guy Honestly who can keep track at this point with the sudden vomit of MtG creeps getting shamed.
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Dec 15, 2017 02:43
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Strobe posted:Alesha, Who Smiles at Death, is the first trans character in MTG. I looked up the card and I'm not seeing anything suggesting that but regardless that's a great move and I'm sure that a lot of terrible internet people are upset about it
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Dec 15, 2017 02:44
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Artum posted:I could go for a lady taking up creeds job now that he's a museum exhibit. Watchers of the throne was pretty good for that with the high Lords for the Imperial navy and the arbites among others being women and not in a token way. Inquisitor Weynand in the Beast Arises books was both female and characterized as a lesbian, but neither quality ever took precedence over her role in the story as one of the two Inquisitorial reps to the High Lords. I always liked her scenes on Terra, conspiring with Vangoritch and dodging assassination attempts, or out in the galaxy conducting or consulting operations against the orks.
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Dec 15, 2017 03:03
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goose willis posted:I looked up the card and I'm not seeing anything suggesting that but regardless that's a great move and I'm sure that a lot of terrible internet people are upset about it That's kind of the point (and also not, at the same time). All of the relevant information is in the stories Wizards puts out with fair frequency. Nerds just had a loving meltdown over it because they're awful people who can't handle adversity presented in the form of fictional characters not being literal manifestations of their worldview.
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Dec 15, 2017 03:11
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:Neave Blacktalon has an alternative head and is a female Stormcast Eternal; that might be an option. Only problem is that you'd have to buy the whole model, although if you have the bits I suspect the model itself would make for an interesting Custodian base. Not sure how Statuesque Miniatures stacks up. I recently bought some of these for a smattering of female guard and a headswap for Angharad Brightshield in Shadespire. The 2 different sprues of hatless heads look fine to me, as do the veteran and beret sprues. The bionic ones look closer to Necromunda though. The heroic scale (regular) ones are just a touch smaller than helmet-less space marines, and the casting quality is really nice. Almost no cleaning up needed and they primed up fine. Shipping was like 10 days UK -> eastern USA. Legendary Ptarmigan fucked around with this message at 03:17 on Dec 15, 2017 |
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Dec 15, 2017 03:15
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:Neave Blacktalon has an alternative head and is a female Stormcast Eternal; that might be an option. Only problem is that you'd have to buy the whole model, although if you have the bits I suspect the model itself would make for an interesting Custodian base. Not sure how Statuesque Miniatures stacks up. I have heard that their heroic scale heads are pretty good and seen some kitbashes with them alongside Dreamforge models to make bulkier Sisters of Battle. efb sorta.
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Dec 15, 2017 03:17
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I'd argue the Fine scale heads suit non-Marines better, Heroic scale feel a little bobble-headish on Guard sized models.
SteelMentor fucked around with this message at 03:42 on Dec 15, 2017 |
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Dec 15, 2017 03:36
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I got a bunch of female Arcadian Guard heads from https://victoriaminiatures.com/ and cannot say enough good things about them. They fit it nicely and worked perfectly with my Cadian army. She a bunch of great styles to pick from as well. Also, I've been thinking about this topic for a bit lately. I'm doing a small Death Watch army to ally with my guard and I recently decided to get some of the Statuesque heads to scatter among the marines as I build them out. A friend of mine wanted to get his daughter into the hobby because she really liked painting the miniatures with her dad, but never could settle on an army she wanted. She is a little girl but still said she "could not find any that looked like her." Now, she is all Disney Princesses etc etc at the moment so she looks for stuff to identify with but the statement really made an impact with him and me once I heard the story. After that, he decided to mix in female heads so she could play Dark Angels with him. I was struck with the same idea for my Death Watch (but not my Death Guard cause they self identity as various diseases and maladies and no longer any genders). I understand and respect the point that Sisters of Battle should be more badass and prevalent in the game as a way to draw in a more diverse player base. At the same time, I don't like putting women in a "silo" so to speak. "If you want to play Marines and have women be the center, you must play Sisters with little other options. Hope you like the aesthetic!" It feels so restrictive and gives you so little options to branch out. Edit: There are good options in other factions from Guard to Xenos, but marine-centric style is pretty much Sisters of Battle and nothing else. I decided to do 50/50 male to female heads on any Death Watch marine that would not have a helmet on. I'd say in my universe, the Space Marines chapters are more equivalent as far as genders go. Who cares when they are jampacked with extra organs, genetic manipulations, and clad in powered armor. If anyone asks why or has an issue with it, I will just shrug and say that I like my universe better this way. If they are a dick about it, I just won't play them. gently caress 'em. I don't have time for that lovely white noise in my life. Its just a game. Crazy Ferret fucked around with this message at 04:02 on Dec 15, 2017 |
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Dec 15, 2017 03:58
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SteelMentor posted:Youtube keeps on recommending me Arch Warhammer videos despite me telling it to stop doing that poo poo. Beyond him just being eyerollingly unfunny and even more desperately Wrong About Hams than Goose is, he's very buddy buddy with actual Nazi Sargon of Akkad and that Unsleeved Media creep who just got lifetime banned by Wizards. I think the point where I realized Arch had some real issues was when he tossed out a racial slur to describe a group in Warhammer fantasy, right after calling gnoblars jewlike.
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Dec 15, 2017 04:20
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Yeah if your target is a little girl then it's definitely a challenge. Maybe Eldar since they're rather androgynous but if you want to play something like Marines (which also happen to be the most accessible and forgiving army on account of how tough they are) then it's really difficult. I suspect I'll have the same challenge in a few years if my daughter ever decides she likes to play with Daddy's toys. On the other hand maybe I'll raise her right and she'll play Orks.
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Dec 15, 2017 04:25
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Lovely Joe Stalin posted:To be honest I find the most ardent supporters of female marines to be just as unsettling as the other unsavoury stereotype hams. Maybe I'm being unfair by not really trusting their motives, but once you look into the abyss of Doc thunder you can't go back. Let's be real it is unfair to compare these two groups even though doc thunder is funny as hell
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Dec 15, 2017 04:25
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:Yeah if your target is a little girl then it's definitely a challenge. Maybe Eldar since they're rather androgynous but if you want to play something like Marines (which also happen to be the most accessible and forgiving army on account of how tough they are) then it's really difficult. I suspect I'll have the same challenge in a few years if my daughter ever decides she likes to play with Daddy's toys. Anecdotal, but tyranids are really popular among the women 40k fans I know.
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Dec 15, 2017 04:41
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Soulfucker posted:Let's be real it is unfair to compare these two groups even though doc thunder is funny as hell I agree, and I was saying it largely tongue-in-cheek. Though I do think there is a distinction to be drawn between people who want better, well thought out, representation across the range of products as a whole, and some of those who only ever seem to talk about women marines. Either because they want titmarines or they can't see beyond the most hamfisted and tokenistic solution.
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Dec 15, 2017 04:42
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:On the other hand maybe I'll raise her right and she'll play Orks. Word. I get this is a specific example but for whatever reason, it really resonated with me. I decided after hearing the story I'd just adjust my Death Watch and not care about whatever noise I'd get from randos since I tend to play a very specific group of folks. Also, I totally get that I'm a gay socialist in Texas so I'm already a bit outside the norm as far as Wargamer demographics go. Still, I think it comes down to it is your army and you have to own it. Hell, one of the strengths of Warhammer in general is the option to "own" your bit of fluff as far your army goes. I will do and paint whatever I want and nevermind anyone else. Everyone else is entitled to their fluff and armies. Unless they are an Nazi, in that case, gently caress em. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Tlwf9A1ivc
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Dec 15, 2017 04:42
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Crazy Ferret posted:Still, I think it comes down to it is your army and you have to own it. Hell, one of the strengths of Warhammer in general is the option to "own" your bit of fluff as far your army goes. I will do and paint whatever I want and nevermind anyone else. It's why I admire someone like the guy who makes the Fighting Tigers of Veda. Sure, it looks like some of his stuff is painted with nailpolish, but in absence of knowledge beyond his website he seems thoroughly passionate about the collecting and the fluff for his mixed gender original chapter, without going to the level of pasting massive green stuff blob tits on the women. He's been around forever and the mad bastard is still at it, his last update was mid october.
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Dec 15, 2017 05:05
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:I would rather not see GW retcon Space Marines to include women. Maybe that puts me on the wrong side of things, but I feel like there are plenty of ways to incorporate women in the hobby without resorting to changing the fluff. For example adding female models to other ranges like Astra Militarum, Adeptus Mechanicus, and Psykers would be great (especially if they were part of the core Guard sprue). Eliminating some of the more sexualized elements like bullet catcher boob plates and high heel power armor boots would also be viable, although given how stylized and extreme the rest of 40K is I can understand keeping it. And finally revitalizing the Sisters of Battle so that the line is much more accessible would be great. Space Marines Can’t Be Female, Because Then I Would Need To Re-Think My Life
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Dec 15, 2017 05:06
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I feel like I'm the only nerd who opposes female space marines on the grounds that the Imperium of Man is a stand-in for regressive ideals like patriarchy. Like, let's try to remember for a minute that they're the dystopian bad guys. That said: I'd be all for organically introducing them as Custodes, Salamanders, Primaris, or the lost leftist Primarch. Or as ultras after Ultramar succeeds.
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Dec 15, 2017 05:08
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I'd be down for them introducing female primaris marines if primaris marines were stronger rules-wise
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Dec 15, 2017 05:13
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malcador was right all the primarchs should've been ladies
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Dec 15, 2017 05:21
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TheChirurgeon posted:I'd be down for them introducing female primaris marines if primaris marines were stronger rules-wise Primaris are actually pretty solid right now, especially if you run them as Blood Angels.
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