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Milky Moor posted:Why'd they bring back Abrams for 9 though? They needed someone quick, and honestly, safe.
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Dec 17, 2017 05:21
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And VII made a poo poo ton of cash
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Dec 17, 2017 05:22
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Milky Moor posted:Why'd they bring back Abrams for 9 though? Beats me, but its still two years out and they could pull another switch-up and have him stay in a producer role.
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Dec 17, 2017 05:33
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CelticPredator posted:They needed someone quick, and honestly, safe. I'd say it was "Book of Henry" plus lukewarm critical and audience feelings towards Jurassic World.
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Dec 17, 2017 05:34
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Yeah but why not give 9 to Johnson? It kind of feels like Disney wasn't totally happy with the bold new direction, or they anticipated the backlash and think that it's not worth it? What's the deal.
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Dec 17, 2017 05:36
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Or it could be that they want Johnson to go into pre-production on the new trilogy right away? Who knows, though.
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Dec 17, 2017 05:37
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Keep in mind that Rian is only locked into directing the first movie of his trilogy. He's just the producer (for now) on the other two. Maybe they just didn't want the same guy having to direct two in a row?
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Dec 17, 2017 05:40
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A single guy with a single cohesive artistic vision is clearly not what Disney is going for.
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Dec 17, 2017 05:44
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JJ can make a movie to spec. The Force Awakens being safe was a strategic decision to prove that Disney can wage Star War. The Last Jedi was less safe, and they decided to give Johnson his own trilogy when it was nearing completion, so clearly they think what he brings to the brand is valuable. So I think Episode IX is not likely to be a second retread.
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Dec 17, 2017 05:55
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Turns out I was right about the next movie having a Reinforce Jr rams the Zanscare fleet moment. Huh.
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Dec 17, 2017 06:10
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I don't think of JJ Abrams as a hack, in general. I feel like Star Trek was pretty darn ostentatious in terms of style and panache and just having a bit of swagger compared to how boxed in everything with that name on it had felt previously. Super 8 I'll stick up for as being, while a Spielberg homage to be sure, also a pretty solid melding of childhood realism and genre tropes. So basically against him he's got, well, Into Darkness, which tried some interesting poo poo even if he did fall back on "we gotta make it like Wrath of Khan, man." I do feel like in Force Awakens that "nah, man, we gotta" thing came into play- the X-Wings, the TIE fighters, the new Death Star, etc. He's a bit susceptible to that. But I don't think he's entirely without his own voice. Anyway Last Jedi was really good. Felt like what I had hoped would happen when we first heard that there were gonna be new movies, and Lucas wanted to pass the torch and so on. We got through the nostalgia portion and now it's finding a new way.
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Dec 17, 2017 06:11
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I'll field this it's because JJ Abrams is good
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Dec 17, 2017 06:16
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Now I also see a parallel to After War Gundam X, with D.O.M.E. saying that "Newtypes are an illusion" being similare to Luke rejecting the old Jedi ways.
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Dec 17, 2017 06:22
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Episode IX is really gonna be the litmus test for Disney Star Wars. Solo is already too far through production to have any huge changes made as a result of VIII's reception. If IX "backpedals" and goes back to VII levels of safe and familiar, we'll know that that's just what Disney wants Star Wars to be, and they're not as okay with individuals films braking new ground and being divisive. But if IX is as fresh as VIII, then we'll have confirmation that Disney is in fact okay with Star Wars throwing new concepts at the wall to see what sticks, and VII really was just a nice safe jumping off point to recapture fans who hated the prequels, and to recoup a bunch of money off the $4 billion purchase
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Dec 17, 2017 06:23
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I like Abrams. But they put him on The Force Awakens with a very specific job to do, expecting that he'd be suited because of his skill with pastiche. I don't doubt that he'll make Episode IX exactly the movie Disney wants it to be; the question is what kind of movie they'll order from him, given Johnson's apparently successful production of something that's a bit more challenging to popular tastes.
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Dec 17, 2017 06:27
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Star Wars space physics have never followed the laws of real world space physics. They're generally fairly internally consistent...but are absolutely fictional.
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Dec 17, 2017 06:29
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Bongo Bill posted:I like Abrams. But they put him on The Force Awakens with a very specific job to do, expecting that he'd be suited because of his skill with pastiche. I don't doubt that he'll make Episode IX exactly the movie Disney wants it to be; the question is what kind of movie they'll order from him, given Johnson's apparently successful production of something that's a bit more challenging to popular tastes. Johnson turned in a treatment for IX. The core structure is going to be his, execution will be abrams. I wouldn't be surprised right now if he's banging out the first draft for a dip in mr scrooges vault. Edit: my official SA poster HOT TAKE of the week: it was a good movie and full of more meaning than any Star Wars movie has a right to have. incoherent fucked around with this message at 06:33 on Dec 17, 2017 |
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Dec 17, 2017 06:31
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Schwarzwald posted:Leia says the Resistance must survive to provide a symbol of hope to the powerless of the universe...yet then Finn and Rose head to the gambling planet where they meet the powerless (reminiscent of Quigon and Obiwan on Tatooine) in the process of hooking up with a code-breaker whose betrayal all but annihilates the Resistance. Does that mean the Force disagrees with Leia, and that it purposely acted to flatten the Resistance? Or that the Force is punishing the Resistance for ignoring the helpless until it serves their interest? Either would fit in with the code-breaker pointing out that both the Resistance and the First Order help perpetuate the system of oppression--but then the movie ends with a slave child being encouraged by his encounter with the Resistance...so the Resistance providing hope is of value after all? I think it is just that the Resistance is Leia's poorly named rogue military outfit. It is slowly transformed through the movie to be the Rebellion reborn, something more than just Mama Skywalker's Space Militia Retirement Club. Fin encapsulates this pretty well, wanting to get the hell away from the Resistance immediately upon waking, but becoming more and more enmeshed until he and his friends just straight up are the Rebellion by virtue of surviving. Luke even gave them a dope rear end creation myth.
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Dec 17, 2017 06:35
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movie owns thematics were incredibly solid, fakeouts were solid, the jokes were pretty well-paced to provide something to prevent the entire second half of the film being the lightsaber duel from ep3: "THE STAKES HAVE NEVER BEEN HIGHER AND WON'T STOP BEING THERE FOR THE NEXT FIFTEEN MINUTES, SO, UH, GET SOME POPCORN" and the entire act 1 climax was finger-kissin' good
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Dec 17, 2017 06:49
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The humor was definitely hit and miss but I loved it when Luke started training Rey and was all "Reach out...do you feel it? Do you? There it is! *smacks hand with tree branch*
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Dec 17, 2017 07:06
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Bill Dungsroman posted:The humor was definitely hit and miss but I loved it when Luke started training Rey and was all "Reach out...do you feel it? Do you? There it is! *smacks hand with tree branch* somebody very clearly asked the question "who is Luke Skywalker, beyond the whiny audience surrogate" and came up with the correct answer: he is a smartass. the discussion with Yoda was so fantastic, not just for "we are what they grow beyond," a legitimately amazing line, but the unspoken "oh, failed have you, young skywalker. caused the destruction of all you hold dear, as the galaxy around you falls into darkness, and so travel do you to the end of the universe hoping to die in obscurity. rings no bells for me, this chain of events." "dipshit."
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Dec 17, 2017 07:17
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The more I think about it what about The Last Jedi is a gamble that Disney would step away from? We still have clearly defined good guys/bad guys, we still have big space battles/lightsaber fights, which I think is all the 'mainstream' viewer goes for anyway. Disney knows people are gonna see these movies in record numbers regardless of the details as long as what people expect from Star Wars movies is in there. When my dad sees this he's not gonna care about how certain expectations from TFA were upended.
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Dec 17, 2017 08:34
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Jihadist lightspeed jumps through ships, for starters.
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Dec 17, 2017 08:36
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incoherent posted:Jihadist lightspeed jumps through ships, for starters. Man I don't think almost anyone is gonna see it that way. Noble sacrifice isn't some sort of rarity for big budget blockbusters.
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Dec 17, 2017 08:38
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trash person posted:Man I don't think almost anyone is gonna see it that way. Noble sacrifice isn't some sort of rarity for big budget blockbusters. I will make it happen.
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Dec 17, 2017 08:53
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It's really heavy character development driven that by all accounts star war movies don't have to do. ever. They didn't have to deconstruct luke before "obi wanning" him at all. Sure he had to go at one point because his HERO'S JOURNEY was long over, but they didn't have to dwell for so long of a life of regret and his motivations. Continuing to build luke in the movie when we were going to eventually see him get off'd. It was pure indulgence.
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Dec 17, 2017 08:55
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I loved that the three 'against the odds' gambits in the film, mostly instigated by Poe, failed and left the Resistance in a worst position: 1. Destroyed the dreadnought, but lost most of their fighters and bombers and was only saved by a last-minute button press. A Pyrrhic victory. 2. The desparate run to the casino planet, which ultimately failed bigtime and exposed the less risky and far more robust plan that Laura Dern had come up with. 3. Assault on the mini-Death Star (lol) which is of no consequence and loses most of the remaining pilots. All backs up the theme around learning through failure, and not being able to solve problems with laser swords and blowing things up in starfighters. People should go watch this film.
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Dec 17, 2017 08:56
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Mighty Steed posted:
My eyes couldn't of rolled harder at the introduction of that.
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Dec 17, 2017 08:59
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8ue_5T4fMk
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Dec 17, 2017 09:31
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incoherent posted:My eyes couldn't of rolled harder at the introduction of that. It's a bunker buster, we have that poo poo now, what surprised you that the Empire had a big laser to attack fortified positions?
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Dec 17, 2017 09:39
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Bongo Bill posted:JJ can make a movie to spec. The Force Awakens being safe was a strategic decision to prove that Disney can wage Star War. That’s the standard take. The truth is that Force Awakens is mostly a really poor riff on The Terminator.
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Dec 17, 2017 09:50
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:That’s the standard take. The truth is that Force Awakens is mostly a really poor riff on The Terminator. But then The Terminator is a riff on Star Wars.
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Dec 17, 2017 09:53
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This one is my favorite of the series. I hope they risk it more next episode. I'm a bit disappointed that abrams is in charge of it again though. gently caress "safe". Nitpicking from fans will happen no matter what, so might as well shake things up even more
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Dec 17, 2017 09:55
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Just got back from the theater. I have a lot of mixed feelings about this. The Good: -Most of Luke's stuff is effective, I just wish there was more of him. I was also not a big fan of him going out like that....it just didn't seem fitting for the character. I get that it's a pretty strong parallel to when Obi-Wan sacrifices himself in ANH to buy time for Luke/Han/Leia to get off the Death Star, but still. Mark Hamill put all he had into this, at least. -The inclusion of Yoda actually worked. When he first showed up unexpectedly, I was concerned, but they actually did it properly. A much better use of a long-gone character than the cameos in Rogue One or his appearances in the Prequels -Kylo Ren is much more interesting in this film. He's still whiny and impatient at times, but he feels more like an actual threat than in TFA. I'm really glad he ditched the dumb helmet. I really hoped for a major swerve where he fully commits to supporting Rey and the Rebellion, but that would be too much I suppose. Instead what we get is basically what would have happened if Darth Vader had decided to off the Emperor in ESB and take over the Empire himself. -Hyperspace suicide run is something I wish they had put in these films before. Between this and Rogue One I am glad that they have added some new dimensions to the space combat since you can now use modern CGI to make the battles more dynamic. -I wish we had seen more of Benicio Del Toro's character. He seemed interesting enough, but was barely around and then presumably died on the giant ship. -The fight after Snoke gets killed was well done and I wish we had more combat like that in the film. The Bad/Disappointing: -Everything with Snoke's buildup was a waste. It's clear that he's an incredibly powerful Force user, arguably stronger than Rey or Kylo Ren. Yet we get no idea of who he even is, or why he's in this position as leader of the First Order. They put all of this secrecy into who he was in TFA and it didn't matter at all. I'm not sure if they just wrote the character for TFA without an intended backstory, then had to kill him in this, but it seems like a waste of time. -What was the point in bringing Phasma back at all? She should have died on Starkiller Base in TFA. She somehow had even LESS screen time in this than in TFA. -Building up the mystery of who Rey's parents were in TFA, only to make it completely pointless. -I agree with others that the side plot on Canto Bight was something that seemed out of place and should have been cut. I'm not sure why that was in the film. Benicio Del Toro's character doing the whole 'well maybe the Resistance is bad too' thing because they also bought weapons was a weird scene. That didn't need to be in the film either, as there is no real reason for it. -Honestly I believe it was a mistake not having Finn sacrifice himself as the conclusion to his arc in the film. Thematically it works well if he goes from being ready to desert the Resistance to nobly sacrificing himself to save what remained of it. Now granted, clearly he was willing to do this and only Rose's interference stopped him, but is there still anything else they really need to do with his character in Episode IX? -This isn't really a 'bad' thing, but I'm not sure why Hux is still alive at this point. Why does Kylo need him? I really thought Kylo was going to off him right after he wake up from being unconscious. -The film really starts to drag during the section where Poe is arguing with Laura Dern's character, and Finn/Rose are on Canto Bight. Pretty much everything with Laura Dern's character is for plot convenience. Why would she keep her plan a secret? It benefited no one. -I feel like in comparison to where the main characters were at the end of ESB, the Resistance in this movie seems hopelessly outmanned and outgunned at the end of the film. I'm really not sure where the final movie is going to start, or how the Resistance is going to be able to stand up to what is clearly a giant force that they even say in the film is weeks away from controlling all of the major star systems. Presumably Leia is going to die offscreen, unless they think they have a good way to send her off in the next movie. -The movie felt very torn between its feelings on the past. You had a character in Kylo Ren who almost seems to be an anarchist, but he still wants to basically rule the Empire like his grandfather had ultimately planned to do. Yoda helps Luke destroy the ancient Jedi temple, and even says that Luke is the last Jedi, but Rey took all of the ancient texts out of the tree off-screen and they are with her anyway? It's just very inconsistent. -I felt like once again we did not get a lot of character development with Rey. She seems to be more of a bog-standard hero character rather than a real three-dimensional character. If you compare her to Luke in the original trilogy she seems very shallow. Luke goes from being an impatient teenage farm boy to a calm, collected, self-assured Jedi by the end of the last movie. In those films his character motivations seem more clear-cut than what we get out of Rey. Rey is very impulsive in both this and TFA, but it doesn't seem to lead to any real peril. I do understand how in TFA there was a lot of criticism that she was already too perfect at everything, and that mostly continues here. She doesn't really fail much in her training, either. Compared to Luke in ESB, who fails repeatedly because he's not learning the right lessons. The movie kind of teases with the idea that maybe she is interested in Kylo Ren's pitch to her, but that's a fakeout. I don't feel like her character has grown much in two films now. I will say overall that I am less interested in seeing Episode 9 than I was interested in seeing Episode 8 after leaving the theater for TFA.
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Dec 17, 2017 10:00
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After seeing The Last Jedi, I walked out of the cinema thinking the prequel trilogy might not actually be the worst one. I have no hope for episode 9.
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Dec 17, 2017 10:05
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This movie was awesome solely due to hyperspace suicide ram. I want to get a huge print of that shot to put on my wall.
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Dec 17, 2017 10:08
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Inescapable Duck posted:But then The Terminator is a riff on Star Wars. Not really. In TFA, Skynet sends a Terminator to ruthlessly kill everything in its path in an effort to track down and eliminate legendary hero John Connor. A PTSD’d future-soldier (terrified of the looming apocalypse) arrives in the present, disguises himself, and goes on the run with an unassuming young woman. Unbeknownst to her, this woman holds the key to John Connor’s location. The soldier is killed in combat with the Terminator, but the woman finds the resolve to defeat it. Now alone, she pledges to deliver John Connor to the anti-Skynet Resistance. She drives off in a truck, with her new dog and a tape recorder.
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Dec 17, 2017 10:24
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FlamingLiberal posted:
Be the main character of this film series which he is the main character of?
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Dec 17, 2017 10:26
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The opinion divide on this movie is really interesting. It seems like most people either absolutely despite it, or think it's fantastic. I'm firmly in the latter. Curious to the opinion of those in the former - did you like TFA? Was this not a satisfying follow up / or you just don't like the treatment of Star Wars redux?
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Dec 17, 2017 10:39
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I couldn't give a gently caress about RT user reviews, because from a quick glance I saw negative reviews talking about the treatment of *MEN* and I already knew where they were coming from. It's good positive reviews, it'll make a ton of money and I don't think that people moaning on Reddit will stop anything.
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