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Hieronymous Alloy posted:so many spells aren't worth the bother right now because their casting times were doubled or tripled but their durations and effects were left unchanged. there are a couple of spells in PoE 1 that would be balanced by that (hello Shadowflame) but if they did that to the rest of the spells 
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Dec 21, 2017 22:45
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| # ? May 26, 2024 02:55 |
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Trip report from the patch: started a new game, dinked around in character creation making a multiclass, ended up with 3 classes in-game  Gotta love betas.
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Dec 21, 2017 22:54
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I wonder if Pillars 2 will import hired adventurers, perhaps it'd be for the best if it didn't because I don't know who I'd cut from Bear Force One. 
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Dec 22, 2017 00:09
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We don't import adventurers, but you can make new ones in Deadfire.
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Dec 22, 2017 00:25
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https://wizardstyles.shinyapps.io/DeadfireRandomParty/ For all your garbage beta party needs. e: I accept no responsibility for any Bleak Walker/Lifegivers or triple Ascendant parties you roll. e2: Wait, did the Ascendant get fixed? It doesn't seem to have to spend its focus within 5 seconds of reaching the cap anymore. At least the description doesn't say so anymore. Wizard Styles fucked around with this message at 01:51 on Dec 22, 2017 |
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Dec 22, 2017 01:23
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Pwnstar posted:A wizard gives you a quest to destroy the wild crow population before they become intelligent enough to threaten the civilised races. Now that's what I call a murder of crows.
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Dec 22, 2017 03:05
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Year in review update. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36oY8b3lkt0
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Dec 22, 2017 06:34
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So did the proficiency/weapon style changes not make it into this patch, or are they back on the drawing board?
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Dec 22, 2017 18:27
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:So did the proficiency/weapon style changes not make it into this patch, or are they back on the drawing board? I expect that to happen in a patch later down the line, but who knows. Hopefully they make good choices as to *what* talents to make universal, because I'm worried that too many of them will feel like no-brainers compared to choosing an additional (not very useful) proficiency. Also, I know it's unpopular, but I'm hoping they stick to the slow casts. By all mean, tune the spells so that they feel more impactful, but having slower abilities that are more susceptible to interrupts feel like a good change that will make casters feel more distinctive.
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Dec 22, 2017 19:04
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Fair Bear Maiden posted:
If they get the balancing right it could be a big improvement but the balancing isn't anywhere near right yet. For the crowd control spells especially you run into a problem where long cast times mean you're immobilizing yourself more than the enemy, but if you lengthen CC duration to balance that out, the CC gets too powerful because long-duration CC is incredibly frustrating when it hits players. (I could also get on a soapbox about how Cipher "cast times" are functionally longer than everyone else's right now due to the focus mechanic anyway, now that the vancians are all per-encounter, but I talk too much about ciphers as it is). When I first heard about the longer casts I thought they were, like, adding a fifth casting speed. . call it "ritual" or something . . . for spells that were extra extra slow but had really big, fight-ending effects when they went off. You could have a little "Llagufaeth Broodmother is casting a Ritual" popup like the "no pen" popups happen and then everyone has to scramble to interrupt the ritual etc. It'd be great. As it is though casters feel like the little brother running up to the fight just after it's all over, going "guys! guys! I brought a spell!". I dunno. I should post less and play more with the new patch for a while. Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 19:14 on Dec 22, 2017 |
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Dec 22, 2017 19:10
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:As it is though casters feel like the little brother running up to the fight just after it's all over, going "guys! guys! I brought a spell!". I dunno. I should post less and play more with the new patch for a while. The issue I have is with a lot of (offensive) abilities that have a one-off effect feeling very inefficient compared to other options. That applies to the choice between Burst of Summer Flame and The Moon's Light, but it also applies to the choice between Knock Down and Disciplined Barrage.
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Dec 22, 2017 19:28
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:If they get the balancing right it could be a big improvement but the balancing isn't anywhere near right yet. For the crowd control spells especially you run into a problem where long cast times mean you're immobilizing yourself more than the enemy, but if you lengthen CC duration to balance that out, the CC gets too powerful because long-duration CC is incredibly frustrating when it hits players. (I could also get on a soapbox about how Cipher "cast times" are functionally longer than everyone else's right now due to the focus mechanic anyway, now that the vancians are all per-encounter, but I talk too much about ciphers as it is). if you want i can show you how to change the cast speeds of spells
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Dec 22, 2017 19:29
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I tried a wizard/druid(fury) earlier and it was actually very effective. I dumped str & con (because of course I would) and prioritized dex because I wanted to actually get all the spells out before the end of the encounter. I abused empowerment like crazy, which I could do because hardtack is cheap and there's no limit to how much of it you can carry. It was kind of stupid, but I strongly recommend constantly using empowerment with all party members since you only need to use food on one character when resting to regain empowerment for all party members (I don't know if this is intended). Edit: I also tried an assassin/wizard but it was a failure because invisibility doesn't give you the assassination bonus with spells or ranged attacks  DOUBLE EDIT: I would like to note that I was initially going to make the wizard/druid a dwarf, but changed my mind when I saw that they got +2 strength which would have been useless for this character
Octo1 fucked around with this message at 21:14 on Dec 22, 2017 |
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Dec 22, 2017 20:58
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:casting a charm takes you out of the fight for longer than it takes out an enemy (statistically).
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Dec 22, 2017 21:07
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To be clear -- six second cast on whisper of treason, two second recovery, ten second duration, but adjust for grazes and misses and crits vs. equal defense, expected average duration will be about six to seven seconds. Those numbers change a bit depending on your int/dex/per but overall not worthwhile.
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Dec 22, 2017 21:15
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Spells are shiiiiiiit fix them ropekid
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Dec 22, 2017 21:56
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Wizard Styles posted:I run out of spells halfway through every fight. Yeah you can use the faster cast damage stuff and run out and you're ok, it's just if you want to use things like summoned weapons or crowd control where it becomes a big issue. It's kindof a per-power issue but enough powers have problems that nobody seems to be reacting granularly -- if you pick all crowd control powers you're hosed even if theoretically some other spell you could have picked would have been good. Meyers-Briggs Testicle posted:if you want i can show you how to change the cast speeds of spells that would involve waaay more thinking than I'm prepared for right now, the only programming language i know is Commodore Basic
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Dec 22, 2017 22:16
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How many years of putting out fires on the basic mechanics is this now?
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Dec 22, 2017 22:24
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Wizard Styles posted:I run out of spells halfway through every fight. That's weird, what difficulty are you playing on? I'm playing on hard and I never managed to get off more than A spell or two per caster before almost every fight is over. I'm really disliking the switch to everything being per encounter, it makes every fight so far seem very much the same in that of course I'm going to open up with my most powerful/effective spells every time, because there's no earthly reason to leave anything in reserve.
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Dec 22, 2017 22:26
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:that would involve waaay more thinking than I'm prepared for right now, the only programming language i know is Commodore Basic no programming required open bb_abilities.gamedatabundle (formatting json optional but recommended to read easier) at the very top are your cast speeds change the durations to whatever fast = 0 average = 3 slow = 6 very slow = 9 are the defaults
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Dec 22, 2017 22:33
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Ratios and Tendency posted:How many years of putting out fires on the basic mechanics is this now? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chainmail_(game) so 2017-1971 = 46
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Dec 22, 2017 22:41
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Yeah you can use the faster cast damage stuff and run out and you're ok, it's just if you want to use things like summoned weapons or crowd control where it becomes a big issue. It's kindof a per-power issue but enough powers have problems that nobody seems to be reacting granularly -- if you pick all crowd control powers you're hosed even if theoretically some other spell you could have picked would have been good. Summoned weapons are fine since they last for a very long time, though I wouldn't mind trying them with both cast time and duration reduced by half.
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Dec 22, 2017 22:42
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Ratios and Tendency posted:How many years of putting out fires on the basic mechanics is this now? how long has D&D been around *efb
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Dec 22, 2017 23:04
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bongwizzard posted:That's weird, what difficulty are you playing on? I'm playing on hard and I never managed to get off more than A spell or two per caster before almost every fight is over. I haven't played the beta but in a properly designed game there should be no clear "most powerful" ability for every encounter. Hopefully deadfire is that.
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Dec 22, 2017 23:04
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You know what didn't have this problem??? that's right, Mass Effect 2
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Dec 22, 2017 23:05
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Yeah you can use the faster cast damage stuff and run out and you're ok, it's just if you want to use things like summoned weapons or crowd control where it becomes a big issue. It's kindof a per-power issue but enough powers have problems that nobody seems to be reacting granularly -- if you pick all crowd control powers you're hosed even if theoretically some other spell you could have picked would have been good. But power balancing, and balance in general really, is far from great right now. So I don't want to make sweeping statements about the casting times. One thing I will say is that something should happen with Concentration soon. I think it's still just Wizards that can get it natively, and only if they have Conjuration access. bongwizzard posted:That's weird, what difficulty are you playing on? I'm playing on hard and I never managed to get off more than A spell or two per caster before almost every fight is over. I pick spells with casting times in mind, too. So my first level Wizard spells include Thrust of Tattered Veils for emergency interrupts and 0 casting time self-buffs, depending on what subclass I'm playing. Druids have a lot of 3 second spells and Nature's Balm, which insta-casts. Chanter casting times mostly seem fine for the effects you get out of the Invocations and they're limited by the rate at which they gain phrases, so they don't even have that problem. Ciphers definitely have issues, though, and I haven't really used Priests.
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Dec 22, 2017 23:16
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Wizard Styles posted:PotD. Ah, there still enough jank that I haven't tried PoD yet. Thus far I've been just making wicked sweet themed parties and just trying to make characters that seem as cool as possible with relatively little thought given to mechanical strength and I am steamrolling most every run so far on Hard w/ level scaling. A single class shifter druid dicks out as the dumbest class right now, like most every level up I get to pick a couple spell I will never loving use because I am going be in beast mode 100% of the time.
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Dec 22, 2017 23:49
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Octo1 posted:DOUBLE EDIT: I would like to note that I was initially going to make the wizard/druid a dwarf, but changed my mind when I saw that they got +2 strength which would have been useless for this character Hieronymous Alloy posted:To be clear -- six second cast on whisper of treason, two second recovery, ten second duration, but adjust for grazes and misses and crits vs. equal defense, expected average duration will be about six to seven seconds. Those numbers change a bit depending on your int/dex/per but overall not worthwhile.
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Dec 23, 2017 01:00
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Wizard Styles posted:
Ok, that makes sense. I've been playing on Veteran because I feel like PotD is a "for later" sorta thing; it's for breaking the game not baking it.
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Dec 23, 2017 01:14
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Ciphers could really do with an active effect being applied during the cast time. Eyestrike starts out as a mass distraction, Mental Binding opens up as a slow on the target. They're just out of the fight too long now and being able to make a bat-poo poo insane lifegiver/mage-anything WHO WILL NEVER RUN OUT OF AWESOME poo poo TO CAST, ciphers need to find a new niche now that bottomless wells of magic is on lockdown by another class. Or let ciphers use and cast multiple abilities at the same time, like psionic mirvs, that'd loving own.
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Dec 23, 2017 01:53
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Thoughts on the new beta: - The Strength change is a bad change, sorry. While it accomplishes it's surface-level goal (making Resolve more attractive to casters) it only does so by making Strength a worse dump stat in like 90% of cases, and doesn't address the actual problem: that casters HAVE a clear dump stat in the first place. It also harshly penalizes gish classes like Druids and Ciphers. There has to be a better way to make Resolve more attractive to casters. - Based on the comments in the thread I dug into Ciphers more, and yeah their single-target CC abilities take too long to cast. While all that's really needed is a review of cast times, I do love some of the ideas floated in the thread about how to make Ciphers more unique (being able to attack while casting a spell, maybe with Soul Whip as a penalty instead of a bonus*, would be amazing). Still, those all seem like they'd be pretty hard to implement so as much as I'd love them I won't hold my breath. *My crazy idea: Ciphers don't have a Focus pool at all, you select a spell you want to cast and then instead of a cast time you have to generate the Focus for it by attacking enemies (with slower focus generation than in PoE1 and maybe a Channeling debuff that lowers damage and/or attack speed). - The Priest automatic spells are a really good change, and I'm thinking specialist Wizards should get them too. I feel like the specialist subclasses need something right now, losing access the 2/5ths of their spells (not to mention the increased recovery) is a pretty harsh downside and makes leveling them up much less interesting. - Speaking of which, casters (Wizards and Priests, at least) could definitely use some passive options on levelup. While not every caster would use them, if you only want one spell from a level it's no fun having to take another one that you just aren't going to use. I'll probably have more thoughts as I play more, but that's all for now. I know some of my posts in this thread have been somewhat negative, so I just want to say that aside from the Strength change I'm very happy with how things are progressing so far, so keep up the good work!
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Dec 23, 2017 10:27
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Thank you for making Wounding Shot usable with melee weapons again.
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Dec 23, 2017 10:43
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Can anyone recommend a good LP of the beta to watch?
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Dec 23, 2017 13:34
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That Nerd Commando dude has been doing analysis videos of the beta mechanics, but he's a rather abrasive dude, which might not be your style. In general, there are a lot of videos of the beta on YouTube and Twitch, though keep in mind most are from the original version.
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Dec 23, 2017 17:01
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I'm going to start streaming in a few minutes here: https://www.twitch.tv/scorchies Haven't seen the new patch too much but I'd like to check out the new combat changes and the attribute system.
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Dec 23, 2017 19:01
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I'm interested in this game, but I regret a lot of choices in my only playthrough of Pillars 1. Will there be something like the Dragon Age Keep, or am I forced to replay PoE if I want to import a from a good save file?
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Dec 23, 2017 21:37
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Torrannor posted:I'm interested in this game, but I regret a lot of choices in my only playthrough of Pillars 1. Will there be something like the Dragon Age Keep, or am I forced to replay PoE if I want to import a from a good save file? There will be a thing like the DA keep. Also, some preset end game states like "goody two shoes" and "rear end in a top hat"
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Dec 23, 2017 21:41
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Torrannor posted:I'm interested in this game, but I regret a lot of choices in my only playthrough of Pillars 1. Will there be something like the Dragon Age Keep, or am I forced to replay PoE if I want to import a from a good save file? It's not clear what degree of freedom you'll have though in the save generator yet though. Whether or not you'll get the chance to make every choice that might be referenced in 2, etc.
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Dec 23, 2017 22:26
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- The new wounding system is good, but I feel it should be more apparent that you have wounds. Your HP use to drop by a significant amount but now the main indicator is the little red drops of blood next to the portrait and I'm not sure it's obvious enough. I accidentally perma-killed a few party members when i wasn't paying attention. - Don't like the new Strength stat for the reasons everyone else listed. For single purpose characters it turns the dump stat decision-making into black and white, whereas it was a lot more greyish before. And for hybrid characters the problems are obvious. - Rogues need... something. Stealthing for 1 resource point is good, gives a more flexibility, but Strike the Bell costs 3 which is way too much for an interrupt, and at the beta's level 6 you can only use it once a fight. Most of the other classes short of like Priests/Paladins/Druids are just flat out better than interrupts than Rogues (Thrust of Tattered Veils is a must on Wizards now btw) and have more renewable resources, which doesn't feel right at all. Their lower cost abilities can Blind and Hobble, but those are much better for the melee enemies; if I jump into the backlines to take out an enemy caster there's not enough options. - Hard to feel out the new graze but I guess hits feels a bit more substantial now. I wasn't getting too frustrated about missing, just more about my guys melting before they could get enough damage off. - For Priests there was always a balance between using protection spells vs. heals, but with the new health where it doesn't carry over to the next fight, simple heal spells just feel incredibly powerful now. The big thing is that the cast time is 0.5s which allows you to be incredibly reactive to combat conditions. I guess the flip side is that when enemies cast the same heals you won't really get a chance to interrupt them.
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Dec 23, 2017 22:35
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| # ? May 26, 2024 02:55 |
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Ranged Monk seems fairly good. My random party generator gave me a Helwalker/Trickster and I decided to try a Dance of Death build. Right now the enemies are nice enough not to target the character and she's leading in total damage done.
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Dec 24, 2017 00:13
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