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Yamada sucks and I'm glad Ashley's around to cut through her bullshit to get to the point.
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Dec 24, 2017 10:22
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Angry Walrus posted:Yamada sucks 
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Dec 25, 2017 00:25
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its true tho
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Dec 25, 2017 06:03
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Angry Walrus posted:Yamada sucks Yikes.
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Dec 25, 2017 06:36
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That’s legitimately a worse take than “Taylor wins too much”
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Dec 25, 2017 07:30
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I'm on arc 10 of worm and my favorite part so far is how Taylor refuses to join the Wards because she feels Sophia is loved and supported there by the heroes there, only for a significant portion of the arc immediately after this decision to be devoted to how much everyone in the wards dislikes Sophia and dunking on Sophia in general Edit: Actually my favorite part of worm is just generally how lovely and hypocritical taylor is in general, and has managed to accomplish exactly zero positive things despite her whole ends justify the means schtick. In particular when she finally accomplishes her stated goal of discovering the undersiders boss only to immediately give up on turning them in because one superhero was mean to her one time and being a supervillain is more fun Charlie Bobson fucked around with this message at 08:18 on Dec 25, 2017 |
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Dec 25, 2017 08:00
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Calef posted:That’s legitimately a worse take than “Taylor wins too much” yamada is awesome is a meme, and a bad one at that she's boring, every conversation she's in brings wildbow's dialogue to an even slower crawl, and her ability as a therapist is pretty much told not shown. she's manipulative and more than happy to abuse that nature in this latest chapter of ward to try and fix the whoopsie she had dealing with the latest batch of damaged superkids. e: she's pretty much the only authority figure wildbow wants the reader to think of as benevolent and competent and he bends over backwards trying to tell us that but looking at what she actually does makes me think of her as anything but. Angry Walrus fucked around with this message at 08:41 on Dec 25, 2017 |
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Dec 25, 2017 08:39
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Charlie Bobson posted:I'm on arc 10 of worm and my favorite part so far is how Taylor refuses to join the Wards because she feels Sophia is loved and supported there by the heroes there, only for a significant portion of the arc immediately after this decision to be devoted to how much everyone in the wards dislikes Sophia and dunking on Sophia in general Uh-oh Flesnolk, looks like someone's better at reading than you are!
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Dec 25, 2017 12:31
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Started up Ward the other day, and I'm liking it so far. I'm sure it's been said before, but Wildbow really has a knack for body horror. How're Twig and Pact? I got into Worm a few months before it wrapped up, and I was so burned at the end—seriously, 1.7 million words?—that I haven't touched any of his other stuff until Ward.
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Dec 25, 2017 16:07
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Skippy McPants posted:Started up Ward the other day, and I'm liking it so far. I'm sure it's been said before, but Wildbow really has a knack for body horror. Pact was not liked by a lot of people, partly because of pacing. I personally loved it, not as much as Worm but I thought the way things worked was interesting. The problem was the story was basically a train that had no brakes. Things got bad, then worse, then even worse, etc. No rest for the main character. Twig is popularly considered his best work so far, though I dropped it half way through and have to go back to finish it, someday. I enjoyed it, but not as much as his other works. Just too busy with other things.
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Dec 25, 2017 16:27
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Twig fuckin rules
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Dec 25, 2017 16:28
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If I partly enjoy worm for having badass super hero fights will twig still appeal to me
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Dec 25, 2017 18:23
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Charlie Bobson posted:If I partly enjoy worm for having badass super hero fights will twig still appeal to me Specifically for fights, only kind-of. None of the protagonists (save for Helen) have explicit combat-related superpowers, and the main character’s whole gimmick is that he’s a normal kid who takes drugs to make him smart and adaptable. He plans and manipulates his way through fights rather than solve them with brute force, so if you liked the “clever uses of a weak power” thing that Worm starts out with then you might like Twig.
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Dec 25, 2017 19:28
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Charlie Bobson posted:If I partly enjoy worm for having badass super hero fights will twig still appeal to me There are plenty of awesome action sequences. Despite the lack of direct combat prowess of the main character that blastron points out, I don't think it's structured too different from Worm.
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Dec 25, 2017 21:33
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blastron posted:Specifically for fights, only kind-of. None of the protagonists (save for Helen) have explicit combat-related superpowers, and the main character’s whole gimmick is that he’s a normal kid who takes drugs to make him smart and adaptable. He plans and manipulates his way through fights rather than solve them with brute force, so if you liked the “clever uses of a weak power” thing that Worm starts out with then you might like Twig. 
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Dec 26, 2017 03:36
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Doctor w-rw-rw- posted:Uh-oh Flesnolk, looks like someone's better at reading than you are! You might want to play through The Beginner's Guide.
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Dec 26, 2017 03:41
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The story starts out by presenting bug control as pretty weak and requires Taylor to come up with clever tricks to let her fight on the same field as other supers. It takes a little while for her bag of tricks to get big enough for it to be apparent how ridiculous her power actually is. She certainly doesn’t start out with a perfect positional map of everything in a 5-block radius, swarm clones, or any of her other bullshit.
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Dec 26, 2017 07:10
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the strongest part of taylors power is the absolutely absurd level of fine control multitasking, which is not really apparent at first i think
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Dec 26, 2017 11:40
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violent sex idiot posted:the strongest part of taylors power is the absolutely absurd level of fine control multitasking, which is not really apparent at first i think It becomes apparent pretty quickly. I remember noticing within the first few arcs, and I was really glad that there was a bit somewhere in the... I want to say the first quarter of the story where Taylor paused and thought, "wait, the human brain can't do this many different things at once. What I'm doing here is physiologically impossible. WTF?" Also, it looks like Ward is proceeding in the expected fashion and Victoria is now the fixer for a nascent group of psychopaths and mental patients with superpowers. I'm sure that will all go swimmingly. Skippy McPants fucked around with this message at 12:38 on Dec 26, 2017 |
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Dec 26, 2017 12:34
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I do like the apparent inversion from Worm, where we had an inexperienced main character getting dropped into a group of people who know more about powers than her, and now we have an experienced main character acting as a guide for a group of people who are trying to figure out how to make it work.
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Dec 26, 2017 17:14
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Also Taylor's polar opposite in terms of external factors. Classic powerset, conventionally attractive, extrovert. Speaking of powers, the foreshadowing with Victoria's forcefield is interesting. The boundaries are potentially malleable, and she has at least some control over the 'phantom limbs' that remain from when she was transformed. That could be incredibly powerful, but she's unwilling to practice or explore the limits for obvious reasons. Skippy McPants fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Dec 26, 2017 |
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Dec 26, 2017 18:15
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I liked this latest chapter of Ward and I'm really excited to learn more about our group of misfits and their powers. I wonder why everyone is so afraid of cute little tinker girl?
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Dec 26, 2017 18:57
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Pussy Quipped posted:I liked this latest chapter of Ward and I'm really excited to learn more about our group of misfits and their powers. I wonder why everyone is so afraid of cute little tinker girl? I hope because her skill set involves something terrifying. Remember String Theory or Labrat (name?) from Worm. Cool tech, would you want to USE it? Also some tinkers are more guided then others by their shard.
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Dec 26, 2017 21:02
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Doctor w-rw-rw- posted:Uh-oh Flesnolk, looks like someone's better at reading than you are! Directly, publicly insulting me because I didn't like the story you like is uncalled for. Get your head out of Wildbow's rear end, you pathetic sycophant.
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Dec 26, 2017 22:10
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Flesnolk posted:Directly, publicly insulting me because I didn't like the story you like is uncalled for. Get your head out of Wildbow's rear end, you pathetic sycophant.  Well, I never! [taking exception that someone would make an insult] [making an insult] right back at you!You claimed that the story was both too subtle or too blunt for you, and someone who read less than you did comes along and basically nails it. You got a lot wrong and then blamed it on the author. It's not that I care that you're not a fan, it's that you overextended by pronouncing people's interpretations as way oversold, but you don't actually know what you're talking about. For example, the "theme of cooperation over competition" is actually both affirmed and heavily subverted, and clues about how effective Taylor's power is are in there from beginning (implicitly) to end (where they are called out).
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Dec 26, 2017 22:47
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Doctor w-rw-rw- posted:
So are you on this forum as a form of narrative control for someone else's first draft or what.
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Dec 26, 2017 22:56
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Doctor w-rw-rw- posted:To be fair, you have to have a very high IQ to understand Worm. The writing is extremely subtle, and without a solid grasp of superhero tropes most of the plot will go over a typical reader's head. There's also Taylor's traumatised outlook, which is deftly woven into her characterisation - her personal philosophy draws heavily from Alan Moore's literature, for instance. The fans understand this stuff; they have the intellectual capacity to truly appreciate the depths of this work, to realize that it's not just cool- it says something deep about LIFE. As a consequence people who dislike Worm truly ARE idiots- of course they wouldn't appreciate, for instance, the humour in Taylor's bug powers which itself is a cryptic reference to Turgenev's Russian epic Fathers and Sons I'm smirking right now just imagining one of those addlepated simpletons scratching their heads in confusion as Wildbow's genius unfolds itself on their screens. What fools... how I pity them. 😂 And yes by the way, I DO have an Undersiders tattoo. And no, you cannot see it. It's for the ladies' eyes only- And even they have to demonstrate that they're within 5 IQ points of my own (preferably lower) beforehand. Get over yourself, this isn't exactly Dostoevsky.
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Dec 26, 2017 23:13
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Milky Moor posted:So are you on this forum as a form of narrative control for someone else's first draft or what. Flesnolk posted:Get over yourself, this isn't exactly Dostoevsky.
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Dec 26, 2017 23:21
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Doctor w-rw-rw- posted:What, I can't just chat as a person? My account is nine years old. I'm here because I'm here. Stop beating around the bush and just tell me you want me to get out because I'm being annoying. Your post history in this thread makes it clear that you're not just a person, though. You toe every party line, push the author mythology, you handle some parts of the upload machine, you set up Wordpress stuff, and so on and so on. I'd be just as concerned if I saw someone doing the same for me under the guise of having a discussion, particularly if they were involved in my creative machine. Milkfred E. Moore fucked around with this message at 23:45 on Dec 26, 2017 |
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Dec 26, 2017 23:39
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Wildbow actually pretty aggressively doesn't advocate for any particular reading of worm. That's not to say he isn't prodigious in his Word Of God output, but the fandom was collectively pretty Team Taylor until relatively recently.
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Dec 26, 2017 23:59
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Saving the human race is a compelling trump card, but Worm definitely has room for thinking that Taylor is Not A Good Person (tm). And from an author position, advocating for a prescriptive reading of any sort seldom works out well.
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Dec 27, 2017 00:09
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Calef posted:Wildbow actually pretty aggressively doesn't advocate for any particular reading of worm. That's not to say he isn't prodigious in his Word Of God output, but the fandom was collectively pretty Team Taylor until relatively recently. poo poo, when I used to be active in the Worm fandom I got downvoted into oblivion for pushing the controversial idea that the theme is cooperation over competition.
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Dec 27, 2017 00:13
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Milky Moor posted:poo poo, when I used to be active in the Worm fandom I got downvoted into oblivion for pushing the controversial idea that the theme is cooperation over competition. Wait, did I miss something? How is one of the themes not cooperation over competition? Humanity is literally eating itself alive because it's got brain-worms turbocharging its initiate tendencies toward conflict. Or was it your point that fandoms are insane? Cause that I totally get.
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Dec 27, 2017 00:17
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The highly controversial party line of "I think this is a pretty good story."
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Dec 27, 2017 00:21
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Milky Moor posted:poo poo, when I used to be active in the Worm fandom I got downvoted into oblivion for pushing the controversial idea that the theme is cooperation over competition. I could maybe see disputing that it's the theme, because a work can very easily have multiple themes at once and Worm probably does, some of them possibly even contradictory, but it's patently absurd to argue against it being a theme, and an important one at that. It's everywhere in the work, you'd have to be actively trying to not see it.
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Dec 27, 2017 01:13
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The central theme of all of wildbow's stories is heroism, but there are often a lot of additional themes.
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Dec 27, 2017 02:16
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Milky Moor posted:Your post history in this thread makes it clear that you're not just a person, though. You toe every party line, push the author mythology, you handle some parts of the upload machine, you set up Wordpress stuff, and so on and so on. I'd be just as concerned if I saw someone doing the same for me under the guise of having a discussion, particularly if they were involved in my creative machine. I have zero input into or knowledge on his creative machine, but point well taken. I'm gonna step back.
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Dec 27, 2017 02:25
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I've read a lot of discussion in this thread, actually already read about this far in a couple of years back before getting distracted, and also have been listening to the We've Got Worm podcast so I definitely haven't come to these conclusions on my own. That being said I think Taylor (so far!) is a very flawed protagonist, who makes things worse due to her character flaws, makes large mistakes and needs to be bailed out by her teammates fairly frequently. Taylor definitely has severe mental issues and doesn't handle them well, and part of writing within a first person perspective is needing to filter events through that perspective. Taylors issues and trauma lead her to making very flawed decisions that while justifiable to a person with her viewpoint and background, are very flawed and breakdown when viewed from the outside. Unfortunately, people in general do not properly evaluate their mindset and actions, even when not saddled with the difficulties that Taylor has and continues to face. I think that read on a surface level Worm can be viewed as justifying Taylors actions and viewpoint, but that's really just a side effect of part of Taylors being a character who constantly justifies herself, and views herself as being in the moral right. The interludes and a more detached viewpoint of the plot indicate the opposite being the case most of the time.
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Dec 27, 2017 10:40
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Practical Guide to Evil will hopefully take a break from the endless battles for a few chapters. I'm thinking that Cat is going to meet with Black, and their names are going to drive them towards conflict. Thematically, she's taken Black's place as the Empress's right hand woman, and should kill Black and take on the mantle of Black Knight. I'm thinking she won't though, or if she does fight Black she'll beat and spare him. I don't see Cat becoming the black knight, there are too many asides about how she does really want to be a Hero. I find it interesting in comparison to Worm, because Taylor and Cat are similar in a lot of ways. Both of them wanted to be heroes but found they could accomplish more of their goals working as villains. Where Taylor just reacts and justifies everything to herself though, Cat at least self reflects on a lot of it. Just like Taylor, Cat knows her growing power and influence are creating new problems that have to be solved through more and more violence. Though, where Taylor just sort of reacts to everything, Cat understands that she's an active player. I don't think Taylor really understood the depths of how far she'd gone until the very end. Also Parahumans 2 is good. This was the first chapter I felt like Wildbow had gotten his stride. Maybe that's why it was so long.
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Dec 27, 2017 19:27
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I finished Twig last night and aside from just wanting to talk about it in general I have to say I'm really surprised I never realized what Ibott's real deal was in regards to Helen until like the very last page of the story.
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Dec 27, 2017 23:12
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