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if you own the property and can't find a tenant at your sky high rent prices, you can write off 100% of the rent as a loss.
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Dec 28, 2017 07:02
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if true, that seems like it was designed to be abused
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Dec 28, 2017 07:08
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why on earth would the tax code protect landlords from the market price that is crazy 
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Dec 28, 2017 07:08
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Beast of Bourbon posted:if you own the property and can't find a tenant at your sky high rent prices, you can write off 100% of the rent as a loss. gently caress, I remember seeing this website (http://www.vacantnewyork.com/) last month and the " take the loss from the vacant properties and shelter other income" phrase flew right over my head. This makes a ton more sense.
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Dec 28, 2017 07:16
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meatpotato posted:why on earth would the tax code protect landlords from the market price that is crazy its almost like the tax system is written specifically to favor wealthy landed gentry or something
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Dec 28, 2017 07:28
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it encourages the wealthy to buy valuable real estate and leave it vacant, managing it with occupation is too much work and also exposes them to liability, so it's better to have it vacant as a tax write off.
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Dec 28, 2017 08:04
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Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud posted:Behold, an indoor swimming pool paid for and maintained by my city's tax receipts i was gonna get a pass for this place to get back into shape but SURPRISE i'm actually flying out to middle of nowhere new jersey for the next four months
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Dec 28, 2017 08:13
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duz posted:they tried filtering them out but then conservatives kept complaining their articles were disappearing they should go back to this, except don’t filter the articles where conservatives freak out about Facebook filtering news that way they’ll get all their rage engagement and not gently caress up society into a new Stone Age
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Dec 28, 2017 08:39
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meatpotato posted:gently caress some sort of tax writedown on the lost rent used to offset income in some other category or from some other property, so taxable income is kept low even though absolute income is nice and high
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Dec 28, 2017 08:41
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Rex-Goliath posted:i was gonna get a pass for this place to get back into shape but SURPRISE i'm actually flying out to middle of nowhere new jersey for the next four months at least New Jersey is basically only a few blocks long so the middle of nowhere, NJ is still within spitting distance of civilization
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Dec 28, 2017 08:43
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eschaton posted:some sort of tax writedown on the lost rent used to offset income in some other category or from some other property, so taxable income is kept low even though absolute income is nice and high it's pretty much a civic duty to vandalize these places then, isn't it?
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Dec 28, 2017 08:53
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run for city council and pass a law allowing them to be classified as blight and seized under eminent domain I really wasn’t kidding with that post, cities should be doing exactly that for storefronts, buildings, and lots that aren’t occupied and aren’t being actively redeveloped
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Dec 28, 2017 08:59
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There are numerous federal tax provisions designed to prevent real estate losses from offsetting other losses. They include, but are not limited to: - at-risk limitations: you can’t take out in losses more than you’ve put in and/or are actually liable for (hence “at-risk”) - basis limitations: similar to at-risk, basis limitations prevent you from taking a loss via flow through entities in excess of your tax basis in said entity - passive activity loss limitations: rental activities are treated as passive, meaning they can’t generally be used to offset other non-passive sources of income. For example if I have a job making $200,000 a year and a rental property that loses $10,000 a year, I can’t deduct the $10,000 on my return unless I met the standards for “material participation”and was deemed to be a “real estate professional” under the code. This are nearly impossible standards to meet unless your career is literally renting property in which case it’s treated like normal business income/loss. - personal use limitations: if you use a rental property for more than 2 weeks (vacation home, yacht etc) your ability to deduct losses is limited -related party limitations: fair rental value must be charged between related parties, including entities that are common,y owned by the taxpayer. This means I can’t buy a $500K house in a college town where my kid goes to school and charge $400 a month in rent for them to live there and take a huge loss. Losses to related parties are disallowed and rents have to be charged at the market rate. - the property has to actually be held out for rent in order for any expenses to be deducted. Expenses for getting the property ready to rent generally must be capitalized. There are others but you get the idea. Since 1986 its much harder to have real estate act as a tax shelter mechanism.
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Dec 28, 2017 12:06
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Beast of Bourbon posted:if you own the property and can't find a tenant at your sky high rent prices, you can write off 100% of the rent as a loss. This isn’t true.
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Dec 28, 2017 12:12
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cool startup feel posted:There are numerous federal tax provisions designed to prevent real estate losses from offsetting other losses. what about the municipal level? isn't that where most property tax happens anyway?
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Dec 28, 2017 12:34
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DaTroof posted:what about the municipal level? isn't that where most property tax happens anyway? Property taxes are usually assessed at the local level. You pay property tax whether a property is occupied or not, generally speaking. Whether that property tax is deductible at the federal level depends though. It’s just treated like any other expense for the most part.
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Dec 28, 2017 14:13
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cool startup feel posted:There are numerous federal tax provisions designed to prevent real estate losses from offsetting other losses. They include, but are not limited to: its not when it's a mixed model building because you use the vacant retail write off to reduce your tax liability on the rent on the apartments overhead. once you've exhausted your taxable basis, sell or continue renting while hunting other deductions.
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Dec 28, 2017 14:23
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cool startup feel posted:This isn’t true. I do real estate tax for a living and this is correct. the only way it is a write down is that there is no income in the first place. in the real estate industry the standard income statement will list the full rent as top line income, and then take “vacancy losses” from that, ie what you “lost” by not renting the property because you didn’t get rent. this is somewhat useful for real estate, but has nothing to do with taxes.
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Dec 28, 2017 14:24
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Mr. Nice! posted:its not when it's a mixed model building because you use the vacant retail write off to reduce your tax liability on the rent on the apartments overhead. where does the deduction come from? there’s no amount to deduct for having a vacant building. please cite code.
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Dec 28, 2017 14:25
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Mr. Nice! posted:its not when it's a mixed model building because you use the vacant retail write off to reduce your tax liability on the rent on the apartments overhead. there is no “vacant retail write off.” If the property is vacant but being held out for rent, expenses can be deducted as paid but there is no benefit because you are paying those expenses with cash. It’s a real economic outlay. If taxable basis is zero and the property is sold then the entire selling price is taxable since basis never goes below zero (although, suspended passive activity losses are released and available to offset other income when the associated property is sold)
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Dec 28, 2017 14:31
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Hurt Whitey Maybe posted:where does the deduction come from? there’s no amount to deduct for having a vacant building. please cite code. the building is mixed use with a single owner. the retail spots on bottom are vacant but all of the residential spots up top are not.
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Dec 28, 2017 14:33
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cool startup feel posted:there is no “vacant retail write off.” If the property is vacant but being held out for rent, expenses can be deducted as paid but there is no benefit because you are paying those expenses with cash. It’s a real economic outlay. i flubbed up my basis thinking. tax classes were quite a while ago.
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Dec 28, 2017 14:34
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DaTroof posted:what about the municipal level? isn't that where most property tax happens anyway? That reminds me, there's a guy running against Wolf for PA governor on a platform of "abolishing the property tax". PA doesn't assess a property tax.
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Dec 28, 2017 14:54
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infernal machines posted:in toronto we're explicitly prioritizing mixed use commercial/residential development and will outright reject plans for new buildings/subdivisions that don't include it Sounds pretty dumb. If someone wants to build a proper 50 story residential or office skyscraper I don't think it should have to have token storefronts/token condos
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Dec 28, 2017 14:57
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Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud posted:That reminds me, there's a guy running against Wolf for PA governor on a platform of "abolishing the property tax". PA doesn't assess a property tax. Most states don’t, it’s assessed by the counties so he probably means pass a state law forbidding local governments from assessing property taxes. Which begs the question of how local governments would be funded
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Dec 28, 2017 15:25
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cool startup feel posted:Most states don’t, it’s assessed by the counties so he probably means pass a state law forbidding local governments from assessing property taxes. Which begs the question of how local governments would be funded They wouldn't, duh. All services provided by the church of your choice. At this point the very concept of governance is the enemy of the right.
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Dec 28, 2017 15:26
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Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud posted:They wouldn't, duh. All services provided by the church of your choice. At this point the very concept of governance is the enemy of the right. Finally you’ll be free of the government stealing your hard earned money to fund socialist public schools
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Dec 28, 2017 15:32
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cool startup feel posted:Finally you’ll be free of the government stealing your hard earned money to fund socialist public schools pretty much a cornerstone goal of the republican party for the last 20 years so checks out
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Dec 28, 2017 15:37
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meatpotato posted:why on earth would the tax code protect landlords from the market price that is crazy if it didnt then they wouldnt be out there creating jobs! fishmech posted:Sounds pretty dumb. If someone wants to build a proper 50 story residential or office skyscraper I don't think it should have to have token storefronts/token condos actually mixed use is good and requiring it makes your city better to live in.
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Dec 28, 2017 16:19
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boy howdy is the christian right mad at california's lbgt textbook policy for k-12 schools. i spent a while last night talking politely on facebook with a mormon friend of mine about how this isn't really a bad thing. for those not in the know, california passed a law that mandated that history books correctly identify people's sexual preference when discussing them in a historical context. like how james buchanan was known by all his contemporaries to be monogamous with william king even while in office, that turing was chemically castrated for being gay and committed suicide because of the shame, or that astronaut sally ride was a lesbian rather than completely disregarding a non-trivial number of historical figure's personal lives.
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Dec 28, 2017 16:20
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kwinklesOFFICIAL posted:if it didnt then they wouldnt be out there creating jobs! Hmm no it sounds like you're from some sort of overgrown suburb where sticking a retail shop on a 2 story building makes a difference. Street level retail in a 50 story tower is just silly to insist on
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Dec 28, 2017 16:22
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fishmech posted:Hmm no it sounds like you're from some sort of overgrown suburb where sticking a retail shop on a 2 story building makes a difference. actually it's quite good
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Dec 28, 2017 16:29
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fishmech posted:Hmm no it sounds like you're from some sort of overgrown suburb where sticking a retail shop on a 2 story building makes a difference. Street level retail and dining is pretty standard on most high rises I've seen here or in Chicago or NYC though?
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Dec 28, 2017 16:31
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fishmech posted:Hmm no it sounds like you're from some sort of overgrown suburb where sticking a retail shop on a 2 story building makes a difference. actually it makes it a lot more desirable as office or residence
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Dec 28, 2017 16:33
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Like literally 3/4ths of the Chicago loop's highrises have multiple floors of retail and dining down below, and there's even retail underground on the pedway.
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Dec 28, 2017 16:34
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It's disingenous to claim that corporations are restricted in empty rental unit 'deductions' without delving deeper into multi layered/beneficial ownership (or whatever it's called) schemes and other devious poo poo. While it may be true that you can't consider lost rent as a deduction, it's definitely true that there are perverse incentives for vacant rental space in some cases. It's not like oh hey here's the rule that says we're allowed to do it. It IS like oh hey if we bury this in enough abstraction we can use empty rental space to generate 'non-income' cash and nobody will ever be able to argue that it's illegal.
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Dec 28, 2017 16:36
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i live in a 44 story building and there are a bunch of 30-40 floor buildings within a block. all of then have ground floor retail and the ones built in the 1980s that dont are busy remodeling their giant 1980s atria into retail or a parking lot for food trucks or whatever. mixed use is good and makes an area more walkable and more desirable.
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Dec 28, 2017 16:39
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muckswirler posted:It's disingenous to claim that corporations are restricted in empty rental unit 'deductions' without delving deeper into multi layered/beneficial ownership (or whatever it's called) schemes and other devious poo poo. While it may be true that you can't consider lost rent as a deduction, it's definitely true that there are perverse incentives for vacant rental space in some cases. What? How does a vacant rental generate cash? Can you give an example of why it would be beneficial to have a rental property without a tenant?
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Dec 28, 2017 16:42
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in hong kong most of the residential highrises have a mall in the bottom few floors, with usually 60-100 retail spaces not this sf bullshit where they build a 500 unit building with 3 tiny spots retail is what makes urban neighborhoods desirable, the highrises in rincon/south beach are trash
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Dec 28, 2017 16:45
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Pittsburgh Fentanyl Cloud posted:Street level retail and dining is pretty standard on most high rises I've seen here or in Chicago or NYC though? hell it's pretty standard here too, like there's a few buildings that just have big empty atriums at the ground level i guess? but there's still lot, even a majority, that are ground-level commercial actually one of the weirder empty atriums has like, this entire side building for an entrance that's maybe 10 stories high that's just *empty space*, like not even floors it's just this giant void cube. i mean it looks cool but seems like they just made a giant volume of otherwise-unusable air that now needs to be air conditioned constantly
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Dec 28, 2017 16:47
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