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PT6A posted:What a coincidence that things in a prequel happened in such a way that it makes possible the events of the following films! You do realize it was a completely clean slate right? Like he could have done loving anything as long as it involved Anakin Skywalker eventually turning into Darth Vader. There's absolutely zero reason the main storyline of The Phantom Menace has to take place on Naboo it could theoretically completely take place on Tatooine. Oh for fucksake I could have taken place on any of the planets of the aliens that were already introduced to the mainline series which would have cut down on having to create these giant CGI worlds that cost a lot of money and probably ended up ruining a lot of the concept of the film because it ended up boxing in star wars and it's storytelling. I like most people here have problems with the prequels and how they display the Star Wars universe. gently caress despite my reservations I even think the force awakens and The Last Jedi have better cohesion into the what their worlds look like and was going on in the plot when compared to the original series than the prequels do and that's pretty pathetic because those are both horrible films. Like I said earlier the film and the world of prequels don't have any kind of complexity or nuance. Jedi Order is 100% irredeemable as every single entity in this universe and it ends up causing Anakin Skywalker to be a hundred percent irredeemable and blah. In the real world people have Dimensions to their character and organizations tend to have Dimensions to their existence as well. I mean no entity is 100% evil and people who participate in an organization that has you know two sides to it and it can be hypocritical at times and that usually affects the way they think about said organization but you're really not shown that kind of conflict at all in the prequels it kind of sucks because of that. The point of view omniscient narration kind of ruins the whole possibility of of anything good being done with it I mean. Let's go back to the original trilogy and you're told things from the point of view of of Luke Skywalker and his limited knowledge but in the prequels it's completely different and the result is a lot of flatter storytelling. And all this leads to a bunch of pseudo Marxist bullshit analysis that leads to "from my point of view the Jedi are evil and the Sith are really the good guys because X and Y and Z" and saying that is kind of like saying that from my point of view the United States is evil and the Russians are X and Y and Z." That makes zero sense because the world is more complex than that but we don't really see any younglings killed or any of the people who have to suffer under what Palpatine does after Vader and him take over so all we get is "haha I'm so glad that Jedi order is done especially for the slaves cuz I tell you what the Jedi Order hate them some slaves!" And that's about as a "I'm so glad the Democratic order it is over especially for the gays cuz I tell you what then Democrats hate them some gays" Hi TheNewt fucked around with this message at 00:54 on Dec 29, 2017 |
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Dec 29, 2017 00:51
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business hammocks posted:I feel extremely gross even trying this out, but when Episode II was put out on video, did they digitally add piping and seams to Natalie Portman’s shirt to obscure her nipples? I swear those elements weren’t there in the theater, but I was a stupid child and may be a stupid adult as well. They certainly did something like that. My entire theater burst out giggling when it became very apparent that it was chilly on the soundstage that day.
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Dec 29, 2017 00:54
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TheNewt posted:You do realize it was a completely clean slate right? Like he could have done loving anything as long as it involved Anakin Skywalker eventually turning into Darth Vader. 
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Dec 29, 2017 00:56
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Waffles Inc. posted:
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Dec 29, 2017 00:58
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I'm genuinely surprised that there are goons who defend the prequels as though they are not loving trash. Or is this some kind of yospos thing where it's 'hilarious' to argue that they are not terrible
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Dec 29, 2017 00:58
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Syrinxx posted:I'm genuinely surprised that there are goons who defend the prequels as though they are not loving trash. Or is this some kind of yospos thing where it's 'hilarious' to argue that they are not terrible You see, from my point of view it is the original trilogy that's bad.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:00
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TheNewt posted:There's absolutely zero reason the main storyline of The Phantom Menace has to take place on Naboo it could theoretically completely take place on Tatooine. I just want to point out that this guy is mad at George Lucas for “boxing in Star Wars and it's [sic] storytelling” by inventing new worlds, cultures, and aliens, and then using groundbreaking new technology to bring them to life. Syrinxx posted:I'm genuinely surprised that there are goons who defend the prequels as though they are not loving trash. Or is this some kind of yospos thing where it's 'hilarious' to argue that they are not terrible This place is remarkably free of fakeposting about the prequels.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:01
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gently caress now I'm sitting here imagining how much better of a film The Phantom Menace would have been if it had been told from the point of view of Anakin. Like you could of literally gotten rid of the entirety of the first third of the film. No Trade Blockade, no journey through naboo, no gungans. Just Anakin and his mom eeking out a survival in the sandy deserts of Naboo. gently caress if A New Hope drew inspiration from the Hidden Fortress Lucas could of drawn inspiration from Pather Pachali. Imagine it: Anakin a slave living with his mother with his sister, enjoying only the most basic of pleasures on this backwater planet, eeking out a survival, having a big magic scene being the first time a sandcruisers runs by his town, ending with his mother getting sick and dying and being discovered by the Jedi just shortly after that. Imagine how amazing that could of been in generating actual connections between the viewers and Anakin and making the universe actually feel real. But no. gently caress it pisses me off. edit: Just imagine this scene with Anakin on Tatoiine instead of Apu in India. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqxho2veqEU. gently caress. TheNewt fucked around with this message at 01:04 on Dec 29, 2017 |
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Dec 29, 2017 01:02
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Syrinxx posted:I'm genuinely surprised that there are goons who defend the prequels as though they are not loving trash. Or is this some kind of yospos thing where it's 'hilarious' to argue that they are not terrible Why are you surprised that people like films?
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Dec 29, 2017 01:03
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Syrinxx posted:I'm genuinely surprised that there are goons who defend the prequels as though they are not loving trash. Or is this some kind of yospos thing where it's 'hilarious' to argue that they are not terrible They're trying to trick people into watching the prequels again.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:05
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Gatts posted:Okay okay peep this. Personally, I'm holding out for the musical about IG-88's descent into a life of crime
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Dec 29, 2017 01:06
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I mean the prequels had a lot of interesting themes and ideas, but it's hard to see how anyone could honestly argue that the execution in most aspects was anything other than horrendous.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:06
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Syrinxx posted:I'm genuinely surprised that there are goons who defend the prequels as though they are not loving trash. You really shouldn't be, considering you registered here in 2002.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:06
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I Before E posted:Personally, I'm holding out for the musical about IG-88's descent into a life of crime If only Freddie was alive to do the soundtrack with Queen. "Mama, just killed a man Put a gun against his head, pulled my trigger, now he's dead Mama, life had just begun But now I've gone and thrown it all away"
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Dec 29, 2017 01:09
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I don't think the Jedi in the prequels are portrayed as irredeemable villains. I think they're mostly portrayed as well-intentioned but short-sighted.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:11
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Acebuckeye13 posted:I mean the prequels had a lot of interesting themes and ideas, but it's hard to see how anyone could honestly argue that the execution in most aspects was anything other than horrendous. I'm just as baffled as to how anyone could watch scenes like, say, the giant flash gordon chrome spaceship descending through the clouds or james dean on his space motorcycle driving through the desert as the sun(s) set and think "hmm yes this is a trash movie that's executed poorly" the execution, from the special effects (for the time) to the cinematography to the art design are incredible
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Dec 29, 2017 01:11
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Waffles Inc. posted:"hmm yes this is a trash movie that's executed poorly" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVOrswUcZiA
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Dec 29, 2017 01:12
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Acebuckeye13 posted:I mean the prequels had a lot of interesting themes and ideas, but it's hard to see how anyone could honestly argue that the execution in most aspects was anything other than horrendous. Everyone, even those who like the prequels, admits they're flawed and could use work. But the former is why they are liked. They're ambitious and grand and with at the time groundbreaking effects but the dialog is poo poo as is some of the direction because its all green screen and the actors clearly aren't up to it.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:12
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The dialogue is fine. Even the "I hate sand" dialogue, which people hold up as an example of the Prequels "bad writing," tells us a lot about Anakin and Padme.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:15
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KaptainKrunk posted:The dialogue is fine. Maybe I should say delivery
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Dec 29, 2017 01:15
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Are you an Angel?
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Dec 29, 2017 01:16
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TheNewt posted:Like I said earlier the film and the world of prequels don't have any kind of complexity or nuance. Jedi Order is 100% irredeemable as every single entity in this universe and it ends up causing Anakin Skywalker to be a hundred percent irredeemable and blah Somehow I don't think Yoda, Obi-Wan, Qui-Gon, Mace Windu, Conehead Man, Blue-Skin Twilek, Gas Mask Guy, Female Yoda, KIT FISTO, and everyone are irredeemable. In fact, the deaths of the Jedi are framed as pretty tragic. The whole thing is a tragedy of galactic proportions.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:23
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Gatts posted:Maybe I should say delivery The delivery is good. The acting is good. Anakin is putting on airs to impress someone he worships, an angel who literally came from the sky in a chrome starship with her wizard bodyguards and freed him before whisking him off to the center of the galaxy to fulfill his destiny as The Chosen One. He speaks with a bouncy, effete, faux noble accent. Christensen's face does a lot of the work here as he moves in to touch her hand and then when he moves to kiss her: a small awkward smile that pulls down into loneliness, a flash of desire that transforms into obvious guilt as he noticeably swallows hard. KaptainKrunk fucked around with this message at 01:34 on Dec 29, 2017 |
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Dec 29, 2017 01:31
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Star Wars is a series of highly idiosyncratic auteurist films. The first one to be released was the closest to a mass-market crowd-pleaser, and its serendipitous success bestowed it with a great deal of momentum. That momentum was sustained through the next two sequels, the first of which was, although far stranger and subtler in subject matter, tonally more conventional. After a sixteen-year gap between installments, the franchise had become legendary, and, like all pop culture legends, was basically totally misunderstood. In such an environment, the director, undertaking a new trilogy of films, consciously elected to defy audience expectations and once again produce exactly the profoundly weird movies he wanted to. He did so all the more audaciously because all the merch had made him a billionaire, meaning there was nobody exerting pressure on him in order to protect their investments. The lesson to learn from all of is that expectations, more than anything else, are what ruins movies. If a movie disappoints you, examine in detail what you wanted it to give you, and compare it with what it actually gave you. Try to do it with value-neutral terms and specific attributes. Even if you don't end up changing your mind, this exercise will teach you a lot and make you better at watching movies.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:33
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KaptainKrunk posted:The delivery is good. The acting is good. Someone's going to poo poo on you for this with a joke about sand, but you're absolutely right. People try to dunk on Hayden Christiansen as if he's bad, but he does incredible work with what he's given. He either grasped or came to understand Lucas' characterisation of Anakin and ran with it, very clearly researching similar performances, like James Dean in Rebel Without a Cause. It's Natalie Portman who does most of the phoning in. In acting parlance, she's judging the work and the character, and it affects her performance. Almost everyone else--especially Christopher Lee and Ian McDiarmid--don't judge the material (or if they do they're good and professional enough actors to put in good work regardless) See also: Alec Guinness in ANH
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Dec 29, 2017 01:40
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"George, you can type this poo poo, but you can't say it!" - Han Solo
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Dec 29, 2017 01:42
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AndyElusive posted:"George, you can type this poo poo, but you can't say it!" - Harrison Ford And yet...he does, and well for the most part
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Dec 29, 2017 01:42
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I'm just pointing out even the actors who did it well still had a hard time forcing out those lines without them sounding like trash at the end of the day sometimes.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:46
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TheNewt posted:You do realize it was a completely clean slate right? Like he could have done loving anything as long as it involved Anakin Skywalker eventually turning into Darth Vader. if anything, it makes less sense that he set the movie on tatooine at all. darth vader broods in a lava castle on mustafar for twenty years and never happens to learn that his half-brother lars just happens to be raising a kid with the last name skywalker. also naboo is gorgeous and one of my favorite locations that we see in the movies. the prequels have all the cool places
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Dec 29, 2017 01:55
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You can paper over awkward dialogue with a decent performances from your actors but I don't think Hayden had the chops for it. That Anakin-Padme romance eats up too much time and it's unwatchable.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:56
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It's all kind of the same reason many people hate Prometheus and Alien: Covenant: the characters are all emotionally-stunted weirdos whose behavior doesn't make any instinctive sense because the movie's storytelling is literal and not visual. You can definitely tell a story: - With a bunch of characters who are out of touch with their basic humanity and therefore largely unrelatable - Make all the dialogue super inane because it's an old school adventure serial - Pioneer greenscreen to such an extent that you can't yet tell the actors to do much but stare at a tennis ball or shoot dialogue with anything but efficiency-oriented soap opera blocking, which greatly limits your choreography Doing all three at once creates something so indistinguishable from a technical disaster that it doesn't even matter. They begin to iron out some of these problems around the third iteration, Revenge of the Sith. It's easily the strongest of the three and you have characters that are finally chewing the scenery. It's also more grandiose and more innovative with its completely digital space. To get to the root of the problem you have to figure out why people respond well to the Flash Gordon movie and not the prequels, and bridge that gap.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:57
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Serf posted:if anything, it makes less sense that he set the movie on tatooine at all. darth vader broods in a lava castle on mustafar for twenty years and never happens to learn that his half-brother lars just happens to be raising a kid with the last name skywalker. Its like a universe, there could be hundreds of families with the name skywalker.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:57
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TheNewt posted:Like I said earlier the film and the world of prequels don't have any kind of complexity or nuance. Jedi Order is 100% irredeemable as every single entity in this universe and it ends up causing Anakin Skywalker to be a hundred percent irredeemable and blah. I think the problem is that you are incapable of reading complexity or nuance. How else could you come to these conclusions having watched any of the Star Wars prequels?
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Dec 29, 2017 01:57
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Less than a month, and people in the Ep 9 thread have run out of things to say. The prequels are back, as was inevitable. Prequels for life. Prequel supremacy.AndyElusive posted:I'm just pointing out even the actors who did it well still had a hard time forcing out those lines without them sounding like trash at the end of the day sometimes. But let's face it: you are unable to give a single example of a 'trash' line from A New Hope that was saved by extreme... exertion(?) by the actors. You haven't even established what you mean by 'trash' writing. This is because memes have infected you. You didn't look at any aspect of Ford's performance, or a single line of dialogue, before ostensibly talking about them. It doesn't matter to you if what you wrote is true or not, or even if it refers to anything that actually happened in reality. The meme just pulled the strings and you typed out words we've all seen before, as if in a trance.
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Dec 29, 2017 01:59
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dont even fink about it posted:To get to the root of the problem you have to figure out why people respond well to the Flash Gordon movie and not the prequels, and bridge that gap. I agree, Timothy Dalton should have been in the prequels.
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Dec 29, 2017 02:02
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I Before E posted:I agree, Timothy Dalton should have been in the prequels. The man is pure bliss on screen. Hot Fuzz is his best role imo and he would have made a great 80s Tony Stark/Iron Man.
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Dec 29, 2017 02:03
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I Before E posted:I agree, Timothy Dalton should have been in the prequels. I think Dalton and Blessed in a ham-off could only improve anything.
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Dec 29, 2017 02:04
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SuperMechagodzilla posted:This is because memes have infected you. Memes have subverted our expectations of dialog.
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Dec 29, 2017 02:07
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dont even fink about it posted:I think Dalton and Blessed in a ham-off could only improve anything. I'd like to add Tyler Perry to that. I've seen Turtles and Gone Girl and the man brings it, stealing scenes and hamming just right. But it'd be different sort of ham. You could probably add Michael Shannon to that and get the right type of ham.
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Dec 29, 2017 02:07
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There's always Episode IX for Dalton. He'd kill in a Star War.
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Dec 29, 2017 02:07
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