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JeremoudCorbynejad posted:The statue of liberty should be a wonder you build and then give to someone else
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Jan 6, 2018 10:32
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New casus belli: Freedom Fries.
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Jan 6, 2018 10:51
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More realistically and helpfully, the Statute of Liberty should give workers, not settlers.
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Jan 6, 2018 16:54
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Jesus, edge scrolling still isn't fixed... what the gently caress are they even doing with this game? I'm legit surprised it's even getting an expansion.
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Jan 6, 2018 17:59
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Deakul posted:Jesus, edge scrolling still isn't fixed... what the gently caress are they even doing with this game? I'm legit surprised it's even getting an expansion. Printing money, that's what
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Jan 6, 2018 18:47
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is it? i mean the name by itself is worth a lot, but is it performing beyond that or are they just burning off brand value for cash?
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Jan 6, 2018 19:07
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Deakul posted:Jesus, edge scrolling still isn't fixed... what the gently caress are they even doing with this game? I'm legit surprised it's even getting an expansion. I am rather astonished at the technical issues the game is still facing. As a game I actually rather like a lot of the new concepts introduced. But there's really no excuse for bugs like this, Alert being weird, and some multiplayer issues I've heard of.
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Jan 6, 2018 23:29
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The Human Crouton posted:Sorry 2K. Milton Tootoosis owns those pieces of human history. ate poo poo on live tv posted:As an American, I'm appalled that I wasn't consulted for America's inclusion in this video game. You guys are acting like real touchy assholes about this.
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Jan 6, 2018 23:33
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khwarezm posted:You guys are acting like real touchy assholes about this. Cree account spotted.
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Jan 6, 2018 23:37
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khwarezm posted:You guys are acting like real touchy assholes about this. gamer culture
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Jan 6, 2018 23:43
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The Human Crouton posted:Cree account spotted. No, seriously, I don't know what your problem is but the guy's concerns seem to be reasonable and well stated enough with a lot of credit given to the developers and their intentions (and in any event more than likely won't effect the game) and you seem to be taking maximum offense to it regardless.
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Jan 6, 2018 23:46
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khwarezm posted:No, seriously, I don't know what your problem is but the guy's concerns seem to be reasonable and well stated enough with a lot of credit given to the developers and their intentions (and in any event more than likely won't effect the game) and you seem to be taking maximum offense to it regardless. they're just jokes, my man
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Jan 7, 2018 00:03
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The Human Crouton posted:Cree account spotted. No that's me. Edit: please knock Mom! posted:gamer culture
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Jan 7, 2018 00:10
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boar guy posted:they're just jokes, my man Nothing funnier than calling Native Americans greedy when it comes to how they view portrayal of their culture.
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Jan 7, 2018 00:19
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khwarezm posted:No, seriously, I don't know what your problem is but the guy's concerns seem to be reasonable and well stated enough with a lot of credit given to the developers and their intentions (and in any event more than likely won't effect the game) and you seem to be taking maximum offense to it regardless. Reasonably stated would be: "Hey dudes, I see that the the tribe I currently represent has recently been made into a faction in a new video game. I'd like to take this opportunity to tell you that the abstraction of a video game does not fully represent our culture, and if you'd like to know more about the Cree and Poundmaker then visit Cree.com. We currently have a petition to exonerate Poundmaker for his false charges of treason. We encourage you to look into the details and help us exonerate this innocent man. If you need more details then contact us at..."
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Jan 7, 2018 00:38
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Played and won my first game on Prince last night. Pretty fun game, looking forward to learning how to actually play it correctly.
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Jan 7, 2018 00:40
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Tell me more how about how a native should comport themselves regarding potential issues with portrayals of natives by palefaces. 
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Jan 7, 2018 00:46
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native america isnt a real country
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Jan 7, 2018 00:56
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wow
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Jan 7, 2018 00:57
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The Human Crouton posted:Reasonably stated would be: "Hey dudes, I see that the the tribe I currently represent has recently been made into a faction in a new video game. I'd like to take this opportunity to tell you that the abstraction of a video game does not fully represent our culture, and if you'd like to know more about the Cree and Poundmaker then visit Cree.com. We currently have a petition to exonerate Poundmaker for his false charges of treason. We encourage you to look into the details and help us exonerate this innocent man. If you need more details then contact us at..." So, skulk in the corners in order to not offend gamers? First off, you seem to be basing this off the PCgamer article, which is really blowing what he said out of proportion. If you want a less slanted article on it, CBC did okay. Second, he mostly just wanted them to approach the community in the right way. As I said before, it seems like the dev team or whatever tried, so it's not like I'm blaming them, but there is a lot of reason to be a bit wary of how we're portrayed, even if Tootoosis might be overreacting, in my opinion. Tiberius Thyben fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Jan 7, 2018 |
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Jan 7, 2018 01:02
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I reject that Milton Tootoosis thinks he can decide how history is decided, I reject his strategy, and I reject that one must approach a council to make a game or otherwise.
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Jan 7, 2018 01:17
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Stairmaster posted:native america isnt a real country I'm going to assume you meant to include that with a little "  " icon, so my response will follow from that.But it's a game called Civilization, not Country-Nation! I mean, it's not like Greece under Pericles and Alexander (to name a couple of their leaders), wasn't a nation as we accept it today, but rather a loose collection of City-states!
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Jan 7, 2018 01:18
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I treat anyone who complains about what Civs or leaders are included for any reason with the same amount of derision, given the current selection. None of them are worth complaining about.
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Jan 7, 2018 01:23
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There's no country or culture in the world which can be depicted accurately in Civilization on that level, but if you're not already familiar with the series it's easy to understand such a response. All in all it doesn't seem to be that big of a deal one way or another.
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Jan 7, 2018 01:41
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The complaints are all really measured and even acknowledge that good might come of the Cree representation in the game, and all the complaints about the complaints remind me of the kind of people who complain about "SJWs", so while I personally think the Cree's inclusion in the game is a good thing and that Firaxis has been handling it well (outside of that they apparently might not have spoken to the tribes about it, which seems weird given how they've been going about this otherwise, but is definitely a thing they should have done since they're representing a historically and presently oppressed group who is still extant, and are representing a relatively recent portion of their history at that), as well as that some of the complaints seem a bit unfamiliar with the games and how they'll be represented in them, I also think that all the people bitching about Tootoosis's comments seem like huge assholes who should stop hanging out on Reddit and 4chan.
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Jan 7, 2018 02:09
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The best point he makes is that not all people value the accumulation of land and wealth as things to aspire to or as a measure of success, and so the inclusion of civilizations/peoples who don't value those things in a game that's pretty much geared for it doesn't respect those people's beliefs. The beauty of the game is that it does allow for other victory types, and that's where I think he was sort of wrong. But in order to really implement a civilization that's specifically anti-expansion and anti-wealth, you'd have to mess with the rules quite a bit, which is still not to say it couldn't be done- Venice in Civ V is a good example of a way to implement a different playstyle altogether.
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Jan 7, 2018 02:21
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american isnt even a race so i dont see how anything here is problematic
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Jan 7, 2018 02:36
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i wouldn't want my culture in this crap-rear end game either, so this cree guy is alright with me
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Jan 7, 2018 02:41
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Glass of Milk posted:The best point he makes is that not all people value the accumulation of land and wealth as things to aspire to or as a measure of success, and so the inclusion of civilizations/peoples who don't value those things in a game that's pretty much geared for it doesn't respect those people's beliefs. I disagree with him most strongly. I apologize for being so boisterous about this in a game thread, but this is something I'm pretty adamant about. I have a very strong interest in human history. My interest is a layman's interest, but still something I really care about. North American Native American history is a very difficult thing to figure out because they did not develop writing. Therefore we must rely on archaeological evidence and add a bit of story telling history to possibly fit in pieces. We know more about Egypt 4000 years ago than we do North America 700 years ago because Egypt and its neighbors wrote poo poo down. I object to people pretending that they have a better idea of their tribal history because they have been decided to be the judge in a game of telephone. This is not any judgement against the Cree or any other tribe. I am only saying that all record of human history, including archaeological digs of North American tribes, have shown that humans kill and take land. Not writing the fact that wars happened does not mean they did not happen.
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Jan 7, 2018 02:47
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The Human Crouton posted:I disagree with him most strongly. I apologize for being so boisterous about this in a game thread, but this is something I'm pretty adamant about. While I'll say that the idea that the first nations didn't war and conquer like any other peoples on Earth did raise my eyebrows, I think I can give him some slack considering the recent history of Native Americans. He's not really wrong when he says "Poundmaker was certainly not in the same frame of mind as the colonial powers" given what was going on when Poundmaker was active and the Cree were generally a much more open society compared to both the white settlers and a lot of the other Indian cultures in America. If he's worried that the game would end up portraying them as a harsh empire I can see why he might say something. In any event, characterizing him as just some butthurt baby was less boisterous and more lovely.
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Jan 7, 2018 03:37
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This is a real fun and good conversation.
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Jan 7, 2018 05:12
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My people Nazca/Paracas even Chincha according to some theories got crushed by the Incas and as a Peruvian I still want them on the game. Mourning and respecting is fine, but so is starting over, that's how Civilizations develop.
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Jan 7, 2018 05:35
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The Human Crouton posted:I object to people pretending that they have a better idea of their tribal history because they have been decided to be the judge in a game of telephone. This is not any judgement against the Cree or any other tribe. I am only saying that all record of human history, including archaeological digs of North American tribes, have shown that humans kill and take land. Not writing the fact that wars happened does not mean they did not happen. Sure, I get that. Paleolithic peoples would certainly fight over resources themselves, and even Poundmaker himself was party to violence against the Canadian army. On the other hand, I don't believe that there was a systemic attempt to increase land for a central government- there was nobody planting a Cree flag in some territory or something, and if the resources moved the people would pretty much give up the land. We see maps today of the Native American nations that showed their ranging, but aside from some specific places they didn't really have the same understanding of land ownership that other civilizations did. I take your point, though.
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Jan 7, 2018 08:12
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Gandhi of all people lusts for nuclear weapons in the game and will annihilate other civilizations with them. I don't think that's disrespecting his legacy because it's just a game and players can play how they want to. If they screwed up some historical facts or showed them in an inaccurate light I would understand. But it seems like their unique traits cast them favorably and accurate.
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Jan 7, 2018 08:26
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Civ6 is now on humble monthly for like fifteen bucks and I'm so tempted, but I've been following this thread since release and I have a sinking feeling that it's still poo poo, and I'll need to wait another 2-3 years until a "Complete" edition arrives before it's playable/good value/worth my time. 
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Jan 7, 2018 08:51
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Civ 6 was good and fun on release
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Jan 7, 2018 09:25
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Serephina posted:Civ6 is now on humble monthly for like fifteen bucks and I'm so tempted, but I've been following this thread since release and I have a sinking feeling that it's still poo poo, and I'll need to wait another 2-3 years until a "Complete" edition arrives before it's playable/good value/worth my time. This comes up a lot and its always the same. Some hate its current state and tell people to wait. Others, such as myself, have enjoyed it despite its many issues. The expansion is roughly a month away and $12 is a great price. Edit: Holy poo poo, I'm already at 300 hours played.
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Jan 7, 2018 11:26
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Serephina posted:Civ6 is now on humble monthly for like fifteen bucks and I'm so tempted, but I've been following this thread since release and I have a sinking feeling that it's still poo poo, and I'll need to wait another 2-3 years until a "Complete" edition arrives before it's playable/good value/worth my time. I think "poo poo" is too far but it's definitely not very good.
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Jan 7, 2018 11:42
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Just buy it, it's only fifteen bucks. It can even be bad at that price. But it's not.
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Jan 7, 2018 11:52
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I wouldn't bother spending the time. Life's too short to play things that aren't good.
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Jan 7, 2018 12:30
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