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Lightning Lord posted:What about Jean Gray? She destroyed entire star systems as the Phoenix. Didn’t they retroactively make it not her so that she was in a coma in a space pod in the Hudson River the whole time?
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Jan 18, 2018 01:51
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So, I just found out that the current spider-man cartoon massively leaks all over. The season finale is up on youtube, via a choppy leak of the hindu release. Someone recorded bits of episode 21 with their phone. For the complaint that too many characters have spider-powers in the show: Episodes 20 and 21 are straight up Spider-Island. All of NYC gets spider powers and it's really fun how people just swing around.
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Jan 18, 2018 01:56
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Samuringa posted:The Illuminati is kinda of a reverse, right? They are all - arguably - heroes who decided they were powerful enough to play puppet master. Dr strange blew up a bunch of worlds on his own during secret wars in addition to what he did with the Illuminati, if that counts
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Jan 18, 2018 01:59
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site posted:Dr strange blew up a bunch of worlds on his own during secret wars in addition to what he did with the Illuminati, if that counts None of that Secret Wars poo poo counts.
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Jan 18, 2018 02:12
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Brief graphic nudity?
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Jan 18, 2018 02:49
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Has Magneto actually done really bad stuff? I feel like I don't know of anything that he has actually done. I know he has been a bad guy and had has some big bad plans, but I can't think of a time he actually did something even on the level of like, Carnage. Also, Emma Frost has waffled between hero and villain, right? I imagine she has an interesting rap sheet.
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Jan 18, 2018 03:54
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He was an X-men villain for 50 years, I'm sure he must've done something really bad.
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Jan 18, 2018 03:57
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There was a whole thing in the Jim Lee era where he was sort of trying to be a good guy (as he does) and they found this sub or ship or something that he sank in this old storyline that was just full of dead soldiers who suffocated. Wolverine tried to gut him then and there. Morrison also had him kill basically everyone in NYC but nobody talks about that anymore. He might not be as out of control as Carnage or Joker or whatever, but he's got at least hundreds of innocent deaths on his hands.
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Jan 18, 2018 03:59
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Lurdiak posted:There was a whole thing in the Jim Lee era where he was sort of trying to be a good guy (as he does) and they found this sub or ship or something that he sank in this old storyline that was just full of dead soldiers who suffocated. Wolverine tried to gut him then and there. As bad as it sounds, I feel like killing soldiers kind of doesn't count by comic book standards. Also lol at the idea that that would trigger Wolverine for some reason. Dude almost certainly has more confirmed kills on screen than Magneto. And his methods are pretty much all stabbing or cutting people to death.
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Jan 18, 2018 04:02
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ToastyPotato posted:Has Magneto actually done really bad stuff? I feel like I don't know of anything that he has actually done. I know he has been a bad guy and had has some big bad plans, but I can't think of a time he actually did something even on the level of like, Carnage. Maybe more bad-rear end than bad but he ripped the adamantium out of Wolverine.
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Jan 18, 2018 04:02
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It was the excruciating manner in which they had died he had an issue with.
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Jan 18, 2018 04:03
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Lurdiak posted:It was the excruciating manner in which they had died he had an issue with. I mean, did Magneto say he had a reason for doing it? Did he proclaim that he enjoyed their suffering or something? Lobok posted:Maybe more bad-rear end than bad but he ripped the adamantium out of Wolverine. I guess that is technically a bad thing, but Wolverine survived, as he knew he would, and Wolverine is not exactly some innocent bystander. I dunno. Maybe I need one of those "Magneto Was Right" shirts. 
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Jan 18, 2018 04:06
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IIRC he just killed them because they were trying to stop him from doing a terrorism. Magneto's a villain.
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Jan 18, 2018 04:10
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Lurdiak posted:Morrison also had him kill basically everyone in NYC but nobody talks about that anymore. From what I remember, that was near immediately retconned as being done by Xorn. No, not that Xorn. The other Xorn. The first one. No, no, the other first one.
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Jan 18, 2018 04:35
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Codependent Poster posted:Brief graphic nudity? You're gonna find out why they call him Captain Boomerang.
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Jan 18, 2018 04:39
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Kurui Reiten posted:From what I remember, that was near immediately retconned as being done by Xorn. I think retcons were involved in rehabilitating Hal Jordan too.
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Jan 18, 2018 04:43
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Kurui Reiten posted:From what I remember, that was near immediately retconned as being done by Xorn. Well he also sent some kind of electromagnetic pulse from space that hosed up the entire planet that one time. That's gotta be in the thousands of deaths.
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Jan 18, 2018 04:44
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FilthyImp posted:"What? That show for a series that won't sell toys didn't get the ratings when we put it in a 6am timeslot on alternating Tuesdays? Well guess we'll have to kill it" I think it's more the kind of rivalry where their mutual owner requires Cartoon Network to show DC cartoons, but doesn't allow them to charge very much money for the privilege, so they would much prefer to show nearly anything else. (Teen Titans Go is under a different arrangement, apparently, or else they wouldn't show it at 100% of all times.)
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Jan 18, 2018 06:00
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I think in his first appearance, he was trying to steal missiles from an army base, and he's had a lot of similar run-ins since. At the very least he's always making some kind of trouble like a rogue state. There are some fun stories in the 80s where he's trying to stop racism but in ways that are somehow immoral, like his anti-racism mind control helmet, or this gem in Secret wars after he spent like 2 issues making out with wasp and lays out his plan to take the Beyonder up on his challenge and use a victory to create a world of harmony.  The most evil scum since Hitler.
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Jan 18, 2018 06:16
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He is pretty much saying. "Yo lets murder anyone who oppose us in creating our Utopia." The exact some thing Doom wants to do.
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Jan 18, 2018 06:52
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MonsterEnvy posted:He is pretty much saying. "Yo lets murder anyone who oppose us in creating our Utopia." The exact some thing Doom wants to do. Ehhhh, it seems more like he feels Doom is going to ask to be made ruler of the world, which he doesn't think will be a good thing, and that he would rather ask for world peace. He wants to kill Doom to prevent him from getting that wish. He brings up killing anyone else who tries to stop him, but really, he is saying he will kill anyone that tries to stop him from making the wish of world peace. That doesn't seem so bad. 
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Jan 18, 2018 07:02
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Doom actually created world peace at one point in time, it just involved a lot of mind control and he got bored with it, that's why I like his hero turn, he's just creating a new challenge for himself.
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Jan 18, 2018 07:09
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The issue should be the standard "superheroes don't kill" rule, since the people Mags is talking about killing are already trying to kill the heroes for their ultimate goal, but they really quickly dismiss Magneto as being some kind of powermad maniac. For comparison, back in 2012 marvel rounded up a bunch of the extraneous teenage characters and did a hunger games, leaving almost half of them dead for reals at the end of it all. Times sure have changed.
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Jan 18, 2018 07:25
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Magneto has historically been more of a "leader of a rogue state/political terrorist" than a mass murderer. iirc the guys in that sub died during the events of Uncanny #150, when he issues an ultimatum to the world to cede political control to him or be destroyed. The USSR responds by sending a nuclear submarine to launch missiles at his island base, and Magneto disarms the missiles and sinks the sub. He then uses an earthquake machine to destroy a Russian city in retaliation - but he gives them a few hours' warning to evacuate first, and no-one dies in the city's destruction. This is actually also the story where Claremont revamps Magneto as an anti-hero rather than a straight villain. It ends with Storm convincing him of the folly of his tyrannical approach to seeking peace and then he straight up doesn't appear for dozens of issues before returning, having reformed and seeking reconciliation with the X-Men. He would only heel turn again much, much later. For a long time his redemption was played as totally genuine, and marked a sea change from the "retro" X-Men era, where straightforward heroes fought simplistic villains, to Claremont's superhero soap opera, where characters had inner lives and dramatic motivations.
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Jan 18, 2018 13:08
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I like Magneto, he's a nuanced complex character. But yeah he has done straight up super villain stuff. Ignoring the ret-conned Morrison stuff and all his attempts at killing the X-Men, he has stolen nuclear weapons, sunk a Russian nuclear sub killing all on-board, later stealing the nuclear weapons from said sub to arm Asteroid M. Then there are the natural disasters (in Fatal Attractions he shut down all power on the planet.)That would in theory kill millions. Even if you say "superheroes worked over time to catch falling planes" that should still leave thousands dead. Also her inverted the planet's magnetic poles. That has to be bad for the planet. Also one time he messed with the Earth's EM field to effect the astral plane so Psychics would have a harder time using their powers. That's just mean.
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Jan 18, 2018 13:45
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All the nuclear weapons stuff isn't super bad though. He's never actually used his nukes, just tried to use them as a bargaining chip to get people to accept his agenda. The sub he sunk was about to launch a nuclear missile at his home base, so he's reasonably covered on self defense/act of war there. I'm sure in his fifty+ years of publication Magneto's done some awful things, though. He's a mess of a character by now if you try to take everything as canon in the same way as, say, Charles Xavier (who lusted after Jean Grey and got a secret team of X-Men killed and did various other shady things across the full breadth of his publication history) and Scott Summers (who abandoned his wife and newborn child to go pal around with X-Force without telling her where he was) are.
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Jan 18, 2018 14:57
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Seriously though, I've never gotten over how X-Men canon just skates over Scott being a deadbeat dad who walks out on his wife and his new baby without even telling her his whereabouts, and spends his time away from her hanging out with his old pals and mooning over Jean Grey, without even so much as calling his wife (who doesn't know where he is or why he's been gone for so long). That pretty much forever ruins Cyclops if you don't glaze over it.
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Jan 18, 2018 15:03
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The Question IRL posted:I like Magneto, he's a nuanced complex character. But yeah he has done straight up super villain stuff. I thought inverting the poles was something Ultimate Mags did. It's what led to Ultimatum, cementing him as one of history's greatest monsters.
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Jan 18, 2018 17:08
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It evens out a little when it turns out that his wife was some kind of horrible goblin clone all along, but yeah, there was a lot of fuckery involved in making X-Factor. He went back to see his family after a little while, but by then they had all mysteriously vanished. His wife and kid he eventually found (before they turned into a goblin clone and old man cyborg respectively), but his grandparents are probably super dead. The role that Cyclops has settled into is the guy who leads because nobody else wants the responsibility, and everybody already hates him because he's kind of a jerk, so they're all ready to blame him for anything that goes wrong, and his life has otherwise been a long series of tragedies. He is the guy whose job it is to tell everybody else to stop having fun while at the same time not being allowed to have any fun himself. Everybody hates him for pretty understandable reasons, and yet he was always my favorite character as a kid who I sympathized the most with.
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Jan 18, 2018 17:10
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Cyclops has always loving sucked
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Jan 18, 2018 17:14
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TwoPair posted:I thought inverting the poles was something Ultimate Mags did. It's what led to Ultimatum, cementing him as one of history's greatest monsters. He did something at one of the poles that lead to the U.N. making him King of Genosha. I read that story like 2 months ago and damned if I can't remember what his original plan was.
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Jan 18, 2018 18:45
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Skwirl posted:He did something at one of the poles that lead to the U.N. making him King of Genosha. I read that story like 2 months ago and damned if I can't remember what his original plan was. I actually had that issue as a kid, I remember it led to Joseph sacrificing himself to stop it/put the poles back. Afterwards a jet lands and some UN guy says that they will meet his demands and give him Genosha.
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Jan 18, 2018 20:04
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That story had some pretty good Alan Davis art but that's all I remember from it.
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Jan 18, 2018 21:08
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ArmyOfMidgets posted:So, I just found out that the current spider-man cartoon massively leaks all over. The season finale is up on youtube, via a choppy leak of the hindu release. Someone recorded bits of episode 21 with their phone. There's the rumor of this and all Marvel Disney XD shows being cancelled. Unfortunately I could see this happening...
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Jan 19, 2018 00:05
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good day for a bris posted:I actually had that issue as a kid, I remember it led to Joseph sacrificing himself to stop it/put the poles back. Afterwards a jet lands and some UN guy says that they will meet his demands and give him Genosha. So what you're saying is you don't remember his original plan either. Why did anyone read comics in the 90's?
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Jan 19, 2018 00:12
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They didn't, they collected them.
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Jan 19, 2018 00:15
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Lurdiak posted:They didn't, they collected them. I was actually reading Spider-Man during the Clone Saga and my dad would buy 2 copies of everything (one for me to read and one to save for investment) if he'd put that money into a normal savings account I wouldn't have any student debt.
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Jan 19, 2018 00:42
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Skwirl posted:So what you're saying is you don't remember his original plan either. I believe his plan was to force the UN to give him Genosha by threatening to reverse the poles and kill humanity. I'm not going to say it was one of his greater plans, but that was the entire thing.
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Jan 19, 2018 00:53
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good day for a bris posted:I believe his plan was to force the UN to give him Genosha by threatening to reverse the poles and kill humanity. I'm not going to say it was one of his greater plans, but that was the entire thing. It worked so it was a pretty good plan really.
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Jan 19, 2018 01:03
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ThermoPhysical posted:There's the rumor of this and all Marvel Disney XD shows being cancelled. Unfortunately I could see this happening... Aw, man.  I can see that, I follow a few of the animators on the show and iirc they all say former employees at Marvel Animation. Makes sense to just clean the slate with what they're going for, sucks that the first show to really break from their stale animated universe gets caught up in this...
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Jan 19, 2018 01:12
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