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abraham linksys posted:I dunno, I felt like I was being pretty reasonable.
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Jan 20, 2018 15:44
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Personally I'd sooner cut out Dublin than Edinburgh. Nothing wrong with Dublin, but in a direct comparison... if you do want to see Ireland, the West coast is very nice too.
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Jan 20, 2018 15:48
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abraham linksys posted:Yeah, this makes sense; I didn't realize I'd be gambling on weather for Switzerland in mid-April. I'd really like to add in some kind of, well, nature or out-of-town historical thing, though. I guess my best options would be like... France or Germany? Your best option to make the travel more sane without cutting anything out (although IMO you should cut out a thing or two) is to fly from Paris to Rome, then do Rome -> Florence -> Venice -> Munich. Flights are wayyy cheaper than trains and it'll save you a TON of time compared to buses (like really 15-20 hours of in-bus / in-train time compared to your current itinerary). The vast, vast, vast majority of the time you don't see anything from the windows of public transport in Europe. Basically all of the "fastest route" public transit routes through Europe show you nothing of interest out the window for the entire visit. Even going through Switzerland (where I live and have done basically every route), the routes you would take if you don't go out of your way to take scenic routes are incredibly boring views, or at best give you a few minutes of something nice. E.g. the train from Zurich to Milan now has hardly any view since 2016 when the new tunnel opened, and now you get like 3 minutes of Lake Lucern and 2 minutes of Lake Lugano out of the full 3.5 hour trip. The mountain route is nice but way slower and the same price. The only really nice train ride I can think of that a normal commuter would take is between Geneva and Montreux. Also on another note Verona is kind of a hassle of a mid-day stopover from Venice->Munich. It's a direct, no-change train from Venice to Munich. You could stop if you really wanted to and take the next train, but then you'd have to book two separate tickets which sounds like unnecessary hassle just to see Verona for a few hours. That said Verona is fine for a 4 hour visit. E: Essentially every train station in Europe has luggage lockers. Not sure about the UK where they're insanely paranoid about Irish people bombing stuff, but everywhere else you can find luggage lockers. Saladman fucked around with this message at 16:18 on Jan 20, 2018 |
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Jan 20, 2018 16:08
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abraham linksys posted:I also figured train stations might have luggage storage that would make this more reasonable, but maybe I'm off-base on that. To answer this one: I know that some larger stations in some countries in Europe have luggage storage. I have no idea how universal that is. It fully depends on whatever company operates the station.
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Jan 20, 2018 16:15
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Saladman posted:Why so specific around Gare de Lyon? It's really not a nice area of central Paris. I go through Paris pretty often (couple times a year, over many years) and while I always go through Gare de Lyon, I always try to get out of that area ASAP. Most restaurants in Paris aren't particularly tourist-oriented once you get out of the Latin Quarter, the Champs Elysee, and a few other specific places right around major tourist landmarks. My hotel (CitizenM) is basically 200m from the station. I've been to Paris a couple of times in the past and I definitely plan on getting out of the area, but I was carious to see if there was anything worthwhile in the vicinity. Thanks for letting me know about Le Marais, I was planning on heading to L'As du Fallafel at some point and didn't realize it was that close
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Jan 20, 2018 16:44
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abraham linksys posted:I dunno, I felt like I was being pretty reasonable. The Milan and Verona stopovers are because they're literally along the train route to my next destinations, so why not get off and walk around a bit? I also figured train stations might have luggage storage that would make this more reasonable, but maybe I'm off-base on that. Yes, train stations is major cities like these should have luggage storage. I'd spend a week in London (although you said you had already been there for two weeks so up to you), Paris, Rome, and Amsterdam. I'd leave out Dublin, Munich and Brussels. Can't comment much on Italy, but 2 days should be enough for Venice. I hear Lisbon is nice but I don't know how much to stay there.
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Jan 20, 2018 17:01
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webmeister posted:What are you interested in? Nature? History? Beaches? Architecture? Partying? Bragging rights? Food? History above all else, followed by architecture and nature I suppose. I haven't done much traveling tbh
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Jan 20, 2018 19:39
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Honestly I'd only cut out a couple of things as others have said. Munich and Brussels (and maybe Dublin) would be the obvious candidates, and then spread out your spare days amongst the rest. If you're really keen on adding another stop, maybe Strasbourg? A lot of train stations on the continent have luggage storage, but check in advance before counting on it! We actually just used it the other day in Pisa, we left Cinque Terre in the morning, did a 3 hour stop in Pisa with our luggage in the storage lockers, then continued on to Florence. We've used it in other places too - Amsterdam and a couple of German cities from memory, usually when we have to arrive in the morning and can't check in to an Airbnb until late afternoon.
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Jan 20, 2018 19:43
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Also if anyone's interested about Florence, yesterday was drizzly and overcast so it wasn't super busy. The line at the Duomo was still on the steps, and there was no queue at the Uffizi. Inside it felt fine, there were school groups and other tour groups rushing through so if you avoided them it was fine. Though it felt like most people just wander through looking for the Birth of Venus and then head downstairs to the Leonardo work. We spent probably ten minutes in a room downstairs with the Raphael works, almost completely alone the whole time. Today however, the sun's out and it's quite busy, though this is my first time in Florence thus I have no real barometer. My wife reckons it's busier than when she was here in April 2003. It seems like the largest group here today are contingents of obnoxious American college kids which has surprised me. After that it's Japanese (and or Korean, I can't easily tell) groups, local tourists, and of course the Chinese in their comical flouro gear.
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Jan 20, 2018 19:55
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curried lamb of God posted:Any recommendations for good and affordable restaurants in the Gare de Lyon/12ème arrondissement area? Mon français n'est pas mal, so they don't have to be tourist-oriented places. I enjoyed Les Garnements (17 Rue Michel Chasles) for a casual meal. I don't mind the 12e, but the Marais is definitely going to be more hip. edit: Plus the Coulée verte René Dumont that runs by there is pretty cool.
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Jan 21, 2018 02:20
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For any of you guys living in Europe, if you'd never been before and had 14 days in January, where would you go ? Wife is really super keen on Disneyland in Paris, we both like food and beer, pretty scenery and probably places that are less crowded, not really sure where to go as there's just so much stuff to choose from, and I'm trying not to try to cram what should be a 6 month tour into two weeks. I've done a bit of solo travel in Indonesia and we did 6 weeks in SE Asia when our first child was 5 months old but haven't been overseas since then. We're travelling from Australia. Really appreciate any suggestions you can give.
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Jan 22, 2018 08:06
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StealthBus posted:For any of you guys living in Europe, if you'd never been before and had 14 days in January, where would you go ? Are you restricted to one city/country for budget reasons, or are your options wide open? With 14 days I'd say probably pick 3-4 cities tops, which gives you enough time in each to see some of the major stuff. Have you been to Europe before? A triangle between Paris/London/Amsterdam would probably be the best assuming you've got the budget for it, just bear in mind that the weather in January is gonna be poo poo no matter where you are (though in southern Europe it'll obviously be less poo poo).
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Jan 22, 2018 08:10
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Drone posted:Are you restricted to one city/country for budget reasons, or are your options wide open? No, planned budget would be up to 13000 Euro, happy spend less obviously but this is for our 5th wedding anniversary and 10th year together and the first significant amount of time without our children so we're keen to have a good time without stressing about the cost of things. I know January isn't the best but it's the only time we can get the kids looked after, and we've both never seen snow. I hadn't really considered London because I think I'd rather see stuff that's a bit more different than here.
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Jan 22, 2018 08:17
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StealthBus posted:I hadn't really considered London because I think I'd rather see stuff that's a bit more different than here. I'd still recommend it. London is really a unique city. Of course "different from here" probably depends heavily on where in Australia you're from I guess. In that case, Paris/Amsterdam are definitely still on the list. You could go to Bruges or somewhere in Belgium and round out that bit of the continent, or go a bit farther afield for Munich or Berlin.
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Jan 22, 2018 08:22
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Drone posted:I'd still recommend it. London is really a unique city. Of course "different from here" probably depends heavily on where in Australia you're from I guess. What about Barcelona as a replacement city ? Friend went a year ago and took lots of awesome photos of public art.
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Jan 22, 2018 08:26
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January's great if you like indoors stuff (since it's not prime holiday season) or winter sports. Actually, if you're looking for snow, unfamiliar scenery, and some peace and privacy without kids northern Scandinavia ticks pretty much all the boxes. Not exactly a cultural or culinary centre, but definitely less crowded if you want something very different instead of a 3rd or 4th major city.
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Jan 22, 2018 08:28
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StealthBus posted:What about Barcelona as a replacement city ? Friend went a year ago and took lots of awesome photos of public art. Barcelona is fantastic. I was there on a work trip in October and unfortunately didn't get to see much of it, but what I did see places it in my top cities in Europe so far. People are great, food is great, the sights are great, the architecture is great, the weather is great, the beer is great. The only downside is that the political situation is... not great. But that's not likely to impact you at all.
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Jan 22, 2018 08:28
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Drone posted:Barcelona is fantastic. I was there on a work trip in October and unfortunately didn't get to see much of it, but what I did see places it in my top cities in Europe so far. Seconding this. If you weren't eyeing Disneyland I might say Barcelona would be better than Paris if you've never been to Europe. You've got the art and architecture and food and beer and wine and all the touristy stuff you might want, but fewer tourists (though you'll still find more than enough drunk young people from [Insert European Country] to fulfil whatever need you might have for them) and Parisians.
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Jan 22, 2018 08:30
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If you want to see snow, Paris is far too south for that to be guaranteed. That aside it's obviously brilliant, especially if you have any interest in European history, arts or literature
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Jan 22, 2018 10:44
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If you want to experience some winter weather and maybe try skiing, but still be somewhat near mild weather as well... Granada/Sierra Nevada in Spain? I'm thinking perhaps the Alhambra also won't be completely loving packed with tourists like it is in the summer, if you want to see that.
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Jan 22, 2018 14:53
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Disneyland Paris is honestly pretty poo poo, but if your wife is totally set on it then go nuts I guess. Personally, coming from Australia, I would do: Paris - 4 days fly to Rome - 5 days train to Venice - 2 days bus to Cortina d'Ampezzo - 3 days Culturally, Italian ski resorts look and feel a lot more Austrian/German than what you'd consider Italian, but still have the way better food. That way you're experiencing three distinct cultures (French, Italian, German) while not having to spend huge days travelling from place to place. You'll also (almost certainly) see snow in Cortina, and depending on what time in January you'll be there you could see a women's world cup ski race as well, which is super cool to see in Europe.
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Jan 22, 2018 15:54
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I thought I'd already posted this but apparently not? Anyway, Disneyland sounds absolutely awful in January. I haven't been, and haven't been to a theme park since I was a teenager, but still going to any theme park while it's 2°C and drizzling sounds like a miserable time. Yeah there are no lines, but there's a reason there are no lines. Depends what you like doing of course, but if you like rides, then it sounds like a pretty awful time. I think the 100% chance of rain is worse than the kind-of cold (although for an Australian, it will probably feel -very- cold). I agree with you about skipping London though. Go somewhere more different from Australia, like Italy or Spain or southern France. Paris is dark and depressing in January, and there's so much more to Europe than seeing paintings in famous museums. Also yeah, as others have said there is not that much snow in most of Europe in January at sea-level or near-sea-level. You have to go up to guarantee snow, like above 600 meters in elevation to be pretty much guaranteed to find it. Going to a "pick two" between {coastal Spain (or even Madrid), Italy, coastal Balkans} and {some mountain ski area near a major airport} seems like a good way to travel around. Greece is IMO less interesting in winter as the best sites are the islands, and wow they are closed down in winter (or at least, Santorini is basically closed from November until March). Booking in advance is such a bummer though. I live in the Alps so maybe I'm biased since I can wait for good weather and not go to the mountains when it's awful, but... at least the last two weeks have been absolutely 100% unenjoyable for anyone unlucky enough to be there right now. It's so bad they're helicoptering people out of Zermatt (where the Matterhorn is) and that's not even the first time that's happened this year. That said this year has been exceptionally a terrible time to be in the Alps. Or Europe in January in general.
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Jan 22, 2018 16:37
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It's the lack of daylight that kills me in a European winter. Not just the short hours, but the constant cloud cover as well. I reckon in our two months in Germany, we'd get maybe one sunny day every two weeks - and even then it wouldn't last all day! It's nicer down here in Italy, but still a long way from what I'm used to. Winter in Sydney is cold (for me, ~10 degrees during the day), but it's still pretty sunny a lot of the time. Though apparently it's been the darkest winter on record? https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/jan/19/aint-no-sunshine-winter-darkest-europe
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Jan 22, 2018 17:09
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Trust me, dark days beat sunny nights.
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Jan 22, 2018 17:54
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Waci posted:Trust me, dark days beat sunny nights. What an absurd thing to say
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Jan 22, 2018 21:29
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Waci posted:Trust me, dark days beat sunny nights. I'll have a chance to test this theory soon enough - we're planning a five week road trip north through Sweden, right up to Hammerfest and then back down the length of Norway during June this year. Keen to check out the midnight sun! In 2017 we spent the summer solstice on the Orkneys north of Scotland which had a sunset at about 10:30pm, but now I need to go all the way!
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Jan 22, 2018 22:25
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Any reason to prefer TAP over Vuelling or vice versa? Need to go from Barcelona to Lisbon.
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Jan 23, 2018 05:04
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Since Venice has been coming up lately... Four tourists charged €1100 for steaks, fish plate and water
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Jan 23, 2018 09:51
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Ras Het posted:What an absurd thing to say It was such an absurd thing to say that I didn't even understand what he meant the first several times I read it. The only way it makes sense is if Waci is literally a vampire or if he has never heard of blackout curtains.
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Jan 23, 2018 12:42
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Doctor Malaver posted:Since Venice has been coming up lately... Apparently this kind of scam is quite common in Lisbon as well; the smooth-talking, friendly waiter ushers you inside, recommends/talks you into today's special while not mentioning the price. Then they just charge whatever they want. Oh and the restaurant changes names every couple of months so all the negative reviews on TripAdvisor disappear.
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Jan 23, 2018 17:48
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webmeister posted:Apparently this kind of scam is quite common in Lisbon as well; the smooth-talking, friendly waiter ushers you inside, recommends/talks you into today's special while not mentioning the price. Then they just charge whatever they want. Oh and the restaurant changes names every couple of months so all the negative reviews on TripAdvisor disappear. They got me with this in Havana one time but I was only out $15 or something, which isn't really too bad in the scheme of things.
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Jan 23, 2018 18:39
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Yes, avoid all the identical-looking restaurants with identical-looking menus east of Baixa-Chiado station and in the Rua das Portas de Santo Antao in Lisbon, where people try to talk you inside. In fact, you're better off avoiding any restaurant anywhere where people try to talk you inside. If it was any good they wouldn't need to do that, people would just go there.
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Jan 23, 2018 19:01
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Entropist posted:In fact, you're better off avoiding any restaurant anywhere where people try to talk you inside. This is a golden rule of travel, honestly. I don't mind a busy waiter approaching as I glance at a menu, but someone actively touting is a 100% avoid, 100% of the time. Apparently with those Japanese tourists in Venice, it seems like they went to a restaurant that shows the weight price rather than the serving price. So the menu shows steak for 20 euros - but the fine print is that it's per 100g, and the steaks all weigh 500g. Order four of those, plus a couple of grilled fish where you've made the same mistake, and it's going to add up  Side note - I was in the Mercato in Florence a couple of nights ago, and although I decided against one of those giant Tuscan T-bone steaks for like 50 euros, this homeless guy bought one and then basically ate it in a "one bit for me, one bit for you" method with his dog :-/
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Jan 23, 2018 19:40
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PT6A posted:They got me with this in Havana one time but I was only out $15 or something, which isn't really too bad in the scheme of things. To me it happened in Brussels but also on a small scale. Two of us were supposed to get a great offer and eat both for only €35. After we already started eating the waiter apologized that there had been a "mistake" and they'll have to charge us €48. And when the check came it turned out that it was per person. I complained and they brought it down to €70. So it wasn't outrageous like in Venice but it left us with a sour taste.
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Jan 23, 2018 20:44
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Re: Lisbonwebmeister posted:It's probably something like the government has made good deals with airlines to offer cheap flights into Lisbon and Porto to bring in the tourists, while at the same time working hard with media companies, ~~~~social media influencers~~~~ etc to make it the new happening destination. I don't really bother with the whole travel blogging cottage industry, but I know plenty of people who do, and yeah that's basically how it works. I'd love to go back sometime as a tourist, I dug it. I loved wandering up some crazy steep, winding streets in the middle of the night, ending up outside some nondescript bar, and when you walk in and back to the back porch you find yourself looking out over the entire city. I could spend a week just doing a walking tour of the sidewalks.
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Jan 23, 2018 21:47
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anyone have hostel recommendations for Rome? my friend who lived there for a few months looked at this Hostelworld map and went "yeah zero of these areas are places I would ever stay for five days," but her Rome knowledge is ~a decade out of date and I'm hoping maybe it's not as sketchy as she's worried about  also taking hostel/area recs for Paris, another city I know nothin about There does seem to at least be a lot of B&Bs that are $40-60 night with Booking.com deals, which I might do instead (e.g. this one). Seems like those are further out of the tourist areas while still transit-accessible? abraham linksys fucked around with this message at 15:10 on Jan 25, 2018 |
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Jan 25, 2018 14:56
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If you want to book a bed in a shared dormitory, you will not be able to go any cheaper than hostels, which cost like €10-€15/night in Rome and a little more in Paris. If you want to book a private room in a hostel, don't, as you can book a room in an AirBnB for significantly cheaper and it'll be way nicer. It's sort of a tossup as far as meeting people between hostel vs. shared apartment airbnbs. Anywhere in central Rome is fine, same for Paris. Staying near train stations everywhere in Europe is usually sketchy, but usually it just feels sketchy and it's not particularly unsafe.
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Jan 25, 2018 15:31
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abraham linksys posted:anyone have hostel recommendations for Rome? The Beehive, the owners are American if that provides any peace of mind https://www.the-beehive.com/ Rome is a safe city other than some petty crime, of which I have not personally witnessed. Almost all the hostels are around Termini, but the biggest spot for pickpockets, from what I heard, is the train station at the airport which offers non-stop to Termini. Even the ticket machines there will warn you to keep your poo poo safe. Just take precautions you would anywhere that's high trafficked and touristy as well as on the metro, and you'll be fine.
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Jan 25, 2018 17:16
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I found Rome to be very safe, though I was never out late at night or anything. I stayed right next to Basilica Papale di Santa Maria Maggiore because it was equidistant from the train station and the Colosseum.
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Jan 25, 2018 17:20
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Italian cities for whatever reason just have really lovely (or non-existent) cleaning services, so there's often garbage strewn everywhere and loads of graffiti which can be a culture shock. Particularly for middle class westerners who assume graffiti = bad area. As others have said, the only real danger aside from drunken 2am wandering is from pickpockets and there are pretty easy obvious ways to protect yourself against that. Also, Tuscany update: it's ridiculously quiet here. The weather's been fantastic the last few days as we've been driving around - bright sunshine and about 15 degrees during the day. We've done Siena, San Gimignano, Pienza and the Val d'Orcia and there's almost nobody here. Even quieter than Cinque Terre. Yes, most of the shops and restaurants are closed, but there's still enough options to find lunch and dinner when you need to. If you don't feel compelled to have a super-hot holiday in Italy, late winter is pretty great.
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Jan 25, 2018 18:06
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