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divabot posted:I have been bloviating about writing a book with the working title Roko's Basilisk, content to be precisely what you'd expect. So far I have 0 words actually written as words, and no idea how to actually approach this. You should open with"let us presume that we are hosed"
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Jan 22, 2018 10:01
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BENGHAZI 2 posted:You should open with"let us presume that we are hosed" Sounds familiar. Someone may have already used this one. I might start with A Basilisk FAQ. Short Version 1) Should I donate to MIRI? No. 2) But I keep seeing all this stuff in the blogs about them and how No. Pop science journalism is uniformly terrible, always remember this. 3) How does this poo poo work? It doesn't make any sense! No, it really doesn't. It's impossible to accurately explain the ideas behind the Basilisk in anything less than mind-numbingly boring technical terms so you should probably just not worry about it. Go make fun of transhumanist racists instead.
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Jan 22, 2018 10:03
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Seriously gently caress MIRI. Doing anything in ML in Berkeley ends up with one of those fuckers willfully misunderstanding everything and being a total loving nuisance. It's like if Jrod or Cingulate started showing up to interesting lectures and professional gatherings and derailing everything.
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Jan 22, 2018 10:25
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divabot posted:Sounds familiar. Someone may have already used this one. In case you're not joking and for the other people in the thread who may not know, it's literally the opening sentence of Neoreaction A Basilisk
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Jan 22, 2018 10:31
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Tom Clancy is Dead posted:Seriously gently caress MIRI. Doing anything in ML in Berkeley ends up with one of those fuckers willfully misunderstanding everything and being a total loving nuisance. You mean like the stuff SolTerrasa posted in Ye Olde LessWrong Thread, but IRL all the fuckin time? Jesus. Does "Yes, that's very interesting, but you're cranks who believe in racial IQ theories and think Damore isn't a fuckwit" do any good?
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Jan 22, 2018 10:40
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divabot posted:I have been bloviating about writing a book with the working title Roko's Basilisk, content to be precisely what you'd expect. So far I have 0 words actually written as words, and no idea how to actually approach this. I was expecting the content to just be an attempt to incite even more dumb people into existential anguish because AM is going to torture them retroactively in computer hell. Seriously that whole thing is like a memetic anti-stupidity virus that makes people who are way too into computers implode.
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Jan 22, 2018 11:52
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Divabot you should write it like Dante's Inferno where you are Virgil and you're guiding some poor schmuck through simulated hell while explaining to them that yes, this really is just how dumb the internet nerds were.
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Jan 22, 2018 13:11
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How about a version of A Christmas Carol but where Scrooge is a libertarian and each of the ghosts show him the error of his ways?
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Jan 22, 2018 13:24
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CommieGIR posted:How about a version of A Christmas Carol but where Scrooge is a libertarian and each of the ghosts show him the error of his ways? Promising, because then you have the opportunity to call one of the ghosts the spectre of communism.
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Jan 22, 2018 13:27
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OwlFancier posted:Promising, because then you have the opportunity to call one of the ghosts the spectre of communism. But dont worry, he has a five year plan.
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Jan 22, 2018 13:38
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divabot posted:You mean like the stuff SolTerrasa posted in Ye Olde LessWrong Thread, but IRL all the fuckin time? Jesus. Since you brought up Damore, and now that Cingulate is taking a break, I thought I'd steer the thread in a different direction. So, Damore has of course, complained about Google's attempts to diversify its workforce. The problem that I never understood is, if you're a libertarian, how could you take issue with the way a private company decides to carry out a particular policy or goal? I mean, Google wasn't doing this because of government fiat, but because they thought it was in their best interests. This also ties into Jordan Peterson's conspiracy theories about Academia and Hollywood being "infiltrated" by Cultural Marxists. Even if that was the case, isn't that just the market deciding that it wants Cultural Marxists in Academia and Hollywood? Because if it didn't, then why would they be there?
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Jan 22, 2018 23:34
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It's because libertarianism has absolutely nothing to do with liberty, and everything to do with preserving existing hierarchies and assuming that being on the top of a hierarchy is liberty. It's why Damore wants to stop a private company from setting a new policy for hiring decisions, it's why Charles Murray endorses subsidies for the "right people" breeding more, it's why Hans Hoppe dreams of unchallenged Homeowners' Associations that ban degeneracy and can't change their own bylaws.
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Jan 22, 2018 23:44
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Mr Interweb posted:Since you brought up Damore, and now that Cingulate is taking a break, I thought I'd steer the thread in a different direction. Libertarianism is basically another incarnation of the ubermensch idea - this time, libertarians are the superior people with the greatest talents who are simply being kept down by external forces, and if only those external forces would leave them alone, they would be great. This is the crux of Libertarianism. Most people who argue for it believe that the only thing keeping them from being millionaires who can go to bed with a different hot attractive woman every night of the week is that the laws and regulations that are part of our society are keeping them down. If you read Jrodefeld's post, everything basically came from this bizarre notion of a world where people have perfect agency and that if they simply chose not to be, they wouldn't be downtrodden. So, of course, these people would hate Google's attempts to diversify its workforce. While they might concede that a company should do what they want, they would argue that a perfectly rational company would only want the best performers, and to take into account someone's race, gender, or background is foolishness. And they would see it another way of keeping them, the white man, down.
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Jan 23, 2018 01:28
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Simpiler answer: American Libertarianism is GOP Lite with pot, with the same Dogwhistle politics, the same Misogynistic viewpoints, and the same culture of racial prejudice. They just try to be...nicer about it and hide behind pseudoscience and pseudo intellectualism to make it appear that they are more progressive.
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Jan 23, 2018 02:14
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CommieGIR posted:Simpiler answer: American Libertarianism is GOP Lite with pot, with the same Dogwhistle politics, the same Misogynistic viewpoints, and the same culture of racial prejudice. The Libertarians I've met in real life seem be of two camps: 1.) Idiots who grew up Republican and don't hate gay people but also don't really want to do anything about it and hate paying taxes. 2.) People born into very privileged lives who feel like the government is utterly incapable of doing anything - like they'll argue that racism and sexism are bad, they may even admit that institutional racism is a thing, but they'll argue that government is utterly incapable of solving these problems. Also they hate paying taxes. My suspicion is that this is just a more elaborate version of position one wherein government HAS to be incompetent and incapable of fixing anything because if not we'd be beholden to fund it and that means taxes. Both camps, despite never shutting up about free markets, seemed pretty mad about the end of Net Neutrality because suddenly the market was loving them personally. Even though this has wasted many hours of my life arguing against brick walls, it's way better than the internet libertarians who, going by this thread, are all up on "black people are genetically inferior to white people."
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Jan 23, 2018 03:13
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I mean yeah, the answer to this question might be the same answer to every question regarding libertarians – they’re hypocritical douchebags that just want to maintain the status quo – but I was just curious if there was any reasonable, intellectually consistent argument they had for second guessing the power of the market.
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Jan 23, 2018 03:26
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to be fair to the second type of libertarian, some of them think that government is incapable because the republican party has sabotaged problem-oriented governance for 40 years in order to make the government appear deeply incapable of tying its shoes they just fell down a rabbit hole on the way to realizing that government can work, the american one just doesn't. or they are incapable of believing in the scale and scope of the right-wing project and are defending themselves psychologically from the terrifying notion that everything is bad on purpose
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Jan 23, 2018 03:30
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divabot posted:You mean like the stuff SolTerrasa posted in Ye Olde LessWrong Thread, but IRL all the fuckin time? Jesus. I've literally driven one of the them off by starting to loudly talk about Rokko's Basilisk and told him I'd stop if he went away. A number of them are banned from a variety of departments and meetups, for doing poo poo like trying to start a conversation on the ethics of AI in image classification lectures.
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Jan 23, 2018 03:59
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Tom Clancy is Dead posted:I've literally driven one of the them off by starting to loudly talk about Rokko's Basilisk and told him I'd stop if he went away. A number of them are banned from a variety of departments and meetups, for doing poo poo like trying to start a conversation on the ethics of AI in image classification lectures.  that's the stuff it's probably some sort of ethics violation to name them, but loving lol
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Jan 23, 2018 09:57
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Mr Interweb posted:I mean yeah, the answer to this question might be the same answer to every question regarding libertarians – they’re hypocritical douchebags that just want to maintain the status quo – but I was just curious if there was any reasonable, intellectually consistent argument they had for second guessing the power of the market. The whole basis of Damore's thing is that he thought Google's actions made it less competitive in the market. Believing in the Invisible Hand doesn't mean that you think any particular company is making correct decisions, and it would make sense for a libertarian with a vested interest in the success of a particular company to offer what they believe to be constructive criticism of its practices. Damore is a dumbass who mistakes his biases for facts, but his letter wasn't hypocritical. Trying to get the government to force a private business not to fire him, and in fact to let him harangue other employees, on the other hand...
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Jan 23, 2018 10:05
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Jan 23, 2018 13:42
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Mr Interweb posted:I was just curious if there was any reasonable, intellectually consistent argument they had for second guessing the power of the market. It is interesting how they discover they have additional values beyond libertarianism, when it's them feeling the pinch. Most semi-libertarians are merely living in a cloudy soup of general selfishness. There's no such thing as hypocrisy to a deeply selfish person. The collective is a sucker to be gamed scammed and fooled. Some claim a value of "individualism," that primarily lets them say how not-racist and not-sexist they are. They do often seem good at putting on a show of politeness and openness, despite being extremely white, ableist, and privilege-denying.... Ten minutes later they'll be shaking a graph of two overlapping population distributions and saying the masses of other people are inferior and it's at least partially genetic (which seems to mean we should treat it as completely genetic), and look there's a personality trait you can test people for, and that must mean it's really important, and men have different scores under women in all these different patriarchal countries, therefore it's biological, it's all just science facts and objective truth that everyone MUST acknowledge blah blah blah ... This is all stuff they've been thinking about A LOT, as as good honest individualists, apparently.
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Jan 23, 2018 13:44
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Wasn't it Ron Paul who said that socialised medicine was slavery for doctors?
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Jan 23, 2018 13:45
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Gorilla Salad posted:Wasn't it Ron Paul who said that socialised medicine was slavery for doctors? This argument is disturbing for a lot of reasons, but one often overlooked one is what it says for someone's understanding of public education.
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Jan 23, 2018 14:24
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Gorilla Salad posted:Wasn't it Ron Paul who said that socialised medicine was slavery for doctors? Yup quote:On May 11th, 2011, Rand Paul stated that a right to health care equals slavery for health care workers, since you now "have a right to come to my house and conscript me" and "have a right to beat down my door with the police, escort me away and force me to take care of you."[89] He has a point, enslaved doctors are a really big problem in Canada.
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Jan 23, 2018 14:32
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Gorilla Salad posted:Wasn't it Ron Paul who said that socialised medicine was slavery for doctors? Probably, but you're likely thinking of something Rand said a year or two ago.
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Jan 23, 2018 14:34
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To be fair, both those guys are interchangeable loving idiots.
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Jan 23, 2018 15:07
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GunnerJ posted:This argument is disturbing for a lot of reasons, but one often overlooked one is what it says for someone's understanding of public education. There's also something special about Confederate apologists attacking things by calling them slavery. It's like the old Nazi "not giving me a platform is as bad as the Holocaust, which didn't happen, but I wish it did" shtick.
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Jan 23, 2018 15:19
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Someone needs to convinced E/N and BFC poster John Smith to start posting here, pretty sure he's the new jrod we've all be waiting for.
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Jan 23, 2018 15:35
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We just spent a week going after a dude for jaqing off over the Bell Curve, I think our blood is still hot from that. If we got a new guy in now we'd chase him off pretty quickly. Give it some time.
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Jan 23, 2018 15:49
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WampaLord posted:Someone needs to convinced E/N and BFC poster John Smith to start posting here, pretty sure he's the new jrod we've all be waiting for.
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Jan 23, 2018 16:14
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Goon Danton posted:We just spent a week going after a dude for jaqing off over the Bell Curve, I think our blood is still hot from that. If we got a new guy in now we'd chase him off pretty quickly. Give it some time. But....fresh
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Jan 23, 2018 16:39
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JUICY HAMBUGAR posted:Probably one of the best explorations of the Bell Curve I've seen (it's over an hour long, the first few minutes are skippable): Finally got around to watching this. The part on Lead Poisoning seems to be the final nail on the coffin to me. Subscribed. Honestly, the followed up video on Cultural Marxism was even more interesting.
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Jan 23, 2018 16:49
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DACK FAYDEN posted:I know him from the Bad with Money thread, holy poo poo they let him post in E/N? He hasn't been banned from there yet? Probated multiple times, but not yet banned. He's got a real nice persecution complex brewing, bitching about how we're this lefty forum full of hippies, so I think he has a lot of ideas about how things should be.
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Jan 23, 2018 16:49
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WampaLord posted:Probated multiple times, but not yet banned. Seems at least partially correct.
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Jan 23, 2018 17:13
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Goon Danton posted:We just spent a week going after a dude for jaqing off over the Bell Curve, I think our blood is still hot from that. If we got a new guy in now we'd chase him off pretty quickly. Give it some time. Also don't worry, I'm sure Cingulate will promptly return to the thread with a massive grudge about how unfairly he's been treated and how the actually fulfilled his toxx and just doesn't get why no one will accept whatever the gently caress he's really arguing. It's that black people are genetically inferior
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Jan 23, 2018 17:50
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Mornacale posted:The whole basis of Damore's thing is that he thought Google's actions made it less competitive in the market. Believing in the Invisible Hand doesn't mean that you think any particular company is making correct decisions, and it would make sense for a libertarian with a vested interest in the success of a particular company to offer what they believe to be constructive criticism of its practices. Damore is a dumbass who mistakes his biases for facts, but his letter wasn't hypocritical. I mean, sure he might think that he has better ideas that will help Google in the long run or whatever, but what right does he have a lowly employee to make such suggestions? He's not a venerated job creator. He's not the one making the decisions on who to hire. If the higher ups felt that their decisions were better for Google, then Damore already lost in the market place of ideas.
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Jan 23, 2018 23:20
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I think the more interesting question that Cingulate's lovely bell curve derail brought up is: To what extent is the stupidity and anti-social behavior of Baby Boomers caused by lead poisoning?
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Jan 24, 2018 00:57
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Mr Interweb posted:I mean, sure he might think that he has better ideas that will help Google in the long run or whatever, but what right does he have a lowly employee to make such suggestions? He's not a venerated job creator. He's not the one making the decisions on who to hire. If the higher ups felt that their decisions were better for Google, then Damore already lost in the market place of ideas. This is silly. Libertarians are white supremacists without a single decent idea, there's no reason to strawman them by pretending that they don't overwhelmingly (e: claim to) support free speech. Universally, in fact, when the free speech is about how we should suppress women and minorities. Mornacale fucked around with this message at 01:21 on Jan 24, 2018 |
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Jan 24, 2018 01:19
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Tom Clancy is Dead posted:I think the more interesting question that Cingulate's lovely bell curve derail brought up is: To what extent is the stupidity and anti-social behavior of Baby Boomers caused by lead poisoning? Hard to say cuz there were a shitload of other pollution with negative effects on the brain that rose at the same sort of times lead did, and fell to safer levels in the same sort of time frame lead did. It all certainly messed people up.
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Jan 24, 2018 01:56
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