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Knifegrab posted:I read the patch notes related to the new crime and punishment systems but I still really don't get what is different, how it works, or why its significant. Basically, current: -Any crime is tied to a commander, not a ship. -If it's a minor crime, you get a fine and a certain amount of time to pay it off. Don't pay it off and it turns into a bounty -Bounties can stagnate, meaning they won't show up after that period unless you commit another crime, in which case it becomes active again. -No matter how hot a commander is, they have full access to station services. -If a wanted commander dies, (I believe) the bounties get wiped out. A more experienced person could also chime in and go over anything I potentially missed.
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Jan 25, 2018 19:22
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Knifegrab posted:I read the patch notes related to the new crime and punishment systems but I still really don't get what is different, how it works, or why its significant. Committing unadulterated murder will now get a SWAT team to come take you out. Committing crimes makes your ship 'hot' and can increase your rebuy or decrease the sale of a hot ship. If you die while wanted you can spawn in a prison facility. If you are wanted in system you are locked out of certain station services, and have to encrypt any dealings you do with them. At the same time, accidentally hitting police or non-hostiles is no longer an instant crime. It's now a fine for an unsafe weapons discharge. So right now it mostly deals with punishment, but FDev says that now that there is a system in place they can start fleshing out criminal careers. The idea is that your ship will gain reputation, so that on sight NPCs and station services will act differently to you.
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Jan 25, 2018 19:27
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So I wonder how the new C&P system will affect SDC or Zarek Null Lord of Eravate? Hoping for lots of salt, personally.
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Jan 25, 2018 19:29
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Does Blue Falcon still hang out around Earth?
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Jan 25, 2018 19:30
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Dogeh posted:So I wonder how the new C&P system will affect SDC or Zarek Null Lord of Eravate? Considering they prey on newbies in sidewinders with a time-to-kill of "faster than the victim's loading screen will let them in" -- nothing. They'll kill their mark and wake out before the swat team arrives.
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Jan 25, 2018 19:36
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It would be nice to actually be able to be a proper pirate in one of these games. Usually they're just akin to Fallout's raiders - NPCs an average player slaughters by the dozen.
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Jan 25, 2018 19:42
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That's what "Liberate" missions and hatchbreaker limpets are for.
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Jan 25, 2018 19:45
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osirisisdead posted:That's what "Liberate" missions and hatchbreaker limpets are for. Multicrew copilots can use hatchbreakers, making pirating a fun group activity. The Python happens to be the best pirate ship.
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Jan 25, 2018 19:58
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I ran a Python for a while, but it was too easy. It does turrets on top and a PAC under the nose really well, which would be a good and fun multicrew loadout.
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Jan 25, 2018 20:21
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osirisisdead posted:I ran a Python for a while, but it was too easy. It does turrets on top and a PAC under the nose really well, which would be a good and fun multicrew loadout. Also necessary for this is the ship kit and Black Friday paint job, as now my “Engineers stuff” multipurpose Python is my favorite ship aesthetically. It looks like a drat F117.
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Jan 25, 2018 20:37
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I like the way Shark looks just fine. I may switch back to it...
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Jan 25, 2018 20:49
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iospace posted:Basically, current: Bounty or not I am pretty hot.  (39C, gently caress)
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Jan 25, 2018 21:33
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https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/7svsm5/engineering_proposals_seem_legit/ So they made the Engineering grind WORSE by tying it to specific modules? That's supreme, alpha-level 
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Jan 25, 2018 21:41
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limaCAT posted:Bounty or not I am pretty hot.   
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Jan 25, 2018 21:43
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Gonkish posted:https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/7svsm5/engineering_proposals_seem_legit/ Welp, time to loving grind done all my remaining engineering poo poo so I don't have to deal with that bullshit.
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Jan 25, 2018 21:44
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Nice piece of fish posted:Welp, time to loving grind done all my remaining engineering poo poo so I don't have to deal with that bullshit. If the posts in that thread are correct, then Frontier's answer to "Engineering is a ridiculous loving grind that is actively driving players from the game" was "Let's make the grind CRAZIER!"
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Jan 25, 2018 21:49
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Sandro you bastard retire bitch 
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Jan 25, 2018 21:52
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Plus, old superior rolls get grandfathered in so Space Grandpas get to keep their ultragrind modules!
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Jan 25, 2018 21:53
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They have to gently caress something big up or they wouldn't be continuing their streak. It's a Frontier patch if it doesn't make something worse - and the bigger the patch, the bigger the feature they ruin.
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Jan 25, 2018 21:53
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So apparently it's not just "grind to G5 for X improvement", it's "grind to G5 for each module/component that you loving own, individually". So if you have two beam lasers... gently caress you grind to G5 for both of them? I guess? PLUS the grogs get to keep their grindrolls because the one group of people Frontier seems to listen to are the ones who desperately want this game to be "space kicks you in the balls and then shits down your throat and makes you thank it for the privilege simulator 2018"? Have they never heard of a dominatrix?
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Jan 25, 2018 21:57
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Oh wow, the beta needs a separate download? Still 14gb on top of yesterday's patch? Cool.   I can't find the sad version of  in the smilies list.
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Jan 25, 2018 21:57
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Gonkish posted:So apparently it's not just "grind to G5 for X improvement", it's "grind to G5 for each module/component that you loving own, individually". So if you have two beam lasers... gently caress you grind to G5 for both of them? I guess? hahah what? if this is accurate i don't think i will play this game again until this changes
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Jan 25, 2018 22:02
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Welp, seems like I made the right call to get off my rear end and grind engineers before they gently caress it all up.
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Jan 25, 2018 22:13
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Enos Cabell posted:Welp, seems like I made the right call to get off my rear end and grind engineers before they gently caress it all up. It's a mixed bag, but things could change a bit through the beta. Currently DD5 engineers are worse at max upgrade in the update by like 20% (of a crazy godroll), but maxed out jump distance is about equal in the update to the best possible godroll in the current game. So you're looking at a much lower material cost to get a great FSD.
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Jan 25, 2018 22:23
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I wouldn't mind working up the ladder for each module so much if it was just 1 roll at each level then as many G5 rolls as you want for diminishing returns. That would be more like a normal upgrade system with fine tuning at the end. On the other hand, with the per-material caps I think people are going to end up stockpiling absolute shitloads of everything through normal gameplay. I think the only grind will be seeking out the specific rare stuff that you mostly only need for grade 5 rolls anyway. Most of all I hope you can buy secondary effects on grandfathered modules without converting them, though.
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Jan 25, 2018 22:26
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In addition to making the grind worse, they have significantly nerfed dirty drives. The maximum achievable bonus to optimum multiplier is now 130%. You can get that up to 135% if you add an experimental effect to the engines. 135% is considered a middling roll in the current system. I think the best roll anyone has ever seen is like 142%. I got lucky one time and got 141%. If you have a nice roll like that under the current system, it would be a huge mistake to convert the module to the new system. There is another special effect that increases the optimum mass by 10%, which might be situationally good. But as far as I can tell at this moment, the new dirty drives are strictly worse than the current ones.
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Jan 25, 2018 22:29
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My plan is to get two each of fsd, thrusters, power plant and distributor at various sizes up to level 5 and throw them in storage. Then I'll be able to experiment with one and leave the other as is, depending on how the beta shakes out.
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Jan 25, 2018 22:29
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If you have not rolled dd5 on c3 enhanced performance thrusters yet, you better do so now. 800 m/s iCourier will probably not be achievable under the new system
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Jan 25, 2018 22:33
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Gonkish posted:So apparently it's not just "grind to G5 for X improvement", it's "grind to G5 for each module/component that you loving own, individually". So if you have two beam lasers... gently caress you grind to G5 for both of them? I guess? You already have to do this for weapons. You get the engineer to Grade 5. You roll the modification you want for your first laser. You keep rolling until you get a result that you're happy with. Then you burn 2 ranks of reputation to apply the experimental you want. You have two of them, so guess what, you have to roll 6 more times to get back up to Rank 5 (3 grade 3s and then 3 grade 4s), so you can roll your other laser to the point where you're happy, then burn 2 ranks to give it the experimental you want. And there's no guarantee you'll get a good roll on those G5 mods, as it currently stands. So you can be in for a lot of farming/rolling if you're a perfectionist. The new system, on the other hand, you make steady progress with each roll. Seems like they're aiming for an average of 3 rolls per grade. Remember: G1 mods take a single common material (you get 3 per drop) and G2 mods take a 1 common and 1 uncommon material. These are super easy to get, in abundance. So, on paper, yes, you'll have to roll more for each individual module. But there's a few other mitigating factors to consider: 1) You can now hold 100 of each type of material. No more inventory tetris, just hoover up everything you come across wherever you come across it. 2) You can trade materials up and down the tiers. You can burn a biotech conductor for a pile of conductive ceramics, for example. Or combine a bunch of conductive ceramics into a biotech conductor. The trades work both ways. Getting pharmaceutical isolators is a pain in the rear end, but the next grade down, Chemical Manipulators, drop like candy off of trader ships. The end result is you roll a bit more, but materials are much easier to deal with and you *always* get improvements. No more praying to RNGeezus for a good roll.
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Jan 25, 2018 22:34
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Helianthus Annuus posted:If you have not rolled dd5 on c3 enhanced performance thrusters yet, you better do so now. 800 m/s iCourier will probably not be achievable under the new system Sandro says they are not done tweaking the numbers and will apply buffs in the next few beta updates.
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Jan 25, 2018 22:39
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Mike the TV posted:Sandro says they are not done tweaking the numbers and will apply buffs in the next few beta updates. Sure, and I hope it does change. I just don't trust Sandro to make good decisions. For example, the decision to dress like Willy Wonka and wear a stuffed animal as a fashion accessory. IMO he's way too sympathetic to this line of reasoning: "We don't want to take away players' sense of accomplishment by making the new dd5s as good as the ones people had to sink 100 rolls for." Would love to be proven wrong here.
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Jan 25, 2018 22:50
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Kurr de la Cruz posted:You already have to do this for weapons. You get the engineer to Grade 5. You roll the modification you want for your first laser. You keep rolling until you get a result that you're happy with. Then you burn 2 ranks of reputation to apply the experimental you want. Ya, I'm all for calling it frontier on their bullshit but this is a bunch of knee jerk reactions based on information we already knew about. We've known about per component rolls and having to max out each rank before going to the next since the very first post about it. The change is significantly less overall grind, especially when you factor in experimental upgrades. This is a huge boost for new players as well. Also who the gently caress is bitching about a tiny loving chance for 142% dirty drives vs anyone and everyone getting 135%. 7% is not a significant difference, even among the minority of players who will have that good of a roll, and unless you're 420pvpgankit, it will make even less of a difference. And weren't we just (and always) complaining about the hardcore pvpers? Just loving high wake or combat log per the usual recommendation, it changes literally nothing. This thread 
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Jan 25, 2018 22:52
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Mr. Crow posted:Also who the gently caress is bitching about a tiny loving chance for 142% dirty drives vs anyone and everyone getting 135%. 7% is not a significant difference, even among the minority of players who will have that good of a roll, and unless you're 420pvpgankit, it will make even less of a difference. And weren't we just (and always) complaining about the hardcore pvpers? Just loving high wake or combat log per the usual recommendation, it changes literally nothing. All I can say is that this (in bold) is simply not true. I like to go fast, and I'm sure others do too. It doesn't necessarily have to do with PvP. You need to chill.
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Jan 25, 2018 23:00
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I think it will affect some people negatively. Mainly those who don’t hardcore pray to the RNG god and just sort of casually use engineers. I unlocked G3-G5 access on most of them for the things i like to upgrade a while ago. So when need be I just take my ships over there and fire off one or two shots on a G4 or G5 upgrade and call it a day and continue on my way. That’s going to be harder in the current system now because it will take more grinding per module to actually use the system casually. Seems off to me.
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Jan 25, 2018 23:02
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I logged into the beta and the game put me some 70Ly from todd blaster mcguffin so I bought 2 small multicannons and went to roll some upgrades. You have to upgrade 3 times per rank, per gun. No wait I lie. the 3 rank 1 upgrades was just for long range. I tried short range blaster and had to upgrade five times to get to rank 2.  5 rank 1 upgrades  Applying the rank 2 upgrade ticked off rank 1 as 'complete' e: Upon further investigation the amount that you get upgraded per rank is random. You could either roll a big upgrade or an absolutely tiny one. Sultan Tarquin fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Jan 25, 2018 |
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Jan 25, 2018 23:03
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The story for weapons is a mixed bag for sure. On the one hand you have to do many more rolls per weapon to get up to g5. On the other hand, you can apply whatever experimental effect you want, so that removes the need to grind reputation. You can apply the special effect immediately, and continue to roll for further improvements without losing the special effect. Old story: * grind rep up to lvl 5 * roll g5 upgrades until you have a roll you like * pay 1 or 2 levels of reputation for a special effect (you might get lucky and get the one you want for free) * never touch the module again, because you don't want to lose the special effect * repeat the rep grind and start the next module New story: * apply whatever special effects you want to all weapons * for each weapon: roll g1, g2, g3, g4, g5 until maxxed out I think it works out to be a better experience. edit: just hit a show-stopping bug and I can't log into beta anymore. crash report sent. hope they fix it. 
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Jan 25, 2018 23:14
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What should I work on engineering wise as a casual player before the patch if I mainly do mining/trading, etc? FSD? I only have the first two engineers unlocked I think.
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Jan 25, 2018 23:15
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One of the things cracking me up is people moaning about how they'll have to upgrade every single module for every single ship 15 times. Like do you people not swap modules around? I swap my poo poo around all the time.
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Jan 25, 2018 23:16
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Kaddish posted:What should I work on engineering wise as a casual player before the patch if I mainly do mining/trading, etc? FSD? I only have the first two engineers unlocked I think. I'd focus on unlocking engineers more than anything else right now. Just getting access to them.
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Jan 25, 2018 23:20
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Re: Chicken Little, https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/401887-Engineering-Update-Rules-and-Feedback?p=6338992&viewfull=1#post6338992
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Jan 25, 2018 23:21
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