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AsInHowe posted:http://www.espn.com/espn/story/_/id/22214566/pattern-denial-inaction-information-suppression-michigan-state-goes-larry-nassar-case-espn quote:In circumstances in which administrators have commissioned internal examinations to review how they have handled certain sexual violence complaints, officials have been selective in releasing information publicly. In one case, a university-hired outside investigator claimed to have not even generated a written report at the conclusion of his work. Ah yes, the Baylor Stratagem
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Jan 26, 2018 19:24
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:Dantonio has booted off a lot of players during his time, so is ESPN bringing out new allegations? Unreported new allegations, where MSU may have forced things to keep from being prosecuted?
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Jan 26, 2018 19:25
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:Dantonio has booted off a lot of players during his time, so is ESPN bringing out new allegations? He also has a history of giving slaps on the wrist to people for crimes, though sexual violence has gotten guys kicked off and kicked out. There was an anonymous accusation of some basketball players a few years ago too but nothing came of it. Izzo always boots guys for unspecified violations that usually turn out to be weed. Maybe we'll finally know what Max Bullough was suspended for!
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Jan 26, 2018 19:28
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Henchman of Santa posted:He also has a history of giving slaps on the wrist to people for crimes, though sexual violence has gotten guys kicked off and kicked out. If it's what I saw while skimming that article, probably gang rape. Lots of gang rape. That anonymous accusation seemed to be Payne and Appling raping a girl in a dorm.
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Jan 26, 2018 19:29
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AsInHowe posted:If it's what I saw while skimming that article, probably gang rape. Lots of gang rape. Ah yeah that’s what I remember the protests at the admin building being about. ....Jesus Christ 
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Jan 26, 2018 19:31
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AsInHowe posted:Unreported new allegations, where MSU may have forced things to keep from being prosecuted? Yeah, considering the source, I'm going to guess that we're not getting retread stories here. Also, kicking dudes off of the team wouldn't absolve anyone of anything if they impeded title IX or police in the first place.
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Jan 26, 2018 19:32
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https://mobile.twitter.com/DantonioMark/status/937803858105065475
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Jan 26, 2018 19:42
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Henchman of Santa posted:99% of players will never make money on sports or win a championship and they know that. There are 130 teams in Division I football alone and about a dozen of them can realistically compete for a title in a given year. Team pride and history is a huge recruiting tool. Players go to schools that suit their needs and interests for sports just like any other kid picking a college. If you're assuming you aren't going to go pro, wouldn't it make more sense to find the best university for whatever it is you want to study, that will still offer you a sports scholarship?
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Jan 26, 2018 19:44
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I'm shocked, shocked that an administration that covers up a nothing sport also covered up for the big boys
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Jan 26, 2018 19:47
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PT6A posted:If you're assuming you aren't going to go pro, wouldn't it make more sense to find the best university for whatever it is you want to study, that will still offer you a sports scholarship? If you’re on a football scholarship you effectively are studying football, but very few people will ever be pro football players and they know that. They might go into coaching. Most will sell insurance or something like that. Also for a lot of kids a sports scholarship is the only way they’ll go to college at all. They’re not brought up thinking about what they’ll study in undergrad. Henchman of Santa fucked around with this message at 19:54 on Jan 26, 2018 |
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Jan 26, 2018 19:50
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Detroit media is reporting that Hollis is the resignation came after he found out about the ESPN report.
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Jan 26, 2018 19:51
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PT6A posted:If you're assuming you aren't going to go pro, wouldn't it make more sense to find the best university for whatever it is you want to study, that will still offer you a sports scholarship? Young men who will never play college football, period, are also influenced by the strength of a school's football program.
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Jan 26, 2018 19:53
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Henchman of Santa posted:If you’re on a football scholarship you effectively are studying football, but very few people will ever be pro football players and they know that. They might go into coaching. Most will sell insurance or something like that. So the goal is to get CTE, while playing for free, in the name of some kind of school pride, and you don't even really get to study the field you actually want to work in after university? I'm starting to think if we really cared "what about the kids???" we wouldn't let them do this poo poo in the first place.
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Jan 26, 2018 19:54
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PT6A posted:So the goal is to get CTE, while playing for free, in the name of some kind of school pride, and you don't even really get to study the field you actually want to work in after university? Basically yeah
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Jan 26, 2018 19:55
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Halloween Jack posted:Young men who will never play college football, period, are also influenced by the strength of a school's football program. This must be a difference between US and Canada, but... why? The two universities I attended had hockey teams and football teams and all that stuff, and I don't think anyone not on those teams or trying to gently caress someone on those teams ever gave a poo poo about their success or failure. This mode of thinking is bizarre to me.
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Jan 26, 2018 19:55
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PT6A posted:This must be a difference between US and Canada, but... why? America is weird.
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Jan 26, 2018 19:57
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The entire concept of further/higher education in sports is just loving bizzare from a UK perspective. Like sure schools have sports teams but they're not, like, important and you don't go to school to do sports.
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Jan 26, 2018 20:00
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PT6A posted:This must be a difference between US and Canada, but... why? (takes deep, extremely socialist breath) Because gridiron football is a cult of violent nationalism, and we're a violent nationalist empire. Don't you want to go to the school that sends the finest young men as tribute?
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Jan 26, 2018 20:00
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Henchman of Santa posted:America is weird. ...no doubt. I mean, the idea that someone would pay the absurd amount of money it takes to go to university in the US, and then select which university to go to on the basis of their strength is a sport the student is not even going to play, makes no sense to me at all. And if sports scholarships are the only way you're going to university, it absolutely makes sense to focus on sports, but if you don't think you're going to go pro, then wouldn't it be all the more important to pick something to do at university that's going to let you do something you want to do afterward, since you basically won the one golden ticket you're ever going to get? What's the thought process here? I'm honestly trying to understand it, and I'm just coming up short apparently.
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Jan 26, 2018 20:00
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PT6A posted:...no doubt. quote:The biggest impact of Rutgers’s [football] success, though, may be the one on campus. Schools are able to get way more applicants with successful major sports, and in turn be more selective of who they allow to enroll. It helps the school a shitload to be successful in sports - Bama spends more on Saban than any other coach but they almost certainly get an actual return on that investment over what anyone else in sports does (because he wins a title every other loving year). So the incentive to cover up literally everything is gigantic. That doesn't get into the athletes but since I was never a college athlete I can't really speak to the mindset. I think they just pick a place they like and keep doing the sport they enjoy and are good at and reap the social benefits.
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Jan 26, 2018 20:05
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mastershakeman posted:
I don't disagree with what you're saying, I'm just trying to understand why the part I bolded above happens.
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Jan 26, 2018 20:07
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The dumbest MSU journalist has weighed in. https://mobile.twitter.com/Graham_Couch/status/956964251045892096
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Jan 26, 2018 20:08
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PT6A posted:...no doubt. From the minute they first put on a helmet in peewee football to when they take if off after high school graduation players have it beaten into their heads that football is what matters by their coaches, parents, and peers. Especially in some smaller rural communities, high school football is insanely important to a lot of people. When you are entrenched in that mindset for a majority of your life, it doesn't shock me at all that football is the primary driving force for college choice, regardless of pro prospects.
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Jan 26, 2018 20:09
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AsInHowe posted:The dumbest MSU journalist has weighed in. jfc that doesn’t make it ok
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Jan 26, 2018 20:10
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https://mobile.twitter.com/AceAnbender/status/956967953769074689
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Jan 26, 2018 20:14
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PT6A posted:I don't disagree with what you're saying, I'm just trying to understand why the part I bolded above happens. Out of sight, out of mind. When a few dozen colleges and universities are in your face and on your TV constantly, why would you apply to Ohio Wesleyan instead of Ohio State? It's the power of branding. People pay more for Advil even though generic ibuprofen is the exact same thing. It's because those brands are on TV and in their forefront of their minds all the time. And, all things being equal, if I grew up a Auburn football fan and I can't decide between going to Auburn or going to some other school, the opportunity to attend Auburn football games for 4 years is a pretty good incentive that'll tip the scales in their favor. I'm not advocating that people should actually use this logic when they're deciding where to receive their higher education, but I am saying that this is why it happens. Hell, my alma mater is a really good private university that I wouldn't have even considered if I wasn't exposed to them through their highly successful basketball team.
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Jan 26, 2018 20:21
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Sports in colleges that have big time programs are a communal experience that can bind people together. I've never played organized football in my life, and I decided my university based on my major, but drat if going to the football games wasn't fun as hell, and I made friends that I still have through attending sports together.
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Jan 26, 2018 20:32
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https://twitter.com/bubbaprog/status/956971746414026753
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Jan 26, 2018 20:42
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Jan 26, 2018 20:43
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Jesus Christ, DeVos is one heinous excuse for a human being. There's always more and it only ever gets worse!
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Jan 26, 2018 20:43
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Mahoning posted:Why would you apply to Ohio Wesleyan instead of Ohio State? It's the power of branding. People pay more for Advil even though generic ibuprofen is the exact same thing. It's because those brands are on TV and in their forefront of their minds all the time. Well, you might also apply to Ohio State because it's way cheaper than OWU (and OWU sucks anyway, go Wooster). But yeah sure a big D1 school like Ohio State is way more visible than a GLCA liberal arts school with an enrollment of under 2000 students.
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Jan 26, 2018 20:49
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Jan 26, 2018 20:50
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Florida Gulf Coast University is in Fort Myers, a couple hours south of the Tampa Bay area. It was established in 1991 and had pretty much zero recognition in the state, let alone nationally. Then in 2013 their basketball team made the NCAA tournament as a huge underdog and dunked all over some big-name schools on national TV before losing in the third round. Within the year, admissions spiked 27%. In the first four days of their tournament run, pageviews on their admissions page went from 2,200 to 42,000. Athletics are a way for bigger, older schools to stay relevant in the public eye and every so often let a newer, smaller school grab some eyeballs and attention. Alabama and Ohio State and UT-Austin are never gonna be hurting for kids trying to get in, but athletics are a way to show prestige (because nobody cares how many Nobel Prize winners are on your faculty, lol). Millions of people heard about FGCU for the first time through basketball and it's going to fuel their enrollment push for years to come. Smaller schools treat athletics as a sort of lottery ticket, I guess. Get a week or two of national TV and it could mean tens of millions of dollars over a lot of years. Big or small, universities are incentivized to hide as much dirt as they can because there are obscene amounts of money at stake. It's a lovely system built for exploitation of free labor, but it is what it is. Hilariously, one way to offset this would be adequate federal and state funding for colleges and universities, but 
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Jan 26, 2018 21:07
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howe_sam posted:Well, you might also apply to Ohio State because it's way cheaper than OWU (and OWU sucks anyway, go Wooster). But yeah sure a big D1 school like Ohio State is way more visible than a GLCA liberal arts school with an enrollment of under 2000 students. This post is funny to me because I’m a Michigan State fan who’s currently ashamed of my favorite teams but a Wooster alum who’s proud of current students for fighting for racial justice this week
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Jan 26, 2018 21:11
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skaboomizzy posted:Florida Gulf Coast University is in Fort Myers, a couple hours south of the Tampa Bay area. It was established in 1991 and had pretty much zero recognition in the state, let alone nationally. Okay, this is starting to make sense. It's not that people choose to go to a school with a highly-rated football or basketball program, but rather that there are so many universities in the US that it's an important way of advertising one's name.
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Jan 26, 2018 21:12
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PT6A posted:Okay, this is starting to make sense. It's not that people choose to go to a school with a highly-rated football or basketball program, but rather that there are so many universities in the US that it's an important way of advertising one's name. Beyond that, to a huge portion of potential students, it's the only way to advertise one's name.
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Jan 26, 2018 21:16
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Between my wife and I, we've worked at some pretty big division 1 schools. And in all my professional life, I have never seen or experienced more blatant disregard for rules than in my experience with college athletics ( andI am someone who once upon a time was licensed as a stock broker in Brazil.). And the reason is real simple: the careers of every single person involved, including those who are supposed to be the gatekeepers, depends on success in athletics regardless of everything else. The difference between being an unpaid assistant coach living off of an RV and being paid a nice salary can be a couple of winning seasons, even for the non-money sports. And unlike, say, accreditation or non-athlete student code of conduct enforcement, there is no one who will make a career by cracking down on things. No one gets promoted or hired because graduation under them went up or the school went 5 years without a case of sexual assault. And worse, if you do have the temerity of standing up for something, your career and the career of anyone who stands up for you will be destroyed for the flimsiest of reasons (the case I linked is one where a school official suspended a football player over rape allegations, the school then fired him because he received an ebay receipt for a porn dvd he bought on his school computer and appointed a booster to handle the rape case, and then forced a dean who gave the first official a positive rec letter to resign). And this cuts across the board. Coaches who lie to students about their professional prospects and tell them to disregard their academic advisors. Officials who think that those recruitment parties and the decision by the coaches to recruit "spirit girls" to host the athletes is all just simple socializing. And then, of course, the reporters who know all of that but don't want to jeopardize access. The MSU case is remarkable for its scope and length of time. But I can see the exact same thing happening at dozens of different schools.
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Jan 26, 2018 21:26
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Henchman of Santa posted:This post is funny to me because I’m a Michigan State fan who’s currently ashamed of my favorite teams but a Wooster alum who’s proud of current students for fighting for racial justice this week  what up fellow Scot.
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Jan 26, 2018 21:29
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When I first worked at MSU I worked summer orientation and part of my job was enrolling students in classes. It was always super awesome working with the athletes (most of the time it was female athletes because the men were flagged immediately and basically never reached us) because as soon as we were done getting them actual classes they would go over to the athletic building and their entire schedule would get overwritten.
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Jan 26, 2018 21:36
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joepinetree posted:The difference between being an unpaid assistant coach living off of an RV and being paid a nice salary can be a couple of winning seasons, even for the non-money sports.
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Jan 26, 2018 21:40
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