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Arrhythmia
Jul 22, 2011
I got every achievement for this game and had a real good time doing it. 10/10 looking forward to the next expansion.

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SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008

~* Challenge *~


Arrhythmia posted:

I got every achievement for this game and had a real good time doing it. 10/10 looking forward to the next expansion.

you're a monster for leaving Zote to die

Your Computer
Oct 3, 2008




Grimey Drawer

SirSamVimes posted:

you're a monster for leaving Zote to die

is there a way for me to kill him after he goes to hang out in Dirtmouth


because I'll do it just to get rid of his mumbling

SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008

~* Challenge *~


Your Computer posted:

is there a way for me to kill him after he goes to hang out in Dirtmouth


because I'll do it just to get rid of his mumbling

Nah, he can only be left to die in Greenpath.

Inexplicable Humblebrag
Sep 20, 2003

zote deserves death

it is only the fact that content is gated behind his survival which allows him to poison the earth with his continued presence

Your Computer
Oct 3, 2008




Grimey Drawer
the amazing atmosphere of the game kinda takes a hit near the end of the game when you can no longer sit and ponder life on the bench next to the Elderbug without the constant Zote grumbling and OH HO HOH HOOO from the blessing :argh:

Azuth0667
Sep 20, 2011

By the word of Zoroaster, no business decision is poor when it involves Ahura Mazda.
Last boss defeated by being face goatsed 10/10 will replay again.

Arrhythmia
Jul 22, 2011

SirSamVimes posted:

you're a monster for leaving Zote to die

Get this: I also killed the blacksmith.

SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008

~* Challenge *~


Arrhythmia posted:

Get this: I also killed the blacksmith.

I mean that one actually wanted to die so it's okay but Zote is a KNIGHT OF GREAT RENOWN and must live forever.

I Said No
May 21, 2007

jesus dude ur gonna kill someone with that av
Zote's sole redeeming quality is that he's not Tiso.

skaianDestiny
Jan 13, 2017

beep boop

I Said No posted:

Zote's sole redeeming quality is that he's not Tiso.

Tiso talking himself up and then getting dumped with the rest of the chaff is iconic.

1stGear
Jan 16, 2010

Here's to the new us.
Zote is the Dark Souls of Hollow Knight NPCs.

Your Computer
Oct 3, 2008




Grimey Drawer
Zote is actually the son of the Pale King and he was expunged from the annals for his folly.


but that's just a theory, a game theory

please smash that like button, subscribe and comment if you want to see more

I Said No
May 21, 2007

jesus dude ur gonna kill someone with that av

Your Computer posted:

Zote is actually the son of the Pale King and he was expunged from the annals for his folly.


but that's just a theory, a game theory

please smash that like button, subscribe and comment if you want to see more

skasion
Feb 13, 2012

Why don't you perform zazen, facing a wall?
Having fought Troupe Master Grimm once, is there any reason in particular to keep collecting flames? Am I going to have to fight him again but harder?

One Hundred Monkeys
Aug 7, 2010

skasion posted:

Having fought Troupe Master Grimm once, is there any reason in particular to keep collecting flames? Am I going to have to fight him again but harder?

ye. the bump in difficulty is significant enough I think it's worth seeing.

Torquemadras
Jun 3, 2013

If you continue collecting the flames, you'll eventually have the option to upgrade the Grimmchild further, or effectively trade it for an entirely new charm. You don't really need either of those.

Seriously, the last boss is the real reward

OzFactor
Apr 16, 2001

Your Computer posted:

Zote is actually the son of the Pale King

I'm not sure it's all that hard to make a case for this: maybe he's the actual, legitimate son of the King and the Queen sent him away to protect him. He very clearly has issues with his mother and returning to lay claim to some sort of vague glory, possibly stolen from him by his pseudo-half-brother, the Hollow Knight, who the King loved more than him.

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused
I do like that if you actually bother to beat +10 Zote then Bretta dumps him and just leaves to have her own adventure. Would be more satisfying if Zote even noticed though.

As for ~game theories~ about Zote I think he's just a really botched vessel. Probably one of the first ones. It might even be that Zote being such a miserable, worthless creature is what made the King decide that emotionless beings were the ideal state for his void golems. The thing is Zote kind of has to be Abyss related because during his fight he uses a bunch of void powers (in comical Zote fashion, but still).

OzFactor
Apr 16, 2001
Is there any sort of speculation or anything about why the Knight (the player, I mean) is outside of Hallownest at the beginning? I like the idea that (endgame spoilers) you're not just one vessel, you're all of them, i.e. every time you die you are a new one, you're basically just the Abyss trying to kill the Radiance any way you can. I'm not really sure there's a lot of support for that idea, especially seeing as how a lot of people (mostly Hornet) recognize your quest and recognize you in particular as being unique, a "this time it's different" situation. But it's fun to think about.

Your Computer
Oct 3, 2008




Grimey Drawer

Internet Kraken posted:

I do like that if you actually bother to beat +10 Zote then Bretta dumps him and just leaves to have her own adventure. Would be more satisfying if Zote even noticed though.

As for ~game theories~ about Zote I think he's just a really botched vessel. Probably one of the first ones. It might even be that Zote being such a miserable, worthless creature is what made the King decide that emotionless beings were the ideal state for his void golems. The thing is Zote kind of has to be Abyss related because during his fight he uses a bunch of void powers (in comical Zote fashion, but still).

so what you're implying is that the starting state of the vessels before being stripped of emotions is "being a petty dick"

maybe the void was a mistake

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused
Alternatively the King deliberately tried to model one of his creations after himself and the result was a narcissistic idiot with delusions of grandeur.

Oh dear.

No Wave
Sep 18, 2005

HA! HA! NICE! WHAT A TOOL!
I subscribe to my headcanon of the king somehow being the hollow knight because he couldn't bear sealing his perfect creation, the protag (and he was arrogant enough to think he could do it). It would make the last scene where the HK helps out the protagonist more gratifying and it would make the Pale King sadder and a better but obviously flawed dude, completing his arc by redeeming himself and doing what he couldn't before (allowing his vessel to perform its task). It would also be a repetition of the kingsoul becoming the void heart. As is, the other HK helping you doesn't mean all that much, he's nobody.

It would also explain the regal air someone says you possess because you were the one who spent time with the king, and it would explain why the radiance seems pale king themed in general (you're in his head). But in the PoP scene we see that vessel had slightly different ears, and it doesn't explain the flashback of the king walking away with a different vessel in the abyss(unless that vessel was you and you were seeing through the perspective of a failed vessel, which again I like) so it's a no-go in terms of actually happening.

No Wave fucked around with this message at 23:58 on Jan 30, 2018

Your Computer
Oct 3, 2008




Grimey Drawer

Internet Kraken posted:

Alternatively the King deliberately tried to model one of his creations after himself and the result was a narcissistic idiot with delusions of grandeur.

Oh dear.
:eyepop:
"Selfish God King clings to dying empire, messes with the natural order of things, pain and suffering ensues" where have I heard that story before:thunk:

If I understand it correctly the Pale King essentially granted individual minds and thus personalities, culture and civilization to the bugs? Was it a secret plot to contain the dark soul achieve world domination or does it kinda seem... not that bad? I mean unless you regard civilization as a mistake (which you might). Some of the lore tablets make him sound a bit sinister (from creatures who do not "share his vision") but as far as I can see he did nothing wrong doesn't seem malicious at all.



well, as far as monarchs go anyway :thermidor:

C-Euro
Mar 20, 2010

:science:
Soiled Meat
Someone in this thread or in the game said that if you equip a charm that has a unique interaction(s) with other charms, those other charms will glow in your menu while the first charm is equipped. Is this true, because I haven't noticed it with the Defender's Crest, which people tell me does something unique with like half of the other charms in the game.

SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008

~* Challenge *~


Salubria says that some charms sing together, but I don't think there's any UI indicator

Discendo Vox
Mar 21, 2013

We don't need to have that dialogue because it's obvious, trivial, and has already been had a thousand times.

Your Computer posted:

If I understand it correctly the Pale King essentially granted individual minds and thus personalities, culture and civilization to the bugs? Was it a secret plot to contain the dark soul achieve world domination or does it kinda seem... not that bad? I mean unless you regard civilization as a mistake (which you might). Some of the lore tablets make him sound a bit sinister (from creatures who do not "share his vision") but as far as I can see he did nothing wrong doesn't seem malicious at all.


It's clear that there were other civilizations beyond Hallownest. The King granted minds and identities to servants he created out of the void. The glowy tablets are exclusively readable by said void-servants, and are made for the servants to read by the king.

SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008

~* Challenge *~


On the other hand, Monomon the Teacher writes "for none could tame our savage souls, yet you the challenge met". Also those tablets are for "higher beings", not creatures of void.

Dancer
May 23, 2011

No Wave posted:

I subscribe to my headcanon of the king somehow being the hollow knight because he couldn't bear sealing his perfect creation, the protag (and he was arrogant enough to think he could do it). It would make the last scene where the HK helps out the protagonist more gratifying and it would make the Pale King sadder and a better but obviously flawed dude, completing his arc by redeeming himself and doing what he couldn't before (allowing his vessel to perform its task). It would also be a repetition of the kingsoul becoming the void heart. As is, the other HK helping you doesn't mean all that much, he's nobody.

It would also explain the regal air someone says you possess because you were the one who spent time with the king, and it would explain why the radiance seems pale king themed in general (you're in his head). But in the PoP scene we see that vessel had slightly different ears, and it doesn't explain the flashback of the king walking away with a different vessel in the abyss(unless that vessel was you and you were seeing through the perspective of a failed vessel, which again I like) so it's a no-go in terms of actually happening.


One quick note (and it's perfectly possible that I'd wrong) but afaik the 'regal air' comment happens after you get the King's Brand, so that would probably explain it better.

Arrhythmia
Jul 22, 2011

No Wave posted:

I subscribe to my headcanon of the king somehow being the hollow knight because he couldn't bear sealing his perfect creation, the protag (and he was arrogant enough to think he could do it). It would make the last scene where the HK helps out the protagonist more gratifying and it would make the Pale King sadder and a better but obviously flawed dude, completing his arc by redeeming himself and doing what he couldn't before (allowing his vessel to perform its task). It would also be a repetition of the kingsoul becoming the void heart. As is, the other HK helping you doesn't mean all that much, he's nobody.

It would also explain the regal air someone says you possess because you were the one who spent time with the king, and it would explain why the radiance seems pale king themed in general (you're in his head). But in the PoP scene we see that vessel had slightly different ears, and it doesn't explain the flashback of the king walking away with a different vessel in the abyss(unless that vessel was you and you were seeing through the perspective of a failed vessel, which again I like) so it's a no-go in terms of actually happening.


On the other hand, you see the hollow knight and the pale king standing side by side. Twice.

Your Computer
Oct 3, 2008




Grimey Drawer

SirSamVimes posted:

On the other hand, Monomon the Teacher writes "for none could tame our savage souls, yet you the challenge met". Also those tablets are for "higher beings", not creatures of void.

Yeah, that. The Elegy for Hallownest seems to spell it out, pretty much. In her dream dialogue Monomon says "...For diversity, a Seal..." which also supports it.


Not sure about her second line about "a world forever unchanging" though. Other than that line which I don't quite get, she's gotta be one of my favorite characters. She was the first Dreamer I encountered and dang what a moment :qq: I was prepared for a big ol' boss fight so it really caught me by surprise that she wanted the seal broken and just.. lets you kill her. Of course it turned out you don't actually fight any of the Dreamers but that still made a strong impression on me.

SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008

~* Challenge *~


A world unchanging means that she is aware that sealing the Hollow Knight (and Radiance) away is a stasis at best and not progress.

No Wave
Sep 18, 2005

HA! HA! NICE! WHAT A TOOL!

Dancer posted:

One quick note (and it's perfectly possible that I'd wrong) but afaik the 'regal air' comment happens after you get the King's Brand, so that would probably explain it better.
Oh I only found her post-KB. My bad.

C-Euro
Mar 20, 2010

:science:
Soiled Meat

SirSamVimes posted:

Salubria says that some charms sing together, but I don't think there's any UI indicator

Ah nuts. Time to experiment then.

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused
The King did not create the first civilization or give literal mind and soul to all the bugs of Hallownest. Its pretty clear that not only are there civilizations outside of Hallownest, but also that other civilizations existed where Hallownest now stands. There are foreign travelers, mention of other lands and kingdoms beyond the borders, and clear indication of precursors to the Pale King's civilization.

The tablets are probably just an embellishment of the Pale King building a new civilization on the ruins of Radiance's. That or they could hint at a relationship between the King and his retainers that went beyond ruler and subject. The King might of had a way to share his power with the retainers and grant them higher intellect. Such intellect would be lost if they strayed away from the King, and thus they would no longer be "higher beings". This could be why Retainers are present in the White Palace dream; they go beyond being memories and are literally part of the King's mind due to this connection.

But again I consider it equally likely the Pale King's ego was so large that he thought anyone outside of Hallownest a savage and everything that predated it to be worthless. It was only through his grace that they were elevated to a state he considered intelligent. The White Bug's Burden.

SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008

~* Challenge *~


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBxtfDAtVTY

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused

Okay this literally looks like a Dark Souls trailer

Gonna spend an hour dying to Nameless King but this time its a loving fly

VVV I guess they are aware of all the bug shipping that people do for this game on Tumblr

Internet Kraken fucked around with this message at 09:13 on Jan 31, 2018

SirSamVimes
Jul 21, 2008

~* Challenge *~


http://teamcherry.com.au/godsglory/#more-1281

Team Cherry posted:

This is the big one. Take your place amongst the Gods in an epic celebration of Hallownest’s Glory and the final chapter of the Knight’s journey.

Let’s jump right into the details:

New Character and Quest – The Godseeker arrives (and your romance options expand). Track down this disturbing yet alluring being, break her chains and aid her in an ancient duty.

New Boss Fights – Hallownest’s greatest warriors raise their blades. Prepare yourself for giant new boss fights against the ultimate foes. Each new battle intertwines with the Godseeker’s quest. No specifics on how that’ll happen, but it may not be as you expect!

New Game Mode – Hollow Knight receives a third game mode. This ones been long requested and is a classic for the genre. Complete the Gods & Glory story to unlock the new mode.

New Music – Christopher Larkin is going all out for Hollow Knight’s final free pack, with new soaring boss tracks and giant remixes of some beloved classics.

Glorify Charms – Prove yourself and uncover a whole new depth to your charm collection.

Of course, other surprises will be hiding about the place, but we can’t spoil all the fun!

Gods and Glory can be accessed at any point in your Hollow Knight journey. Prepare to ascend, Early 2018, free for all players!

Early 2018 seems a little vague, right? We’ll there’s an important reason for that. Content Pack 03 is coming together right now. It’s shaping up great (and huge!), but we’ve another even more enormous release to deliver first: Hollow Knight for Nintendo Switch.

As much as we’d have loved to sneak the new content pack in, ready for Switch launch, we’d kill ourselves in the process. Expect Gods & Glory to land free for all players AFTER the initial Switch release.

quote:

New Character and Quest – The Godseeker arrives (and your romance options expand). Track down this disturbing yet alluring being, break her chains and aid her in an ancient duty.

quote:

The Godseeker arrives (and your romance options expand).

quote:

your romance options expand

Your Computer
Oct 3, 2008




Grimey Drawer
let me tell you I am :stoked:

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Knorth
Aug 19, 2014

Buglord
Oh boy oh boy

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