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Lote posted:What’s to prevent people from generating losses without changing their position? IE what the wash sale rule was designed to prevent? COMRADES posted:e: actually idk I guess but if they are taxing BTC under capital gains I'd be surprised if the wash rule didn't apply. It's not specifically just 'stocks' it is assets? https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/rr-08-05.pdf Basically the statute applies to 'stocks or securities'. BTC/ETH and other coins are plainly neither so the wash rule doesn't apply. ICOs are a more interesting story, but as they're all (claiming to be) utility tokens the wash sale rule currently isn't relevant to them either. Sooner or later a few of them will turn out to be securities after all and the wash sale rule will suddenly become extremely important to the handful of people unlucky enough to be audited. Also, what the SEC thinks is not necessarily relevant to what the IRS thinks so it's entirely possible the two departments will react differently to the same token. If this is relevant to the interests of anyone reading this thread, GL and may God have mercy on your soul.
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Jan 31, 2018 22:02
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If people lose faith in tethers of course the BFX price goes up, you need to offer more fake bucks for pogs as skepticism grows.
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Jan 31, 2018 22:02
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Lote posted:A 1% arbitrage is huge. I remember when I was in Vegas and there was a 1% arb on World Cup soccer. People were going crazy. Not without volume. You can't buy 1000 bitcoins at the cheaper exchange and sell 1000 bitcoins at the more expensive one. a 20 bitcoin buy and 20 bitcoin sell is probably enough to erase the difference.
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Jan 31, 2018 22:03
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“Let’s dress up like Native Americans and dump all the bitcoin in Boston harbor.” https://www.marketwatch.com/story/bitcoin-trader-after-a-discussion-with-his-accountant-fk-taxes-2018-01-31
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Jan 31, 2018 22:07
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Grand Theft Autobot posted:Warren buffet famously beat hedge funds with ETFs recently, I believe. You really think some goon is going to do as well as Warren Buffet huh
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Jan 31, 2018 22:11
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Grand Theft Autobot posted:Warren buffet famously beat hedge funds with ETFs recently, I believe. I thought hedge funds traditionally had pretty bad returns and are popular because of how wildly rich they make hedge fund managers.
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Jan 31, 2018 22:11
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Bip Roberts posted:I thought hedge funds traditionally had pretty bad returns and are popular because of how wildly rich they make hedge fund managers. Yeah Buffet has always been about long term investing and has been talking about SP500 over any kind of hedge fund for years and years. There's a strong argument to be made that the current valuations/prices are a result of tons of passive investment and at some point there will be a strong correction but even then I'd rather be invested in ETFs versus picking stocks or letting a manager decide what to do.
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Jan 31, 2018 22:13
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Bip Roberts posted:I thought hedge funds traditionally had pretty bad returns and are popular because of how wildly rich they make hedge fund managers. Coincidentally, those are also semiprivate so you can't just give them your money, and most of the money in there is from the hedge fund managers themselves. ElGroucho posted:You really think some goon is going to do as well as Warren Buffet huh
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Jan 31, 2018 22:14
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proctorbot posted:etherium is divorcing from bitcoin today and is going to hold value as bitcoin plummets. It's been divorcing the entire way down from 20k and given how many people want to buy into ICOs vs. how many people use bitcoin for virtually anything, there's a very good chance you're right and the dethroning happens this year.
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Jan 31, 2018 22:14
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Buffet isn't trying to beat the market anyway though, that's not his strategy. His strategy is identify strong companies and then invest long term because the US market will always perform well. Buffet's advice would probably be to just put your money into SP500 as often as possible and then forget about it. But that's not *fun* though so if you want to try and trade with a bit of cash go for it. Just don't trade with anything you can't afford to lose 100%. Based on that rule of thumb you're not risking retirement or college savings or what have you anyway.
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Jan 31, 2018 22:16
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COMRADES posted:but even then I'd rather be invested in ETFs versus picking stocks or letting a manager decide what to do. Yeah. I wanted to get into investing but I dont have the stomach to see something lose a quarter of its value overnight, or realize I sold something before the price took off like a rocket. At the minimum, I'd stress vomit with either of those events. I'm really happy with my target retirement fund with Vanguard. I get to see numbers go up (and down too) and I know I'll have a nice fat egg when I retire. e: sorry about your av COMRADES. I for one appreciate your ardent socialist posting buglord fucked around with this message at 22:23 on Jan 31, 2018 |
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Jan 31, 2018 22:21
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buglord posted:Yeah. I wanted to get into investing but I dont have the stomach to see something lose a quarter of its value overnight, or realize I sold something before the price took off like a rocket. At the minimum, I'd stress vomit with either of those events. I'm really happy with my target retirement fund with Vanguard. I get to see numbers go up (and down too) and I know I'll have a nice fat egg when I retire. Vanguard is loving rad, can't recommend it enough
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Jan 31, 2018 22:22
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buglord posted:Yeah. I wanted to get into investing but I dont have the stomach to see something lose a quarter of its value overnight, or realize I sold something before the price took off like a rocket. I recommend never reading this thread except for schaudenfreude and never ever touching crypto in any way because its ability to do both of those things is kinda the whole point right now.
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Jan 31, 2018 22:27
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Adar posted:I recommend never reading this thread except for schaudenfreude and never ever touching crypto in any way because its ability to do both of those things is kinda the whole point right now. I'm just here so I can rally on the destruction of bitcoin so GPUs are no longer marked up 300% my dude
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Jan 31, 2018 22:33
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https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814487244 lol
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Jan 31, 2018 22:36
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Tether has for the first time destroyed any of their tokens, in this case 30M. See, y'all, it's really bound to the USD and people can cash out whenever they want!
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Jan 31, 2018 22:37
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buglord posted:I'm just here so I can rally on the destruction of bitcoin so GPUs are no longer marked up 300% my dude Adar posted:It's been divorcing the entire way down from 20k and given how many people want to buy into ICOs vs. how many people use bitcoin for virtually anything, there's a very good chance you're right and the dethroning happens this year. bad news: bitcoin isn't what's marking up your GPUs, ethereum is good news: at some point in the next 18 months ethereum is transitioning to proof of stake, which will stop murdering your GPU prices bad news: that will leave the 384983498234982354234121 other coins still doing it forever until the end of time
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Jan 31, 2018 22:37
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Lote posted:A 1% arbitrage is huge. I remember when I was in Vegas and there was a 1% arb on World Cup soccer. People were going crazy. 1.8% looks great on paper but believe me, it's not that much for crypto arbitrage. People can do it successfully but it's not as straightforward as you might think.
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Jan 31, 2018 22:38
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From the tax article posted a few up:quote:Now, the part that really irks crypto enthusiasts. Any time you divest your digital asset, it’s a taxable event, even if you’re buying something with it. For example, say you bought $50 worth of bitcoin and then, when it doubled, used it to buy something worth $100. You’re on the hook for a $50 gain. quote:Also, want to exchange your bitcoin for Ethereum? That’s now a taxable event, as well. There’s no longer the sort of exchange relief you’d find in real estate.
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Jan 31, 2018 22:38
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buglord posted:I'm just here so I can rally on the destruction of bitcoin so GPUs are no longer marked up 300% my dude I don't think you're going to get your wish; even if bitcoin falls people are still going to pump and dump a million altcoins and people are going to want to gpu mine those even if they're in the red after electricity costs. Bitcoin showed that a lot of people are willing to eat a loss now while insanely speculating Gamers and hobby HPC people are hosed probably into next decade at which point everyone will just be used to the new high prices
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Jan 31, 2018 22:41
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Yeah but you can pay that exorbitant cost in bitcoins! ...Or did Newegg stop taking Bitpayments as well?
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Jan 31, 2018 22:43
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Adar posted:bad news: bitcoin isn't what's marking up your GPUs, ethereum is Hype over proof of stake is largely overblown, poo poo basically evolves into more complicated proof of work. No one has figured out how to prevent this yet
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Jan 31, 2018 22:43
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Sten Freak posted:From the tax article posted a few up: ohhhh drat this is gonna be good
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Jan 31, 2018 22:43
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Sten Freak posted:Wait, wait, wait, so if you exchange between coins it's a taxable event too? Does that include tether or is it just certain coins? Some people are facing a big ol mess of a return. Yup. Literally every sale or trade is a taxable event that needs to be reported in USD
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Jan 31, 2018 22:45
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QuarkJets posted:Yup. Literally every sale or trade is a taxable event that needs to be reported in USD Fun
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Jan 31, 2018 22:47
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For ya'll interested in actual investments a great book to read is the "the intelligent investor". Written decades ago, it's interesting to see what investing used to mean, the short version being that a "good investment" used to be buying stock in a company that had a stock value equal to that of the companies current assets, minus all debt. Try applying that logic to literally any stock available today
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Jan 31, 2018 22:47
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QuarkJets posted:Hype over proof of stake is largely overblown, poo poo basically evolves into more complicated proof of work. No one has figured out how to prevent this yet This is a debate worth having in a thread that isn't the lol buttcoin thread on the SA forums. I think the outcome here is that while a successful attack will always be theoretically possible, social consensus should prevent one from ever happening IRL, aka if a hostile entity were to ever seriously attack a PoS coin that is as visible as ethereum most of the community would immediately fork off and ignore the attacking chain. Because Vitalik has effectively blessed ethereum hard forks, a genuinely malicious attack on a hypothetically well-enough-coded-POS-ETH is probably impossible to pull off. A split into two valid forks would require a genuine split in consensus such as ETH vs. ETC. This does not mean a switch from PoW to PoS won't cause dozens of those forks as miners revolt or that any single coin will ever be short on drama, but Vitalik is one of about four people in crypto who is well aware that there is a massive bubble and has done his best to deflate it (the totally obvious Asperger's probably helps with this, tbqh) / his governance is basically enough to prevent a fork from escalating because the market will simply pick the fork that he's on top of. Adar fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Jan 31, 2018 |
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Jan 31, 2018 22:55
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QuarkJets posted:Yup. Literally every sale or trade is a taxable event that needs to be reported in USD Well I’m sure * they are aware of this * have all transactions documented with the tax forms the exchange provides like my fidelity acct * have a tax accountant to handle all of this
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Jan 31, 2018 23:03
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How to beat the market. Buy anything that converts to being a chainblock company. Smile as swarms of people pour everything into chainblock. Sell it all the next day because everyone realizes it's a scam. See $KODK
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Jan 31, 2018 23:08
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abigserve posted:For ya'll interested in actual investments a great book to read is the "the intelligent investor". Or buttcoins. It also means buttcoins.
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Jan 31, 2018 23:45
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Grand Theft Autobot posted:Warren buffet famously beat hedge funds with ETFs recently, I believe. Survival bias in a buttcoin thread? I am so shocked I nearly dropped my monocle.
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Jan 31, 2018 23:49
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Adar posted:bad news: bitcoin isn't what's marking up your GPUs, ethereum is
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Jan 31, 2018 23:54
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Burt Sexual posted:Well I’m sure Um Mr IRS you're totally wrong to audit me, I have never transacted in fiat USD! I'm exclusively using tether  Wait why are you arresting me? I do not consent!!!
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Jan 31, 2018 23:56
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Hobologist posted:But even back then most of those stocks were special cases, and sounds investing back then, as it does now, meant looking for companies that sustainably throw off enough free cash flow to make a very large yield on the purchase price. I was about to chime in with this. If you want to "have a fun time getting into investing", researching companies and valuation is a good way to go. If that sounds boring it's hard to go wrong with just letting your money sit in a low-cost index fund or etf. And even if you're getting heavily into analysis you still should keep most of your money in broad indexes, it's like modern portfolio theory 101.
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Jan 31, 2018 23:56
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this gold fringe on my bitcoin, u see. I do not consent
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Feb 1, 2018 00:00
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Andy Dufresne posted:Property rights and contract law require an independent and trustworthy 3rd party to mediate disputes (i.e. a legislature and court system), which doesn't work with an immutable blockchain. A central authority isn't a bug, it's a feature. By the way, this is actually a really big deal. That's kind of the huge flaw with the whole 'trustless' poo poo. OK, we have "trustless" economies. They are all incredibly corrupt shitholes where you can't get anything done and no serious business can REALLY happen because it all has to go through 10 bureaucrats and their buddies and also the local mob bosses and then after all that you get butt hosed anyway because lol what are you gonna do, sue them? Yeah, the USA has corruption too but its high level it's not here's is a list of people that need bribes before you can get a retail permit and here are a list of judges you need to keep happy in case you end up in small claims court. A fundamental pillar of a functioning economy is trust and mutual agreement. Designing a solution for an economy without that is like deciding on the best bandage to use for someone whose legs just got blown off.
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Feb 1, 2018 00:01
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Moridin920 posted:By the way, this is actually a really big deal. Yeah, I've tried pointing this out to people before Cool, we now track property ownership on the blockchain How do we ensure that people don't just lie when adding things to it initially. Like if Bob says he owns my house and I haven't registered it yet, how is it supposed to know he doesn't have a legit claim? You still need some kind of trusted gatekeeper to make sure that people aren't just adding bogus claims constantly.
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Feb 1, 2018 00:05
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i know nothing of technology and currency but does it have to be gpus doing the currency minting? can cryptocurrency be minted from beanie baby .pngs or QR codes with pepe on them or womens high heel shoes?
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Feb 1, 2018 00:07
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https://twitter.com/jack/status/958743238512328704 lol
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Feb 1, 2018 00:07
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Burt Sexual posted:Well I’m sure Even though I haven't gotten a statement from Coinbase or any other exchange, I've declared and paid capital gains taxes on the income I made from bitcoin. I just used the standard rates based on how long I'd held the coin and my bracket. Even if I'm off a little one way or the other, it shows a good-faith effort. The IRS never forgets, pay it now or pay it later with interest and penalties.
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