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Mulva posted:We've gone over this, you set the bar at "They continue to exist" and I said "Ok". You continue to set the bar at "They continue to exist". And I say again "Ok". Would you like to say it again? I get what you are saying. I don't agree. You have this funny idea that a group of heroes only exist to fight 1 world ending threat every 3 years or so and do nothing at all in the meanwhile, and the fact half of them are on the run and their family lives are destroyed and they can't meaningfully stand together unless forced to by amazing circumstance means they won. That seems loving insane to me, so you are functionally an alien to me. Your brain works in ways I will never understand. You're just fundamentally misunderstanding the point of the Avengers. They're not the police or the military or, despite what some people would have you believe, the paramilitary wing of Stark Industries. They exist to fight big, world-ending threats. Threats too big for each of them to handle on their own. They're also not a social club. The individual members' happiness doesn't matter. You keep saying "Yeah, but they won't team up again unless they're forced to!" They never did! They weren't out there teaming up to help old ladies cross the street or to stop Wilson Fisk from loving poo poo up in Hell's Kitchen. They're going to "meaningfully stand together" exactly as they have before. The only things that are actually, functionally different about the Avengers are that they don't live together or hang out together anymore and that some of their members' personal lives are more complicated. That is absolutely not what Zemo had in mind. He wanted to kill them. To end the Avengers. He ended up inconveniencing them slightly.
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Feb 2, 2018 17:07
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Phylodox posted:He ended up inconveniencing them slightly. The entire plot of Ant-Man 2 that we've been shown is how his life as it was is destroyed by what he did. Rhodey can't feel his dick no more. Captain America doesn't live in America. When presented with your exact argument Zemo just quietly lays back and goes "Really?". He seems content with the damage he caused. They don't seem happy with their victory. I know who came out of that exchange pleased with the results. He took his best shot and it was pretty Goddamn great. Certainly better than the god and the AI and the entirety of the Nazi party did. Everyone is worse off from what Zemo did in ways they may not ever fully recover from.....just like he is from the fallout of their actions. I'd say if he didn't get what he wanted when he started, by golly he got what he needed. Your bar for "minor inconvenience" is, again "Is still able to show up in Avengers 3". It's a bar that only works if you don't treat them as people living in a real world, and only as characters in a fictional drama. He failed because there will be an Avengers 3. That is the bottom line of all your arguments. There will be an Avengers 3.
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Feb 2, 2018 17:21
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The Avengers still exist, it's Cap's ragtag band of fugitives. Minus Clint, because his wife absolutely killed him once he was broken out of Floating Supermax.
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Feb 2, 2018 17:26
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Mulva posted:The entire plot of Ant-Man 2 that we've been shown is how his life as it was is destroyed by what he did. Rhodey can't feel his dick no more. Captain America doesn't live in America. When presented with your exact argument Zemo just quietly lays back and goes "Really?". He seems content with the damage he caused. They don't seem happy with their victory. I know who came out of that exchange pleased with the results. He took his best shot and it was pretty Goddamn great. Certainly better than the god and the AI and the entirety of the Nazi party did. Everyone is worse off from what Zemo did in ways they may not ever fully recover from.....just like he is from the fallout of their actions. I'd say if he didn't get what he wanted when he started, by golly he got what he needed. Zemo was satisfied because he thought he had won, that the Avengers were done for. Then they show the scene where Tony reads Steve's letter, showing that Zemo has, in fact, lost. Nobody is saying that things will go back exactly to what they were or that everything is happy. But Zemo didn't want to change them or hurt them. He. Wanted. To. Kill. Them. He failed. The movie doesn't end with Rhodey lying bitterly in a hospital bed, it ends with Rhodey struggling to recover from his traumatic injury. It ends with Steve pledging to step up if and when he's needed. They will certainly recover. Zemo didn't get what he wanted or needed.
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Feb 2, 2018 17:31
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Yo, just because your parents are finally chill enough to talk to each other without screaming doesn't mean they're not still divorced. Your family/life have changed and outside of cosmic interference will never be the same.
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Feb 2, 2018 17:41
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Why do you keep saying a bunch of poo poo that is just "There will be an Avengers 3" like it re-contextualizes your statement? Guess what: There was no chance of the Avengers name dying off once Tony Stark and Captain America walked out of that silo alive. He's still happy with the results. He's heard your argument even without the letter at the end. And he's happy with what he's accomplished. Because what it means is tarnished, and the people involved are devastated, and they will never ever go back to what they were.
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Feb 2, 2018 17:42
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Just like everyone in Civil War, in many ways you are both wrong.
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Feb 2, 2018 17:46
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Dibs on Hulk.
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Feb 2, 2018 17:46
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Mulva posted:Why do you keep saying a bunch of poo poo that is just "There will be an Avengers 3" like it re-contextualizes your statement? Guess what: There was no chance of the Avengers name dying off once Tony Stark and Captain America walked out of that silo alive. He's still happy with the results. He's heard your argument even without the letter at the end. And he's happy with what he's accomplished. Because what it means is tarnished, and the people involved are devastated, and they will never ever go back to what they were. That's not what Zemo wanted. "An empire toppled by its enemies can rise again. But one which crumbles from within? That's dead. Forever." Forever. He wanted the Avengers, as an organization, to be dead. He says so. They're not. He failed. He doesn't, at any point, seem like a character that would be satisfied by half-measures.
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Feb 2, 2018 17:50
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Ok so when they don't come together enough to stop Th-AH-n-OSE in the next movie can we stop being so certain about the future? Or are we going to keep splitting hairs on what makes them "the Avengers". Like if McDonald's becomes a raw juice chain is it still "McDonald's"? More importantly do you think people with a vendetta against McDonald's would consider that a win?
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Feb 2, 2018 18:06
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Eh, it's just like when the X-Men basically ceased to exist at the end of the Australian Outback era. Individually they were all off having their own adventures/forgetting who they actually were. Actually, I like at the start of X-tinction Agenda when Storm and I think Jean are having a conversation about whether or not it's worth re-forming the X-Men.
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Feb 2, 2018 18:12
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Fiege said that there's no plans on bringing the X-men or FF to the MCU anytime soon, but its been pointed out that's exactly what he said about Spider-Man and "oh hey Spider-Man's in Civil War" like a month later. Obviously, that's hopeful wishing, but I'd think Avengers 4 would be the first place we'd see anything more than just an easter egg. The main reason I really want Marvel to start putting out X-men is they'd go beyond what the Fox movies have done. They've been stuck in the late 70s/early 80s era, but afraid to embrace the more crazy parts of it. Marvel has shown to be more willing to embrace the crazy and more out there aspects. They're not beholden to making everything "grounded".
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Feb 2, 2018 18:33
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I saw that, he mostly just said they have everything planned out through 2019 so far so if they come in it wouldn't be until after that.
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Feb 2, 2018 18:36
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Aphrodite posted:I saw that, he mostly just said they have everything planned out through 2019 so far so if they come in it wouldn't be until after that. Which seemed obvious to me making that more or less a nonanswer.
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Feb 2, 2018 18:49
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X-men seems incredibly sexist Shouldn't it be called X-men & Women & Other? Or X-people/persons
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Feb 2, 2018 18:57
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Well, I mean, it was started by a creepy guy who wanted to bone the high school girl he was mentoring so i don't think he cared that much
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Feb 2, 2018 19:10
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X-Folk
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Feb 2, 2018 19:28
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Wolverine and Pals for accuracy
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Feb 2, 2018 19:30
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Fiege has to say that since they can't actually begin any work with those characters until the deal closes, which is still up to 18 months away. From there, it's at least another year before you'd see them in any movies.
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Feb 2, 2018 19:36
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Zzulu posted:X-men seems incredibly sexist Every other X-team has a better name. Except maybe Generation X.
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Feb 2, 2018 19:36
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Lobok posted:Every other X-team has a better name. Fixed
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Feb 2, 2018 19:55
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Feb 2, 2018 19:59
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https://twitter.com/Phil_Lewis_/sta...513531447173121
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Feb 2, 2018 21:57
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Endless Mike posted:Fiege has to say that since they can't actually begin any work with those characters until the deal closes, which is still up to 18 months away. From there, it's at least another year before you'd see them in any movies. This is what he's saying, but remember that they had plans ready for Spidey and were able to get him in the films super fast. I have no doubt that they're already getting their plans together, but they can't say anything until it's official.
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Feb 3, 2018 01:25
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Avengers 4 will probably be out before they get any regulatory approval.
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Feb 3, 2018 01:27
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This is me in highschool when someone brought in a bootleg copy of Blade to watch during Auto shop.
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Feb 3, 2018 02:39
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https://twitter.com/ArdoOmer/status/959600795485290496 And yet DC can't figure their poo poo out between all the people they've had working on their movies
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Feb 3, 2018 02:42
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This is why I never worry about Disney's aquistons, at least on a creative side. They seem to be pretty good at keeping arms length away from the properties, and letting the creatives do their own thing. There's probably a broad policy coming from from on down high but they're probably stuff like "make sure the movie has broad appeal, both demographically and internationally". WB seems intent on fiddling with everything in the DC movies. Plus, like I enjoyed Johns comic work, but he's not a movie guy, he's a comic guy that has very clear biases so having him be their guiding force is not going to really help. Octavia Spencer also is making sure poor kids can see Black Panther too. This is 100% amazing, and I've heard that Shuri is apparently going to be the smartest person in the MCU, hands down. That's awesome, make the young black woman smarter than all these white dudes.
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Feb 3, 2018 13:30
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Octavia Spencer is so awesome.
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Feb 3, 2018 19:42
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I've heard people say that Peter Parker should hook up with Shuri in the MCU and I am %1000 on board with that.
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Feb 3, 2018 19:47
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Shuri needs no man
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Feb 3, 2018 19:57
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Codependent Poster posted:I've heard people say that Peter Parker should hook up with Shuri in the MCU and I am %1000 on board with that. Honestly, yeah. MJ and Gwen have both been done to death and having Pete match up with another (soon to be) prominent MCU character would lend itself to some neat connective movie tissue. Plus, they both have the whole “teenage Einstein” thing going and I’d pay good money to see Pete acting awkward and intimidated around T’Challa.
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Feb 3, 2018 19:58
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I'm always down for some original shipping but there's a bit of an age difference there, isn't it
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Feb 3, 2018 21:18
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Samuringa posted:I'm always down for some original shipping but there's a bit of an age difference there, isn't it I forget how old the characters are supposed to be, but Letitia Wright is 24 and Tom Holland is 21.
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Feb 3, 2018 22:17
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Wow, he definitely does not look the part, poor kid.
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Feb 3, 2018 22:36
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Approximately zero people in the world know what an actual teenager is supposed to look like. Including teenagers.
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Feb 3, 2018 23:16
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BrianWilly posted:Approximately zero people in the world know what an actual teenager is supposed to look like. Including teenagers. 
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Feb 3, 2018 23:34
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Samuringa posted:I'm always down for some original shipping but there's a bit of an age difference there, isn't it It worked out fantastically for Padme and Anakin
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Feb 4, 2018 01:49
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Apparently shuri is like 16 in the movie
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Feb 4, 2018 02:29
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Somebody make a nebula emoji so I can post about how she's my wife until iw comes out https://twitter.com/MarvelStudios/status/960326476670226432
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Feb 5, 2018 02:58
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