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I'm financing Lasik so I don't have to comb the wastelands for my prescription, will I have to pay it off?
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Feb 4, 2018 15:21
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The Groper posted:I'm financing Lasik so I don't have to comb the wastelands for my prescription, will I have to pay it off? I've seen a ton of security documents for medical procedures, but they've always been for breast implants. I have no idea what in rem relief you could have against LASIK. I still think repossessing a financed dog is harsher than repossessing implants, but that's just me. I once saw a little old lady get spiteful as gently caress in a Chapter 7. Her neighbor filed a 7 and listed a personal loan from her on Schedule F. She had no way to get her money back or challenge the dischargeability, so she offered the Chapter 7 Trustee $8,000 for her now-bankrupt neighbor's dog. Her neighbor couldn't match it so she got the dog.
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Feb 4, 2018 15:34
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Acelerion posted:So much money owned by the rich it has to float from bubble to bubble chasing returns This is pretty much it, yeah
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Feb 4, 2018 15:55
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Digiwizzard posted:the banks didn't learn poo poo. The systemic risks never went away, they only got postponed and they've snowballed in magnitude as a result. Since the late 1980s the financial system has been wracked by shocks of increasing severity and frequency. This time there's nothing left that can prevent the crash. The banks did learn one thing: if they gently caress up badly enough that the consequences would destroy the entire global economy, the government will step in to save them. They learned that we do negotiate with terrorists, as long as the terrorists are wearing expensive enough suits.
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Feb 4, 2018 16:08
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 I call it "Brave God"
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Feb 4, 2018 16:50
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Digiwizzard posted:it's really simple, the 2008 financial crisis was caused by insane, excessive levels of debt. No. No. No! NO! NO! NO! NO!! *flips table* *tears shirt open* *falls to knees and screams at the heavens* Most of what you said was correct but make no mistake, debt was not the cause of the 2008 crash but merely the tool used to create it. The actual cause was fraud. People taking and giving too much debt was bad but it wouldn't have tanked the world economy on it's own. For that kind of fun we needed people gaming the system at every level of the home buying process. You started with bankers selling houses to people they knew drat well would never pay them off. From there they would cut those loans up and mix them with good loans and sell them as AAA rated investment instruments. From there you had various bought off government watchdogs turning a blind eye to this because they worked in JP Morgan Chase's offices and wanted cushy bank jobs down the line. And to top it all off you had banks scamming each other by insuring these known toxic assets with other banks, assuring that when they went up in flames they'd take literally every major bank (and by extension the world economy) down with them. It was so, so much worse than "too much debt". readingatwork fucked around with this message at 17:08 on Feb 4, 2018 |
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Feb 4, 2018 17:02
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readingatwork posted:
they call it nonprime instead of subprime now so everythings fine ofc
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Feb 4, 2018 17:12
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and then we gave them all the fattest bonuses in history for doing so, in order to guarantee that they would do it again. which they are! in fact, they never even stopped!
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Feb 4, 2018 17:13
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readingatwork posted:No. Ok but do you want the meal or just the sandwich
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Feb 4, 2018 17:17
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fun fact: you don't see colossal amounts of debt without fraud you just don't see it turns out the creditworthyness of populations of people don't change
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Feb 4, 2018 17:36
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Turns out when fictitious capital can't be valorized by labor, it's very bad
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Feb 4, 2018 17:48
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bob dobbs is dead posted:fun fact: you don't see colossal amounts of debt without fraud As a consumer bankruptcy attorney who sees literally hundreds of cases a week, this is not true. E: My irony detector may have been broken here. I was on the bike. Sorry if I missed the joke. Pancakes fucked around with this message at 18:03 on Feb 4, 2018 |
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Feb 4, 2018 17:51
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Pancakes posted:As a consumer bankruptcy attorney who sees literally hundreds of cases a week, this is not true. i ain't talking individual debt ain't talking individual fraud neither
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Feb 4, 2018 18:07
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Digiwizzard posted:it's really simple, the 2008 financial crisis was caused by insane, excessive levels of debt. You didnt explain the first graph regarding MBS held by the FED at all. The third one I linked before criticizing Ritzholtz for saying that's indicative that millenials are starting to buy houses. You're linking these graphs as thinking these are self evident when they are not so I insist you share your source who has these graphs pulled from the FRED
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Feb 4, 2018 18:14
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I wonder if this is how all those people in the 20s felt after repeated crashes and busts before the big one hit
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Feb 4, 2018 18:14
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the whole U.S. economy is built on fraud lol
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Feb 4, 2018 18:22
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*points to the bank* fraud *points to the skyscraper downtown housing the insurance companies* mmm that's fraud *points to bed bath & beyond* built on fraud i'm not joking either
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Feb 4, 2018 18:24
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https://twitter.com/Lisajon66479615/status/959968250284138497
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Feb 4, 2018 18:37
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CheeseSpawn posted:You didnt explain the first graph regarding MBS held by the FED at all. The third one I linked before criticizing Ritzholtz for saying that's indicative that millenials are starting to buy houses. You're linking these graphs as thinking these are self evident when they are not so I insist you share your source who has these graphs pulled from the FRED Looking at those graphs it seems like the rate of increase in debt and home prices has decreased noticeably since the Great Recession, which I would take as an indicator things are different. And if that link on the last page suggesting home prices are up mostly because of a lack of construction is right it makes sense home ownership would be down despite rising costs and debt, since there’s more people competing to buy fewer homes.
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Feb 4, 2018 18:52
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It is a mistake to assume that it is people buying homes
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Feb 4, 2018 19:20
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BrutalistMcDonalds posted:the whole U.S. economy is built on fraud lol Deregulation was really successful
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Feb 4, 2018 19:22
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CheeseSpawn posted:If boomers aren't selling and construction isnt taking advantage of low interest rates, why is there a low housing supply? poo poo is too complex to know for sure until we can see it in hindsight. https://www.housingwire.com/articles/41839-invitation-homes-starwood-waypoint-homes-merge-to-create-largest-single-family-landlord and get this: the funds are now bundling rental payments and selling them as securities -- rental-backed securities instead of mortgage-backed securities. https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/11/wall-street-buying-foreclosed-homes/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfpBarn7jlc
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Feb 4, 2018 19:43
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Ruzihm posted:Ok but do you want the meal or just the sandwich when i become god of cspam i shall destroy this meme and all who bow before it
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Feb 4, 2018 19:43
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it really is the shittiest zero effort catchphrase
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Feb 4, 2018 19:46
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BrutalistMcDonalds posted:hedge funds have been gobbling up huge numbers of houses. why sell to a millennial when you're (like my boomer parents) getting regularly cold-called by buyers willing to show up that day and pay in cash? (and pay well.) the buyer, small- and mid-level speculators, can then flip the house to a hedge fund. 
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Feb 4, 2018 19:46
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Definancalize the economy
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Feb 4, 2018 19:47
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quote:“You kind of just hope they know what they’re doing,” says Dean Baker, an economist with the Center for Economic and Policy Research. “That they have provisions for turnover and vacancies. But have they done that? Have they taken the appropriate care? I certainly wouldn’t count on it.” The cash flow analysis in the documents sent to investors assumes that 95% of these homes will be rented at all times, at an average monthly rent of $1,312. It’s an occupancy rate that real estate professionals describe as ambitious.
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Feb 4, 2018 19:50
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I, uh...hmm...thats a only little terrifying
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Feb 4, 2018 19:58
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video owns: so the perspective here is that *of course* the economic system is going to blow itself up. that's built in. but what does it and when? i kinda have an idea about the first one but the second one is unknowable. a bunch of people (who did everything they were supposed to do) will get tossed out on the street and lose everything, a small number of people will get even richer from it, and then the system will stabilize before careening into the next crisis ad infinitum. because  rental-backed securities is also a great example of what harvey is talking about around 7:30 BrutalistMcDonalds fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Feb 4, 2018 |
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Feb 4, 2018 20:04
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H.P. Hovercraft posted:it really is the shittiest zero effort catchphrase it is a vital ecological buffer against goonery
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Feb 4, 2018 20:11
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BrutalistMcDonalds posted:and get this: the funds are now bundling rental payments and selling them as securities -- rental-backed securities instead of mortgage-backed securities. this. this is what's gonna gently caress everything up again. aren't they doing the exact same thing with loving car payments too?
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Feb 4, 2018 20:14
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Rhesus Pieces posted:this. this is what's gonna gently caress everything up again. looks like tesla is getting in on it: https://www.wsj.com/articles/tesla-raises-546-million-in-its-first-asset-backed-securities-deal-1517512824
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Feb 4, 2018 20:17
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I mean tell me if I'm wrong but wasn't a huge cause of 2008 the sale of CDOs full of mortgage-backed securities, which were supposed to be as sound and stable as treasuries? and aren't banks/hedge funds doing the exact same goddamn thing now with much less secure debts like rent and car payments?
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Feb 4, 2018 20:25
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https://twitter.com/wyatt_privilege/status/960229549878505480
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Feb 4, 2018 20:27
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i know one tesla owner and she's my landlord lmao
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Feb 4, 2018 20:30
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that graph, fuckin lmao
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Feb 4, 2018 20:32
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Rhesus Pieces posted:I mean tell me if I'm wrong but wasn't a huge cause of 2008 the sale of CDOs full of mortgage-backed securities, which were supposed to be as sound and stable as treasuries? and aren't banks/hedge funds doing the exact same goddamn thing now with much less secure debts like rent and car payments? that was only one component of many. the 2008 crisis was basically a 'perfect storm' financial disaster because dozens of different components all failed and symbiotically fed into a vicious cycle of additional failures. in this case no one is treating sub-prime auto loans as AAA backed securities
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Feb 4, 2018 20:37
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don't get me wrong i'm not saying it can't go *bang* and leave a lot of people screwed over but it'll be contained and won't spread into every other sector and crash the entire world economy like the housing bust did
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Feb 4, 2018 20:39
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BrutalistMcDonalds posted:hedge funds have been gobbling up huge numbers of houses. why sell to a millennial when you're (like my boomer parents) getting regularly cold-called by buyers willing to show up that day and pay in cash? (and pay well.) the buyer, small- and mid-level speculators, can then flip the house to a hedge fund. drat you always get good research links Bru. While your link is somewhat old at 5 years, a little more current link that's current estimates their ownership of marketshare at 1-2% but even that small number seems shaky. I wonder what other market firms are out there looking at this more carefully but it's not like that's Trump is going to help out individual home buyers any ways. Despite these lovely moves by Wall Street, there are still resistive market factors like existing homeowners that aren't willing to sell since there's "limited" choices of updgrading or downgrading since they are contributing to the problem. Despite these issues, I feel that since a lot of potential buyers are removed from the market since they cant really afford to buy, the only real losers are whoever is overleverged when they purchased their inflated asset. It seemed like the only way to win was not to play their game but Wall Street keeps finding another way to gently caress over people in some way.
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Feb 4, 2018 20:40
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Big Companies have been doing this thing recently where they turn to SV for ideas. Startup culture, agile development, 'disruption', et cetera, is the new cottage industry for 'that thing that will take us to the next level'. And why not, un-tethering valuation to pesky things like 'assets' and 'cash flow' can be fantastically convenient. So Ive had the Tesla and Uber conversations with a lot of folks recently and i cant find anyone that thinks this is remotely ok. And the participants here would be more naturally skewed toward the apologist side to boot.
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Feb 4, 2018 20:43
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