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Gort posted:I was a fan of Civ 1's system, where you could stack infinitely and the best defender would defend. However, if you lost the defender, you lost everything in the stack. That was back in the days where every combat resulted in a dead unit, though, so I'd say the stacking for Civ 7 should be: Also make it where you cannot attack directly out of a stack. So you'd have to have formations of units. and blockers/flankers etc surrounding your "core" stack. If they roll up and flank you with cavalry they can easilly route your army. End game units like tanks etc would be able to stack unlimited and attack from a stack just to make end game combat faster.
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Feb 1, 2018 17:49
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Gort posted:Nah, this is a non-answer. Games always have flawed AIs - good design consists of making a game that your AI can play, not making a game and then hoping the AI you have can play it. 
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Feb 1, 2018 17:53
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Did anyone else's Civ 5 just download an update?
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Feb 1, 2018 21:58
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Non-stacking units really shine in scenarios, where you can have intentionally designed tactically interesting battlefields without having to introduce complicated terrain effects. In random map play, most combat just revolves around getting your units to a city and that's only complicated by random chance. I can remember exactly one time in Civ 5 random play where non-stacking units actually created an interesting tactical situation. I ended up settling my capital right next to a mountain range with a single tile valley. On the other side of the city was Athens. I spent the entire game battling with Alexander over control of the bottleneck, which was actually challenging and fun. Otherwise, there was no real benefit outside of scenario play.
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Feb 1, 2018 22:23
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Gort posted:Europa's attrition wouldn't work in civ since reinforcing civ units is free. Time spent recovering from attrition damage instead of attacking or defending is a cost, too.
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Feb 1, 2018 23:56
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Roadie posted:Time spent recovering from attrition damage instead of attacking or defending is a cost, too. Europa has that cost as well as the manpower and money cost.
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Feb 2, 2018 00:24
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So Shaka of Zulu will almost certainly be revealed tomorrow. I must say, despite myself, I am pretty hyped for this expansion. It'll be fun to get back into playing Civ, and even if the final product doesn't satisfy me totally I am looking forward to opening up all the modding potential the expansion brings with it. Gonna be exciting to really dig into the code and start to play around with all the new toys.
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Feb 6, 2018 08:17
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Man, putting all your eggs in a religious victory can be hard when the enemy AI can actually use Gurus and poo poo. Rip 4 hours.
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Feb 6, 2018 11:22
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Civ VII should bring back do or die combat instead of this unit carpet poo poo we have now where it is quite possible to outproduce the possible applicable damage you can be dealt.
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Feb 6, 2018 12:01
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10 Crownsquote:Starbreeze, an independent creator, publisher and distributor of high quality entertainment products, has signed a publishing agreement with Mohawk Games regarding the project currently under the working title 10 Crowns. 
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Feb 6, 2018 14:28
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jBrereton posted:Civ VII should bring back do or die combat instead of this unit carpet poo poo we have now where it is quite possible to outproduce the possible applicable damage you can be dealt. also civ 7 has to reduce ranges by 1, the AI clearly can't handle ít and shooting arrows across ocean straits etc. is dumb as gently caress
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Feb 6, 2018 14:28
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Just remove ranged combat to begin with. It doesn’t really add anything.
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Feb 6, 2018 15:02
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Hell yes. Please be the competition Civ needs.
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Feb 6, 2018 15:07
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Excitement: palpable
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Feb 6, 2018 15:23
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It'd be nice if it actually ends up pretty good, alternatives are good to have and Paradox just isn't really comparable because they don't do turn-based (which I greatly prefer). The Endless games never really clicked for me.
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Feb 6, 2018 15:42
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 Attention PBEM crowd I'm looking for a replacement for myself for 3 PBEM games (even separately). I'm leaving for a vacation for 3 weeks and I won't be able to play my drat turns. So if there's anyone who'd be interested in hopping into ongoing games, I'll be happy to swap with you. Depending on how you like the games, I might either take them back after 3 weeks or leave them to you (and start new ones), I don't really have preference. Anyway, what I'm offering: - Autumn Goon Game. Renaissance era. Me playing Scythia (2nd place), currently being declared war upon by Indonesia (1st place). Could be an interesting fight. - Winter Goon Game. Medieval era. Me playing Indonesia (2nd place). Ulvino is in the lead as Russia. Largely a peaceful game, sans some border skirmishes with my Nubian neighbour. I'd like to build and settle some islands. - Acechante's pubbie game. Classical era. Me playing Egypt (2nd place) and just about to finish conquering Kongo - we spawned very close to each other. After that is done, it's still undecided what to do, perhaps build some wonders. So if anyone's interested, send me a private message or find me on Steam. If I don't find replacements I'll probably have to drop altogether since I don't want to keep people waiting for 3 weeks.
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Feb 6, 2018 15:55
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The jump from King to Emperor is a real motherfucker, huh? I don't think I'm confident enough to do it with anyone apart from Rome or Australia.
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Feb 6, 2018 16:00
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toasterwarrior posted:The jump from King to Emperor is a real motherfucker, huh? I don't think I'm confident enough to do it with anyone apart from Rome or Australia. It really is. King is a cakewalk while Emperor can be actually difficult. The biggest difference is the early snowball effect of wonders, in King you can get most of them, in Emperor you have to really plan ahead to get one or two. I'm pretty pumped for this expansion. Flipping cities by being straight up better than them was one of my favorite elements in Civ IV. I used to love pumping out so much culture that my borders would enfold other cities until they just said screw it and came to my side, then I would reward them by buying them every single life-improving building there is.
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Feb 6, 2018 16:03
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To the surprise of absolutely nobody, Shaka of Zulu is the last Civ in Rise and Fall and appears to be pure, 100% military. Earlier corps and armies will be interesting, especially with that UD allowing them to be built early and the UA upgrading units that capture cities.
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Feb 6, 2018 16:12
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Corps with +5 combat strength in the Medieval era? If they haven't changed the combat system at all that sounds insanely broken.
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Feb 6, 2018 16:25
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Not that the Zulu bonuses are bad, but I feel like they're both good and late enough that no human neighbor would ever let the Zulu live past the Medieval era, lest they deal with cheap, +15 strength combat units.
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Feb 6, 2018 16:26
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It really depends, right now the AI never really goes for Military Tactics which unlocks Pikemen (and presumably Impis). And you certainly can't expect the AI to conquer cities with them to upgrade them, though they'll probably just build the Corps naturally. Here's something to consider though, it looks like the Impi costs 125 production, compared to the 200 production of a Pikeman. That's a pretty significant discount, and screenshots from Rise and Fall have shown us that the military policy cards like Feudal Contract have been adjusted to increase production towards anti-cavalry. Anti-cavalry have not traditionally been very strong, but now that Oligarchy boosts them (and you can get the Oligarchic Legacy policy card to keep that +4 strength around as long as you want to dedicate a wildcard slot to it) and you can actually boost their production, they might see more use. Certainly 56 strength Impi corps sound like a terror.
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Feb 6, 2018 16:34
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Zulu pretty much took my early corps and armies idea I had for my Napoleon mod.(I wasn't going to give them additional strength though because I actually understand the game).Guess I have to get more creative now. Zulu are crazy though. The kind of Civ you can win with accidentally and with no though. The Human Crouton fucked around with this message at 20:29 on Feb 6, 2018 |
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Feb 6, 2018 17:50
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markus_cz posted:
Maintaining the strategic "I hope nobody notices me" second place in all three games I see  I'll message you later - I'll happily step in for one of your non-winter games
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Feb 6, 2018 17:56
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What is everyone's guess for supremely overpowered Civ that made it through because Firaxis does not know their own game? For vanilla, 100% of people who played 5 could tell that Scythia was overpowered, and they were right because Scythia was overpowered to the point where they had to change game mechanics(getting gold for disbanding units) just to make Scythia a manageable, but still the best Civ in the game. Mine is: Zulu UU that is cheaper, stronger(flanking bonus), and gains more XP than its base unit sounds powerful. But wait, you can also build corps of those units earlier, and without the prerequisite buildings. Also let's take the main purpose of corps, which is more power per hex, and add 5 to that. So not only do we have the built in advantage of a corp versus a single unit, but we're adding more power to that advantage at a time when the opponent cannot possibly counter on a hex versus hex basis. But let's make that worse and make corps and armies cheaper. So now, Shaka's opponent's can't compete on a hex versus hex basis, but they also can't compete with total military production and power. Also, a half-cost encampment replacement will net Shaka an early great general. Second place is Cree for the mekewap because housing plus production is very powerful by itself, even better with bonus food or gold, and you can build three of them with one builder. But it's not really OP because if you start next to Zulu then you are dead no matter what. The Human Crouton fucked around with this message at 21:07 on Feb 6, 2018 |
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Feb 6, 2018 20:44
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It'll all depend on timing, really. While I think the Zulu are potent, I don't think they're as egregious as Scythia or Persia. First, Military Tactics is a fairly undesirable leaf tech that I almost never get with other Civs unless I really want the Huey Teocalli. Second, even with their potent flanking, an Impi starts at a disadvantage versus Swordsmen due to being anti-cav. 41 strength vs. 36+10, even if the Zulu has a flank the sword doesn't they're still breaking even. Now, Zulu will get Corps at late Medieval with Mercenaries. This gives them a pretty significant advantage, but if they have to face Musketmen at early Renaissance it's still a tough battle, as the 55+10 strength Muskets will face off well against Impis. The Impis also lack any promotion to give them strength against ranged units, while both of the first-tier promotions of the melee line do. Honestly, while the Impi has a brief window where it can really shine (particularly if you build lots of spears in advance and upgrade them), it might be better in some cases to forgo Impis altogether and just throw Knight corps at the enemy. Those things will be truly terrifying (though the addition of the Pike and Shot at Gunpowder may shorten the length of time you can expect Knights to be effective). The primary advantage of the Impi seems to be their cheap cost, allowing you to totally swarm the enemy with Impi corps. Magil Zeal fucked around with this message at 21:17 on Feb 6, 2018 |
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Feb 6, 2018 21:13
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I'm sure in single-player games, the Zulus are going to have fun stomping all over the helpless AI, but I'm not sure anyone's going to want to play them in any multiplayer game. While the Zulus have some game-breaking abilities, outside of the cheap encampments their bonuses don't come online until at least the late Medieval era. That's in stark contrast to the likes of Sumeria, Scythia or Macedon who can almost immediately annihilate their next door neighbors with early units. Playing as the Zulus will pretty much mark you as the first person to go to war with because they have to; no one can compete with cheaper, earlier, stronger corps and armies when the time comes, especially if they're made up of Impis who are cheaper (both production-wise and maintenance-wise) and stronger It's apparent that no one at Firaxis ask themselves whether a civ is fun not just to play as but also to play against. Bluff Buster fucked around with this message at 21:34 on Feb 6, 2018 |
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Feb 6, 2018 21:25
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I don't think the Impis actually have 3 movement. The (edit: production) tooltip says 2. They had 3 movement (edit: in the combat preview window) because they had a Great General nearby. On a side note, most of those shots with the Impis in combat had two Great Generals nearby, but the Impis seemed to only be getting +1 movement and +5 strength. Which suggests either one of the GGs was ahead two eras, or GG-stacking is gone. Magil Zeal fucked around with this message at 21:32 on Feb 6, 2018 |
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Feb 6, 2018 21:29
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The Zulu music is also op.
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Feb 6, 2018 21:46
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markus_cz posted:
Two games taken by JeremoudCorbynejad. The Winter Game is still available so let me know if you want to take it.
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Feb 6, 2018 22:11
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Has anyone playing the iPad version lost all their achievements? It’s annoying as I can’t remember which cubs I played as.
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Feb 6, 2018 22:20
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Body Status: READY
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Feb 6, 2018 23:11
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Ratios and Tendency posted:The Zulu music is also op. Quoting this
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Feb 7, 2018 04:45
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I've been watching this thread since pre-release, and bought civ6 in the humble monthly for cheap. I waited so long due to all the nay-saying in this thread, but it's been so long that I kinda went into it with starry eyes and excitement. I have a little notepad full of musings and first impressions that I might organize and post later, but I'll just say this: I normally binge 8+ hours when I get a new 4X, no matter how good or bad. It's been two weeks now, and I'm not even halfway through my first Civ6 game. Every time I try to build something small (builder etc) and see that its approximately two tech eras away before finishing, I just give a sad sigh and exit to desktop.
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Feb 7, 2018 16:12
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Serephina posted:I've been watching this thread since pre-release, and bought civ6 in the humble monthly for cheap. I waited so long due to all the nay-saying in this thread, but it's been so long that I kinda went into it with starry eyes and excitement. I have a little notepad full of musings and first impressions that I might organize and post later, but I'll just say this: If it takes you that long to build something you're doing it wrong. Like, horribly wrong.
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Feb 7, 2018 17:15
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I've won three King games since I got this during the bundle so yeah, you have to be doing something terribly wrong.
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Feb 7, 2018 17:29
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There are also extreme examples such as YouTube videos of people winning via Science Victory around turn 150 (Standard speed, Deity). Not the exact way I like to play the game, but even I understand the concept that by the midgame if I'm still settling new cities (rather than conquering them) then yeah it might need some forest chops/trade routes to get going.
Magil Zeal fucked around with this message at 17:45 on Feb 7, 2018 |
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Feb 7, 2018 17:36
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What are early impressions? I was hugely into 5 but 6 seemed pretty bad so I held off. Expansion fix enough stuff to be worth it or should I wait until the next expansion?
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Feb 7, 2018 18:02
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Barent posted:What are early impressions? I was hugely into 5 but 6 seemed pretty bad so I held off. Expansion fix enough stuff to be worth it or should I wait until the next expansion? Civ VI is a good game but it's not V (which is good because V was very bad). Its two largest problems are the UI and AI, but frankly I think most Civ players are used to deficiencies in those areas.* *Edit: Which isn't to say those things aren't problems, because they are. I still really like playing it though. Magil Zeal fucked around with this message at 18:42 on Feb 7, 2018 |
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Feb 7, 2018 18:27
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Rise and Fall soundtrack! Did they upload it properly this time?
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