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Are you a This poll is closed. |
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| homeowner |
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39 | 22.41% |
| renter |
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69 | 39.66% |
| stupid peace of poo poo |
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66 | 37.93% |
| Total: | 174 votes | ||
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This is gonna be fun 
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Feb 12, 2018 23:39
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| # ? May 23, 2024 13:15 |
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In hindsight that poo poo with Bishop was pretty clearly some mud slinging from someone within National who knew blinglish was going to go. Bish is really well positioned to get deputy and then to take over as leader when they inevitably lose the next election
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Feb 12, 2018 23:47
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bike tory posted:when they inevitably lose the next election Don't fuckin jinx it
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Feb 12, 2018 23:48
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El Pollo Blanco posted:Let the psychotic infighting commence It has been going on for a while, now it should spill out in to the streets.
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Feb 13, 2018 00:18
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Good, gently caress off Bill you prick.
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Feb 13, 2018 01:30
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So much for that whole "strongest Opposition party that Parliament has seen" thing, eh Bill?
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Feb 13, 2018 01:35
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Really surprised that National failed to deliver on another of its promises.
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Feb 13, 2018 01:40
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Bye Bye Bill 
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Feb 13, 2018 01:49
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Rahul posted:So much for that whole "strongest Opposition party that Parliament has seen" thing, eh Bill? 
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Feb 13, 2018 02:28
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https://twitter.com/radionz/status/963181002381078528?ref_src=twcamp%5Ecopy%7Ctwsrc%5Eandroid%7Ctwgr%5Ecopy%7Ctwcon%5E7090%7Ctwterm%5E2 "I'm not owned! I'm not owned!"
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Feb 13, 2018 02:53
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he said he was proud of his terrible stint as health minister in the 90s lol
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Feb 13, 2018 03:06
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Varkk posted:It has been going on for a while, now it should spill out in to the streets.
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Feb 13, 2018 03:38
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Charles 2 of Spain posted:Lol at the idea a National politician would walk anywhere on a public street. I see Steven Joyce all the time Resisting the urge to shove him into traffic is hard sometimes A friend told me an amusing anecdote about meeting JK on a plane recently, she pretended not to know who he was and asked if he came to Wellington often, he said "it's my first time here actually" The point of this story is more evidence key's a pathological liar El Pollo Blanco fucked around with this message at 03:56 on Feb 13, 2018 |
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Feb 13, 2018 03:47
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they're all way shorter than you think. winston is tiny!
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Feb 13, 2018 03:53
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exmarx posted:he said he was proud of his terrible stint as health minister in the 90s lol His social investment baby is actually not a terrible idea, and I'm glad the SIA didn't get shitcanned.
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Feb 13, 2018 03:58
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bike tory posted:In hindsight that poo poo with Bishop was pretty clearly some mud slinging from someone within National who knew blinglish was going to go. Bish is really well positioned to get deputy and then to take over as leader when they inevitably lose the next election You're dead right, but to be fair it was extremely obvious on the day the story broke too; even Hooton was screaming about it on Kiwiblog.
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Feb 13, 2018 04:06
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sebmojo posted:His social investment baby is actually not a terrible idea, and I'm glad the SIA didn't get shitcanned. That one that was designed around allowing the same social services that accidentally forward excel spreadsheets of privileged client information to journalists or (allegedly) MPs full access to every single government funded service you have ever accessed so that it can do more 'big picture' analysis like perhaps emailing your abuser what shelter you're in? The one that's currently illegal under the Privacy Act?
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Feb 13, 2018 05:19
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sebmojo posted:His social investment baby is actually not a terrible idea, and I'm glad the SIA didn't get shitcanned. the idea of early intervention saving $$$ down the track is both good and incredibly obvious. social investment under national was basically a voucherisation of the welfare state, with choices made through big data that's supported by a dubious level of context.
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Feb 13, 2018 05:31
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also i heard a rumour it was actually paula's thing originally 👀
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Feb 13, 2018 05:32
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Ghostlight posted:You mean the scheme founded on all of the bad principles used to put extra police into black neighbourhoods under the self-fulfilling prediction that more black people will commit crimes; which has seen a huge growth in criticism in the last couple of years for entrenching the very legal and social issues that it is supposedly designed to detect and ostensibly address? I worked for the Privacy Commissioner for 16 years, my area of responsibility was information sharing law reform and social investment, and I co wrote the report on ICLD that got the MSD programme shut down, so yes. That is what I mean.
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Feb 13, 2018 05:38
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Social investment is just using data to see what works, and there are non invasive ways to do that, eg the idi. The social investment agency is doing good work, and worked very closely with opc to get a privacy friendly solution to social investment. As evidence, they've convinced carmel sepuloni that they should keep going, with a shift in focus away from a strictly monetary understanding of investment. What happened with msd was ministerial bullying, if you read the report they could easily have done what they wanted to do in a privacy protective way.
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Feb 13, 2018 05:56
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I don't doubt that there are privacy-friendly solutions, but the National social investment programme was started with the explicit purpose of using that information on a much more targeted level than would be available through anonymised sharing between agencies. That's why the MSD thought they should be getting that information in the first place - because it would allow them to tie use of those services by individuals to others to determine 'risk factors' for their children, relatives, etc. It wasn't about improving the deployment of, say, benefits by using benefit-related big data - it was about glomping benefit-related data into offense-related data and schooling-related data for targeted 'interventions' for children that data determined would become a future burden on society.
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Feb 13, 2018 06:14
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exmarx posted:also i heard a rumour it was actually paula's thing originally 👀 I was going to say, if it benefits the little man then how are we sure he actually had anything to do with it?
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Feb 13, 2018 06:29
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Ghostlight posted:I don't doubt that there are privacy-friendly solutions, but the National social investment programme was started with the explicit purpose of using that information on a much more targeted level than would be available through anonymised sharing between agencies. That's why the MSD thought they should be getting that information in the first place - because it would allow them to tie use of those services by individuals to others to determine 'risk factors' for their children, relatives, etc. It wasn't about improving the deployment of, say, benefits by using benefit-related big data - it was about glomping benefit-related data into offense-related data and schooling-related data for targeted 'interventions' for children that data determined would become a future burden on society. Yeah that's fair, and we found it creepy and concerning at the time. But when you're getting astonishing data driven conclusions like uneducated solo mum plus dad in jail plus on a benefit equals toddler more likely to be at risk, it's obvious enough that calling it Orwellian seems melodramatic. I agree tha a legally mandated single big pool of government data (which they were pushing, and we put a lot of effort into killing) would have been extremely bad. But with that off the table, the idea of using data to spend money where it's needed is fine. That was an entertaining couple of years.
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Feb 13, 2018 06:34
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Makes sense to me. Proper investment requires good research, and good research requires a sizable amount of standardised data.
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Feb 13, 2018 06:44
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Just to remind everyone enjoying Bill English’s retirement that Maureen Pugh is next on the list. https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/80884541/national-mp-maureen-pugh-doesnt-believe-in-pharmaceutical-drugs Obviously being National she is bad, but she is a special case of bad. Also the article fails to mention her time as Mayor of Hokitika saw the council take on a huge amount of debt to pay for her and her friends to go on junkets.
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Feb 13, 2018 07:18
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Varkk posted:Just to remind everyone enjoying Bill English’s retirement that Maureen Pugh is next on the list. Hey At least she wasn't taking money directly from the Chinese government for it a step above most high ranking national members
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Feb 13, 2018 07:28
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The likes of Nick Smith, David Carter, maybe Brownlee and Joyce, are also gonna go this term. The fourth guy on the list outside of parliament is a hardcore conservative catholic: https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/95869217/abortion-goes-against-his-conscience-says-nationals-new-lynn-candidate also i'm team judith 100%
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Feb 13, 2018 07:44
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sebmojo posted:Yeah that's fair, and we found it creepy and concerning at the time. But when you're getting astonishing data driven conclusions like uneducated solo mum plus dad in jail plus on a benefit equals toddler more likely to be at risk, it's obvious enough that calling it Orwellian seems melodramatic. It's especially bad when your goal isn't to see fewer uneducated mothers or fewer fathers in jail, but simply to identify where you could save money on social services by, for example, railroading children into privately-run reform schools in the name of future crimes.
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Feb 13, 2018 10:17
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Ghostlight posted:A lot of the issues they've seen in the US in similar schemes is when you identify a child as 'at risk' and every government worker coming into contact with them throughout their life has the computer ping up as "statistically a thief" then they are treated like a thief seeing fewer opportunities and being more closely scrutinised until the prediction is eventually fulfilled. That's the sort of thing that we were fighting against, having a poverty popup that follows you through your life. On reflection, i'm not sure we disagree that much - social investment is the core of a good idea with a bunch of terrible potential outcomes. I feel good about the work we did helping avert the worst aspects of it, and the scheme may have dodged a bullet with National getting kicked out.
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Feb 13, 2018 11:37
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The idea of identifying "at risk" kids so that you can make "efficient social investments" is penny pinching neoliberal bullshit
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Feb 13, 2018 18:55
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Probably not. I don't disagree with the idea of social investment, just with National getting credit for its introduction when it was only as phase one in their planned social welfare apocalypse rather than for the idea itself.
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Feb 13, 2018 19:02
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Social investments needs to target communities and social spaces rather than trying to individualise all social ills and reduce them to the simple product of a handful of discrete, identifiable contributing factors.
voiceless anal fricative fucked around with this message at 20:12 on Feb 13, 2018 |
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Feb 13, 2018 20:05
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as a Green Party Member I ranked Marama highly when she entered the list in 14' but I support Julie Anne Genter for co-leader for a buncha good reasons and dumb ones like I've met her and she is the best American New Zealander we could hope for in terms of fighting the old stereotype of Americans as only wanting to 'take something' while in NZ also yes LOL at Crusher potentially leading
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Feb 13, 2018 21:05
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No please vote Marama Davidson for green coleader, she is exactly what the Greens need, and also complements James Shaw perfectly. Julie Anne Genter hits the exact same demographic appeal as James Shaw.
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Feb 13, 2018 21:41
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Hooton, Slater etc all support JAG. She's a cool lady and I like her but that support should worry you. Right-wing pundits do not have the best intentions of the Greens at heart.
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Feb 13, 2018 21:44
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COME ON CRUSHER make my dreams come true 
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Feb 13, 2018 21:59
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SurreptitiousMuffin posted:Hooton, Slater etc all support JAG. I guess you have a point. Man I hadn't thought about Slater for what seems like years until reading your post just now. Im glad at how much that guy has dropped off the radar. But with a Collins run hmmm
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Feb 13, 2018 22:02
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Based current mood amongst the Greenies I know (and the party is almost certainly aware if this), anybody except Marama would be suicide. Julie-Anne's people prefer her but will support the party with Marama at the helm. Marama's supporters will fuckin walk if Julie-Anne is at the helm.
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Feb 13, 2018 23:36
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lmbo, nice legacy Englishquote:Economist Shamubeel Eaqub has hit out at the Labour Government's fiscal responsibility rules, saying it was acting as a "straitjacket" on it and debt could be used to reform the housing market.
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Feb 14, 2018 00:31
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