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atomicthumbs posted:Who will arrive in about five minutes, having fed Hrotomos to the Door *having fed the Door to Hrotomos
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Feb 18, 2018 02:02
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1 is having to console Mammon because watching someone else make the same major fuckup he did is very distressing for him
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Feb 18, 2018 02:04
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so who was cc with the first time she did this? "who" is probably plural in this case, given she would have had to throw someone to the door
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Feb 18, 2018 02:08
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Oh poo poo Mammon/Virgin Mariesque will probably remember Yabalchoath dang
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Feb 18, 2018 02:45
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suddenly Mammon springs to his feet. "We shall have ICE CREAM!" he cries. And it was the best ice cream because it was shared between friends.
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Feb 18, 2018 02:50
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AbysmalPeptoBismol posted:Yep. Ingsvld is still presumably marching along with what Auntie Maya so appropriately termed the "parade of fools" chasing Allison. Ohh yeah, the fanfic book isn't named is it? Or living/a mimic/able to roll its eye at Cio's cornier writing.
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Feb 18, 2018 02:55
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I now want the fanfic book to be a mimic
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Feb 18, 2018 02:56
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:Good ol' betrayin' Cio, shown here reverting to type In the world background, Abbadon has pretty strongly implied that angels and devils are not like mortals. They are not a product of their societies and socialization, but their nature. White Chain's telling a single lie with the best of intentions still disrupted her physical form. She can apparently be a woman among brothers, because that's not against the rules, but breaking the Old Law would literally destroy her. Abbadon states pretty clearly here that the Law is as core a part of the angels as their individual identity. For devils, their identity and individuality is entirely artificial: they are all the hot black flame, with the veneer of a face and voice tacked on. Again, Abbadon has pretty strongly alluded to this, and it matches with Himself's apparent contradictions. Dead Reckoning fucked around with this message at 09:12 on Feb 18, 2018 |
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Feb 18, 2018 09:09
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Himself's mask is his cage, isn't it?
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Feb 18, 2018 09:15
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I'm not really sure the concept applies, since it I'm 99% sure that any distinction between Himself and the Hot Black Flame is artificial. That's his deal: he recognized that the personality and individuality imposed by a mask was fake, that devils are all limbs of the same great beast, and somehow kept His mind intact.
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Feb 18, 2018 09:26
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Dead Reckoning posted:I'm not really sure the concept applies, since it I'm 99% sure that any distinction between Himself and the Hot Black Flame is artificial. That's his deal: he recognized that the personality and individuality imposed by a mask was fake, that devils are all limbs of the same great beast, and somehow kept His mind intact. Somehow like by locking it up?
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Feb 18, 2018 09:36
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Dead Reckoning posted:I mean, going by the art, she was only stopped from murdering someone she had convinced herself she cared about in a devilish rage, apparently not for the first time, by the thickness of a few chapters... or perhaps more accurately, by Cio Ciocelle's unwillingness to submit her work to an editor. So it might be a bit early to crow about her overcoming her hungry and violent nature. Cio is certainly more conflicted and sympathetic a devil than Oskar, but she can never stop being a devil. Yab is part of her and always will be (ready to stab anyone Cio desires revenge against.) Eh. I don't think you or anyone in the setting gives enough credit to a devil or their 'veneer of personality' That whole idea is founded on the idea that a devil cannot actually resist their inherent lovely nature and therefore they are untrustworthy and awful which while based in truth is also a self fulfilling prophecy, you either embrace or resist it but the intrinsic assumption will always color the way others deal with you. If Allison wasn't so lovely to Cio and didn't put her in such a lovely position repeatedly and generally do her loving darnedest to draw out the Yab part which is what she needed to crack the vault with than weirdly enough I doubt she'd have gotten into a stabbin' mood. Its like saying all humans are predisposed to violence because when I poke them with a stick for as long as possible they tend to get violent. Like, the thickness of the book is a good visual metaphore. Cio has been Cio for ages, but only went Yab 2.0 for like half an hour in the most stressful situation of her life
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Feb 18, 2018 13:27
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I just picked up King of Dragon Pass because this thread has raved about it and it's currently on sale. I have no idea what's going on, but a bunch of ducks just rounded up a possé and absolutely kicked my poo poo in. Excellent.
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Feb 18, 2018 19:04
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You hosed with the ducks. You shouldn't'a done that. Also, I'm glad Cio's back. I wonder if those orange shades will come back soon, too.
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Feb 18, 2018 19:57
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Bongo Bill posted:Somehow like by locking it up? Motherfucker posted:That whole idea is founded on the idea that a devil cannot actually resist their inherent lovely nature and therefore they are untrustworthy and awful which while based in truth is also a self fulfilling prophecy, you either embrace or resist it but the intrinsic assumption will always color the way others deal with you. If Allison wasn't so lovely to Cio and didn't put her in such a lovely position repeatedly and generally do her loving darnedest to draw out the Yab part which is what she needed to crack the vault with than weirdly enough I doubt she'd have gotten into a stabbin' mood. Dead Reckoning fucked around with this message at 22:27 on Feb 18, 2018 |
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Feb 18, 2018 20:38
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Dead Reckoning posted:Devils. Are. Not. People. They're not human, you mean, they are certainly people.
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Feb 18, 2018 21:10
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They're only temporarily people.
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Feb 18, 2018 21:12
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Bongo Bill posted:They're only temporarily people. So are people.
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Feb 18, 2018 21:16
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I feel like the existence of Petal Knights makes it pretty clear that an angel can choose to forswear the Old Law and mutate into something new and different. Long live the new flesh!
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Feb 18, 2018 21:22
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Old Kentucky Shark posted:So are people. Speak for yourself!
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Feb 18, 2018 21:23
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Dead Reckoning posted:His imprisonment is merely a formality. alright reading back you're right. Still, there's no such thing as ethical consumption under capitalism and every first world person you see in your day to day is borne by an invisible palanquin of the downtrodden. If you're saying devils are somehow intrinsically worse because they HAVE to eat people than that's like applauding a coke fiend because 'they COULD give it up at any time!' Do you get it? I'm the devil's advocate.
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Feb 18, 2018 21:32
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Sounds like it’s time for an idiot to change the fundamental nature of devils then.
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Feb 18, 2018 21:38
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VanSandman posted:Sounds like it’s time for an idiot to change the fundamental nature of devils then. that or kill 6 billion of them
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Feb 18, 2018 21:42
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Mankind is directly responsible for devils anyhow, it was us literally putting a human face on the black flame. Look what you did, you took a perfectly healthy flame and gave it anxiety and greed. Bad humanity.
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Feb 18, 2018 21:46
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Dead Reckoning posted:His imprisonment is merely a formality. they’re definitely people e: Tetracube posted:that or kill 6 billion of them are demons devils
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Feb 18, 2018 21:49
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Yes, the terms are synonymous. If one of them is a slur I don't know which one.
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Feb 18, 2018 22:03
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shirts and skins posted:Wait, my brain is still waking up. What does Cio mean by "again?" The "...again?!" is probably because Yab is reverting back to Cio again. The latter of which seems to really not want to kill Allison, and won whatever weird internal struggle was going on. Note that there's a change in her size across the three panels back to Cio height, even though the frame by far and large stays the same. You can even see her hair change from Yab's to Cio's. It's also why she starts to lose it in the second frame and breaks down completely and starts sobbing over (what she thinks is Allison's corpse) Allison by the third. Cio is the one freaking out and Yab is just "Aw, gently caress. Not this again.". This whole set of pages kind of proves that devils in this setting aren't innately evil, I think. Unless there's some big twist it's just that they have to actually work at not being evil jackasses. Edit: It fits with the chapter so far too. Internally struggling over your nature and the loss of control that can come with it is a big theme so far. Hell, Cio even said it earlier with the whole "You've been dealing with your own demons." thing. Archonex fucked around with this message at 22:21 on Feb 18, 2018 |
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Feb 18, 2018 22:14
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Tuxedo Ted posted:You hosed with the ducks. I knew befriending the ducks was a good plan. Never gently caress with waterfowl.
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Feb 18, 2018 23:06
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I'm really having a hard time imagining how someone can read this comic and come away thinking "yes, the take away here is that beings are slaves to their fundamental nature and true change is impossible". The story about royalty, the terrible power of will, the act of cutting, and how a true King cuts themselves into new shapes. That's a special kind of dense.
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Feb 19, 2018 00:38
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As a fat person the idea that someone can change their fundamental nature is intrinsically dangerous to my world view and lifestyle and I cannot allow it.
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Feb 19, 2018 00:42
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Joe Slowboat posted:I feel like the existence of Petal Knights makes it pretty clear that an angel can choose to forswear the Old Law and mutate into something new and different. Long live the new flesh! I don't know if they're violating the Old Law, which is what Koss chiseled into them when he made them..
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Feb 19, 2018 00:50
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Motherfucker posted:Still, there's no such thing as ethical consumption under capitalism and every first world person you see in your day to day is borne by an invisible palanquin of the downtrodden. If you're saying devils are somehow intrinsically worse because they HAVE to eat people than that's like applauding a coke fiend because 'they COULD give it up at any time!' Captain Oblivious posted:I'm really having a hard time imagining how someone can read this comic and come away thinking "yes, the take away here is that beings are slaves to their fundamental nature and true change is impossible".
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Feb 19, 2018 00:58
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Dead Reckoning posted:Except for the part where the actual words that the author wrote down state that both devils and angels are constitutionally incapable of harnessing that terrible will to change, and that this static nature is part of the price they pay for immortality. God is a liar. This is canon.
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Feb 19, 2018 01:03
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Schwarzwald posted:God is a liar. This is canon. But if it's the word of God that God is a liar, how can we trust it? 
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Feb 19, 2018 01:10
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Dead Reckoning posted:It's not really an applicable metaphor, because, despite what D&D might tell you, first world people are not in fact alien lizard creatures wearing skin masks. If you're talking to a devil in K6BD, there is a fundamental and indivisible part of that devil that is considering whether you are vulnerable enough for it to rip your face off and eat your soul. Well now you're just crazy talking.  Plus I dunno about you but if you've ever been forced to walk behind a slow rear end twenty something while they flail their limp wrists and honk out internet contractions in casual conversation with their shittily dressed friends and you havn't imagined biting their spinal column from behind and shaking them to death like a dog with a squeaky toy than I'm afraid we're living two different humanities.
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Feb 19, 2018 01:12
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Dead Reckoning posted:His imprisonment is merely a formality. I brought up White Chain's gender not because it's an example of her changing her intrinsic nature as an angel, but because it's an example of everyone's in-universe assumption about what the intrinsic nature of an angel is is wrong. Also, we don't really know enough about what the Law actually means. If it's something fundamental to angels, which I agree it is, it's still a broader concept than you're giving it credit for, since angels include a suuuper wide range from Juggernaut to Liminal Blossom. If angels can't break the Law, then both Liminal Blossom and Juggernaut are following the Law despite being extreme opposites. I also got the impression that technically consuming human flesh IS a choice for devils, since it's 'just' an extremely efficient way for them to feed. They could technically try to avoid that while feeding in other ways, as Cio seems to. But the desire is going to be there because humans are devil-delicious. Considering human flames get snuffed out shortly after their body dies due to Aesma's big gently caress up, I'm sure a devil trying this empathy thing could even justify it to themselves as the flame otherwise going to waste. It's interesting! That said, a theme of the comic is ALSO breaking ironclad laws of reality through the power of Royalty, so.
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Feb 19, 2018 01:13
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Basically devils are 'addicted' to consumption, although addicted is the wrong term I think, but applies in how increasing dosage spirals. What you seem to be arguing is that addicts don't truly have free will. This is upsetting.
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Feb 19, 2018 01:18
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Angels don't revert to flame when they die though. They seem to perfectly retain their personalities and thoughts in the ether and even if they are significantly weakened they can sleep for a few millennia and come back. The fact that they count their deaths shows that they always retain their self. Angels still seem to change though, White Chain was probably a lot more strict in previous lives and recently has started showing human traits and compassion and a willingness to bend the law when the situation calls for it. So the law they have to obey could just be an attribute of their physical bodies that was put there to control them, order, if you will. The Thorn Knights don't need to obey the law because their bodies aren't the same.
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Feb 19, 2018 01:20
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Bongo Bill posted:Yes, the terms are synonymous. If one of them is a slur I don't know which one. The entire Blood War just got really mad at you.
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Feb 19, 2018 01:21
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Demiurge4 posted:Angels don't revert to flame when they die though. They seem to perfectly retain their personalities and thoughts in the ether and even if they are significantly weakened they can sleep for a few millennia and come back. The fact that they count their deaths shows that they always retain their self. Angels still seem to change though, White Chain was probably a lot more strict in previous lives and recently has started showing human traits and compassion and a willingness to bend the law when the situation calls for it. So like, the gender thing is core, but the knowledge of it isn't...?
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Feb 19, 2018 01:28
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