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BlazetheInferno posted:Warcraft 2 actually had a keyboard shortcut for slowing down or speeding up the gamespeed, and I actually used that frequently in my most recent playthrough of it, mostly for bursts of casting stuff. Like, about to fight, set gamespeed to minimum, have Ogre-magi bloodlust everything, crank gamespeed back up. Closest you'll get to the Computer-style "everything casts their spells simultaneously" level micro. So did Starcraft. I abused the hell out of it in the campaign to do massive airdrops with the Zerg, since the amount of micro involved in not getting half your army killed doing so is godawful.
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Feb 19, 2018 03:19
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I did not know that! I always thought it was MechCommander II which had that "pause game to give orders thing". Or am I thinking of something else?
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Feb 20, 2018 08:47
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painedforever posted:I did not know that! To be fair, you can't actually PAUSE the game and still give commands... but slowing the speed down to the slowest setting is pretty drat close.
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Feb 20, 2018 21:48
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Chapter IX: March of the Scourge Hello everyone, and welcome back to Warcraft III. Every time I replay this, there's one mission in each campaign that I dread more than any other. Three of them share the same structure... the one introduced here in this very mission.    : Hearthglen, finally! I could use some rest!   : Now, it's heading this way! : drat it. Jaina, I'll stay here to protect the village. Go as quickly as you can and tell Lord Uther what's happened.: But--: Go, Jaina! Every second counts!  : Just a grain shipment from Andorhal. There's no need to worry, milord. It's already been distributed amongst the villagers.: Oh no.   So there's the other shoe regarding the plague. Anyone who catches it is killed while they sleep and then they raise as a zombie. And Kel'Thuzad infected all of the Andorhal granaries and oversaw the distribution of the plagued grain. In terms of zombie apocalypses, this is a nightmare scenario that's unfolding here. Also yeah, that opening launches straight into combat against a bunch of weak zombies. This mission is different from all the others so far in that we have a very strict time limit.  The mission, for good or bad, will end in 30 minutes. We just have to hold out until then, and the computer will not make it easy on us. There's two very massive undead bases out on the map and they're set to produce units constantly to send at us. The good news is that Hearthglen has most of the important infrastructure already set up.  There's even an optional quest on this map, and it's one we're very much going to want to do.  Finally, Jaina is out of the story permanently. She had her two missions to act as a mana battery, and now when we might actually need her, she's gone off to get help. Characters sometimes leave the story, but retain their items if they'll be back. If you begin a mission and there's a bunch of treasure chests on the ground, then they're gone for good.   : Lord Arthas, before she left, Miss Proudmoore promised me that Dalaran would contribute mages to our cause. So whenever we get an Arcane Sanctuary built, we'll have magical backup.: That's the first good news I've heard all day. What's the town's defensive situation?   : Hearthglen has four entrances, three of which I suspect will be trouble in the future. Preliminary scouting has already revealed the existence of two massive enemy bases, similar in style to the one that guarded Andorhal.: Falric, is it possible we could clear those bases out? : In theory, my lord. However I recommend we just dig in here and prepare for a siege. We know they're coming. If we shape up the town's defenses, we should be able to hold out until Uther arrives.: Alright. I'll see to the defenses. Falric?: Aye, sir. I'll be in the barracks getting the troops ready.: Thassarian, I'l be back in a little bit. While I'm gone, I want you to find everyone who received some plagued grain. We need to ensure this town is safe, even from its own inhabitants. So if you take Arthas back the way you first came from, there's a small secret.   : We'll fight for Lordaeron! Get your swords!This is one mission where every extra hand will be extremely useful.  The attacks in this mission are timed out. The first comes at 90 seconds.  : Prince Arthas, the undead forces have arrived!: Hold your ground! We are the Chosen of the Light. We shall not fall!It's just a simple probing attack of 6 ghouls. (The sixth is attacking the southern tower). None of the individual assaults are difficult to repel, but they are designed to drain your strenth constantly. The attacks are spaced roughly a minute apart, give or take a little bit. The next attack comes at 27:20 from the other base, then we have nearly two minutes of peace. This cycle repeats throughout the entire mission. First the purple undead attack, then 50 seconds later the green come. We have 110 seconds of downtime, and then it repeats.  Speaking of which, the three ghouls making up the second wave arrive to say hello. : Prince Arthas, we've found everyone who consumed the plagued grain. They're lined up outside of the keep.: Kill them.: What?: For the love of all that is good, put them out of their misery. For their sake and ours. We can't afford to be attacked from within.: My lord...: DO IT! If you can't, then I will.: I'll take care of it. Sir.: drat that necromancer for forcing us to do this... Wave 3, and for some reason they attacked the northeast entrance. This is the only time this side of the base is assaulted in the mission. So I guess these were just probing attacks?  On the west side of the base, the defenses are progressing quite nicely.  : Prince Arthas, a famous engineer lived here in town. He had to be killed in the... recent purge... but we found some schematics in his lab.: So?: The schematics appear to detail a way to improve a defensive tower with anti-personnel cannons, similar to what our mortar teams use.: That could be very handy.: One of my men is building a series of scout towers for just that reason. Once we have an engineering workshop set up, we'll start converting them.A lot of this mission is just waiting. There's always more to do, but even doing that takes time. So there are long stretches of time where you're just looking around, waiting for the next attack. There's not even anything new to show off until I have an arcane sanctum. So expect this update to be the cliff notes version of the mission.  Right on cue, at 24:20 remaining the next assault comes. This is the last time they'll be this simple. From here on out, the assaults are gonna start ramping up in intensity.  Using the downtime to prepare. Hoping for the cannon towers to begin upgrading before the next attack comes.  22:30 and the next purple assault comes. This time it's four ghouls and a necromancer. So that's up to 8 skeletons as well depending on how fast the necromancer dies.   : Faster, my brethren! If we lose the shipment, the master will have our hides!: Prince Arthas, we've spotted an undead caravan carrying a large load of plagued grain.: That caravan must be stopped before it reaches the outer villages!The caravan is our optional quest for this mission. It spawns at 22:30, and slowly infects villages around the outside edge of the map. We have until 11:00 to stop it. Failing to do so will mean that a third undead base gets set up, which will also start assaulting us. It attacks once on Normal, and it's just four ghouls. This caravan is also why certain people in the thread have been strongly suggesting that I put all of Arthas' early skill points into divine shield. At level 3, it lasts just long enough that he can solo the five catapults. But on the other hand, you're missing out on either upgrades to Holy Light or Devotion Aura in order to get divine shield that high in time for this mission. It's you literally building Arthas from the beginning of the game in a specific way just so you can have an easy(ier) time on a not very hard optional quest in this one mission. You have 11 and a half minutes before you fail the mission, and the worst assaults that show up before that point are just a handful ghouls, necromancers, an either an abomination or a catapult.  : Lord Arthas, the new towers are being outfitted with cannons as we speak.: Excellent. Once they're done I'll head out to stop the caravan. No sooner does the upgrade process begin when the 21:20 green attack comes. This time it's five ghouls and a necromancer. At least it's not the hard mode map, where we'd be facing 8 ghouls and 4 necromancers in this one.  Almost 10 minutes into this defense map, I finally get around to training new units. I'm doing this unintentionally as badly as possible and still win in the end, spoilers. I don't even know why I did this so badly. Usually I like overwhelming preparations, but something about this mission always throws me off my game. Probably because it has a strict time limit, and I hate being rushed.   The cannon towers finish. These act similar to the mortar teams, and even deal siege damage for some weird reason. They even have the splash damage effect that comes from all siege units. So that's neat.  19:30, and the next attack comes as scheduled. 2 ghouls and an abomination is pretty light, to be honest. Almost like they're holding back because you're supposed to have sent Arthas out after the caravans by now.  Speaking of Arthas, he levels up to 6 when the abomination explodes, and learns his ultimate ability Resurrection. In case you've forgotten, it brings back 6 friendly units from the dead.  Something that annoys me is that you can't build anything on cobblestone. In this mission, that's kind of a pain because most of the interior of Hearthglen is made up of the stuff.  18:20 and the next attack comes. The undead have started trotting out catapults, which means our towers are useless. These things have better range than any of our towers, and are content to sit back and rain siege damage on our defenses. Siege units in the hands of the enemy are nothing but bad news. Thankfully they're somewhat fragile.  : Falric, take over the town defenses. I'm heading out to stop that caravan before we get overrun.: Sir!Anyway, now that we're in the 2 minute downtime between assaults, this is the best time to send out Arthas we're gonna get. The next attacks are only gonna be worse, so let's take the chance while we still have it. Also worth pointing out that at some point in the past four minutes, the first village fell to the undead.  A little ways north of our base in the wilderness, we find the outside edge of the purple base. We want nothing to do with that, so we'll have to skirt around the outside and hope we don't draw attention.  A little farther north again, we find a cobblestone road. This is actually the path the caravan takes, so we can just follow it until we find them.  16:30 attack arrives, bringing 2 ghouls, 2 necromancers, and an abomination. This is starting to get kinda messy. Thankfully between two cannon towers, two guard towers, and 11 units left behind to defend, we're still good for the moment.  Meanwhile in practically the northwest corner, Arthas turns a blind corner on the kingdom road and comes face to face with the caravan. This fight is going to be ugly no matter how you slice it. Especially so because these undead siege weapons also seek out and carry bodies around just for the necromancers to raise.  : Hold fast, men! The light is with us, today! We won't let these bastards infect any more innocent people.Those green clouds are an upgrade the meat wagon gets. It causes damage to any unit that stands in the cloud, and all five catapults have the upgrade.  In addition to the ghouls and necromancers, there's also a bunch of zombies. : It's no use! For every one we kill, two more take its place.: We can't give up! If we fail here, then Hearthglen will be overrun. Hold the line! While Arthas and his rapidly dwindling assault team are occupied, the 15:20 attack arrives at Hearthglen. It's just 6 ghouls, and is the last reprieve we're going to get. The mission is halfway over and the kid gloves are coming off. From now on, expect abominations or meat wagons with every attack. Sometimes both at the same time for that extra "gently caress you."  : drat that necromancer and his master. Those men shouldn't have died.The endless tide of skeletons are finally winding down, and the meat wagons are finally falling. It cost all three footmen, but we did it.  The last meat wagon, for some reason, decides it's had enough and tries to path around the riflemen. Once it falls, the quest is over and we get our rewards. A scroll of town portal and a medallion of courage. The scroll returns the caster and all nearby units to town, while the medallion boosts all stats by 1. A pity that Arthas' inventory is full and we can't use the scroll without losing on stat bonuses. So it'll just have to sit and rot where it fell. : I just pray that the grain haven't reached anymore villages. Back in town, the Arcane Sanctuary finished a while ago, but I've been kinda busy. In addition to being able to train sorceresses, we can also get their first upgrade. So they'll be that much better when we train a few.  Speaking of which, they're decently cheap to train. They come with the ability slow, which is set to autocast on nearby hostiles, and can learn some other support magic. Polymorph isn't as strong as it used to be in Warcraft 2, where it permanently removed a unit from battle, but it's still pretty effective crowd control when used properly.  As Arthas returns victorious, the 13:30 attack arrives. 3 ghouls, 2 necromancers, and a meat wagon.  This marks the beginning of the tower losses. From now on, pretty much every time a meat wagon shows up to attack, we're going to lose at least one defensive tower before it goes down. It's frustrating.  : Welcome back, Prince Arthas. How did the...: *slowly shakes his head* We won. Leave it at that. The 12:20 attack arrives late, but it's a meat wagon and two abominations. They make a beeline for the peasant building new towers and kill him before any defenders realize there's an attack happening.  The 10:30 attack is right on time. This time it's 4 ghouls, a necromancer, and two abominations. And they're attacking right where the new peasant is trying to get defensive towers built. This is why I hate defensive missions. You never have time to sit back and take a breath and plan out strategy. And once you fall behind, you'll never get caught up. And you'll inevitably fall behind because that's just how defensive missons work.  The mission is 2/3 over. It feels like it's taking forever.  9:20 and the next attack comes. This is the largest yet with 6 ghouls, 2 necromancers, and 2 abominations.  The attack is also late by about 20 seconds. I don't know why they're sometimes on time and other times not. We also lost another peasant trying to build defensive towers, as well as one of the cannon towers. I really do not like this mission. I don't like being behind the ball, so to speak.  On interior news, after almost 22 minutes of playing, I finally have cause to add more houses. And these three new ones won't even be the last ones we need. We'll have to add more later!  7:30 attack comes. This time it's 3 ghouls and a necromancer. Despite the presence of the undead bases on the map, I'm pretty sure the game just spawns these in as needed. I have nothing to back that hunch beyond my deep loathing for this mission.  The 6:20 attack is very late, but brings 6 Ghouls, 2 Necromancers, 1 Meat Wagon and 1 Abomination. We lose several towers here.  4:30 attack arrives, this time it's 4 Ghouls, 1 Necromancer, 1 Meat Wagon and 1 Abomination. This is also the last one before the final push.  We also get this useless warning. Can't do a thing about it, and our reserves are too flush for it to matter. But... thanks for the warning regardless? : Prepare yourselves, everyone! I have a really bad feeling that this is going to get a lot worse before it gets better. I want every able bodied man, woman, and child who can hold a sword out on the front lines. We will not let this town fall! Out of nowhere, the meat wagon from the 4:30 attack shows up, a full minute and a half late.  : Prince Arthas, one of our scouts has returned. He claims that both undead bases are emptying out. That a tide of rotting flesh is coming this way.: poo poo. Everyone get ready! : The north! They're coming from the north!  : What the hell is that thing?  : LICH! THEY'RE HEADED BY A LICH! : Hold your ground!: Sir, I've lost contact with the northwestern group!: HOLD STEADY! : Sir! The northwestern towers! The bricks... they're decaying!: What?: They're literally crumbling to dust!: Dammit Uther, where the hell are you?     : Uther, your timing couldn't have been better. : Don't celebrate yet, son. This battle's far from over! : I'm surprised that you kept things together as long as you did, lad. If I haven't arrived just then--: Look, I did the best I could, Uther! If I'd had a legion of knights riding at my back, I would've--: Now is not the time to be choking on pride! What we faced here was only the beginning. The undead ranks are bolstered every time one of our warriors falls in battle.: Then we should strike at their leader! I'll go to Stratholme and kill Mal'Ganis myself if I have to!: Easy, lad. Brave as you are, you can't hope to defeat a man who commands the dead all by yourself.     Yes, the green undead base also has a lich. A level 10 lich. That's why it's an incredibly bad idea to try to clear it out!  NEXT TIME: The Prince and the Prophet & The Culling
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Feb 21, 2018 00:57
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That mission is horrid on hard. The lich starts appearing every few waves, and its nova spell hurts.
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Feb 21, 2018 01:13
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Holy poo poo the northeast entrance actually got attacked!?
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Feb 21, 2018 01:15
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And to think that's the easiest base defense mission in the game.
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Feb 21, 2018 01:38
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Eh, I'd say the next mission was the first that really gave me trouble as a total RTS noob. That being said, yeah, I dislike these missions more because often there's not much you can do to either speed things up or make it easier on yourself. In the SC1 rough equivalent to this mission, for example, if you were feeling particularly confident, you could send out an attack force to clear out the Zerg bases spread out all across the map, though I forget if that has any actual effect on the waves of attackers.
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Feb 21, 2018 01:54
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Regalingualius posted:Eh, I'd say the next mission was the first that really gave me trouble as a total RTS noob. That being said, yeah, I dislike these missions more because often there's not much you can do to either speed things up or make it easier on yourself. In the SC1 rough equivalent to this mission, for example, if you were feeling particularly confident, you could send out an attack force to clear out the Zerg bases spread out all across the map, though I forget if that has any actual effect on the waves of attackers. The evacuation mission in SC? Yeah, you can just sit and wait once you kill all the bases. SC2 has a similar mission but I believe the enemy still spawns forces to attack but I believe they are weaker. I prefer this mission on hard. The final attack is much scarier and I usually win but I have to just the Resurrection spell and call out the militia to stall for time and the towers all fall along with a lot of the town. Has a more thematic ending though completing the side quest is a much bigger challenge. Other downside is there are missions in other campaigns I really struggle with on Hard.
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Feb 21, 2018 02:18
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I love this mission, its the 1st genuinely hard one, and one of the toughest in the game in my opinion on Hard. (Not the hardest mission in ROC for me personally, that's much later, but its pretty close) It's much scarier on Hard than on Normal, but the extra difficulty helps to sell the idea of Arthas leading a desperate defence against a never ending tide of a bit better I think. Also, I'm fairly sure the Medallion of Courage is +4 to two stats, rather than +1 to all stats.
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Feb 21, 2018 02:40
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I'm pretty sure the bases do actually produce the units they use to attack you, though I think they get a significant production speed bonus. It's been a few years but I half-remember smashing up one of the bases in god mode and a necromancer popping out after about five seconds of building.
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Feb 21, 2018 02:55
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Only the Sorceress this time around. Dude, you may have missed the quotes for the generic heroes. ****** Line time! Ready lines are used by units when they're produced. What lines are used when they're initially selected. Yes lines are used when they're given a move order. Attack lines are used when they're given an attack order. Warcry is used randomly for Attack when attacking hero characters. (Thanks to Drakenel for the correction) Pissed is what you get when you keep clicking a unit and it exhausts the What lines. Special is for builder units, and for certain special units, e.g. Uther, who is an AI-controlled character. Sorceress: Ready
What
Yes
Attack
Warcry
Pissed
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Feb 21, 2018 04:17
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biscuits and crazy posted:
Just tested this in the campaign, you seem to be correct. I thought there was an item available that gives +1 to all though. kvx687 posted:I'm pretty sure the bases do actually produce the units they use to attack you, though I think they get a significant production speed bonus. It's been a few years but I half-remember smashing up one of the bases in god mode and a necromancer popping out after about five seconds of building. At the least some units do come from buildings, and the waves all seem to originate from the bases. If anyone was crazy enough to explore this map in addition to doing the sidequest, there are some useful item drops from ogres, in the top and bottom left corners of the maps, including gauntlets of ogre strength +3, and a periapt of vitality that raises HP.
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Feb 21, 2018 04:40
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Hearthglen still exists in WoW and while its never directly attributed to this mission, it is one of the more heavily fortified towns in the game.
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Feb 21, 2018 06:22
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If you do hit and run attacks on the caravan you can get away with just having one point in divine shield, I'm pretty sure. In general I do kind of think that having one point in it just so that Arthas can go off on his own and do stuff without much worry is nice. It doesn't come up too much though, but one point is not a big sacrifice I think having Arthas do a solo operation in the next mission is very useful, if you can effectively micro him, and 1-2 other groups of units + your base, kind of tricky
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Feb 21, 2018 06:26
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If you CAN manage to destroy all the undead bases in this mission, you will win as soon as the last building is gone. The ending sequence is still the same though. I only know this from screwing around with cheats, but I've seen it done legitimately on Hard.
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Feb 21, 2018 06:31
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Mechanics aside, you start seeing some real tension between Arthas and Uther at the end of this mission. DoubleNegative has been making it a lot more explicit, but you can feel the tension that Arthas is under, especially with this particular mission (if you're not a true pro, and can build up enough of a murder-mob to destroy all of the bases). And notice, that Arthas instantly got defensive when Uther was praising him for holding out for so long. Uther is somewhat plain-spoken (and I'll probably point that out in one of the later missions), and Arthas is over-reacting. To be fair to him, he was under a lot of pressure, but... Arthas' blood is up. If the next mission is the one that I think it is (I'm not going to look it up), then we're going to see where Arthas' brashness will lead us. The first two campaigns (I think) have some of the best writing of WarCraft 3. I'm not as fond of the rest, but it'll all come around when we (eventually) reach Frozen Throne.
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Feb 21, 2018 07:37
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Yeah, the next mission is the big elephant in the room everyone's been dancing around when it comes to discussing Arthas' characterization.
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Feb 21, 2018 08:48
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I really hate this mission, but I like the additional story bits, as well as the foreshadowing for the next mission.
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Feb 21, 2018 09:52
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The ai definitely builds its attack waves. The last defensive hold out mission of the game involves an enemy that shuts down and moves its base. If you use air units to snipe the workers building the new one it completely stops enemy attacks. And oh yes does the ai cheat build times to make it all work.
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Feb 21, 2018 11:53
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FoolyCharged posted:The ai definitely builds its attack waves. The last defensive hold out mission of the game involves an enemy that shuts down and moves its base. If you use air units to snipe the workers building the new one it completely stops enemy attacks. Beating that mission on hard was one of the great achievements of my life. It has been a pretty uneventful life......
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Feb 21, 2018 16:26
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Regalingualius posted:Yeah, the next mission is the big elephant in the room everyone's been dancing around when it comes to discussing Arthas' characterization. Someone messaged me on steam saying it was a pity I didn't start the LP a few weeks later than I did, that I could have had a lot of fun with April Fool's Day and the next mission. You know something? They're right. That would have been an amazing joke.
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Feb 21, 2018 18:06
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don't let your dreams be dreams
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Feb 21, 2018 18:12
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AriadneThread posted:don't let your dreams be dreams I'm neither confiriming nor denying future plans, however... I got a lotta screenshots to take in 7 days. Lots of stuff I want shots of for lore corners
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Feb 21, 2018 18:21
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I don't know what you're talking about, so I'm really looking forward to what you're going to come up with.
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Feb 21, 2018 22:43
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painedforever posted:I don't know what you're talking about, so I'm really looking forward to what you're going to come up with. Same. This is a really enjoyable LP, and I'm really curious what happens then. Blizzard's April's Fools jokes can be pretty funny, so this should be good.
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Feb 21, 2018 23:03
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There have been quite a few stories I wished were April Fool's Jokes. Blizzard, Marvel, and Rich Burlew have been among the perps.
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Feb 21, 2018 23:17
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I remember at least one joke that wound up becoming (partial) reality: A dungeon in WoW that would be in total darkness, including being unable to see enemy creatures. In Legion, the final section of Vault of the Wardens does just that... though you're given an orb of light that lets you navigate.
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Feb 21, 2018 23:24
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Ahhh, this LP makes for a great nostalgia bomb for me. My brothers and I played the poo poo out of this game. We'd always fondly remember the humorous dialogue the NPCs would give you. IIRC, weren't the Pandaren an April Fool's joke once?
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Feb 22, 2018 00:22
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The Warcraft III announcement from Blizzard was a gigantic esports invitational tournament. https://us.battle.net/forums/en/bnet/topic/20762026715#1 There's also a new major patch coming, which apparently adds widescreen support and 24 player lobbies.
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Feb 22, 2018 01:28
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24 nerds playing WC3 at the same time? MADNESS I TELL YOU
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Feb 22, 2018 01:48
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DoubleNegative posted:The Warcraft III announcement from Blizzard was a gigantic esports invitational tournament. Disappointing.
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Feb 22, 2018 02:30
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1stGear posted:Disappointing. It was never going to be WC4. Especially not with a new WoW expansion coming later this year. And incidentally, the nonstop tragedy that is Jaina's life is going to go even further downhill in BFA. Blizzard twitter revealed that she and her most recent boyfriend broke up at the beginning of Legion, and about the first thing players see of her in BFA is her getting disowned by her mother and exiled from Kul Tiras.
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Feb 22, 2018 02:37
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Again I hate Blizzard for hurting its strong female character Jaina. Grr.... And it saddens me that they have given up on strategy games. I prefer those to their other previous work.
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Feb 22, 2018 02:38
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Cythereal posted:It was never going to be WC4. Especially not with a new WoW expansion coming later this year. I didn't think it was going to be WC4. Indeed, I don't think a WC4 is ever coming and any plans that might have existed for it were indefinitely put on hold once WoW turned out to be a mega-hit. I just wanted WC3 Remastered. 
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Feb 22, 2018 02:42
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DoubleNegative posted:The Warcraft III announcement from Blizzard was a gigantic esports invitational tournament. Well, that managed to be even less than I was expecting. Kinda cool, in a way, but I was pretty sure they'd be announcing a WC3 remaster. 
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Feb 22, 2018 02:44
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Cythereal posted:It was never going to be WC4. Especially not with a new WoW expansion coming later this year. Eh, I can see this as a trial ballon to see if there is interest in Blizz RTSes.
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Feb 22, 2018 03:04
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Mooseontheloose posted:Eh, I can see this as a trial ballon to see if there is interest in Blizz RTSes. The continued success of Starcraft 2 says there is. I just think Warcraft as a franchise will never see another game until WoW is gone.
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Feb 22, 2018 03:06
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1stGear posted:I didn't think it was going to be WC4. Indeed, I don't think a WC4 is ever coming and any plans that might have existed for it were indefinitely put on hold once WoW turned out to be a mega-hit. I wouldn't necessarily count out a surprise remaster announcement at the tournament itself just yet.
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Feb 22, 2018 03:16
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| # ? Jun 11, 2024 16:50 |
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Wow dies, StarCraft Online starts, WC4 comes out, rinse, repeat.
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#
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Feb 22, 2018 03:19
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