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Firebert
Aug 16, 2004
I doubt the thresholds are low enough that you could just do THE BUILD and meet all of the criteria, but you can probably fullfill the ap and aspd parts with guinsoos, nashor's tooth and void staff.

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foutre
Sep 4, 2011

:toot: RIP ZEEZ :toot:

Amish Ninja posted:

I'm trying to figure out how to pull myself out of Silver.

Post a replay and I'll take a look!

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



Firebert posted:

I doubt the thresholds are low enough that you could just do THE BUILD and meet all of the criteria, but you can probably fullfill the ap and aspd parts with guinsoos, nashor's tooth and void staff.

My hope is that the threshholds are balanced in such a way that only one of the Second Skin bonuses apply with any given build (unless you sacrifice your 5th slot specifically for a damage/ASPD item over Hexdrinker/Mercurial/GA/whatever). Thus, there's a benefit to going an ASPD build (Guinsoo's + Wit's or BotRK + Hurricane), a benefit to going an AD build (Reaver + Statikk + IE), and a benefit to going an AP build (Luden's + Liandry's or something).

Vermain fucked around with this message at 23:08 on Feb 20, 2018

Amish Ninja
Jul 2, 2006

It's called survival of the fittest. If you can't slam with the best, jam with the rest.

Vermain posted:

General advice, but also "post a replay".

foutre posted:

Post a replay and I'll take a look!

Noted. I'll post a follow up later today with what is hopefully not too embarrassing of a game (but I'm sure it will be from the perspective of someone who is decent). Thanks!

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



Maintenance announced for 8.4 on Thursday. You can take a look at the PBE cycle notes on S@20 if you want a sneak peak. Highlights include:
  • Zoe sent to Camille Prison until they figure out what the hell they want to do with her.
  • Gnar and Gangplank both getting a non-insignificant amount of laning power chopped off of their kits.
  • Kalista getting a whole bunch of her power shifted around. Arguably a more effective lane bully early, but holy hell is she short range now.
  • Rengar getting partially reverted. His Q is back to its old incarnation. Ult's been changed so that he depends more on the other parts of his kits to score a one-hit instead of simply leaping out of stealth for a trillion damage on his own.
  • Fairly significant Volibear buffs. His E now has a knockback, meaning that he has a pretty drat good method of interrupting dashes, and the buff to his W means you might actually start seeing him getting play in solo queue as a jungler.
  • Stopwatch has a 10 minute arming time. Now sufficiently niche that you should only really take it if you think you have critical outplay potential in the midgame and are building Zhonya's relatively early. The fact that Inspiration no longer gets the passive +20% bonus to potion duration without taking a tier 3 rune is actually pretty significant, since you're losing a lot of lane sustain if you you opt for Cosmic Insight instead.
  • Second Wind is now on the same tier as all of the Armor/MR runes, which is huge. Now you either take Second Wind to survive poke, or you take one of the Armor/MR options to survive burst, rather than having both at the same time. Should make every lane that abused this (especially top) a lot less safe.
  • Shitload of AP item changes that were already discussed. Should be interesting to see how ends up benefiting most.
  • Baron and Elder are now significantly more impactful in the lategame. Baron actually got a pretty solid buff in general with the increase to cannon creep damage and the fact that the casters can no longer get instantly nuked. Look for games to close a lot faster.

Teikanmi
Dec 16, 2006

by R. Guyovich
This is A Good Patch

Amish Ninja
Jul 2, 2006

It's called survival of the fittest. If you can't slam with the best, jam with the rest.
For those asking me to post a replay for feedback: https://my.mixtape.moe/bmadsx.rofl

This was a game where we had a decent early lead and then teamfights went to crap later on. I suspect part of it was me not doing the right things in those teamfights to deal with tristana, or peel or what have you. I found it difficult to deal with their front line and also deal with their high damage threats. Anyway - feel free to tear it apart. Thanks again!

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



Amish Ninja posted:

For those asking me to post a replay for feedback: https://my.mixtape.moe/bmadsx.rofl

This was a game where we had a decent early lead and then teamfights went to crap later on. I suspect part of it was me not doing the right things in those teamfights to deal with tristana, or peel or what have you. I found it difficult to deal with their front line and also deal with their high damage threats. Anyway - feel free to tear it apart. Thanks again!

Thanks for posting it. I'll try and take a look at it tomorrow and provide some commentary.

Monicro
Oct 21, 2010

And you could feel his features in the air
A wide smile and perfect hair
He had complete control of the rising tides
And a medicine bag hanging at his side

In the flowing blue world of the death-dealing physician
I finally got around to playing new swain for a handful of games and i think he might legit be my new favorite champion

Killed By Death
Jun 29, 2013


Vermain posted:

Maintenance announced for 8.4 on Thursday. You can take a look at the PBE cycle notes on S@20 if you want a sneak peak.

quote:

Twitch
Contaminate (E) base damage lowered from 20/35/50/65/80 to 20/25/30/35/40
Fffuuuuuuuckkk yooouuuuu

Teikanmi
Dec 16, 2006

by R. Guyovich

Monicro posted:

I finally got around to playing new swain for a handful of games and i think he might legit be my new favorite champion

He was strong at release and this is overbuffing. Gonna start to see Swain bans, guaranteed

The Mash
Feb 17, 2007

You have to say I can open my presents
Finally a good loving Jarvan skin. Back to spamming J4/Leona bot like in the old days.

Aumanor
Nov 9, 2012

Vermain posted:

Maintenance announced for 8.4 on Thursday. You can take a look at the PBE cycle notes on S@20 if you want a sneak peak. Highlights include:
  • Zoe sent to Camille Prison until they figure out what the hell they want to do with her.
  • Gnar and Gangplank both getting a non-insignificant amount of laning power chopped off of their kits.
  • Kalista getting a whole bunch of her power shifted around. Arguably a more effective lane bully early, but holy hell is she short range now.
  • Rengar getting partially reverted. His Q is back to its old incarnation. Ult's been changed so that he depends more on the other parts of his kits to score a one-hit instead of simply leaping out of stealth for a trillion damage on his own.
  • Fairly significant Volibear buffs. His E now has a knockback, meaning that he has a pretty drat good method of interrupting dashes, and the buff to his W means you might actually start seeing him getting play in solo queue as a jungler.
  • Stopwatch has a 10 minute arming time. Now sufficiently niche that you should only really take it if you think you have critical outplay potential in the midgame and are building Zhonya's relatively early. The fact that Inspiration no longer gets the passive +20% bonus to potion duration without taking a tier 3 rune is actually pretty significant, since you're losing a lot of lane sustain if you you opt for Cosmic Insight instead.
  • Second Wind is now on the same tier as all of the Armor/MR runes, which is huge. Now you either take Second Wind to survive poke, or you take one of the Armor/MR options to survive burst, rather than having both at the same time. Should make every lane that abused this (especially top) a lot less safe.
  • Shitload of AP item changes that were already discussed. Should be interesting to see how ends up benefiting most.
  • Baron and Elder are now significantly more impactful in the lategame. Baron actually got a pretty solid buff in general with the increase to cannon creep damage and the fact that the casters can no longer get instantly nuked. Look for games to close a lot faster.

:stare: Well, time to take a two week vacation from LoL and let people better than me figure out the builds.

Ra Ra Rasputin
Apr 2, 2011
With Wit's end in the patch notes getting 100g cheaper with +2 damage and going from 5 MR steal to 6 melee/3 ranged it made me think.

Who actually builds wit's end besides ranged champs? I can only think of Kog/Kayle/Teemo/Varus and it's sometimes situational for them.

el dingo
Mar 19, 2009


Ogres are like onions
Bad Warwick players?

Firebert
Aug 16, 2004

Ra Ra Rasputin posted:

With Wit's end in the patch notes getting 100g cheaper with +2 damage and going from 5 MR steal to 6 melee/3 ranged it made me think.

Who actually builds wit's end besides ranged champs? I can only think of Kog/Kayle/Teemo/Varus and it's sometimes situational for them.

Volibear ... who just got mega-buffed :unsmigghh:

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.


Ra Ra Rasputin posted:

With Wit's end in the patch notes getting 100g cheaper with +2 damage and going from 5 MR steal to 6 melee/3 ranged it made me think.

Who actually builds wit's end besides ranged champs? I can only think of Kog/Kayle/Teemo/Varus and it's sometimes situational for them.

Varus is already near the top of the ADC pile and that's only going to make him stronger. This makes me happy.

iSurrender
Aug 25, 2005
Now with 22% more apathy!
You're better off building straight crit on Varus in soloQ unless you're up against at least 2 tanks. Only other advantage of rageblade build is you spike at first item. At most other points you'll be worse off with rageblade.

SSJ_naruto_2003
Oct 12, 2012



iSurrender posted:

You're better off building straight crit on Varus in soloQ unless you're up against at least 2 tanks. Only other advantage of rageblade build is you spike at first item. At most other points you'll be worse off with rageblade.

what? you're like, so so wrong lmao

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.


Rageblade is an insane 1-item spike that helps massively in taking towers and makes his damage harder to itemise against. You can build that and a hurricane and be solid for damage most of the time so freer to build a Wit's End for fight durability and BotRK for more magic damage and lifesteal.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



I'd say "spiking at one item" in a meta with some of the shortest average game times ever is actually a pretty significant argument for always going Rageblade on him. Like, yeah, there's the possibility of the game dragging on to 40 minutes and crit Varus eventually outscaling Rageblade Varus, but wouldn't you rather just itemize to end the game before then?

SSJ_naruto_2003
Oct 12, 2012



you will do more sustained damage in teamfights, be more survivable, have a cheaper overall build, a faster powerspike

literally on-hit is superior in every way unless you're against 5 tristanas or something

Taciturn Tactician
Jan 27, 2011

The secret to good health is a balanced diet and unstable healing radiation
Lipstick Apathy

Ra Ra Rasputin posted:

With Wit's end in the patch notes getting 100g cheaper with +2 damage and going from 5 MR steal to 6 melee/3 ranged it made me think.

Who actually builds wit's end besides ranged champs? I can only think of Kog/Kayle/Teemo/Varus and it's sometimes situational for them.

Historically some tanks that have heavy auto interaction like Shen have, and it's the sort of item Yi might build if it's good. Shyvana and Jax also might work with it, except that no one builds AS on Jax anymore. Cho'Gath used to sometimes as a niche strategy, especially on TT, when E was a toggle. The problem is not a lot of characters want attack speed and not crit. Azir might build it but it'd need to be very overtuned.

pog boyfriend
Jul 2, 2011

udyr, wolibear, shen, and shyvana might build new wits end.

Sexpansion
Mar 22, 2003

DELETED
drat those gangplank changes are significant.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



I'm genuinely hoping and praying for another Weedwick situation with the Voli buffs where he ends up being completely out of control with new Wit's and hard smashes games for like a week before they hotfix him.

Taciturn Tactician
Jan 27, 2011

The secret to good health is a balanced diet and unstable healing radiation
Lipstick Apathy
If tank Ekko ever comes back he might build it.

Amish Ninja
Jul 2, 2006

It's called survival of the fittest. If you can't slam with the best, jam with the rest.

Monicro posted:

I finally got around to playing new swain for a handful of games and i think he might legit be my new favorite champion

Agreed. I liked him before rework, and was skeptical of the new version because he seemed a bit on the weaker side. Then I tried him out and thoroughly enjoyed. He's basically Tywin Lannister, and that owns.

Anyway: how do you rune him? I've tried a few different setups. Electrocute + lifesteal + sorcery secondary (gathering storm and celerity) seems like a decent way to go about it. Lets you build some tanky AP items and still be a potent mage later in the game. Haven't tried aery or comet based builds. Done an unsealed spellbook build too.

Matt Lindland
Feb 10, 2018

SHUT THE FUCK UP KEVEN

ALSO GJ BUYING A NEW ACCOUNT LIKE A GODDAMN COWARD
YOU USELESS WHITE NOISE POSTER

YOU WILL NOT ESCAPE THE BOLF RAMSHIELD YOU SO RICHLY DESERVE


now with professional animation
Everyone built wits end 9 years ago when every top laner was mixed damage with no scaling and the item was 2k gold.

Aumanor
Nov 9, 2012

Sexpansion posted:

drat those gangplank changes are significant.

Still not enough of a nerf imo, he's supposed to have a weak early game but currently hes safe enough that the pros are regularily firstpicking him.

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.


Vermain posted:

I'd say "spiking at one item" in a meta with some of the shortest average game times ever is actually a pretty significant argument for always going Rageblade on him. Like, yeah, there's the possibility of the game dragging on to 40 minutes and crit Varus eventually outscaling Rageblade Varus, but wouldn't you rather just itemize to end the game before then?

I will say with my on-hit build I did just end up in a 46 minute game where my damage was chipping at the tanks at best by the end but I was still relevant against the Xayah who had more gold than me because my build was cheaper so I ended up an item ahead without even trying.

foutre
Sep 4, 2011

:toot: RIP ZEEZ :toot:

Amish Ninja posted:

For those asking me to post a replay for feedback: https://my.mixtape.moe/bmadsx.rofl

This was a game where we had a decent early lead and then teamfights went to crap later on. I suspect part of it was me not doing the right things in those teamfights to deal with tristana, or peel or what have you. I found it difficult to deal with their front line and also deal with their high damage threats. Anyway - feel free to tear it apart. Thanks again!

Getting a bug splat when I try and watch it at the moment, will see if I can get something to work.

e: Oof, now I'm getting a 'corrupted' message. I forgot what a mess replays are. Will post comments if I get it working.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



foutre posted:

Getting a bug splat when I try and watch it at the moment, will see if I can get something to work.

e: Oof, now I'm getting a 'corrupted' message. I forgot what a mess replays are. Will post comments if I get it working.

Unfortunately, the method of actually viewing other people's .rofl files is a little complicated. Basically:
  • Find the .rofl file and CTRL + C it.
  • Look for the latest deploy folder (e.g.: C:\Riot Games\League of Legends\RADS\solutions\lol_game_client_sln\releases\[Version #]\deploy). Create a shortcut of the LoL application in that folder.
  • Open up the shortcut's properties and paste the .rofl file at the end of the target name. Apply and OK.
  • Launch via the shortcut.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



Amish Ninja posted:

This was a game where we had a decent early lead and then teamfights went to crap later on. I suspect part of it was me not doing the right things in those teamfights to deal with tristana, or peel or what have you. I found it difficult to deal with their front line and also deal with their high damage threats. Anyway - feel free to tear it apart. Thanks again!

Like the replay I did for the other dude, this will mostly be stream of consciousness:
  • 4:02: You got a good wraparound gank on Brand beforehand that blew his Flash, which is good. This return gank, however, isn't a good gank. Corki has no real gank followup, especially pre-6, the wave's in a bad spot (still pretty large and pushing into Corki), you're a level behind Brand, and Brand is very close to his turret at nearly full HP. You and Corki simply cannot kill him at this point. All you'll end up doing is making him lose, like, 2 or 3 CS while he gets to chunk you for free and put you further behind Xin. You also should've considered Xin's likely path, since you had vision on him the previous gank. Given standard pathing, you can intuit that he went Blue -> Wolves -> Red, which meant that he almost assuredly would go Raptors -> Scuttle after. There's a small chance of him going Raptors -> Krugs, but it's highly unlikely. Therefore, you can guess that Xin is going to be waiting in topside river to come in and countergank if you try and swing around onto Brand. The better option here would've been to simply go Raptors -> Scuttle to match him and then either recall or look to burn a Flash botlane if they're playing too far up.

  • 8:38: You double kill their botlane with your bot alive and healthy, the drake is Cloud, and you have Red. You should be spam pinging their bot turret and pushing the wave as fast as humanly possible, because you three can shove it in completely and take first turret 100%. You even had a cannon wave! If you get kills, your next immediate thought needs to be, "What's the highest value objective I can take?" You have to be decisive here, because the alternative is what happens: you waffle around river aimlessly, plant a ward, kill a Control Ward, and then Recall. You eventually take first tower, but it's off the back of a garbage dive that costs your support, midlaner, and toplaner their lives. Imagine what would've happened if you simply smashed that turret and told top and bot to swap. None of that mess would've happened.

  • 16:33: Your Leona goes a little apeshit. This is one of those cases where you need to responsibly make your own decisions about what to do instead of following your dumb teammates in on everything. Neither you or Ez have ult, all three of them have their ults, and Leona whiffs her R bad. This is a failed engage. After Trist jumps away at half health, you should spam ping Leona back and focus on the turret. You should not commit here unless the enemy team decides to handshake it and tries to engage on your backline. Remember, your focus is the tower: you want to bust open midlane outer so that you can control upper jungle in preparation for an eventual Baron. You committing on them ends up baiting in the rest of your team to go all-in with Leona, which causes you to trade 1-for-1. In a situation where you're behind, trading 1-for-1 is almost always worth it, especially since it buys enough time for Brand to reinforce mid and prevent you from taking outer.

  • 18:00: Not a good engage, but for a pretty subtle reason. Take a look at Corki's items: he's sitting on two Trinity components, a Hexdrinker, and nothing else. Not only is killing either Braum or Brand unlikely in this scenario, but you have no clue where Xin is. If Xin was coming back from base and hanging around Raptors, he could have easily looped down and probably picked one of you off. As it is, this play causes your team to instantly lose all pressure on mid. All of this meaningless fighting might not seem like a huge loss, but take a look at Xin: he's almost caught up to you in EXP, and it's only your massive killing spree that's keeping you ahead of him in gold. Every time the stronger team loses pressure, it's an opportunity for the weaker team to get back into the game.

  • 20:30: Objectives are important, but it's equally important to understand when you should and should not cede them. Should you cede this Cloud Drake? Absolutely. You have the other two already, you're all super low compared to them, and Cloud's benefit to your team is miniscule at best. This costs you your Flash, which means that, at 21:51, you can't Flash -> Q away to disengage, which leads to you feeding a 450g killing spree to Tristana, the one champ that absolutely cannot get fed on their team.
  • 22:47: Ping either Yasuo or Corki and tell them to catch this wave. Sejuani is not a carry champ that strongly benefits from items and, even after all that's happened in the past 5 minutes, you're still super far ahead of the rest of your team. Your carries need that gold to be able to do appreciable damage to their two tank frontline. Your entire jungle is up; get a ward on Baron and then clear your side front to back.

  • 23:39: You should not be encouraging this dive. The reason you see people ARAMing a lot of the time in Bronze/Silver/Gold is because they have zero idea what to do come midgame, which leads to them just grouping up mid and trying to roll the dice to win. You have to be the voice of reason for your team and nudge them towards the correct plays. You should deward their jungle as best as you can, plant a ward at the bush up by the blast cone to the right, and then look at your options. You've got two waves building in top, which means that you can either ping your team off mid once mid is pushed up and have them rotate up to top (thus forcing the enemy to potentially walk right into you and Leona and get CC chained to death), or you ping your team off mid and ping for Baron. Your team is super strong right now in an even fight, as Ez has his his major spike (Tri + Muramana), Corki's hit one of his big spikes (Tri), Xin is building total garbage, and their Trist hasn't hit her three-item spike yet. You either hide in pixel brush and wait for them to facecheck, or you brute force Baron and peel off when they come to investigate. You have an active Warmog's, which gives you the ability to constantly force Baron over and over until someone goofs and you can make a pick. Instead, you encourage a dice roll fight where they go 5 for 3 and nearly even out the gold.

  • 26:30: Mountain is mostly useless at this stage in the game, and your team has Baron buff ticking. You have a wave and a half mid with a cannon. You need to ping your team, escort the wave up with 5, and wait to see what they do. If they don't respond, you crush their inner and blow up their inhib turret before they can even get back to base. If they try to run up through mid to cut you off, you calmly direct your team to go through their topside jungle, leaving a trail of wards behind. You do the same thing up top, pushing it up to their turret, and then you rotate to mid and push it up, forcing them to either take a dangerous rotation through their jungle or arrive in time to see their inhib turret die. Ideally, you want to send one of your carries (preferably Corki, since he has an escape) to mid to escort the wave and start pushing it up so you can rotate more smoothly, but moving as a clump when you're this strong is fine in low MMR solo queue. This is probably the last chance your team has to take an even fight, since Trist is rapidly approaching 3 item territory and your Yasuo is useless. If you don't get inhib pressure to force uneven fights, the game's probably over.

  • 28:00: You needed to play this slower. Look at top: you've got a nearly triple stacked wave pushing onto their inner, and while they do have minion pressure in bot, it isn't matching yours and Corki still has TP to save the inhib if he needs to. You need to sit mid, let the mid wave push up into their turret, and wait until the top wave reaches inner. You move your team up, you crack that turret, and then you try to crack their inhib turret with minion pressure. You stand in front to catch any engage and threaten with your ult, and you back off and ping your team away if the enemy team tries to engage on you. Let them waste their ults so that you can confidently move up to the turret with ult advantage and then crack it open. Instead, you choose to fight under turret with 75 Armor, get clobbered by tower shots, and bait your team into getting wiped and giving up all pressure. The game's effectively over after this, with some cleanup fights from 3+ item Trist but nothing much else to say.

My takeaway from this replay is that you're either not consciously thinking about what your next move will be, or you're simply unsure of how to play the macro game. You weirdly undervalued certain objectives (first turret) and overvalued other ones (a third Cloud Drake), you sat mid ARAMing with your team or following up on their nonsense dives, you angled for low value kills, and you didn't try to lasso your team towards the right plays during that game. The good news is that your early game was, aside from the forced return gank on Brand, completely solid: you pathed well, you responded to Xin's ganks appropriately, and you got off three extremely high-value ganks of your own. All you realistically need to do is start appreciating the importance of certain objectives like first turret and Baron and taking a more active role in pushing your team towards them and you can easily hit Gold.

Only other thing to note is that your third item needed to be something different. Spirit Visage does next to nothing for Sej. You either want Knight's Vow (if your ADC is getting dove a lot) or Locket. Into Brand and a behind-the-curve Xin, I definitely would've picked up Locket, even if Leona already has one.

Vermain fucked around with this message at 21:35 on Feb 21, 2018

SSJ_naruto_2003
Oct 12, 2012



Was this posted yet. https://eune.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/patch/patch-84-notes

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006




I was going to, but three posts in a row is a little awkward, so thanks for doing it. :shobon:

Probably the best patch of the season so far. Hit nearly everyone I thought should be hit, carved away some of the most troublesome rune combinations, gave some buffs to underperforming champs, and made changes to help ensure games close out in due time.

Rygar201
Jan 26, 2011
I AM A TERRIBLE PIECE OF SHIT.

Please Condescend to me like this again.

Oh yeah condescend to me ALL DAY condescend daddy.


I'm not wild about the Xin Nerf, but I ever been mainly playing Udyr this season anyway

Orv
May 4, 2011

Amish Ninja posted:

Agreed. I liked him before rework, and was skeptical of the new version because he seemed a bit on the weaker side. Then I tried him out and thoroughly enjoyed. He's basically Tywin Lannister, and that owns.

Anyway: how do you rune him? I've tried a few different setups. Electrocute + lifesteal + sorcery secondary (gathering storm and celerity) seems like a decent way to go about it. Lets you build some tanky AP items and still be a potent mage later in the game. Haven't tried aery or comet based builds. Done an unsealed spellbook build too.

I've been running him Comet, Hat, Transcendence, Storm; Stopwatch, Insight because I'm endlessly amused by how abuseable some peoples ults are with Hat. Swain isn't really one of them, but as a standard thing it works fine and Comet gives Visions a better chance at actually securing that snipe on someone going back at a tower.

I played against someone running Grasp that was monumentally annoying during laning but they ended up losing and not being overly effective later on, but it keeps nagging at my mind as something that might work if played better.

Orv fucked around with this message at 21:51 on Feb 21, 2018

Luna Was Here
Mar 21, 2013

Lipstick Apathy
All of you loving animals who wish for volibear to be good need to be sent back to the hell meta of season 4 or whenever the gently caress they super buffed him and made him the highest damage jungler and let him be literally unkillable. That poo poo was un-loving-playable bad

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gvibes
Jan 18, 2010

Leading us to the promised land (i.e., one tournament win in five years)
Why the hell does darius need a buff?

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