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corn in the bible posted:Also every challenge in a jrpg can be ground past so it's possible to get by with enough time regardless This is one of the things FF13 did well, by putting a hard cap on how much you could grind before each boss.
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Feb 21, 2018 17:39
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| # ? Jun 8, 2024 07:36 |
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FF13 is probably the toughest FF game. Its also the best one and unironically if I were in charge of FF id be making so many spinoffs using that combat engine you all would be begging for mecy.
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Feb 21, 2018 17:48
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TheCenturion posted:Meanwhile, the emphasis on story has been growing, and growing. How so?
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Feb 21, 2018 18:06
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zedprime posted:15 is like every other FF game, completely brainless on the main path At least until you encounter a pack of coeurls and invariably get your poo poo kicked in.
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Feb 21, 2018 18:11
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You can't grind Crystarium, but being able to upgrade equipment decently at all will definitely break a lot of the story mode challenge up till chapter 11. TheCenturion posted:FF13? Just figure out when to have ravagers, and when to have commandos. I can name several story fights where playing the obvious rav-com setups will get you destroyed if you don't use any other debuffs/buffs/sens to have your back. Heck, there are multiple random encounters that basically do this too throughout the story. Maybe you were just high level'd and upgraded your equipment. Some of those fights will lose their challenge if you manage to do that, though a lot of the later fights will still require better strategy. It's also weird to say "just know when to switch your paradigms", when several fights make that exact thing tricky to find out, and is thus the point. It also depends a lot on which teams you're using too, since that's a big part of the equation for a lot of fight in 13, where some are harder/easier than others for each team.
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Feb 21, 2018 18:15
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Barudak posted:Its also the best one and unironically if I were in charge of FF id be making so many spinoffs using that combat engine you all would be begging for mecy. 
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Feb 21, 2018 18:33
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FFXIII is definitely the hardest FF game I've played. But I would have appreciated XIII's challenging gameplay more if there was literally anything else to do in the game. Running from cutscene to cutscene and fighting a bunch of battles along the way really robbed the game of its potential. Why I pfefer XIII-2. Sure it's simpler and easier but there's actually stuff to do besides battles so who cares if the battles are easier. FF3D was probably the second hardest FF game. ApplesandOranges posted:There are actually a few bosses I can think of that don't exactly get easier by grinding; Necron has fixed damage attacks (Blue Shockwave and Neutron Ring) and Grand Cross can screw you up regardless, and Kuja/Ozma actively punish you for levelling because of Flare Star. loving Necron. In the two hard patches where I've gotten to the end (beat one but didn't beat the second one) he was a solid brick wall of difficulty because apparently he has some insane mechanics where there are actually more than one Necron. It's just the others are "invisible" butt he point is Necron apparently gets multiple turns or something because of this? This is what I was told. The point is he will wreck your poo poo because you get overwhelmed. Trance Kuja by contrast is a joke.
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Feb 21, 2018 18:36
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You are all the most toxic, hyper-negative turds. I know you're all falling over each other to be the most ironically detached joke makers about these games but it hasn't been funny for years. The fact that you can grind past challenges in RPGs isn't the fault of the designers. It's lazy button mashers who can't be bothered to overcome challenges without grinding or following a guide because they're fragile little Trump-like egos can't handle failure or because they're too stupid to solve any kind of problem. If you choose to ignore intended game mechanic driven ways to fight hard bosses that's your fault for being an idiot or lazy or both.
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Feb 21, 2018 18:40
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Source. Your. Quotes.
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Feb 21, 2018 18:42
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Lmao
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Feb 21, 2018 18:42
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Elephant Ambush posted:You are all the most toxic, hyper-negative turds. I know you're all falling over each other to be the most ironically detached joke makers about these games but it hasn't been funny for years. sir this is a chocobo rental business
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Feb 21, 2018 18:43
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Weirdly enough, last time I tried to play FF7 and actually bothered to pay attention to the fact that Materia altered your stats and played accordingly, I found the game a lot harder. Like, running out of MP against the first Jenvoa, would have wiped at the end of disc 1 if I didn't have the water ring, a few other places... Maybe I was just having an off day, or maybe I ground out levels a lot more when I was a young'un.
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Feb 21, 2018 18:45
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Eight-Six posted:Weirdly enough, last time I tried to play FF7 and actually bothered to pay attention to the fact that Materia altered your stats and played accordingly, I found the game a lot harder. Like, running out of MP against the first Jenvoa, would have wiped at the end of disc 1 if I didn't have the water ring, a few other places... I always thought they only gave you the water ring cause they didn't intend for people to lose on Jenova-life, cause losing there sucks big time and the impact of Aerith dying is a looooot less impactful the 2nd time around
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Feb 21, 2018 18:49
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Yeah, nobody realizes smart materia management exists because everyone ends up grinding. Like maybe not even in purpose, you just end up running in circles because you weren't sure where to go and ending up with a bunch of xp. Materia Keeper, the Demon Wall, and Carry Armor are some of the hardest bosses I can pick out from the series but you can largely miss that challenge with either grinding or guiding the weaknesses or ideal materia set ups.
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Feb 21, 2018 18:50
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The stat changes are pretty much negligible, though. "Smart Materia" management is less "oh use this one for the +1 Magic/-1 Strength" and more "use these two linked because their abilities combo in a ridiculous way"
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Feb 21, 2018 18:52
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Putting the Water Ring on Cloud and having him enter a berserker rage of just slashing Jenova-LIFE to death even as his teammates collapse is the only way to play that fight, imo.
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Feb 21, 2018 18:52
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The health affects stack up FAST if you aren't grinding. Like the difference between Materia Keeper Trine one shotting you from full health or not.
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Feb 21, 2018 18:53
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I was recently replaying FFVII and FFIX, each with a gameplay patch, and I still can't get over how much my opinions on the games have changed since I was younger. I used to think IX's gameplay was the worst even as I loved everything else about the game. Nowadays I can barely play FFVII and I have to do pseudo-Job Classes where Cloud is like a Paladin which means he gets Cover and Cure materia and that's it or else the game gets dull. Everyone having distinct roles is the only way I can enjoy these games anymore. (I shouldn't be replaying this poo poo anyway, I gotta get working on Xenogears to celebrate the 20th anniversary)
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Feb 21, 2018 18:59
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seiferguy posted:Running into Warmech on the sky castle in 1 is pretty hilarious if you aren't expecting it. It’s cool that when you try to go back to besaid or go back to get tidus’s sigil that your whole party gets obliterated by a dumb recolor that’s a trillion times stronger than the final boss
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Feb 21, 2018 19:33
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Elephant Ambush posted:You are all the most toxic, hyper-negative turds. I know you're all falling over each other to be the most ironically detached joke makers about these games but it hasn't been funny for years. Agreed. The problem a lot of people have, is that they passively expect the game to give them a specific gaming experience, even though that's impossible because everyone wants something different out of their game. You have to be more active, take the game as a base, or a suggestion, from which you do what you want. It's when you expect to be passively entertained by an interactive medium that you get people who button mash while at the same time complaining that the game never forces them to do otherwise. Or when a game mechanic they've never used before becomes somewhat more important, they say the game is punishing them. They surrender all agency and make it all about what the game is doing to them. It's kinda weird imo
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Feb 21, 2018 20:12
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Elephant Ambush posted:You are all the most toxic, hyper-negative turds. I know you're all falling over each other to be the most ironically detached joke makers about these games but it hasn't been funny for years. i can tell your favorite final fantasy is... 8
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Feb 21, 2018 20:30
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I don't remember FF9 being challenging because you can do reflect x4 on your party and make water deal 9999 damage every turn, and then stall out to full heal with a summon animation.
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Feb 21, 2018 20:32
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The White Dragon posted:i can tell your favorite final fantasy is... 8 Nah that's me But only sometimes
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Feb 21, 2018 20:34
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Dragonatrix posted:Nah that's me Same. But always.
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Feb 21, 2018 20:35
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Tae posted:I don't remember FF9 being challenging because you can do reflect x4 on your party and make bio is way better because it's non-elemental
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Feb 21, 2018 20:35
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Tae posted:I don't remember FF9 being challenging because you can do reflect x4 on your party and make water deal 9999 damage every turn, and then stall out to full heal with a summon animation. Yeah there's like 40 different ways to do 9999 in FFIX and it's easy even when you're not so you should just enjoy it idk why people waste time maxing out thievery/frog drop etc
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Feb 21, 2018 20:43
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rpgs shouldnt even have combat imo
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Feb 21, 2018 20:46
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Help Im Alive posted:idk why people waste time maxing out thievery/frog drop etc maxing frog drop is insane because the function is lv*frogs, and you can barely catch 100 frogs in 50 hours of playing. maxing thievery is easy mode though: you'll probably GET 400+ encounters throughout the entire game, and if you steal just one little time in each one, it'll cap out without any effort at all.
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Feb 21, 2018 20:50
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I remember equipping Daggers on Zidane for the final stretch of the game instead of his polearm because the dagger's animations were way, way, way shorter. FF9's combat system led to stupid poo poo like that because of how slow it was.
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Feb 21, 2018 20:52
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Catching frogs should be done for the rewards from Quale. Frog Drop is unimportant. I want that Robe of Lords. I seem to recall you can steal one from Quale, another one from Hades, you can synth a third one with a Black and Light Robe (and you still have a Light Robe left over from Kuja IIRC so you can keep that around for extra Holy damage with Eiko) and I guess the last one is from Chocobo Hot N Cold when some absolute madman grinded enough points? That's everyone who uses Robe in FFIX, I think? I guess you could just synth one and steal one from Hades and forget catching frogs and Quale...
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Feb 21, 2018 21:06
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NikkolasKing posted:Catching frogs should be done for the rewards from Quale. Frog Drop is unimportant. You can synth unlimited White and Black robes at Daguerro, thus unlimited RoLs. corn in the bible posted:rpgs shouldnt even have combat imo RPG fights are usually just giant puzzles anyway, so I think it'd be a neat twist to do away with the numbers completely other than hit points, but maybe on a scale of 5-10, and have a combat system around a variety of moves that do things, especially interact with one another, like a more organic form of CT's Dual Techs, and try to figure out a way to defeat enemies based on your environment, the enemy's actions, and various other factors, meanwhile trying to mitigate whatever damage is dealt to you. Of course it'd be more work than throwing more numbers at everything, and it'd break tradition, so I doubt we'll see anything like that in a full-fledged game anytime soon, but it could also take the charm of experimentation in open world games and apply it to your bog-standard RPG.
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Feb 21, 2018 21:35
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Elephant Ambush posted:You are all the most toxic, hyper-negative turds. I know you're all falling over each other to be the most ironically detached joke makers about these games but it hasn't been funny for years. I'm still sitting here trying to figure out who you're melting down at and I have no clue. "Final Fantasy has always been simpler than you remember" isn't a controversial opinion considering the series markets itself as being able to be played by literally anyone with a pulse, and pointing out examples how isn't that hard.
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Feb 21, 2018 21:36
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Final fantasy is serious loving business
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Feb 21, 2018 21:40
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The GIG posted:I'm still sitting here trying to figure out who you're melting down at and I have no clue. "Final Fantasy has always been simpler than you remember" isn't a controversial opinion considering the series markets itself as being able to be played by literally anyone with a pulse, and pointing out examples how isn't that hard. I was assuming it was copypasta because there’s no reason to have an apoplectic meltdown but apparently it isn’t 
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Feb 21, 2018 21:49
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goons
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Feb 21, 2018 21:51
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The older games are too easy, but people would probably have complained worse if they were harder.
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Feb 21, 2018 22:13
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The funny thing about XIII is that it isn't even hard from a design perspective, people were just terrible with it because it was so different. Vanille's English voice actor played a fairly large chunk of the game and was able to learn how switching paradigms quickly was important. It's still one of the best systems the series has given us though. Shame about the rest of the game.
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Feb 21, 2018 22:19
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Ventana posted:I always thought they only gave you the water ring cause they didn't intend for people to lose on Jenova-life, cause losing there sucks big time and the impact of Aerith dying is a looooot less impactful the 2nd time around lol like I ever give anyone any accessories except ones increase their strength or magic damage
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Feb 21, 2018 22:20
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Something to keep in mind is that they’re easy to us now. Dumb kid me struggled through loving FF6 at times because I didn’t know the hundreds of ways to break the game back then. Adult me knows all about Vanish/Doom and Gau and Genji/Offering and Gau and 5xUltima at MP and Gau and Ripplering Interceptor onto Relm as she sketches me a hundred Illuminas and Gau so I can make the game cry in several ways because I’m a *peers closer* toxic, hyper-negative turd. I won’t argue the fact that I’m not funny, though.
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Feb 21, 2018 22:21
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| # ? Jun 8, 2024 07:36 |
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I've always been a big fan of each boss having a status element they're weak to, then exploiting that. Ruby Weapon is trivial if you use dazers to stun him. A lot of early to mid mark hunts in 12 can be broken using the niho + remedy strategy.
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Feb 21, 2018 22:21
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