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Mendrian posted:It's not really a game breaker for me but at the upper end of VT2 you'll be basically playing Diablo 3. Never played Diablo 3 so can you explain?
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Mar 8, 2018 18:31
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Night10194 posted:I had like 40 hours played in 1 before I got a single new Rapier for Victor. The loot system at release in 1 was so goddamn bad. yuuuuuuuuuup all i wanted was a great axe for my dwarf and i kept on getting crap for classes i never intended to even touch, EVER.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:32
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Giant Isopod posted:It's currently failing in the available hats metric, but I have faith  Atoramos posted:Digirat cares a whole lot about the first game and how it balances/plays at the hardest difficulties, and its players like him that kept Vermintide 1 going as long as it did with as many updates as it got. More than likely he's right about a buncha stuff like how the new specials/shield rats are gonna effect handling large hordes of rats and such. Caring about a good game is fine, but projecting a bunch of stuff from the first game onto its sequel is silly Especially with wide sweeping statements like "The design of this game is total bollocks."
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Mar 8, 2018 18:32
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Agrajag posted:Never played Diablo 3 so can you explain? Once you've basically capped or nigh-capped your Hero Power - which doesn't seem all that unattainable - you'll be on the quest for perfect items. Which means butting your head into the RNG over and over. I don't think that's necessarily bad, but it's something people will end up complaining about.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:33
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Martout posted:Finally got a Bolt staff with +5% crit chance and Heat Sink and it is everything I ever wanted for Sienna, gonna own when they nerf it! I honestly don't think it's gonna get touched for a minute, just because huntsman and bounty hunter and literally every single individual thing the waywatcher gets are so much more out of tune, whereas BW gets insanely off the fuckin' chain after Twenty-Four American Levels of Wizard. Most redditors seem to not have that patience I guess. its so good though, isn't it? I've been kinda-sorta trying to roll cooldown reduction on crit instead of heat sink, but after fourteen orange gubbins the game saw fit to leave me with the heat sink trait again so I cut my losses on Item Pachinko and threw color junk at some other characters who I'm told also use items as well.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:34
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Mendrian posted:Once you've basically capped or nigh-capped your Hero Power - which doesn't seem all that unattainable - you'll be on the quest for perfect items. Which means butting your head into the RNG over and over. I complain about it to all who will listen when I roll junk and then get the exact and precise combo I just had. If you only have a pool of 4 traits, getting "shield ally on assist" seven times in a row gets old quick.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:36
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Mendrian posted:Once you've basically capped or nigh-capped your Hero Power - which doesn't seem all that unattainable - you'll be on the quest for perfect items. Which means butting your head into the RNG over and over. You mean the red coloured rarity items right? Yeah I can see that happening for people but does this game really require extreme amounts of min maxing? I thought it was mainly just coop bashing rats is the main objective and not much more beyond that. Are you implying that soon we'll be getting groups where you're required to have X of this or X of that?
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Mar 8, 2018 18:37
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The loot system in vt2 is far improved, both compared to vt1's initial "hope you like getting whites" rng as well as the "you're kitted in full blues/oranges before you even finish the 13 base maps" after the buffs. I don't give a poo poo whatsoever that someone can no longer look at half a horde and instantly know that this goober here takes exactly 2 hits to kill and that goober there takes 3. It's a game about fighting hordes and then taking a break between hordes to inch further toward the goal, there should be some chaos involved. 94.6% of vt1's playerbase never bothered to touch Cataclysm anyway, which was the only place that sort of precision ever mattered.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:37
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Willie Tomg posted:I complain about it to all who will listen when I roll junk and then get the exact and precise combo I just had. If you only have a pool of 4 traits, getting "shield ally on assist" seven times in a row gets old quick. Revive Speed % Respawn Speed %
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Mar 8, 2018 18:38
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Mendrian posted:Once you've basically capped or nigh-capped your Hero Power - which doesn't seem all that unattainable - you'll be on the quest for perfect items. Which means butting your head into the RNG over and over. this is the basic premise of literally every loot game ever, and is only really a problem if the gameplay loop you're participating in to get loot isn't good. the problem with d3 isn't that you chase the perfect loot, it's that the gameplay is super mediocre and you chainrun three minute rifts full of mobs you one-shot in order to get the perfect loot, and once you have it all you're left with is a weird isometric rpg where you press one button 99 percent of the time.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:38
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Night10194 posted:I had like 40 hours played in 1 before I got a single new Rapier for Victor. The loot system at release in 1 was so goddamn bad. 300 hours in vt1, never received a Drakefire pistols. Of any quality, ever.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:39
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Agrajag posted:Revive Speed % spoiler this rude garbage. jesus christ, man
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Mar 8, 2018 18:40
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Stanley Pain posted:Caring about a good game is fine, but projecting a bunch of stuff from the first game onto its sequel is silly he actually called out the additions to the mechanics as specifically what he has issues with, especially the hero power thing, which is dumb, bad, and baddumb. perhaps even dumbbad. like i disagree with digirat on a bunch (just hit my ? if you want to see us arguing) but people are ragging on him for a bunch of poo poo they wished he said rather than what he actually said.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:42
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I rerolled my trinket trait and got 25% bomb recycle 5 times in a row. Are there even other traits in that category?
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Mar 8, 2018 18:43
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Ad by Khad posted:The loot system in vt2 is far improved, both compared to vt1's initial "hope you like getting whites" rng as well as the "you're kitted in full blues/oranges before you even finish the 13 base maps" after the buffs. And for what it's worth as a counterpoint, leveling Saltzpyre and thus finally having to learn how to play Vermintide again instead of burning all my problems to ashes, I'm really liking the different feels encounters have. Skaven fly apart to light attacks like tissue paper whereas chaos dudes necessitate the good ol' stick n' move like a Diet Stormvermin. I will freely admit though that it felt like garbage until I pumped my Destiny Level. But that took... maybe an hour or two of flailing? And then felt fine. Good poo poo. On stream right now: Power level number now has a tooltip that explicitly shows stagger levels and other relevant stuff. which it shoulda done in the first place but, fatshark, better late than never, etc etc
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Mar 8, 2018 18:44
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Ignite Memories posted:I rerolled my trinket trait and got 25% bomb recycle 5 times in a row. Are there even other traits in that category? Insanely good ones. The RNG is streaky like unwashed underwear. I think I spent no joke thirty green+blue trying to find crit chance on a trinket. It was actually impressively unlucky.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:46
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So is stagger level solely linked to character power or is it still also influenced by weapon type as well? Will my falchion shove like a shield and mace given the same power level?
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Mar 8, 2018 18:46
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Willie Tomg posted:On stream right now: Power level number now has a tooltip that explicitly shows stagger levels and other relevant stuff. which it shoulda done in the first place but, fatshark, better late than never, etc etc I didn't play Vermintide 1 for long, but unlike Bungie, Fatshark at least has a track record of realizing that there's dumb stuff in their game and fixing it, rather than yammering about vision or some nonsense like that.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:47
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There are issues, but they're attached to a good as hell basic gameplay model and a good developer who has already done a ton of work on balancing since the original tests. I just wish they'd give me a Bretonnian to play as, but I totally get why 'Hey we have 5 characters who really work and whose VAs are still able to come back for game 2' would push them to keep those PCs.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:49
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I have no issue what so ever with Hero Power.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:50
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Coolguye posted:speaking of projecting What part of entire design bad bad did I not comprehend here?  When you start with a broad, spicy hot take like that.....He's been projecting VT1 --> VT2 for pages here. Hero power is fine. At least from my perspective. Number goes up, things die faster, better, harder. I move up difficulty things get tougher until numbers go up. I even managed to get a few random champion runs completed by 1) making number go up 2)rolling traits that a) suit my play style b) fit my build. There's nothing overly complex here. It might break some brain s further if you absolutely have to min/max every aspect of your character. But I'm not like that but can appreciate if someone is.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:51
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One of the most common pieces of advice we gave in the first game was 'try not to see loot as the point, but a vestigial mini-game attached to a good FPS'. That's harder to stress here since there are real differences between an HP 50 character and an HP 350 character, but it's probably still the healthiest mindset.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:52
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DeathSandwich posted:So is stagger level solely linked to character power or is it still also influenced by weapon type as well? Will my falchion shove like a shield and mace given the same power level? Its both and also power thresholds to do things get more stringent on higher difficulty. So: Rapier; lovely base stagger, that gets less lovely with more power level. Think of it like rolling devestating blow in VT1, except you eventually get it just for playing Saltz. Then you go to champion or whatever, and its Dodge City again. Coolguye posted:speaking of projecting yea i have hype for this game i havent had since my teenly days, and i just straight-up disagree that the variable and divergent enemy types are Bad For Vermintide, but opaque power levels have a lotta room for improvement no two ways about it and berserkers as they presently exist are BS and so on and so on and so on. birds fly, bees buzz, vermintide is full of jank. we all know this. game is still a drat sight better than 1 was on release, ESPECIALLY regarding the loot.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:53
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When playing games, have fun. When fun is no longer had move on.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:53
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Agrajag posted:Festering Grounds jump for the 2nd grim is totally not worth the risk of fall damage unless you use the Slayer jump ability. Don't jump. Face the wall and just walk off the boardwalk/ramp thing and press left once you've started falling. I get that grim 100% of the time with no issues, easy as pie. Darius099 fucked around with this message at 18:57 on Mar 8, 2018 |
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Mar 8, 2018 18:54
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Night10194 posted:There are issues, but they're attached to a good as hell basic gameplay model and a good developer who has already done a ton of work on balancing since the original tests. Here's a hot take for you: I've seen the game get more refinement in 2 weeks than I've seen Overwatch get refined in 2 years.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:55
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Stanley Pain posted:When playing games, have fun. When fun is no longer had move on. wisdom
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Mar 8, 2018 18:56
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Willie Tomg posted:I honestly don't think it's gonna get touched for a minute, just because huntsman and bounty hunter and literally every single individual thing the waywatcher gets are so much more out of tune, whereas BW gets insanely off the fuckin' chain after Twenty-Four American Levels of Wizard. Most redditors seem to not have that patience I guess. It really is! Although I'm putting out about the same numbers as I do with a good fireball staff except more headshots it feels very different - having the superfast light attacks to blast away at enemies that get close makes it workable to keep the staff out in situations when I'd otherwise switch to melee. The more fire I get to shoot at rats the happier I am and this is the best weapon for it I've found so far. I am curious to see how a Beam staff with Heat Sink handles or if it suffers from the fact that it's a beam staff.
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Mar 8, 2018 18:57
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oh my GOD there's twitch integration in the mode they're showing off right now. with chat votes and everything. e; OH MY GOD one of the votes is for "treasure hunt" which is where seven loot rats spawn in Lunethexian manner and everyone has to chase them down and bop them. Willie Tomg fucked around with this message at 19:00 on Mar 8, 2018 |
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Mar 8, 2018 18:57
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Willie Tomg posted:Its both and also power thresholds to do things get more stringent on higher difficulty. So: Rapier; lovely base stagger, that gets less lovely with more power level. Think of it like rolling devestating blow in VT1, except you eventually get it just for playing Saltz. Then you go to champion or whatever, and its Dodge City again. Yeah, disregarding anything else, I am having fun with the game. I know the broken poo poo like the Huntsman + Shotgun, some of the crit nonsense, the waywatcher in general, and the like are all going to get tuned up in time. Quick Play alone for the loot bonus gives you a reason not to just blindly, dumbly play the same  easy map/exploit over and over again in order to get easy loot like you seen happen in Vermintide 1 and Payday 2. I'm kind of nervous that less than half of the maps have been playtested, especially with Empire in Flames and War Camp being way out of whack with the others from this and the previous beta. EiF really needs some guaranteed ammo and like 1-2 health kits right before the drop into the estate because that map is super savage right now and War Camp has kind of the opposite problem with it being far too easy.
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Mar 8, 2018 19:04
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Willie Tomg posted:oh my GOD there's twitch integration in the mode they're showing off right now. with chat votes and everything. Link this stream that sounds awesome
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Mar 8, 2018 19:05
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Dr. VooDoo posted:Link this stream that sounds awesome Its just fatsharks release stream https://www.twitch.tv/fatsharkgames
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Mar 8, 2018 19:06
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I love that they're being constantly harangued by friend requests
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Mar 8, 2018 19:07
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It should be released now or is it still another hour?
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Mar 8, 2018 19:08
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Martout posted:I am curious to see how a Beam staff with Heat Sink handles or if it suffers from the fact that it's a beam staff. I see lots of people advocating Beam staff as the best staff, but I don't really get it. I guess it's cool in a benevolent support way, insofar as you can wave it around to stunlock enemies your teammates are fighting in melee. But it seems to take forever to actually kill anything?
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Mar 8, 2018 19:08
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Agrajag posted:The one aspect i hated the most from vermintide 1 was the poo poo rear end loot rng. Yeah I’m only really talking about gameplay here, I totally agree that the experience of starting out in 2 is way better than 1 in terms of loot Stanley Pain posted:Caring about a good game is fine, but projecting a bunch of stuff from the first game onto its sequel is silly Especially with wide sweeping statements like "The design of this game is total bollocks." I’ve never called it “total bollocks” and wouldn’t still be here saying it’s a good game if it was. the problem is that it’s worse than the first game, a statement that really isn’t sweeping at all when I’ve explained numerous reasons why over loving weeks here. You’ve spent longer misrepresenting those reasons as all being “different than the first game” than you have actually reading them, so forgive me if I have a hard time taking a single word you post seriously
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Mar 8, 2018 19:09
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Willie Tomg posted:On stream right now: Power level number now has a tooltip that explicitly shows stagger levels and other relevant stuff. which it shoulda done in the first place but, fatshark, better late than never, etc etc Done in the first place? Game's not even out yet.
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Mar 8, 2018 19:09
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One good thing about liking to play Bright Wizard is that for some reason pubbies never pick her? I guess cause she doesn’t have some kind of broken power but I never have an issue of joining a game and being told the Bright Wizard is taken
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Mar 8, 2018 19:10
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Captain Mediocre posted:I see lots of people advocating Beam staff as the best staff, but I don't really get it. I guess it's cool in a benevolent support way, insofar as you can wave it around to stunlock enemies your teammates are fighting in melee. But it seems to take forever to actually kill anything? i think its effectiveness, like everything else, is largely affected by what difficulty you're playing on and what hero power number you're at. that said it could kill chaos spawns in 5 seconds and i still wouldn't use the thing because of how utterly anemic the beam effect feels compared to hucking a firebolt Dr. VooDoo posted:One good thing about liking to play Bright Wizard is that for some reason pubbies never pick her? I guess cause she doesn’t have some kind of broken power but I never have an issue of joining a game and being told the Bright Wizard is taken i think someone earlier pointed out that getting to a brokenly powerful version of the bright wizard takes the time/effort needed to get to level 25, meanwhile getting to similar states with the elf/kruber/saltzpyre happen almost immediately by comparison, so her poplarity might be explained by that Cowcaster fucked around with this message at 19:14 on Mar 8, 2018 |
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Mar 8, 2018 19:11
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Tagichatn posted:Done in the first place? Game's not even out yet. "out" is a term with a lot of inbuilt flex in these, the days of early access, as VT has essentially been for a few weeks.
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Mar 8, 2018 19:11
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