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Do hive minds care about habitability?
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Mar 9, 2018 23:54
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winterwerefox posted:Do hive minds care about habitability? As far as I know, yes, it won't make your pops unhappy, but you still get a direct habitability penalty to productivity as with normal pops.
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Mar 9, 2018 23:57
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Alright, saves me from having to make another tundra race. I'm doing what that goon did with having 2 races per planet type, plus 1 tomb, machine, and gaia
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Mar 10, 2018 00:01
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Jazerus posted:just checking here: am I the only person really skeeved out by the fact that egalitarian empires can use Deep Space Black Sites without even a peep from the egalitarian faction? I really wish more things like this were ethos-dependent or policy based, but at the same time had different versions of similar effects with similar fluff. So a non-egalitarian could get the blacksite which does evil poo poo far away from society to suppress non-state ethos, but egalitarians instead get some sort of democratic concensus building forum that gives a specific boost to just egalitarian ethos and generates a bit more unity or something. Or just identical but with different fluff. But the faction demands stuff often seem pretty arbitrary. Like I can have deep space black sites and have vassals that are slavers without a peep, but if I try to pay people to move to another planet I'm some sort of tyrant?? (seriously egalitarians need some "carrots" to ethnically move people around with. Make it expensive sure, but don't take away the option entirely) Baronjutter fucked around with this message at 00:03 on Mar 10, 2018 |
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Mar 10, 2018 00:01
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Jazerus posted:just checking here: am I the only person really skeeved out by the fact that egalitarian empires can use Deep Space Black Sites without even a peep from the egalitarian faction? Thinking about basically every Western government, it makes perfect sense to me.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:03
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Baronjutter posted:I really wish more things like this were ethos-dependent or policy based, but at the same time had different versions of similar effects with similar fluff. So a non-egalitarian could get the blacksite which does evil poo poo far away from society to suppress non-state ethos, but egalitarians instead get some sort of democratic concensus building forum that gives a specific boost to just egalitarian ethos and generates a bit more unity or something. Or just identical but with different fluff. yeah that's what i just suggested on the paradox forums and i got a bunch of "but america is egalitarian and has black sites!!!" nonsense replies from the typically clueless paradox forum regulars so i wanted to see if i was overreacting Soup du Jour posted:Thinking about basically every Western government, it makes perfect sense to me. yeah uh the egalitarian faction in western nations has a happiness penalty due to things like that, if you want to reduce reality into game terms. it's not a matter of nobody caring at all.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:03
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double post
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Mar 10, 2018 00:04
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Yeah the egalitarian factions in the real world are constantly loving pissed and enraged and protesting poo poo like that. It's almost like the governments have not decided to click "embrace faction" or realized they don't give a poo poo about the influence bonus.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:05
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I mean "egalitarian" as a faction isn't really very coherent to be honest, given that they also get pissy about free movement which has bugger all to do with egalitarianism. Like, no, nobody is allowed to move to a planet that they aren't very well adapted to, that's very fair and equal, you all have an equal chance to not suffocate trying to breathe loving methane with the methane breathing people, you idiots.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:11
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OwlFancier posted:I mean "egalitarian" as a faction isn't really very coherent to be honest, given that they also get pissy about free movement which has bugger all to do with egalitarianism. Like, no, nobody is allowed to move to a planet that they aren't very well adapted to, that's very fair and equal, you all have an equal chance to not suffocate trying to breathe loving methane with the methane breathing people, you idiots. Also the well known demands of pacifists are ferrengi-like greed and control of critical rare resource.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:12
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Baronjutter posted:But the faction demands stuff often seem pretty arbitrary. Like I can have deep space black sites and have vassals that are slavers without a peep, but if I try to pay people to move to another planet I'm some sort of tyrant?? (seriously egalitarians need some "carrots" to ethnically move people around with. Make it expensive sure, but don't take away the option entirely) this is because egalitarian/authoritarian used to be individualist/collectivist; they kept some of those bonuses and penalties even though they don't necessarily make sense with the new axis.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:13
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Jazerus posted:this is because egalitarian/authoritarian used to be individualist/collectivist; they kept some of those bonuses and penalties even though they don't necessarily make sense with the new axis. I love the idea of ethos and factions but the implementation of it and the revision after revision has left it really feeling like a mess.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:14
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Still think collectivism/individualist was fine as is and didn't need changing.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:15
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OwlFancier posted:Still think collectivism/individualist was fine as is and didn't need changing. nah collectivism was too authoritarian for the societies many people wanted to build, while individualist was too libertarian. i'd be fine with their reimplementation as another axis entirely, though!
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Mar 10, 2018 00:17
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Eh, it was only as authoritarian as you wanted it to be, though i suppose that would gently caress up if they tried to introduce a faction based around it.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:18
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I feel like if we had about twice as many factions as we do now, with some of them maybe having influence from multiple ethics, things would be a lot better.OwlFancier posted:I mean "egalitarian" as a faction isn't really very coherent to be honest, given that they also get pissy about free movement which has bugger all to do with egalitarianism. Like, no, nobody is allowed to move to a planet that they aren't very well adapted to, that's very fair and equal, you all have an equal chance to not suffocate trying to breathe loving methane with the methane breathing people, you idiots. Like this, it makes perfect sense for egalitarians to be opposed to forced resettlement, but opening up the core worlds to other species overlaps too much with Xenophile. They should only really care about citizen species and let xenophiles worry about everyone else. I also brought up a few pages back that I don't like how the militarist faction has a lot of goals that inherently conflict with eachother and don't really allow for saber-rattling and displays of power rather than just knocking heads all the time. And then there's the fact that the xenophobe faction is almost more pacifist than the actual pacifist faction, which is all about economic growth for some reason.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:31
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As many options as the ethos system gives it's still weirdly impossible to make so many well known scifi nations. If they were kept loose and down to interpretation it could maybe work, but the fluff and faction demands end up being hyper-specific what sort of interpretation of the term is. The ability to define the "flavour" of your ethos would be cool, which would generate or let you pick a correct flavour faction to match. Like the demands from the spiritualist faction in a fanatic pacifist empire might be different from those of a militarist empire. A xenophobic empire's materialists probably wouldn't be demanding research treaties with gross enemy aliens, and a xenophile's egalitarian faction might care deeply about the rights of free movement and reproduction for all citizens regardless of species, a xenophobic egalitarian faction might only care about the rights of the core species and be fine with xenos being given residence only or movement restrictions.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:31
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Aethernet posted:Chap makes good points. Worth noting he doesn't recommend missiles at all, which is correct because they're currently terrible. They should be a good anti-corvette weapon, but they're too slow to reliably hit them - missiles are only twice as fast as a basic corvette, and with level 4 engines a corvette is only 20% slower than a missile. I have seen missiles pursue a swarming corvette around a station twice. Missile engines should be upgraded in line with your engine tech. brb renaming the torp corvettes to Cavalry Ravens
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Mar 10, 2018 00:34
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There’s a pacifist/Xenophobe faction and a pacifist economic faction. Really there needs to be more splits like that, or each needs to be narrowly tailored to their ethics.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:35
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Jabarto posted:I feel like if we had about twice as many factions as we do now, with some of them maybe having influence from multiple ethics, things would be a lot better. Yeah, I often avoid playing certain ethos combos because I hate their factions, they're just too hard to make happy or outright conflict with each other or conflict with my playstyle idea for that race. Egalitarian materialist is easy. Set your policies right and egalitarians are happy, research good and have robots and you materialists are happy. I never do research treaties but even then the lack of them isn't enough to make materialist faction angry. I can keep both around 60+ happiness which is enough to generate influence. Other factions though get most of their happiness buffs from temporary things or limited things, you conquered someone, you have enough rivals, you gained a new vassal and so on. Worse is when you have two faction from your state ethos which conflict with each other, like trying to play xenophobe egalitarian for the reasons you listed. Every faction should have a few alternates you can pick to match the society you're trying to build. Only for your state ethos of course. Adding in more specific combo faction types like they already have should be doable, I've looked at the faction files, I just can't make heads or tails of them because I'm not a modder 
Baronjutter fucked around with this message at 00:44 on Mar 10, 2018 |
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Mar 10, 2018 00:39
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Baronjutter posted:Yeah the egalitarian factions in the real world are constantly loving pissed and enraged and protesting poo poo like that. It's almost like the governments have not decided to click "embrace faction" or realized they don't give a poo poo about the influence bonus. I don't really protest in the streets much, but to be clear I'm not currently contributing my share of unity.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:39
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Jazerus posted:just checking here: am I the only person really skeeved out by the fact that egalitarian empires can use Deep Space Black Sites without even a peep from the egalitarian faction? Using them coming with an increasing risk-per-site of their discovery and the sudden development of a large reform faction/unrest penalty would be cool. Betray your government's principles at your own risk.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:50
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I wish there was a way to flag portraits as 'Dont use for random species' There are a bunch I just hate, like the Blorg living crap one.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:52
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Aethernet posted:Chap makes good points. Worth noting he doesn't recommend missiles at all, which is correct because they're currently terrible. They should be a good anti-corvette weapon, but they're too slow to reliably hit them - missiles are only twice as fast as a basic corvette, and with level 4 engines a corvette is only 20% slower than a missile. I have seen missiles pursue a swarming corvette around a station twice. Missile engines should be upgraded in line with your engine tech. Why on earth would you think missiles were anti-corvette? They have 30% tracking and corvettes can mount PD. Theoretically strike craft should be anti corvette but they do garbage tier damage according to battle reports. I also can't agree with a guide that doesn't put big warning signs on Destroyers in terms of efficacy. The principle advantage a destroyer has over a corvette are 100 hp per naval cap, greater ability to mount PD, and the ability to use Artillery and Line computers. But none of that actually applies to fighting corvettes, which can also get picket computers if they want, and its very easy to get corvette +HP techs such that when you are considering corvette vs destroyer the corvette has as much or more effective hp/nc. Medium guns aren't noticably better at killing starbases than the autocannon/laser combo, while the destroyer is much more vulnerable to a starbases medium guns in return.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:56
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Napoleon Bonaparty posted:A quality of life change I'd look into, in a recent game I had a fallen xenophobic empire next to mine, and there was one system in particular that bordered them which they insisted should never be colonized or have an active star base. The result was new pirates every year, and a fleet dedicated to their constant eradication. This really sucked and I hope the pirates know not to set up next to xenophobes in a patch soon, or that said empire will do something about the alien pirates they say they hate.
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Mar 10, 2018 00:57
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Jazerus posted:just checking here: am I the only person really skeeved out by the fact that egalitarian empires can use Deep Space Black Sites without even a peep from the egalitarian faction?
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Mar 10, 2018 00:59
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I like doing Militarist/Egalitarian and giving everyone utopian living standards. Like we're conquering you for your own good and yes you will like it. But the factions I think tank it somehow? I forget but it was annoying.
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Mar 10, 2018 01:01
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I don't think there's a problem with specialized starbases per se. If you redesign it for non-specialized starbases - like say flat bonuses from Offworld Trading Company - you end up with 'optimal' design potentially just being a mix of modules on every starbase, and I don't think that's actually better or more interesting. Trading starbases will probably be more interesting when the economy DLC comes out, since the current system can easily function as a placeholder for a more complicated system. I like the specialized buildings from enclaves/black holes as encouragements for starbases. There's a lot of potential for variety there. Actually it should be pretty easily moddable!
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Mar 10, 2018 01:03
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I'm really curious about the next update, the dev diary pretty much said nothing but the topics are really interesting.
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Mar 10, 2018 01:07
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appropriatemetaphor posted:I like doing Militarist/Egalitarian and giving everyone utopian living standards. Like we're conquering you for your own good and yes you will like it. But the factions I think tank it somehow? I forget but it was annoying. i usually play xenophile/egalitarian/militarist we're really thrilled to meet new people and make them happy. the fact that that usually involves blowing up oppressive governments just makes it even better!
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Mar 10, 2018 01:07
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Aethernet posted:Mind you, torpedoes are typically slower than the corvettes that launch them, in a magnificent ignoring of physics. I know Stellaris isn't hard scifi, but when people break the rules of physics it's not normally to make things worse. I'm explaining this from now on by declaring corvettes too small to mount "real" torpedo launchers. Instead they have simple flush tubes, and the torpedoes are just flushed out into space, where they have to re-orient themselves with maneuvering thrusters towards their target before igniting their own engines. This means physics forces the torpedoes to be slower than their mother ships, since battles will be long over before the torpedoes could feasibly accelerate to a higher speed. Larger ships have progressively more powerful launchers, but are also getting progressively slower so the torpedoes, by sheer coincidence, end up having the same end speed in total when launched from them.
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Mar 10, 2018 01:14
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One thing to remember with starbases are the unique building thingies available. The neutral stations all have an option that is really good, blackholes can get a +10 physics research, and nebula can get a +5 minerals building. So I aim to put my anchorage starbases in one of those systems, since they're almost never trading hub base options.
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Mar 10, 2018 01:21
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Libluini posted:I'm explaining this from now on by declaring corvettes too small to mount "real" torpedo launchers. Instead they have simple flush tubes, and the torpedoes are just flushed out into space, where they have to re-orient themselves with maneuvering thrusters towards their target before igniting their own engines. This means physics forces the torpedoes to be slower than their mother ships, since battles will be long over before the torpedoes could feasibly accelerate to a higher speed. In an inertialess setting - the torpedos just dont have strong inertia canceling coupled with weaker engines 
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Mar 10, 2018 02:35
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Are natural wormholes supposed to be unstable? I explored all the ones in my empire awhile back, but now they're back to being unexplored.
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Mar 10, 2018 02:35
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Jazerus posted:just checking here: am I the only person really skeeved out by the fact that egalitarian empires can use Deep Space Black Sites without even a peep from the egalitarian faction? I thought they were available to me because my empire was fanatically authoritarian....
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Mar 10, 2018 03:11
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Synthbuttrange posted:Are natural wormholes supposed to be unstable? I explored all the ones in my empire awhile back, but now they're back to being unexplored. I don't think this is intended behavior at all. Also I found a solution to the Marauder events stalling out due to an early loss of transports. You can tag switch to the marauder empire, run event marauder.500 (which re-starts the great-khan event) and they'll get a fresh load of troop transports and construction ships.
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Mar 10, 2018 03:37
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Synthbuttrange posted:Are natural wormholes supposed to be unstable? I explored all the ones in my empire awhile back, but now they're back to being unexplored. You (or a spectral wraith) didn't by any chance remove the starbases, did you? I removed a few captured ugly lizard outposts to replace them with my beautiful molluscoid starbases, and systems immediately became unexplored, forcing me to bring up science ships to survey them so I could rebuild. My guess is that I got the data from communication with the former owners, but they were still not flagged as having been surveyed, so when the outposts were removed they reverted to that state.
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Mar 10, 2018 03:37
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Oh god a wraith is tearing its way through my empire after popping out of a wormhole.  I've got a bunch of fleets totalling about 9k in fleet power at this point. No way I can take it on.
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Mar 10, 2018 04:52
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Thank gently caress it took a right turn and exited into my friendly neighbours. Sorry guys, better you than me.
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Mar 10, 2018 04:56
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I wish to inform you all that I love the Worm and the Worm loves me.
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Mar 10, 2018 05:29
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