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I'd really enjoy Eureka if I could level alt jobs in it. But no, you can't. Even though they let you switch to under-70 jobs, they're completely useless. Unless like, I dunno, the idea is you go "oh no my friend died better run back to town and switch to my level 32 White Mage so I can run back through the hellscape of enemies that will one shot me so I can Raise my buddy so they don't lose EXP". In which case, that's a stupid idea.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:10
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I finished the HW Hildibrand quests this morning. Not as funny as the ARR stuff, maybe because it's not completely fresh now, but still a good time that ended perfectly. At this rate I'm half expecting Nashu to turn out to be married to Kan-E Senna or some such and them saying you never asked.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:13
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They probably just didn't feel like coding in a level restriction when it wouldn't have added anything
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Mar 15, 2018 18:14
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Trasson posted:I'd really enjoy Eureka if I could level alt jobs in it. Does raising avoid an xp loss? If its the case maybe they'd want it to be "you'll want to party up with a healer / someone with a high level healer" rather then "literally anyone who has a healer at like, level 10" That said I agree. Eureka might be interesting to me if it was scaling you up to 70 and granting you regular xp on top of the elemental xp. I'd love more options for levelling my alts up, doubly so if I'm accomplishing some other grind at the same time.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:15
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Cythereal posted:I'm a person of simple tastes. I like my villains hammy, my women queer, and my elves punchable.  flicks poison at u Also, as someone who's never done a Relic quest before nerfs, I'd like to say that the worst thing about Eureka is the effect it's had on queue times for non-Eureka stuff. I was getting spoiled by sub-10 minute queues for stuff on DPS, and now everyone's busy hellgrinding instead and it takes 20+ minutes to get into anything.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:16
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eureka is a loving nightmare because i am being asked to trust glorified ldr healers to keep me alive or i lose like days of progress on top of this, you get the dps who are like 'i'll help! i'll pull!', only five different idiots did it, so suddenly you're fighting 5 new mobs and three old ones, and at this point i just abandon the duty.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:16
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Tenik posted:I know the joke is that it's a long post, but they aren't wrong. They’re not wrong. They just didn’t need 10,000 words to say it.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:17
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KoB posted:Its always funny to me when people on the very first day of new content are losing their minds because they seriously think it will take literal years to grind out the new currency. You make it sound like that wasn't certainly the result of like 18 hours of work. Even if you're in a psycho FATE train, those things aren't spawning every minute. Plus you need to be of a decent level to even get decent rewards out of them and you sure aren't getting worthwhile exp until a FATE pops. And have fun running your rear end all the way to the T-Rex FATE when you're level 5 and everything that sees you can one shot you. Once you hit like 6-8, you can start turning your brain off in Eureka, but it's still real bad.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:20
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KoB posted:Its always funny to me when people on the very first day of new content are losing their minds because they seriously think it will take literal years to grind out the new currency. It takes 8-12 hours of mindless grinding to get to the level where you can actually start doing FATE trains and the majority of those trains are going to die out fairly quickly and the best way to grind is to actively gently caress up the servers by AFK'ing in the instance and wait for FATEs to spawn and never actively engage the content as designed. People have found a shortcut through the grinding, it's still a loving nightmare of bad designs.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:24
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Eureka is bad independent of every secondary issue it has because it's basically patronizing as gently caress. "Here's a baser-urge grind that involves making hp bars get empty ad-nauseum." That's what a major developer of an extremely popular MMO thinks is content in 2018. Talking out issues with the piddly poo poo like the best strategies for it, the crystals taking up inventory space for some loving reason, the random drops being untradeable, etc. is stupid because it legitimizes the base content in doing so. It's all dead on arrival tied to something as conceptually anachronistic as Eureka.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:26
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Solo Wing Pixy posted:
In my defense, here's my character (still in leveling gear).  So I'm not completely bigoted.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:31
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Cythereal posted:In my defense, here's my character (still in leveling gear). By the way Cythereal, you mentioned before that you really hate tanking. Is that a tanxiety thing, or an experience with tanking in other games thing? Because I'd encourage you to at least give it a shot, since A) Dark Knight's story is really good and B) tanking in FF14 is a fair bit different from WoW. The goal of tanking is to spend the absolute minimum time possible in tank stance  Having tanked in both FF14 and WoW, I found WoW tanking to be frenetic and tiresome to do at length. It's comparatively relaxing here.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:41
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Shere posted:"Here's a baser-urge grind that involves making hp bars get empty ad-nauseum." To be fair, people actually play and enjoy BDO and it's designed around endless grinding. Some people like and want that content.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:43
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Captain Oblivious posted:By the way Cythereal, you mentioned before that you really hate tanking. Is that a tanxiety thing, or an experience with tanking in other games thing? Because I'd encourage you to at least give it a shot, since A) Dark Knight's story is really good and B) tanking in FF14 is a fair bit different from WoW. The goal of tanking is to spend the absolute minimum time possible in tank stance Firmly tanxiety. I enjoy healing, I've played a healer in every MMO I've touched. It's challenging and fun and enjoyable. I've never found tanking in MMOs to be anything but stressful and anti-fun. I took a gladiator up to 20 during the free trial period, did the tutorial and the first couple of dungeons, and said nope this is not for me.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:45
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Just remember the mantra of the pubbie tank: its never your fault.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:46
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I tried tanking a few lower level dungeons and it loving sucked. I've had way more fun tanking in WoW as a monk or DH. otoh XIV healing is fantastic and nothing like healing in WoW (but I only healed as a monk too).
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Mar 15, 2018 18:51
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Cythereal posted:Firmly tanxiety. I enjoy healing, I've played a healer in every MMO I've touched. It's challenging and fun and enjoyable. I've never found tanking in MMOs to be anything but stressful and anti-fun. Fair enough. If you can't relax, you can't relax. For a lot of people tanxiety is just a building it up to be more than it is in their head thing, for others there's just no getting around it. I know for me in WoW a lot of my disdain for tanking came from the fact that WoW shifts a fair bit of the lethality of the dungeon onto the trash mobs rather than the boss fights and that never felt satisfying or enjoyable to deal with.
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Mar 15, 2018 18:52
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Captain Oblivious posted:Having tanked in both FF14 and WoW, I found WoW tanking to be frenetic and tiresome to do at length. It's comparatively relaxing here. I've had a harder time getting into FFXIV tanking because the slower pace/longer GCD makes it feel like you have to be far more careful what you're pressing. Wrangling mobs up feels like more of a process then WoW where it's kinda just "spam aoe." Past 50 it seems like you need to be on your poo poo a lot more to deal with dungeon mechanics where in WoW you can kinda just bumble your way to max, as well it feels like tanking an EXDR would be a lot more work then tanking heroic dungeons in WoW where as dpsing the two feels about the same. Granted I only have PLD in the 40s and War at 30 so I might just need to push myself to get more used of it. Captain Oblivious posted:I know for me in WoW a lot of my disdain for tanking came from the fact that WoW shifts a fair bit of the lethality of the dungeon onto the trash mobs rather than the boss fights and that never felt satisfying or enjoyable to deal with. Granted I think it's different with recent changes but it feels like for a long stretch dungeons (and particularly trash) was pretty facerolly outside of stuff like mythic. Round it up and spam AOE. Tanks would regularly top DPS at lower levels since they'd usually get more AOE early on. Oxyclean fucked around with this message at 18:56 on Mar 15, 2018 |
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Mar 15, 2018 18:54
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I tanked for Heavensward and for the first tier of Savage raiding this expansion before switching to SAM for the second tier. DPS is way more stressful trying to keep your damage up while juggling all the mechanics. Tanking, comparatively, was a snoozefest. As long as the monsters are hitting you you're doing your job perfectly fine. I would still be tanking, probably, if their damage rotations weren't insultingly simple.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:11
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Oxyclean posted:I've had a harder time getting into FFXIV tanking because the slower pace/longer GCD makes it feel like you have to be far more careful what you're pressing. Wrangling mobs up feels like more of a process then WoW where it's kinda just "spam aoe." Past 50 it seems like you need to be on your poo poo a lot more to deal with dungeon mechanics where in WoW you can kinda just bumble your way to max, as well it feels like tanking an EXDR would be a lot more work then tanking heroic dungeons in WoW where as dpsing the two feels about the same. Yeah my frame of reference was Mythic+ early progression. Trash was an aggravating attention tax to me. I don't really put a whole lot of effort into trash in FF14 tanking. Yank a pack with Abyssal Drain or Unleash and move to the next or stand still and AoE them down. Most of my actual attention goes to boss fights which is how I like it 
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Mar 15, 2018 19:12
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The game really needs to make it easier to get sets from non-leveling dungeons. rip skalla casting chest
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Mar 15, 2018 19:13
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Shere posted:Eureka is bad independent of every secondary issue it has because it's basically patronizing as gently caress. It's sort of funny because after doing the NM train life for a lockout or two I sort of get what they're going for with Eureka it's just scaled all wrong. Eureka actually comes alive when you fight a boss that can survive 5-10 minutes of the entire instance pounding on it while dropping a few simple but deceptively tricky mechanics to make sure you're awake during the process. I mean, poo poo, Number almost sold me on the entire Eureka concept by itself whenever the summoned Garms sent the fight spiralling wildly out of control. That stuff is a laugh riot. Not to mention that in terms of raw numbers efficiently murdering your way through the available NMs is faster levelling, faster crystal acquisition, and gives you some of the cosmetic stuff like minions or glamour gear that people enjoy. Plus, right now, we only have common access to something like 6-7 NM fights in an instance when datamining indicates there are NMs going straight up to elemental level 20; the player base just isn't leveled up enough yet for later ones. This actually does harken back to the FFXI inspiration for Abyssea where all the roving pack mobs were just means to an end. You murdered trash mobs to pop the bigger bosses which is what you were actually there for. That was the intended content, not sitting in place killing regular mobs. FFXIV has changed that concept considerably to accommodate the fact that instead of separate groups working on separate goals it's an entire instance collaborating but the core idea is there. Frankly that's comforting compared to my initial impression which like everyone else was pretty scathing. Right now it's just a bit too slow to be properly enjoyable. If they had cut the required trash kills by a third or even a half of what they are now, and reduce the respawn timers for NMs to maybe 60 minutes, that would keep everything flowing better. It's possible that having access to higher level NMs will fix this problem, at least.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:16
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Argas posted:The game really needs to make it easier to get sets from non-leveling dungeons. rip skalla casting chest It took me about 30 skallas to get my drat striking pants so I am seconding this. Edit: The fate trains are still incredibly boring, as are hunts just in general. This poo poo didn't need to be it's own zone with it's own insipid levelling progression. They could just as easily have slapped this relic poo poo onto the current hunts and saved themselves a ton of developement time while putting out a better product. Failboattootoot fucked around with this message at 19:21 on Mar 15, 2018 |
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Mar 15, 2018 19:16
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Cythereal posted:Firmly tanxiety. I enjoy healing, I've played a healer in every MMO I've touched. It's challenging and fun and enjoyable. I've never found tanking in MMOs to be anything but stressful and anti-fun. Hello fellow lifetime healer. I've played a healer ever since vanilla WoW and the original Guild Wars. I lived the years under vanilla WoW's "holy priests can't kill anything. gently caress you." I was a monk forever in GW1. Any time I would try a new MMO, I would always play healer. This is one of the reasons Guild Wars 2 fell loving flat from me (aside from it also being a garbage game goddamnit Arenanet! Guild Wars 1 was so loving good how could you gently caress this up so badly. AAAHHHHH  ). When I came to FFXIV, I naturally gravitated immediately to White Mage. When Heavensward came out, I was lured by the siren call of Astrologians. I'm crossing my fingers that the next expansion brings dancers a healers because then I could die happy. Point of this is, I have always played healer and could never imagine playing anything else ever. Being a healer is great. You're almost always wanted in groups and as us lifelong healers know, healing isn't actually nearly as stressful as people would imagine it to be. I was always one absolutely terrified of tanking because I was terrified of loving up. As a healer, I've hosed up plenty of times. But often when things go to poo poo and people start dying, it's because other people screwed up, not me. My fear as a tank is that it would be immediately known that I'm bad and loving up. As a healer, I figured that I could occasionally hide my gently caress ups in a way that I couldn't as a tank. I recently leveled a warrior to around level 50 solely from levequests and PotD. So I reached the point where that class terrified me because I never actually stepped foot into a dungeon. So I started fresh with Dark Knight (with is incredibly my aesthetic). This was about the time squadron dungeons were introduced, so I abused double archer Stone Vigil to get to 55. Over the last two days, I've taken it to 59 running completely off dungeons with pubbies. Point of this all - being a tank isn't nearly as scary as we think it is. Does it take skill to be a good tank? Yeah. But it also takes skill to be a good healer. Just as a newbie healer can start out by just exclusively healing and never DPSing until they're comfortable with the job, a newbie tank (like myself) can start out by never dropping tank stance and just focus exclusively on making sure I always have aggro than worrying about dropping tank stance and DPSing. I would highly encourage you to try tanking. One of the biggest draws to healing for me was that I always wanted to be a class in demand. Well, tanks are far more in demand than healers. Also, if you're afraid of loving up in front of pubbies - use the squadron dungeons. They're a great way to practice the basics with no fear of embarrassing yourself in front of others. Also - play Dark Knight.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:19
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Eltoasto posted:To be fair, people actually play and enjoy BDO and it's designed around endless grinding. Some people like and want that content. The issue arises when people from those MMOs who enjoy grinding end up in a game like FFXIV and try to bitch and moan about how this game isn't like that game.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:21
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This happened in Eureka and was kind of neat.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:23
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tanking isd the easiest job in 14's dungeons
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Mar 15, 2018 19:24
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Extrapolating off of this, I wonder how they could have done things differently. I wonder if it would have been better to be more transparent with information. If each NM spawn cooldown was 60 minutes and the game surfaced a "progress to spawn" meter based off the kills in the area, would that help a little at least? It feels like more of a focus needs to be on the NM and less on the packs of monsters all around.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:25
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I mean technically the +2 345 poo poo allows you to bring the maximum possible ilvl to Ult Coil without being downsync'd
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Mar 15, 2018 19:27
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I get the feeling they were aiming to intentionally provide limited information to promote community discovery and word-of-mouth. It's a contained world that runs on its own rules to be explored and Poise doesn't do anything.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:31
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a medical mystery posted:community discovery and word-of-mouth. That would be great if this was 2005. Community discovery and word-of-mouth doesn't exist in the modern internet the way it did 15 years ago. I feel like that's the summary of this content. "It would be great if this was 2005."
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Mar 15, 2018 19:33
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Eureka would sound cooler if it was nothing but a world of boss monsters.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:35
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The actual most annoying thing about Eureka is the culling and I can't believe they keep making that mistake.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:40
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Mordiceius posted:That would be great if this was 2005. Community discovery and word-of-mouth doesn't exist in the modern internet the way it did 15 years ago. Yeah that's the sentiment the little Souls jab at the end was trying to communicate
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Mar 15, 2018 19:40
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Meiteron posted:Right now it's just a bit too slow to be properly enjoyable. If they had cut the required trash kills by a third or even a half of what they are now, and reduce the respawn timers for NMs to maybe 60 minutes, that would keep everything flowing better. It's possible that having access to higher level NMs will fix this problem, at least. Well, yes, the main problem is it's functioning on a timescale that's basically a non-starter for people allergic to having their time wasted. It's busywork in its least subtle form.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:41
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Rhjamiz posted:Eureka would sound cooler if it was nothing but a world of boss monsters. Eureka would be cooler if it was anything except endless trash. Edit: When they announced Eureka I was imagining something more along the lines of timeless isle in WoW. That was a fun little place with a ton of different stuff to do and discover. They could have just copied that concept wholesale.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:42
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Whole game should be like Eureka Sans the elemental wheel because that would get tedious, but the constant danger and needing to solid snake around dangerous mobs and risk losing exp adds so much to the world, its no where near as brutal as FF11 but still gives you that feelling
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Mar 15, 2018 19:44
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if you're an experienced healer, you should already have an intuitive understanding of defensive tank play (cooldown rotation, how much mitigation is necessary, enmity management, etc). theory isn't practice, of course, and you'll still have to learn how to optimize dps while continuing to not-die, but you definitely have a head start also, playing a tank at level cap makes you a better healer.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:44
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I think I'll continue to play what I find fun instead.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:46
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Eureka being segregated content is also awful. Past Relic content was designed to get the players with the most time to grind to get into content and keep the roulettes populated. Eureka does away with all of that after another expansion's worth of content.
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Mar 15, 2018 19:46
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