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ElCondemn posted:Seems like the human driver didn't have the reaction speed to prevent it either, not sure what you expect? the autonomous system didn't even try to prevent the accident. it never applied the brakes and plowed in to her at 40mph (the speed limit of the street) pangstrom posted:I kind of hope that when they release the victim's name it's Sarah Conner. it was Elaine Herzberg
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Mar 20, 2018 02:11
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Condiv posted:the autonomous system didn't even try to prevent the accident. it never applied the brakes and plowed in to her at 40mph (the speed limit of the street) Neither did the human. You can post some conspiracy theory that he was taking a nap or playing a gameboy or something instead of doing his job but with the information we have now neither the computer nor the person paid to watch the road for this stuff made any reaction.
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Mar 20, 2018 14:01
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:Neither did the human. You can post some conspiracy theory that he was taking a nap or playing a gameboy or something instead of doing his job but with the information we have now neither the computer nor the person paid to watch the road for this stuff made any reaction. It’s not a conspiracy theory to suspect that experimental technology might have been directly involved in this woman’s death. You don’t always have to put on the cheer leader outfit whenever a new tech story comes out.
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Mar 20, 2018 14:30
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:Neither did the human. You can post some conspiracy theory that he was taking a nap or playing a gameboy or something instead of doing his job but with the information we have now neither the computer nor the person paid to watch the road for this stuff made any reaction. It's not a conspiracy theory to think that they weren't paying attention in the same way they would have been if they were actively driving, dipshit. Nobody is saying they were doing anything they weren't supposed to, just that sitting mostly passively isn't conducive to having lightning reflexes when something actually happens
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Mar 20, 2018 14:38
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Also "the person didn't do anything either" is not an absolution of your precious robocar fuckwit
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Mar 20, 2018 14:39
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people run over pedestrians all the time and don't even get fined so why should robots be any different
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Mar 20, 2018 14:41
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BENGHAZI 2 posted:It's not a conspiracy theory to think that they weren't paying attention in the same way they would have been if they were actively driving, dipshit. Nobody is saying they were doing anything they weren't supposed to, just that sitting mostly passively isn't conducive to having lightning reflexes when something actually happens If the woman stepped out in a way that required lightning reflexes to avoid that is a very different story than if the car austin powers steamrollered her because self driving cars were fake all along and this finally exposes it.
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Mar 20, 2018 14:42
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:If the woman stepped out in a way that required lightning reflexes to avoid that is a very different story than if the car austin powers steamrollered her because self driving cars were fake all along and this finally exposes it. Yes because it's far more likely that she was trying to put herself under the wheels and stepped in front of a car doing forty that was close enough that they wouldn't have time to even apply brakes You realize "like a flash" is a colloquial term that just means "I didn't realize it was about to happen until it was happening" and not "actually it was physically impossible for anyone including a computer to respond in time" right It does literally nothing to disprove what I said
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Mar 20, 2018 14:46
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Oocc would rather blame a dead person than admit that technology isn't a force of pure good and light
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Mar 20, 2018 14:46
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ElCondemn posted:I'm not sure what you mean by no oversight, these companies have licenses with the locations they operate. If they are found unsafe their rights to operate are revoked. Very poor oversight: Wired posted:Uber, Waymo, and other autonomous vehicle developers like Arizona not just for the sunny weather and calm conditions but for the near total lack of restrictions on how they test: Self-driving vehicles don’t need any sort of special permit, just a standard vehicle registration. And their operators don’t have to share any information about what they’re doing with the authorities. This also means that we can't know how many incidents are prevented by the backup drivers in autonomous cars. ElCondemn posted:If your standard is to have autonomous cars be perfect it's not going to happen, it's a stupid thing to expect, at least at first. But I can guarantee you that an autonomous vehicle will do better than the vast majority of drivers on the road and I trust technology more than I do some rando on the road. At the moment it doesn't do better: Wired posted:Humans don’t have a great record: Nearly 40,000 people died on American roads last year. Almost 6,000 of them were pedestrians—that’s more than 16 per day. But human drivers kill just 1.16 people for every 100 million miles driven. Waymo and Uber and all the rest combined are nowhere near covering that kind of distance, and they’ve already killed one. Quotes from https://www.wired.com/story/uber-self-driving-car-crash-arizona-pedestrian
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Mar 20, 2018 15:00
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Technology saves many lives, thats a fact. Most of us will not even exist if not where to technology. Lets wait and see if they find something wrong happened here.
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Mar 20, 2018 15:03
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Tei posted:Technology saves many lives, thats a fact. Most of us will not even exist if not where to technology. Self driving cars on the other hand are clearly not saving lives
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Mar 20, 2018 15:06
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BENGHAZI 2 posted:Oocc would rather blame a dead person than admit that technology isn't a force of pure good and light There was a person at the wheel too! you are blaming a human either way!
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Mar 20, 2018 15:11
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:There was a person at the wheel too! you are blaming a human either way! I don't understand why you would blame the safety driver over a dead lady shrieks oocc Also I'm not blaming the safety driver, I'm blaming automated cars and noting that "safety drivers" are not as effective as ordinary drivers thanks to the passivity of the role, hth
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Mar 20, 2018 15:13
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BENGHAZI 2 posted:Oocc would rather blame a dead person than admit that technology isn't a force of pure good and light Imagine being the kind of person who thinks this, what must their life be like? Seriously, this thread is full of tech bros blaming a corpse for besmirching the good name of autonomous cars, a technology they want mainly so they can more safely masturbate on their morning commute.
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Mar 20, 2018 15:18
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Word on the street is that the car didn't initiate braking at all. That sounds like a malfunction. The software only needs milliseconds to react, so, no matter how she got in front of the car, there should have been more than enough time to at least initiate braking.
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Mar 20, 2018 15:26
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Oh man is this real? Ahahahaha https://twitter.com/EricPaulDennis/status/975891554538852352 BENGHAZI 2 posted:I don't understand why you would blame the safety driver over a dead lady shrieks oocc
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Mar 20, 2018 15:42
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Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:Word on the street is that the car didn't initiate braking at all. That sounds like a malfunction. The software only needs milliseconds to react, so, no matter how she got in front of the car, there should have been more than enough time to at least initiate braking. https://i.imgur.com/7XPr2cL.mp4 But why don't we wait for a video and telemetry before deciding what happened 
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Mar 20, 2018 15:44
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mobby_6kl posted:Possibly. We've all seen the (other) Volvo plow into a reporter at a self-stopping demonstration, though this should have an order of magnutude better detection capabilities than that:
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Mar 20, 2018 15:58
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GEMorris posted:
Besmirching the good name of a living man that sat in the driver's seat while the car killed someone and just assuming he was negligent at his job or stupid or beguiled by a machine witch or something before any investigation is done to see if the accident was even avoidable to begin with.
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Mar 20, 2018 16:05
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:Besmirching the good name of a living man that sat in the driver's seat while the car killed someone and just assuming he was negligent at his job or stupid or beguiled by a machine witch or something before any investigation is done to see if the accident was even avoidable to begin with. I would not expect a passenger to be able to yank the wheel in time to avert an accident, I'm not blaming the safety driver at all, stop ignoring me saying that to claim people are blaming him
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Mar 20, 2018 16:13
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Me: the inherent passivity of being a safety driver instead of being actively engaged in driving and paying attention to the road combined with the time necessary to switch to manual mode makes safety drivers not really a great failsafe Oocc: how dare you say he masturbated while the car ran her over
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Mar 20, 2018 16:15
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https://twitter.com/caseyjohnston/status/976110416068861953
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Mar 20, 2018 16:17
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BENGHAZI 2 posted:Me: the inherent passivity of being a safety driver instead of being actively engaged in driving and paying attention to the road combined with the time necessary to switch to manual mode makes safety drivers not really a great failsafe You: the driver in the car is very inconvenient to my narrative so I need to remove him via some weird handwavy claim that the accident happened in a time scale where the car should have reacted but didn't but a driver in the car couldn't possibly react but then a driver in a non self driving car definitely could have reacted. Like what are you claiming that time range is? That seems extremely specific and narrow.
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Mar 20, 2018 16:27
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nobody cares, an autocar killed a person because uber sucks at everything except overworking people for less than minimum wage
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Mar 20, 2018 16:33
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Truga posted:nobody cares, an autocar killed a person because uber sucks at everything except overworking people for less than minimum wage Uber didn't even make the car!
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Mar 20, 2018 16:34
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uber also probably hasn't changed person monitoring the car in the last 26 hours and they were asleep
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Mar 20, 2018 16:35
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I mean that is kind of the point of having the safety driver there. These self-driving cars are in development, it's understood that they're not completely ready to drive all on their own. The person in the driver's seat isn't just there for show.
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Mar 20, 2018 16:36
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i think the joke is that since it's a faulty uber car, uber should be held accountable.
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Mar 20, 2018 16:38
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So this was just a bad driver mowing down a homeless woman? Sounds like something an automated car could have prevented.
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Mar 20, 2018 16:44
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:You: the driver in the car is very inconvenient to my narrative so I need to remove him via some weird handwavy claim that the accident happened in a time scale where the car should have reacted but didn't but a driver in the car couldn't possibly react but then a driver in a non self driving car definitely could have reacted. How is reaction time for something you're passively vs actively engaged in a handwave oocc, and why do you keep strawmanning people as blaming the human in the car
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Mar 20, 2018 16:53
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BENGHAZI 2 posted:How is reaction time for something you're passively vs actively engaged in a handwave oocc, and why do you keep strawmanning people as blaming the human in the car I think people aren't blaming the driver, because they know that it was likely an unavoidable accident (or a negligent test driver) and are trying to cook up some extra contrived situation where you can't blame the driver in the car but can still blame the car. So they have to be sure that the accident took place in the ultra thin number of milliseconds where a non-negligent but not engaged test driver could not have stopped things and can not be blamed but that if a real driver was in the car he would have saved the day.
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Mar 20, 2018 17:00
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Owlofcreamcheese posted:I think people aren't blaming the driver, because they know that it was likely an unavoidable accident (or a negligent test driver) and are trying to cook up some extra contrived situation where you can't blame the driver in the car but can still blame the car. So they have to be sure that the accident took place in the ultra thin number of milliseconds where a non-negligent but not engaged test driver could not have stopped things and can not be blamed but that if a real driver was in the car he would have saved the day. You're an absolute loving moron
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Mar 20, 2018 17:03
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Why is it so important that this thread assign blame today with only the information reported in the news?
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Mar 20, 2018 17:13
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Nevvy Z posted:Why is it so important that this thread assign blame today with only the information reported in the news? It's not about assigning blame, it's about the folks like OOCC who can't ever admit to the possibility that technology might not be 100% awesome in every case. He couldn't even admit that Elon Musk got a leg up because his father owned mines in South Africa.
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Mar 20, 2018 17:26
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Hey guys I have a hot take: what if both Uber (the car) and the driver are at fault.  Really though, this is a tragic accident and an important wake-up call for tech companies that you can't play fast and loose with things that can easily kill people. I don't think it's a condemnation of autonomous cars (more a condemnation of Uber and their universally terrible practices), but it is and should be a cautionary tale and a way for oversight to get into the thick of things instead of letting all the tech companies just do whatever they want. But having said all that it shouldn't slam on the brakes (ha ha ha) on the tech because I do strongly believe it has the potential to save thousands of lives in the very near future.
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Mar 20, 2018 18:34
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BENGHAZI 2 posted:Self driving cars on the other hand are clearly not saving lives Less traffic accidents will save lives. Many. Then you will have the anecdotal case of pregnant women being driven to a hospital, or very ill person driven to a hospital. Is easy to imagine how many lives will be saved from people that need to go to a hospital but cant drive.
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Mar 20, 2018 18:37
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Tei posted:Less traffic accidents will save lives. Many. Agreed, its good that we finally found a way to get people who can't drive to the hospital, which we've been struggling with for years
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Mar 20, 2018 18:45
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BENGHAZI 2 posted:Agreed, its good that we finally found a way to get people who can't drive to the hospital, which we've been struggling with for years In lots of states the ambulance driver is an EMT who has to spend half the ride just driving instead of providing medical care. That would be pretty nice to free up.
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Mar 20, 2018 18:51
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BENGHAZI 2 posted:Agreed, its good that we finally found a way to get people who can't drive to the hospital, which we've been struggling with for years Yes, actually it would be nice to solve that problem. If you are familiar with US healthcare you should know what a big problem it is.
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Mar 20, 2018 18:54
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