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s.i.r.e. posted:I don't recall the end of ROTJ exactly, but the Death Star 2 is blown up and all of the ships we see the film are destroyed (I think?). It doesn't seem like there's much left, but if the whole fleet isn't what's destroyed in the films and there's more poo poo all over the place then I guess that answers the question but it's lame as gently caress because it ruins the whole happy ending of the film and doesn't really close out the trilogy. The beginning of TFA should have had "The Empire was destroyed, but that poo poo didn't matter because there was more Empire elsewhere!" in the opening title crawl. No, but the terms of the end of WWI were wildly punishing to Germany, so they might as well have. They had no army, no tanks, etc. Only once they ignored the terms and rebuilt their army from scratch did they rise up again. Also, the Empire didn’t blow up. The Death Star and a bunch of their ships did, as did the Emperor. But plenty of the Empire was still around. If a large portion of the American Navy and the President were wiped out or killed, you wouldn’t say the United States was obliterated.
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Mar 24, 2018 00:25
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germany and france are different nations, if you have to badly evoke real life at least make it a civil war when you're discussing the republic turning into the empire turning into the republic turning into...whatever unexplained thing the first order wants
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Mar 24, 2018 00:27
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Brother Entropy posted:germany and france are different nations, if you have to badly evoke real life at least make it a civil war when you're discussing the republic turning into the empire turning into the republic turning into...whatever unexplained thing the first order wants This analogy is specifically addressing the complaint of how the First Order built up such an army after “only” 30 years. It’s just pointing out that, in real world terms, Germany did similar in less time. Of course it’s possible.
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Mar 24, 2018 00:30
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thrawn527 posted:This analogy is specifically addressing the complaint of how the First Order built up such an army after “only” 30 years. It’s just pointing out that, in real world terms, Germany did similar in less time. Of course it’s possible. that complaint wasn't about whether it was possible or not, it's about an important aspect of the sequel trilogy's backstory going completely unexplained
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Mar 24, 2018 00:34
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Brother Entropy posted:that complaint wasn't about whether it was possible or not, it's about an important aspect of the sequel trilogy's backstory going completely unexplained Do we need an explanation? They built up an army. It’s not unheard of even in the real world. Do you want the movies to spend time going into contract orders and military expenditures? Or does it just matter that they have rebuilt from the ashes of the Empire, like the opening crawl says they did?
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Mar 24, 2018 00:36
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an explanation for how the first order came into being would help clarify potential goals or outcomes that they're fighting for, making me actually give a poo poo about them as antagonists or comprehend what has changed now that kylo ren is in charge as it is it's transparently obvious they just went 'well we need another empire-like group' and it's hard to get interested in something so lame
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Mar 24, 2018 00:43
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They are trying to find Luke Skywalker and destroy the republic.
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Mar 24, 2018 01:59
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what do we know about the empires motivation at the start of anh theyre just rear end in a top hat authoritarians like all of lucas' movies up until then contain facets of
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Mar 24, 2018 02:31
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unfortunately this doesnt cut it after half a dozen movies and decades of world building
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Mar 24, 2018 02:32
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Han: "gently caress me, hold tight. What's that?" Lando: "It's my belt, Han." Han: "No, Lando. There's a blaster in your trousers. What's a blaster doing in your trousers? Lando: "For protection." Han: "Protection from what? Ze Germans?"
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Mar 24, 2018 03:22
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Food Boner posted:unfortunately this doesnt cut it after half a dozen movies and decades of world building Conversely, sure it does. Star Wars is based on serial sci-if pulp. The movies should be viewed as such. A Galactic Empire fell. From it’s remnants, a new Empire rose. And I’m gonna be over here thinking that’s a fun and cool setting for a movie. Snoke’s motives don’t matter. What does matter is that, whatever they were, they’ve been replaced by those a murderous psychopath obsessed with revenge and wiping out what came before. And he now has near unlimited resources. What the hell is he going to do with that? That’s your story.
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Mar 24, 2018 03:28
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Snoke shouldn’t have been in the movies at all. A lame character with a dumb name.
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Mar 24, 2018 03:32
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sponges posted:Snoke shouldn’t have been in the movies at all. A lame character with a dumb name. I can’t disagree about the dumb name.
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Mar 24, 2018 03:36
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thrawn527 posted:Conversely, sure it does. Star Wars is based on serial sci-if pulp. The movies should be viewed as such. what i'm reading here is "tfa was completely irrelevant" and while you're not wrong it's probably not the ringing endorsement you think it is
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Mar 24, 2018 04:11
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ungulateman posted:what i'm reading here is "tfa was completely irrelevant" and while you're not wrong it's probably not the ringing endorsement you think it is What? That’s not even remotely what I said. I said that the backstory leading into TFA is irrelevant. Though I’ll admit my post was referring to TLJ, but it was not at all dismissing TFA. TFA was not telling Snoke’s story. It was telling part of Kylo and Rey’s origin story. Snoke was just one character in Kylo’s origin story.
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Mar 24, 2018 04:53
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Would the Snoke haters have liked the movie more if Hux had been dark side Supreme Leader? Or the Goering looking guy on the dreadnought?
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Mar 24, 2018 04:57
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anh wouldnt have worked out if it had been a reboot of flash gordon homage isnt the same as rote copying
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Mar 24, 2018 05:44
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thrawn527 posted:What? That’s not even remotely what I said. I said that the backstory leading into TFA is irrelevant. Though I’ll admit my post was referring to TLJ, but it was not at all dismissing TFA. also if backstory is irrelevant why not just do something new
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Mar 24, 2018 06:14
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOcUL0FuKIQ This is better than most of the poo poo they left in
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Mar 24, 2018 06:23
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The problems not that the First Order built up in 30 years, It's that they did it nowhere (Their territory dislike all things with them inconsistently and contradictorily explained) When the OG Empire had to use the whole Galaxy to do the equivalent. A more apt comparison than real life WWI to WWII Germany would be if after WWI Germany used the resources of an unknown continent in the middle of the Atlantic everyone had failed to notice in order to build a military bigger than all the Allies combined.
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Mar 24, 2018 07:35
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Jeb! Repetition posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOcUL0FuKIQ Brain dead producers/director/editor
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Mar 24, 2018 08:03
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Baron Porkface posted:Would the Snoke haters have liked the movie more if Hux had been dark side Supreme Leader? Or the Goering looking guy on the dreadnought? Actually, yeah, I think that could have been interesting. Have him and Kylo's relationship a bit like Thrawn and C'Boath in the old novels - he thinks Kylo's a useful tool who he can control, only to realize too late that he can't keep Kylo in check anymore. Basically start them off where TLJ ends, with the two of them in an unstable and unsustainable alliance. Snoke was completely unnecessary and didn't add anything to their dynamic.
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Mar 24, 2018 12:53
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contrary to expectations the film turned out pretty good) I was glad to see Yoda))
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Mar 24, 2018 13:28
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galagazombie posted:The problems not that the First Order built up in 30 years, It's that they did it nowhere (Their territory dislike all things with them inconsistently and contradictorily explained) When the OG Empire had to use the whole Galaxy to do the equivalent. A more apt comparison than real life WWI to WWII Germany would be if after WWI Germany used the resources of an unknown continent in the middle of the Atlantic everyone had failed to notice in order to build a military bigger than all the Allies combined. They are some key differences between space and 1930s earth
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Mar 24, 2018 14:27
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:They are some key differences between space and 1930s earth The story of how the First Order was built up using resources unknown to the larger galaxy to become powerful enough to supersede the New Republic would have made a far more interesting story than TFA.
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Mar 24, 2018 16:48
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First order mimicking the build up of germany during the 30s is okay and sort of works. What doesn't work is former imperial territory, now republic territory, not having industry or arms adequate to check eventual first order aggression. In the analogy great britain would've kept their navy and arms to a minimum and the US/russia would not exist as a military state. Reminder that the republic in TLJ has nothing in the way of arms.
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Mar 24, 2018 17:05
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Schwarzwald posted:The story of how the First Order was built up using resources unknown to the larger galaxy to become powerful enough to supersede the New Republic would have made a far more interesting story than TFA. People said the same thing about Vader's backstory and the Clone Wars and look how that turned out Bad Really bad Wild Horses posted:
You can clearly see a fleet of ships above the planets that get blown up in TFA.
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Mar 24, 2018 17:05
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yeah, they have nothing after a fleet blew up. that's pitiful
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Mar 24, 2018 17:09
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Snoke can kiss my rear end.
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Mar 24, 2018 17:11
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Ammanas posted:People said the same thing about Vader's backstory and the Clone Wars and look how that turned out Thank goodness Disney is here to protect from the prequels. 
Schwarzwald fucked around with this message at 19:13 on Mar 24, 2018 |
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Mar 24, 2018 17:19
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Ammanas posted:People said the same thing about Vader's backstory and the Clone Wars and look how that turned out The idea was really really good, Lucas just didn't have the skill to really bring something like that through.
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Mar 24, 2018 17:27
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Wild Horses posted:First order mimicking the build up of germany during the 30s is okay and sort of works. What doesn't work is former imperial territory, now republic territory, not having industry or arms adequate to check eventual first order aggression.
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Mar 24, 2018 17:43
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Irony Be My Shield posted:It makes some sense to me - the old Republic had no army up until the point where it began to be corrupted into the Empire. I can see why they would want to avoid a repeat of that. They did try to make another set of Jedi peacekeepers but that didn't exactly work out. The implication being that they wanted to go right back to how things were before. As did Luke, it would seem.
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Mar 24, 2018 17:47
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:Snoke can kiss my rear end. I was snoked when he died
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Mar 24, 2018 20:39
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:Snoke can kiss my rear end. Ford was sleepwalking through TFA, just as he was through Return of the Jedi, but he almost chokes on "Snoke" during that bridge scene, like he can barely get it out because it's so silly. Carrie Fisher barely covers up her contempt when she mumbles "It was Snoke" through her dentures, too.
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Mar 24, 2018 20:44
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Timby posted:Ford was sleepwalking through TFA This is blatantly false. Dude was having a great time and put in some effort with TFA. If you want to see sleepwalking go watch Indy 4 again.
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Mar 24, 2018 23:09
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Yeah that was easily the best Ford performance in a recent blockbuster. He was totally into it.
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Mar 24, 2018 23:40
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Yeah, Ford has been sleep walking through his performances since...I’m gonna say Hollywood Homicide. But this was the first time I’ve seen him try in decades. I think he was happy to finally be able to kill Han Solo.
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Mar 25, 2018 02:02
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CelticPredator posted:Yeah that was easily the best Ford performance in a recent blockbuster. He was totally into it. He was real good in bladerunner but that wasn’t a blockbuster. Hah.
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Mar 25, 2018 02:02
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He seemed to give a poo poo when be played Branch Rickey in '42'
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Mar 25, 2018 02:31
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