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My Lovely Horse posted:roll for knowledge If they're rolling about something plot critical they find out what they need, but something bad happens. They don't have much time, some previously unknown danger rears its head, or you give them a painful choice. Or suddenly, ninjas attack.
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Mar 17, 2018 16:06
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I wouldn't even bother with PHB1 - Rules Compendium has all the errata baked in and all the rules in one better-laid-out book, and you just use a builder for player options.
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Mar 17, 2018 16:06
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Moriatti posted:but Solo design is still wonky so boss fights are gonna be a problem. This is unfortunately really true. A solo needs multiple turns and some way to handle things like dazes and stuns, but that gets kinda unfun to go "Actually your stun did nothing, loser." The only solo I've had a challenge from that didn't feel cheap was a solo with multiple turns that burst into flames when dazed, stunned or dominated. If you have a solo, make it like a level lower, throw in some minions or something.
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Mar 17, 2018 16:10
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Gharbad the Weak posted:This is unfortunately really true. A solo needs multiple turns and some way to handle things like dazes and stuns, but that gets kinda unfun to go "Actually your stun did nothing, loser." The only solo I've had a challenge from that didn't feel cheap was a solo with multiple turns that burst into flames when dazed, stunned or dominated. Yeah, just a page ago though there was this post which is great for building some cool solos: Kaza42 posted:http://blogofholding.com/?p=512
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Mar 17, 2018 16:15
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Moriatti posted:Yeah, just a page ago though there was this post which is great for building some cool solos: Oh man, I totally missed that, thanks
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Mar 17, 2018 16:19
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Gharbad the Weak posted:Oh man, I totally missed that, thanks No problem. Worth noting, this is a good general suggestion even if it's not against a solo. If the party has tracked an evil mercenary group to their hideout, having 3 phases as the base gets on higher and higher alert the final phase being against the bamdit leader is a really cinematic and cool "boss fight" even though the leader might be a standard leader class/elite brute with a couple of goons instead of a true solo. Especially if their plan or ambush leads to stuff like the hideout being on fire or if the bandits holed up in a room witn some ballistae, etc.,
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Mar 17, 2018 16:27
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ross the boss posted:I bought a bunch of 4e books on eBay and DTRPG because honestly I'm getting sick of playing 5e and I can probably convince my group to play a 4e Dark Sun Campaign if I sell them on the combat being way less boring. Check your PMs.
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Mar 17, 2018 19:26
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So in the OP under the math fixes, sections, it's mentioned that inherent bonuses have some "weirdness" with masterwork armor when it comes to the defense bonuses. Could anyone expound on this a bit? Is it just that even with the magic item treadmill being replaced by inherent bonuses, the bonus from masterwork armor is still needed to keep player AC up to speed with monster attack bonuses?
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Mar 23, 2018 01:42
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BattleCake posted:the bonus from masterwork armor is still needed to keep player AC up to speed with monster attack bonuses? Yeah basically. You still need to upgrade the base armor, even if the enhancements scale automatically.
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Mar 23, 2018 02:45
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Dick Burglar posted:Check your PMs. I'm doing similar stuff, can you PM me whatever you PM'd this guy?
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Mar 23, 2018 16:07
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We're approaching paragon tier and I need some build advice. If I already have Improved Defenses on a fighter should I consider picking up Superior Will? I'd only be gaining +1 will, but I'd also get a free save on stun/daze effects.
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Mar 26, 2018 01:07
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The free save makes it one of the more powerful standalone feats in the game, yes. Even better, it's a free save even against effects that don't normally allow a save. Keep in mind that you can retrain heroic tier feats into paragon tier feats (so long as you don't break a prerequisite chain), so you can get two paragon feats at level 11.
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Mar 26, 2018 01:10
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As a fighter I took both, but wound up by the middle of Paragon with all three Superior defenses so I retrained out of Improved somewhere around 14 or 16. The riders all come in handy at various points and I'm tanky as gently caress as a result. If you're not totally feat-starved it's something to shoot for.
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Mar 26, 2018 01:37
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Kay, so. I wrapped up my 1-20 game, and my Bard player wants to run a 21-30 continuation. So now Im trying to make a bard with no idea what Im doing. Goal is offtanking and loving with the DM's carefully planned encounters.quote:Level 20 valor bard / warchanter (MC paladin / warlord) For items, he's giving me 375kgp. I was looking at quote:Rituals: Where do I go from here? 
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Mar 26, 2018 03:25
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Free Triangle posted:We're approaching paragon tier and I need some build advice. If I already have Improved Defenses on a fighter should I consider picking up Superior Will? I'd only be gaining +1 will, but I'd also get a free save on stun/daze effects. It's definitely a good option if you don't have a feat heavy build (Polearm Fighters I'm looking at you). If you do so retrain Improved Defenses into Superior Fortitude as Resist 3/Tier vs ongoing is well worth moving some Ref into Fort for. (If you do this you'll eventually want to see if you can get Superior Reflexes by Epic). The only question is how close to Paragon are you and whether there are any Paragon feats you are eyeing; it's very common to retrain your final feat or two at Heroic for a Paragon feat or two when you hit 11 and possibly 12.
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Mar 26, 2018 04:15
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Unfortunately it is a polearm fighter, so my first two paragon feats are polearm gambit and impaling spear. I'm leaning towards superior fort/will and maybe skipping reflex? What generally happens if you fail a reflex check at higher levels? Edit: we're about to hit level 9. Free Triangle fucked around with this message at 08:51 on Mar 26, 2018 |
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Mar 26, 2018 08:45
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Retraining feats up a tier is entirely possible, yes, but I tend not to do it because...I dunno, maybe it's just me, it just doesn't feel good. It means even MORE in advance planning for poo poo, which I hate, and honestly, 4e games are rarely so cutting edge that you have to do it. That said, retraining Improved Defenses to Superior Will is more of a sidegrade then upgrade, so don't feel TOO bad about it and worry that it's OP or whatever. And as others have said, there really isn't anything wrong with having both - the scaling bonus to the defense is easily the lesser part of Superior Will compared to the save it grants. As for both epic bards (and kinda for fighters too), most my advice is going to be all but literally copy-pasted from their respective handbooks...so give those a look if you haven't! Fighters and bards. But, I practically have to give my general handbook warnings: remember, just picking the teal options vaguely isn't going to give you a super strong character - actually look at what your doing and see if things work together, both with your character and with the team. 4e is and has always been all about synergy between options and players. Likewise, on the opposite end, don't get despondent over choices that aren't the best; 4e has a decently low power ceiling (outside of certain absurdities) and a decently high power floor - outside of dumping your attack stat, it's hard to kneecap your own character, so don't stress about needing to be the strongest/best.
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Mar 26, 2018 09:00
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Thanks for the advice, while I'm approaching polearm gamble would it be worth retraining swift spear to forced opportunist so I can push away non-reach melee opponents? Or would you grab both?
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Mar 27, 2018 00:47
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Loel posted:Kay, so. I wrapped up my 1-20 game, and my Bard player wants to run a 21-30 continuation. So now Im trying to make a bard with no idea what Im doing. Goal is offtanking and loving with the DM's carefully planned encounters. Eternal Seeker Epic Destinycan let you randomly poach powers from different classes if you don't want to spend feats, while Avangion has a couple of neat features for supporting your party. If you want to off-tank then Demand Respect at level 23 and Discipline the Unruly at level 25 let you punish the hell out of people even if they're already marked by someone else, which lets you inflict some severe damage. What's the rest of your party look like? If your party's MBAs are good then swapping one of your at-wills for Staggering Note is fun. Free Triangle posted:Thanks for the advice, while I'm approaching polearm gamble would it be worth retraining swift spear to forced opportunist so I can push away non-reach melee opponents? Or would you grab both? Spiked Chain is a somewhat less feat-intensive gimmick if you want a reach weapon with forced movement. The main thing you lose is polearm gambit, but you can get a lot of work with flail expertise (flail attacks that slide knock prone), lashing flail (flail MBAs slide) and dragging flail (slide people you knock prone with a flail).
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Mar 27, 2018 07:39
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Free Triangle posted:Thanks for the advice, while I'm approaching polearm gamble would it be worth retraining swift spear to forced opportunist so I can push away non-reach melee opponents? Or would you grab both? I can't find Forced Opportunist. If you mean Agile Opportunist think how often you get pushed (not often) and you already have uses for your interrupt. The fighter is possibly the least useful class for Agile Opportunist.
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Mar 27, 2018 23:25
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LightWarden posted:Eternal Seeker Epic Destinycan let you randomly poach powers from different classes if you don't want to spend feats, while Avangion has a couple of neat features for supporting your party. If you want to off-tank then Demand Respect at level 23 and Discipline the Unruly at level 25 let you punish the hell out of people even if they're already marked by someone else, which lets you inflict some severe damage. Ah, neat  What are some good warlord/paly powers to grab before 20?quote:What's the rest of your party look like? If your party's MBAs are good then swapping one of your at-wills for Staggering Note is fun. Checking into that now
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Mar 28, 2018 03:35
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neonchameleon posted:I can't find Forced Opportunist. If you mean Agile Opportunist think how often you get pushed (not often) and you already have uses for your interrupt. The fighter is possibly the least useful class for Agile Opportunist. Woops I mean forceful opportunist, it allows you to push on attacks of opportunity, while swift spear allows you to pull on oppies. Basically swift spear would make the fighter more sticky, but forceful opportunist would up his survivability (especially combined with polearm gambit)
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Mar 28, 2018 09:00
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Free Triangle posted:Woops I mean forceful opportunist, it allows you to push on attacks of opportunity, while swift spear allows you to pull on oppies. Assuming you're going for a fairly standard polearm package then the Forceful Opportunist/Spear Push/Polearm Momentum/Polearm Gamble combination is more than slightly horrifying to enemies - step next to the fighter and end up looking at the sky, two squares away, and marked; Swift Spear doesn't get Spear Push so it doesn't get Polearm Momentum. And four feats (plus Expertise and probably Weapon Focus - and possibly greatspear or gouge proficiency) is a huge investment giving you not many feats to use on other stuff. neonchameleon fucked around with this message at 11:13 on Mar 28, 2018 |
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Mar 28, 2018 11:09
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Ah, I just realized polearm momentum says push OR slide, so its incompatible with swift spear. Thanks for the advice goons!
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Mar 28, 2018 19:58
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quote:What's the rest of your party look like? If your party's MBAs are good then swapping one of your at-wills for Staggering Note is fun. Looks like we have Rogues, Cleric, Psion, Warlock, depending on who is showing up.
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Mar 29, 2018 04:18
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Loel posted:Ah, neat Warlord level 13: Death from Two Sides means you make an MBA and your ally makes an MBA, and if you both hit, it's a crit for your ally, which is great. If you have the Combat Virtuouso feat then you can use Strength-based powers with your Charisma mod for the attack roll (not the damage modifier, but who cares with warlord powers?). In that case, Hail of Steel (Warlord level 17) becomes an excellent choice because if you land a hit then every single one of your allies gets to unload a basic attack on your target. It's one of the best enabling powers in the game other than Valorous Charge (Cleric level 27), which is excellent if you pick it up through something like Eternal Seeker. Technically it's possible to have both Hail of Steel and Valorous Charge on a War Chanter bard, and then pick up both the Martial Mastery and Divine Mastery feats so you can have four straight turns of "everyone go ham with +Con to hit and damage". Incredibly excessive though. If you're still looking for tanking powers, Valorous Strike (Paladin 1)/Castigating Strike (Paladin 13) are mass-sanction abilities that challenge your enemies to attack you, but without a paladin's full kit of feats like Weakening Challenge they can be a little weak, especially if you don't have the defenses to take the hits. Since you're a tiefling you qualify for Secrets of Belial, which lets you straight up swap one of your utility powers for a utility from any class and there's a lot of good options out there.
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Mar 29, 2018 05:24
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Loel posted:Looks like we have Rogues, Cleric, Psion, Warlock, depending on who is showing up. Might I suggest reflavouring a paladin as a bard aand being a tankbard?
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Mar 29, 2018 20:35
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Paladin MC bard is also a good build. Bard MC opens Paladin up to the Avangion ED, which is a nice one for paladins.
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Mar 30, 2018 06:42
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"Huh, maybe I should have checked the XP guidelines." Yeah maybe you should have, guest DM. Maybe you should have. It might have prevented you from setting us up against four double strength encounters in one session. I swear, this is the kind of stuff that puts people off the system for good.
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Apr 2, 2018 21:55
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My Lovely Horse posted:"Huh, maybe I should have checked the XP guidelines." https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iAYMs_NsYsY
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Apr 2, 2018 22:21
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LightWarden posted:If you have the Combat Virtuouso feat then you can use Strength-based powers with your Charisma mod for the attack roll (not the damage modifier, but who cares with warlord powers?). In that case, Hail of Steel (Warlord level 17) becomes an excellent choice because if you land a hit then every single one of your allies gets to unload a basic attack on your target. It's one of the best enabling powers in the game other than Valorous Charge (Cleric level 27), which is excellent if you pick it up through something like Eternal Seeker. Technically it's possible to have both Hail of Steel and Valorous Charge on a War Chanter bard, and then pick up both the Martial Mastery and Divine Mastery feats so you can have four straight turns of "everyone go ham with +Con to hit and damage". Incredibly excessive though. Are you getting both of those from eternal seeker or multiclass swap feats?
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Apr 4, 2018 18:34
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Funny thing is he somehow managed to hit a sweet spot, or a bitter spot I guess, where they were all completely nonthreatening, just took twice the time to play through. I try not to metagame, knowing the system as well as I do, but when you're in a level 10 party, and your DM opens the second phase of an encounter with "the beholder shows up, and the mages among you realize he's prepared with protective spells, he gets +2 to all defenses and regeneration 10" you kinda hope for the TPK because the alternative is a very, very long fight. At one point during encounter #3 he said "okay, these guys are practically defeated, there's one's escaping, if no one wants to stop him we can call it a fight right here" and his girlfriend replied "I want to try and stop him, he might raise an alarm." That didn't help. Yes, you and I wouldn't have calling a too long fight depend on a player's decision, or if we made that mistake we'd say "yeah okay you manage to stop him" but this guy would not. We should have just all taken the overpowered familiars.
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Apr 5, 2018 13:30
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Double post for a separate question, I'm thinking of running one-shots for this group, but they absolutely need to be one session games, and I've noticed I have trouble planning a session when I have only four encounters to play with. And for obvious reasons I now want to avoid overly long and boring fights. Is "enemies get half HP and deal double damage" still a viable method to make fights more snappy, and does it combine well with using more, but weaker encounters? Say I have 6 PCs, and instead of playing 2 encounters with 6* enemies each before a milestone, they get 3 with 4* enemies each, but the enemies are double strength/half HP? *to be replaced by minions as required, of course
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Apr 5, 2018 13:35
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My Lovely Horse posted:Funny thing is he somehow managed to hit a sweet spot, or a bitter spot I guess, where they were all completely nonthreatening, just took twice the time to play through. I try not to metagame, knowing the system as well as I do, but when you're in a level 10 party, and your DM opens the second phase of an encounter with "the beholder shows up, and the mages among you realize he's prepared with protective spells, he gets +2 to all defenses and regeneration 10" you kinda hope for the TPK because the alternative is a very, very long fight. Oh this is the OP familiar group? gently caress. It sounds like your DM has no idea wtf he's doing, in a very "I think this works like 3E" way, and should stop and learn the basic game before he goes all-out house ruling the gently caress out of everything. Barely anything in 4E has regen, for example, including players.
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Apr 5, 2018 23:59
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Also monster stat blocks assume they're as prepared as they generally will be. Boosting its stats by 2 is effectively giving it an extra 2 levels.
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Apr 6, 2018 00:26
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Yukari posted:Are you getting both of those from eternal seeker or multiclass swap feats? Hail of Steel requires a multiclass swap since you need Combat Virtuoso to land the attack, but you can get Valorous Charge on an Eternal Seeker swap no problem since it's just "everyone in AoE charges or makes a basic attack, gains +Con to defenses".
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Apr 6, 2018 01:06
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dont even fink about it posted:Oh this is the OP familiar group? gently caress. I feel like people bounced off of 4th edition precisely because of DMs like this guy. I had a DM who had us fight against a +8 level standard monster as a solo because the xp tables said it was OK. No, only being able to hit on a 18 isn't OK.
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Apr 6, 2018 20:23
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KPC_Mammon posted:I feel like people bounced off of 4th edition precisely because of DMs like this guy. It's extra funny because the DMG explicitly says "never adjust a monster's level by 5 or more."
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Apr 6, 2018 20:32
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Lemon-Lime posted:It's extra funny because the DMG explicitly says "never adjust a monster's level by 5 or more." This was the same DM who had us fight against a level 6 Assassin when we were level 4 in 3rd edition. The prestige class. Without having to take any other levels in anything else. No, we couldn't save against DC 20 to avoid death. Some DMs shouldn't DM. edit: It is a lot more noticeable in 4th since everything is tightly balanced if you play correctly. KPC_Mammon fucked around with this message at 20:42 on Apr 6, 2018 |
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Apr 6, 2018 20:40
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Man at least that guy looked at the XP tables.
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Apr 6, 2018 21:58
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